Marshy
Proper Gas
Posts: 13,979
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Post by Marshy on Feb 6, 2020 11:06:55 GMT
Problem is the core of the team are still all workers not footballers, Lines having been shown the door last summer. Whilst we have, Davies, Craig, Kilgore, Upson, Ogogo & OC as the core there's going to be no drastic changes. Serc's being out injured just adds to the problem. What’s going on with Sercs? Anyone know how long he might be out for?
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Post by cj on Feb 6, 2020 11:08:17 GMT
I just can't see the youngsters BG's signed making that big a difference, as the core of the team will still be DC/GC's, Barrett who you'd hope would make a difference in midfield has hardly set the team alight so far, meaning we have two new wingers and 3 new strikers plus Harries but still no RB or central midfielders. Personally I don't think we needed another RB in the last window. Hare will hopefully be back soon. And we have Little too. Also Rodman has done a great job filling in at RB. And Kilgour can do a job there too - although I rather he be in the middle of the defence and not full back. There is no rush for a new RB right now. Maybe if Little goes in the summer then yeah get another in then. We got in 7 new players in the window, which no one really expected. Getting in a RB when we have 3/4 players already who can fill in that position just seems like a waste of funds.
Same in the CM position. We have plenty of players already in that area. I have no doubts BG will strengthen that area in the summer after some will go. But I guess in the last window some would have had to go first before any could come in.
We lacked strikers and wingers. That's what BG mainly brought in. They give us options. We can now play pretty much any formation we want and have width and more attacking options than before with hopefully as they gel more and get fitter, we will see more creative play. You cant see them making a difference. I think they will work well. We'll see how it goes.
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pirate
Forum Legend
Posts: 18,396
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Post by pirate on Feb 6, 2020 11:17:06 GMT
The central midfielders are too alike and we could've done with a more progressive deep lying option with an eye for a forward pass.
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Post by cj on Feb 6, 2020 11:19:17 GMT
Problem is the core of the team are still all workers not footballers, Lines having been shown the door last summer. Whilst we have, Davies, Craig, Kilgore, Upson, Ogogo & OC as the core there's going to be no drastic changes. Serc's being out injured just adds to the problem. I agree fully with you here. We have a lot of defensive players, which under GC made us hard to beat and thankfully mainly down to JCH scoring our goals, that got us up to 4th. But we have heavily relied on JCH as Nichols, Victor and Smith just didn't score enough. We've lacked big time in attack this whole season. BG's new signings have mainly been attack minded as we've not scoring or creating enough throughout the season. The issue is, with BG's style, those defence minded players that you mentioned are not really good enough to provide service to the new attack minded players - hence the lack of service has meant a lack of chances being created. Hopefully in time as they gel more that should get better. Maybe this is why BG got the players chasing balls down much higher up the pitch creating pressure and hopefully create more chances as a result.
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Post by cj on Feb 6, 2020 11:21:57 GMT
The central midfielders are too alike and we could've done with a more progressive deep lying option with an eye for a forward pass. I agree. What doesn't help is their form too. For me Ollie has had a pretty poor season compared to last season. Upson started well but now he gives the ball away so much in games. Ogogo and Sercombe has missed games. I guess though we are stuck here in this position until the summer when we could ship some out.
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Post by Gas_Quarters on Feb 6, 2020 11:36:31 GMT
I think that situation is a bit different and more unique though in that they were big underdogs. The never say die fighting spirit was what we had under GC wasn’t it? And it was working. But there was obviously plenty of people that weren’t happy with that. We were performing the best we have done since we’ve been back in League One yet the attendances were the lowest they’ve been. I would also prefer results than pretty football but you can’t please everyone, and I can see why the board felt the need to change the style of football to appease some fans. Were attendences that low ? I thought we were getting about 7000 most weeks, which is what we’ve always averaged in league 1 for donkeys years. The bigger crowd under DC were down to momentum after back to back promotions but rare for us since we’ve left Eastville. IF we’d stayed top six that would have increased and we would have been getting 9000 + in the run in. All those stay away fans due to coughlans style haven’t come back have they. Our average crowds for the last 3 seasons were: 16/17 - 9,302 (finished 10th) 17/18 - 8.933 (finished 13th) 18/19 - 8,320 (finished 15th) I think averaging 7000-7500 when we’re 4th in the league is considerably low. And I think if we were in that position playing attractive attacking football it would’ve been above 9k personally.
