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Post by warehamgas on May 16, 2017 12:52:43 GMT
In the end we are stuck with it. I will leave it to DC to use the competition how he wants, take it seriously and play the best team, play the reserves and give game time or somewhere in the middle. I will trust DC to do the best for BRFC and try and recoup something positive from a crap competition. UTG!
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2017 1:37:18 GMT
Lets face it the clubs voted to keep the same format so its what they want. I wont be attending because the negative implications are obvious but the majority want this crappy format. Not looking forward to bristol rovers v bristol city under 12"s though,hate the thought of it.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2017 6:05:40 GMT
A desperately sad day for lower league football in this country. The EFL is at the mercy of the financially bloated Premier League who are looking to rip the soul out of another competition having finished the job with their own. They're looking for a playground to showcase and develop their stockpiled talent and many clubs have seemingly sold out to provide it. Disgraceful. The boycott action needs to be stepped up and a clear message sent out that supporters won't accept this. The academies have always struggled to find adequate "adult" competition. Some of the best young talent don't take to first team football due to the physicality and are unable to progress any further. This competition format, as you have correctly identified, is perfect for the huge squads to get game time for the youngsters. They are using lower league clubs as a run out. The increased prize money is bait for lower league clubs and they have fallen for it. It will only get worse if this takes hold and the next step will be div 5 to integrate premier reserves into the pyramid, much like in Europe.
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Post by philbemmygas on May 17, 2017 6:32:15 GMT
A desperately sad day for lower league football in this country. The EFL is at the mercy of the financially bloated Premier League who are looking to rip the soul out of another competition having finished the job with their own. They're looking for a playground to showcase and develop their stockpiled talent and many clubs have seemingly sold out to provide it. Disgraceful. The boycott action needs to be stepped up and a clear message sent out that supporters won't accept this. The academies have always struggled to find adequate "adult" competition. Some of the best young talent don't take to first team football due to the physicality and are unable to progress any further. This competition format, as you have correctly identified, is perfect for the huge squads to get game time for the youngsters. They are using lower league clubs as a run out. The increased prize money is bait for lower league clubs and they have fallen for it. It will only get worse if this takes hold and the next step will be div 5 to integrate premier reserves into the pyramid, much like in Europe. Will we get to play in "red" when that happens?
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2017 8:24:27 GMT
A desperately sad day for lower league football in this country. The EFL is at the mercy of the financially bloated Premier League who are looking to rip the soul out of another competition having finished the job with their own. They're looking for a playground to showcase and develop their stockpiled talent and many clubs have seemingly sold out to provide it. Disgraceful. The boycott action needs to be stepped up and a clear message sent out that supporters won't accept this. The academies have always struggled to find adequate "adult" competition. Some of the best young talent don't take to first team football due to the physicality and are unable to progress any further. This competition format, as you have correctly identified, is perfect for the huge squads to get game time for the youngsters. They are using lower league clubs as a run out. The increased prize money is bait for lower league clubs and they have fallen for it. It will only get worse if this takes hold and the next step will be div 5 to integrate premier reserves into the pyramid, much like in Europe. Exactly. It's also worth remembering that part of the 'first team football' experience is playing infront of bigger crowds and atmospheres. In that respect, we hold the cards.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2017 8:27:36 GMT
Lets face it the clubs voted to keep the same format so its what they want. I wont be attending because the negative implications are obvious but the majority want this crappy format. Not looking forward to bristol rovers v bristol city under 12"s though,hate the thought of it. The majority of lower league chairman/owners want this format due to the £20k participation carrot and prize pot. The majority of supporters evidently don't want U23/B teams anywhere near lower league competitions.