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Post by lastminutewinner on Feb 6, 2020 12:26:19 GMT
Were attendences that low ? I thought we were getting about 7000 most weeks, which is what we’ve always averaged in league 1 for donkeys years. The bigger crowd under DC were down to momentum after back to back promotions but rare for us since we’ve left Eastville. IF we’d stayed top six that would have increased and we would have been getting 9000 + in the run in. All those stay away fans due to coughlans style haven’t come back have they. Our average crowds for the last 3 seasons were: 16/17 - 9,302 (finished 10th) 17/18 - 8.933 (finished 13th) 18/19 - 8,320 (finished 15th) I think averaging 7000-7500 when we’re 4th in the league is considerably low. And I think if we were in that position playing attractive attacking football it would’ve been above 9k personally.
I'm inclined to agree with that.
Despite the results we were never really convincing against anyone. I often check out the opposition fans forums after a game and rarely saw any positive comments towards a GC side.
Can anyone really say they enjoyed games under GC prior to the final whistle?
Football fans are too spoilt these days with top level football available to watch almost every night of the week. We want it all, but in reality very few teams succeed. I often wonder if L2 is genuinely our level given the stadium and reducing crowds, and that we are actually overachieving?
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Post by socrates on Feb 6, 2020 13:11:50 GMT
Were attendences that low ? I thought we were getting about 7000 most weeks, which is what we’ve always averaged in league 1 for donkeys years. The bigger crowd under DC were down to momentum after back to back promotions but rare for us since we’ve left Eastville. IF we’d stayed top six that would have increased and we would have been getting 9000 + in the run in. All those stay away fans due to coughlans style haven’t come back have they. Our average crowds for the last 3 seasons were: 16/17 - 9,302 (finished 10th) 17/18 - 8.933 (finished 13th) 18/19 - 8,320 (finished 15th) I think averaging 7000-7500 when we’re 4th in the league is considerably low. And I think if we were in that position playing attractive attacking football it would’ve been above 9k personally. Yeah but like I said that’s DC post double promotion. I’d be interested to see When trollop was manager in league 1. I’m pretty sure we used to get around 7000 quite regularly and to be honest I’m not sure about Holloway as it’s so long ago...
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Post by landrover on Feb 6, 2020 16:40:47 GMT
A bit of digging reveals numbers a bit less that we thought. Trollop’s time saw gates averaging just over 7,000 in his first season then a drop down to 5,500 returning to around 7,000 just before he left. Ollie’s time saw gates averaging between 5,500 and 6,000. Memory can play tricks it seems.
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Post by Topper Gas on Feb 6, 2020 18:28:11 GMT
Were attendences that low ? I thought we were getting about 7000 most weeks, which is what we’ve always averaged in league 1 for donkeys years. The bigger crowd under DC were down to momentum after back to back promotions but rare for us since we’ve left Eastville. IF we’d stayed top six that would have increased and we would have been getting 9000 + in the run in. All those stay away fans due to coughlans style haven’t come back have they. Our average crowds for the last 3 seasons were: 16/17 - 9,302 (finished 10th) 17/18 - 8.933 (finished 13th) 18/19 - 8,320 (finished 15th) I think averaging 7000-7500 when we’re 4th in the league is considerably low. And I think if we were in that position playing attractive attacking football it would’ve been above 9k personally. Problem is once you lose 1,000 or so season ticket holders it's hard to get them back, they did seem to return for the Festive season games but then promptly disappeared again. If we were winning games and will a chance of making the play offs fans would have returned regardless, the problem now is we're losing games and the football no better, which is the worse of both worlds.