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Post by warehamgas on May 17, 2017 8:43:33 GMT
A desperately sad day for lower league football in this country. The EFL is at the mercy of the financially bloated Premier League who are looking to rip the soul out of another competition having finished the job with their own. They're looking for a playground to showcase and develop their stockpiled talent and many clubs have seemingly sold out to provide it. Disgraceful. The boycott action needs to be stepped up and a clear message sent out that supporters won't accept this. The academies have always struggled to find adequate "adult" competition. Some of the best young talent don't take to first team football due to the physicality and are unable to progress any further. This competition format, as you have correctly identified, is perfect for the huge squads to get game time for the youngsters. They are using lower league clubs as a run out. The increased prize money is bait for lower league clubs and they have fallen for it. It will only get worse if this takes hold and the next step will be div 5 to integrate premier reserves into the pyramid, much like in Europe. I can almost remember where this came from. In the 70s and 80s when our national team was not the best and everyone was saying about the poor skill levels of our young players they thought they didn't get enough playing against their own age players and they were all about being being physical in a man's league. Now they have developed all these age groups and let's face it the youth development in this country has an awful lot of game time. They are now spending so much time playing youth football where the art of tackling and being "physical" is frowned on it has gone the other way. Young players, and we've seen a few this season, have almost lost the art of being physical in a man's game. JAke S-C was a good centre half with good positional sense but struggled against the bigger, more physical forwards. Colkett was just muscled out of it often and didn't want to get involved with anything physical, nor did Boateng. Yet the PL teams want to give their young players experience of man's football. It's almost as if the argument has flipped over completely, now we have young players who want to show some skill but when they come up against physical players find it hard. The transition to first team football is hard and the PL are trying to bridge the gap by paying us to do it for them. They want that and the lower league clubs want the money! Unfortunately money talks! UTG!
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2017 9:57:45 GMT
The academies have always struggled to find adequate "adult" competition. Some of the best young talent don't take to first team football due to the physicality and are unable to progress any further. This competition format, as you have correctly identified, is perfect for the huge squads to get game time for the youngsters. They are using lower league clubs as a run out. The increased prize money is bait for lower league clubs and they have fallen for it. It will only get worse if this takes hold and the next step will be div 5 to integrate premier reserves into the pyramid, much like in Europe. I can almost remember where this came from. In the 70s and 80s when our national team was not the best and everyone was saying about the poor skill levels of our young players they thought they didn't get enough playing against their own age players and they were all about being being physical in a man's league. Now they have developed all these age groups and let's face it the youth development in this country has an awful lot of game time. They are now spending so much time playing youth football where the art of tackling and being "physical" is frowned on it has gone the other way. Young players, and we've seen a few this season, have almost lost the art of being physical in a man's game. JAke S-C was a good centre half with good positional sense but struggled against the bigger, more physical forwards. Colkett was just muscled out of it often and didn't want to get involved with anything physical, nor did Boateng. Yet the PL teams want to give their young players experience of man's football. It's almost as if the argument has flipped over completely, now we have young players who want to show some skill but when they come up against physical players find it hard. The transition to first team football is hard and the PL are trying to bridge the gap by paying us to do it for them. They want that and the lower league clubs want the money! Unfortunately money talks!UTG! But ultimately, where does money in the game come from? The PL are trying to collect as many youngsters as possible and retain them for as long as possible in order to get the maximum transfer fee when they inevitably leave. Lower league clubs are often walking a financial tightrope and therefore can be easily targeted through conditional payments. If PL were genuinely interested in the wider game in this country, they would subsidise loans of younger players to lower league clubs in order to get them this experience they deem so valuable.
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Post by Topper Gas on May 17, 2017 10:10:52 GMT
I can almost remember where this came from. In the 70s and 80s when our national team was not the best and everyone was saying about the poor skill levels of our young players they thought they didn't get enough playing against their own age players and they were all about being being physical in a man's league. Now they have developed all these age groups and let's face it the youth development in this country has an awful lot of game time. They are now spending so much time playing youth football where the art of tackling and being "physical" is frowned on it has gone the other way. Young players, and we've seen a few this season, have almost lost the art of being physical in a man's game. JAke S-C was a good centre half with good positional sense but struggled against the bigger, more physical forwards. Colkett was just muscled out of it often and didn't want to get involved with anything physical, nor did Boateng. Yet the PL teams want to give their young players experience of man's football. It's almost as if the argument has flipped over completely, now we have young players who want to show some skill but when they come up against physical players find it hard. The transition to first team football is hard and the PL are trying to bridge the gap by paying us to do it for them. They want that and the lower league clubs want the money! Unfortunately money talks!UTG! But ultimately, where does money in the game come from? The PL are trying to collect as many youngsters as possible and retain them for as long as possible in order to get the maximum transfer fee when they inevitably leave. Lower league clubs are often walking a financial tightrope and therefore can be easily targeted through conditional payments. If PL were genuinely interested in the wider game in this country, they would subsidise loans of younger players to lower league clubs in order to get them this experience they deem so valuable. I doubt we paid Lumley & co's full wages last season?
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Post by Antonio Fargas on May 17, 2017 10:23:43 GMT
If PL were genuinely interested in the wider game in this country, they would subsidise loans of younger players to lower league clubs in order to get them this experience they deem so valuable. Yeah, or have maximum squad sizes.
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Post by warehamgas on May 17, 2017 11:06:21 GMT
I can almost remember where this came from. In the 70s and 80s when our national team was not the best and everyone was saying about the poor skill levels of our young players they thought they didn't get enough playing against their own age players and they were all about being being physical in a man's league. Now they have developed all these age groups and let's face it the youth development in this country has an awful lot of game time. They are now spending so much time playing youth football where the art of tackling and being "physical" is frowned on it has gone the other way. Young players, and we've seen a few this season, have almost lost the art of being physical in a man's game. JAke S-C was a good centre half with good positional sense but struggled against the bigger, more physical forwards. Colkett was just muscled out of it often and didn't want to get involved with anything physical, nor did Boateng. Yet the PL teams want to give their young players experience of man's football. It's almost as if the argument has flipped over completely, now we have young players who want to show some skill but when they come up against physical players find it hard. The transition to first team football is hard and the PL are trying to bridge the gap by paying us to do it for them. They want that and the lower league clubs want the money! Unfortunately money talks!UTG! But ultimately, where does money in the game come from? The PL are trying to collect as many youngsters as possible and retain them for as long as possible in order to get the maximum transfer fee when they inevitably leave. Lower league clubs are often walking a financial tightrope and therefore can be easily targeted through conditional payments. If PL were genuinely interested in the wider game in this country, they would subsidise loans of younger players to lower league clubs in order to get them this experience they deem so valuable.I guess they probably do that and that is one if the ways lower league clubs benefit. As Topper said I expect Sweeney and Lumley were subsidised although I don't know for sure. This whole argument is tied up with what the Accrington owner said about the PL and how he was shot down by the PL when they said if you don't want our help then don't take it. Whatever way you look at it the PL have the lower league clubs where they want them. The PL take the vast majority of the TV revenues and with overseas rights the PL has become a money making machine. Us lower league clubs have to get from it what we can. The formation of the PL set the scene and we now have to accept whatever crumbs we can. Sad but I think true. Sorry, from a thread about the checkatrade trophy I've appeared to go off on a rant at the PL and the greed surrounding it. UTG!
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2017 11:41:55 GMT
But ultimately, where does money in the game come from? The PL are trying to collect as many youngsters as possible and retain them for as long as possible in order to get the maximum transfer fee when they inevitably leave. Lower league clubs are often walking a financial tightrope and therefore can be easily targeted through conditional payments. If PL were genuinely interested in the wider game in this country, they would subsidise loans of younger players to lower league clubs in order to get them this experience they deem so valuable.I guess they probably do that and that is one if the ways lower league clubs benefit. As Topper said I expect Sweeney and Lumley were subsidised although I don't know for sure. This whole argument is tied up with what the Accrington owner said about the PL and how he was shot down by the PL when they said if you don't want our help then don't take it. Whatever way you look at it the PL have the lower league clubs where they want them. The PL take the vast majority of the TV revenues and with overseas rights the PL has become a money making machine. Us lower league clubs have to get from it what we can. The formation of the PL set the scene and we now have to accept whatever crumbs we can. Sad but I think true.Sorry, from a thread about the checkatrade trophy I've appeared to go off on a rant at the PL and the greed surrounding it. UTG! Agree that they've become money making machines but can't accept the idea that we should simply surrender a fundamental principle of 130 years of the Football League. The football league structure in this country is envied across the world. Just last Saturday we saw nearly 8,000 at Halifax in the play-off final in the 6th tier. To add some context, that's higher than the highest home attendance of 11 clubs in Italy's second tier, 11 in French second tier, 9 in Spanish second tier and 8 in the top flight in Portugal. An amazing figure which illustrates the popularity of lower league competition and match day experiences. Ultimately football supporters are the biggest actors in the game. The game is nothing without us. If we take a stand on something and vote with feet, it causes the powers that be a real problem. It was only recently the Premier League panicked at the prospect of away fans boycotting/protesting by reducing away ticket prices to £20. If the income streams of lower league clubs were threatened by a withdrawal of financial input by supporters, they would absolutely have to review their support for the EFL Trophy changes. The introduction of U23/B teams simply isn't acceptable and the money offered should have been rejected out of sight. The integrity of the lower leagues is at stake here and it's worrying that many seem oblivious to the threat it poses to our identity and hopes to climb the footballing ladder.