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Post by Topper Gas on Feb 6, 2020 18:34:05 GMT
I just can't see the youngsters BG's signed making that big a difference, as the core of the team will still be DC/GC's, Barrett who you'd hope would make a difference in midfield has hardly set the team alight so far, meaning we have two new wingers and 3 new strikers plus Harries but still no RB or central midfielders. Personally I don't think we needed another RB in the last window. Hare will hopefully be back soon. And we have Little too. Also Rodman has done a great job filling in at RB. And Kilgour can do a job there too - although I rather he be in the middle of the defence and not full back. There is no rush for a new RB right now. Maybe if Little goes in the summer then yeah get another in then. We got in 7 new players in the window, which no one really expected. Getting in a RB when we have 3/4 players already who can fill in that position just seems like a waste of funds.
Same in the CM position. We have plenty of players already in that area. I have no doubts BG will strengthen that area in the summer after some will go. But I guess in the last window some would have had to go first before any could come in.
We lacked strikers and wingers. That's what BG mainly brought in. They give us options. We can now play pretty much any formation we want and have width and more attacking options than before with hopefully as they gel more and get fitter, we will see more creative play. You cant see them making a difference. I think they will work well. We'll see how it goes.
I can't see BG ever trusting Little to be a regular starter as he must already be more or less fit now, let's hope he only signed a 1 year contract or we'll be stuck with him again next season. Hare must be at least a month away from playing so that's at least 2 months w/o a RB, meanwhile we now have 5 wide men, Rodman, Barrett, M-L, Ginnelly and Bennet, plus THD can play there as well. Whilst we can play any formation we still have the same issues we've had since Hare was injured no RB and also still no replacement for Lines.
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Post by twertonboy on Feb 6, 2020 18:34:50 GMT
I would rather both like the way Leeds play..good flowing football and then hit teams like a train when out of possession. Well they do that most of the time
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Post by twertonboy on Feb 6, 2020 18:38:20 GMT
Pump it up to the big man and get players around him to win the ball high up the pitch is the best way out of this league. Which teams have been promoted from this league playing that style recently? Exactly and play that way in the championship and your be shafted.
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Post by twertonboy on Feb 6, 2020 18:40:53 GMT
We scabbed some results playing it and everyone is obsessed with playing hoof ball. Luton Barnsley Charlton Promoted last year and they all played decent possession football
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Post by markczgas on Feb 7, 2020 9:18:21 GMT
Problem is the core of the team are still all workers not footballers, Lines having been shown the door last summer. Whilst we have, Davies, Craig, Kilgore, Upson, Ogogo & OC as the core there's going to be no drastic changes. Serc's being out injured just adds to the problem. I agree fully with you here. We have a lot of defensive players, which under GC made us hard to beat and thankfully mainly down to JCH scoring our goals, that got us up to 4th. But we have heavily relied on JCH as Nichols, Victor and Smith just didn't score enough. We've lacked big time in attack this whole season. BG's new signings have mainly been attack minded as we've not scoring or creating enough throughout the season. The issue is, with BG's style, those defence minded players that you mentioned are not really good enough to provide service to the new attack minded players - hence the lack of service has meant a lack of chances being created. Hopefully in time as they gel more that should get better. Maybe this is why BG got the players chasing balls down much higher up the pitch creating pressure and hopefully create more chances as a result. Yes lets wait before we judge. We have 6 new outfield players, some haven't even kicked a ball yet and they will have to gel with their new team mates. So I don't think we can say Upson, Sercombe and Rodman won't help create chances for them. Lets compare the last 20 games of the season to the first 24 and see if we create and score more.
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Post by Kingswood Polak on Feb 7, 2020 12:03:57 GMT
Seriously though, a great failure of English football culture is that we think this is a choice between one or the other. . Successful sides have a mixture of both, there doesn’t have to be a choice
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Post by stuartcampbell on Feb 7, 2020 12:40:44 GMT
Got to say no, me personally I'd rather play like the people who are likely going to win a Premier League and Champions League double with an unbeaten Premier League season over Shrewsbury, who despite the fact we were never a great goalscoring team under Coughlan and our long goal-scoring dry spell under Garner, we still have EIGHT more goals than.
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