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Post by warehamgas on May 17, 2017 15:39:31 GMT
I guess they probably do that and that is one if the ways lower league clubs benefit. As Topper said I expect Sweeney and Lumley were subsidised although I don't know for sure. This whole argument is tied up with what the Accrington owner said about the PL and how he was shot down by the PL when they said if you don't want our help then don't take it. Whatever way you look at it the PL have the lower league clubs where they want them. The PL take the vast majority of the TV revenues and with overseas rights the PL has become a money making machine. Us lower league clubs have to get from it what we can. The formation of the PL set the scene and we now have to accept whatever crumbs we can. Sad but I think true.Sorry, from a thread about the checkatrade trophy I've appeared to go off on a rant at the PL and the greed surrounding it. UTG! Agree that they've become money making machines but can't accept the idea that we should simply surrender a fundamental principle of 130 years of the Football League. The football league structure in this country is envied across the world. Just last Saturday we saw nearly 8,000 at Halifax in the play-off final in the 6th tier. To add some context, that's higher than the highest home attendance of 11 clubs in Italy's second tier, 11 in French second tier, 9 in Spanish second tier and 8 in the top flight in Portugal. An amazing figure which illustrates the popularity of lower league competition and match day experiences. Ultimately football supporters are the biggest actors in the game. The game is nothing without us. If we take a stand on something and vote with feet, it causes the powers that be a real problem. It was only recently the Premier League panicked at the prospect of away fans boycotting/protesting by reducing away ticket prices to £20. If the income streams of lower league clubs were threatened by a withdrawal of financial input by supporters, they would absolutely have to review their support for the EFL Trophy changes. The introduction of U23/B teams simply isn't acceptable and the money offered should have been rejected out of sight. The integrity of the lower leagues is at stake here and it's worrying that many seem oblivious to the threat it poses to our identity and hopes to climb the footballing ladder. Sorry, who mentioned surrender? I didn't and certainly don't think we should. We have to get out of it what we can and make it work for us and with regards the checkatrade I've said earlier on I trust DC to use it how he sees fit. But as we've seen, fans input last season with boycotts and low crowds was taking a stand as you wanted but had no effect. The EFL have continued with the experiment because 66% of the clubs accepted the money offered. Id like to think you were right in saying if income streams were threatened then the clubs would have to review their support for the EFL Trophy but evidence last season indicates otherwise. If you want to stop the U-23 teams then the clubs have to vote against it. Yes the money should be rejected as Rovers did and the integrity of the league is at stake but if you think the EFL are going to help then I think you're wrong. The clubs have to vote against it because if nothing else this past week has shown that Harvey and the EFL will do nothing just because fans don't like it. They are not concerned with what we think. In the end we support our club and I want and trust DC to use the competition as he sees fit and use the loan market, now that the PL clubs have hoovered up much of the young talent, to our advantage and make the PL clubs pay the wages! I don't consider that surrender but it's pointless thinking just because we don't like something and we boycott a competition that the powers that be will say sorry and change their minds. It is simple we have to vote against it as a club and hope enough are like minded and do the same. Your reply gets no argument from me because I agree with most of what you say but please don't say I'm saying something when I'm really not! 😀 UTG!
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