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Post by LJG on Feb 1, 2018 12:38:48 GMT
so like a lot of clubs then But wouldn't it be nice if we could not be one of those clubs? To actually be able to keep hold of a few of our better ones so the club goes up the leagues rather than one individual? The risk is, if you rely on that for income, and you don't unearth one, you stagnate. It's been working wonderfully for Peterborough for over 10 years. It has even brought them championship football at times. You're basically wishing we had mediocre players that no one further up the chain would be interested in. Every club is a selling club bar the top 6 in the prem. |
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Post by gashead1981 on Feb 1, 2018 12:46:22 GMT
🙄🙄🤦🏼♂️🤦🏼♂️ There is no logical debate with some people. I’m not talking about signing Ronaldo for £80m and putting him on £500k a week. If we could have kept Bodin and Taylor on 10k per week or a higher wage plus a good bonus I think we would be at the sharp end of L1. A club that is pushing onto the championship will then draw a better caliber of player. I’m not saying we need a return to the halcyon days of paying anyone 4-8k per week on 3 year deals. But recognise your assets and invest in them to push forward. Example: City keeping hold of Flint in the summer. Hasn’t DC also said he can’t keep selling his best players? That message in effect is exactly what I have said. And THAT is why you are not running a football club!
Those sort of wages would cripple us in League 1 with our income, especially if the gamble doesn't pay off and you miss out on promotion. Just ask Leyton Orient.
I'm not talking about playing with our income streams. I am talking about the owners underpinning the investment or increasing the salary cap DC has to play with by giving him the budget he wants. I'm also not saying to sign a squad load of players on top money, like Orient did, but lock in your best assets and reward with achievement. Of course you can only hold on to players for so long if the club doesn't achieve, similar to Scott Hogan at Brentford, he committed himself there and then got himself a big move to Villa. |
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Post by gashead1981 on Feb 1, 2018 12:57:47 GMT
But wouldn't it be nice if we could not be one of those clubs? To actually be able to keep hold of a few of our better ones so the club goes up the leagues rather than one individual? The risk is, if you rely on that for income, and you don't unearth one, you stagnate. It's been working wonderfully for Peterborough for over 10 years. It has even brought them championship football at times. You're basically wishing we had mediocre players that no one further up the chain would be interested in. Every club is a selling club bar the top 6 in the prem. Not every player there is home grown though is it. They paid £300k for Nichols as well, that's a fair price, Bogle on loan from Cardiff, I bet that isn't £2k a week and I bet they offered a good wage to try and resign Tomlin as well. How can you deduce from what I wrote that I want mediocre players at the club? Where have I ever insinuated that?! If you have a core of 3-4 outstanding players that will earn you promotion to a higher league and give you twice the revenue stream that you earn in a lower league just on tv money and FA subsidiaries, isn't it a bit short term vision to cash in for what maybe 1/3 of that potential revenue? |
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Post by LJG on Feb 1, 2018 13:07:16 GMT
It's been working wonderfully for Peterborough for over 10 years. It has even brought them championship football at times. You're basically wishing we had mediocre players that no one further up the chain would be interested in. Every club is a selling club bar the top 6 in the prem. Not every player there is home grown though is it. They paid £300k for Nichols as well, that's a fair price, Bogle on loan from Cardiff, I bet that isn't £2k a week and I bet they offered a good wage to try and resign Tomlin as well. How can you deduce from what I wrote that I want mediocre players at the club? Where have I ever insinuated that?! If you have a core of 3-4 outstanding players that will earn you promotion to a higher league and give you twice the revenue stream that you earn in a lower league just on tv money and FA subsidiaries, isn't it a bit short term vision to cash in for what maybe 1/3 of that potential revenue? I didn't say every player there is home-grown. We spent £300k on Nicholls too, what's your point? I can quite easily deduce from what you've said that you want mediocre players. You don't want us to sell our best players. There are two ways to achieve that: 1) be at the top of the pile, 2) have players no one else is interested in. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2018 13:12:23 GMT
Yesterday was an emotional rollercoaster all made up in my own head! Thankfully I’m calm again now! Good signings I reckon! Bring on the shrews! UTG!
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Post by madgas on Feb 1, 2018 13:21:00 GMT
And THAT is why you are not running a football club!
Those sort of wages would cripple us in League 1 with our income, especially if the gamble doesn't pay off and you miss out on promotion. Just ask Leyton Orient.
I'm not talking about playing with our income streams. I am talking about the owners underpinning the investment or increasing the salary cap DC has to play with by giving him the budget he wants. I'm also not saying to sign a squad load of players on top money, like Orient did, but lock in your best assets and reward with achievement. Of course you can only hold on to players for so long if the club doesn't achieve, similar to Scott Hogan at Brentford, he committed himself there and then got himself a big move to Villa. And how do you expect the other players that are currently preforming so well to react. If someone doing the same job gets a 3 times pay increase- you’d expect something yourself. Also 10k? That certainly crazy money. |
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Post by gashead1981 on Feb 1, 2018 13:27:13 GMT
Not every player there is home grown though is it. They paid £300k for Nichols as well, that's a fair price, Bogle on loan from Cardiff, I bet that isn't £2k a week and I bet they offered a good wage to try and resign Tomlin as well. How can you deduce from what I wrote that I want mediocre players at the club? Where have I ever insinuated that?! If you have a core of 3-4 outstanding players that will earn you promotion to a higher league and give you twice the revenue stream that you earn in a lower league just on tv money and FA subsidiaries, isn't it a bit short term vision to cash in for what maybe 1/3 of that potential revenue? I didn't say every player there is home-grown. We spent £300k on Nicholls too, what's your point? I can quite easily deduce from what you've said that you want mediocre players. You don't want us to sell our best players. There are two ways to achieve that: 1) be at the top of the pile, 2) have players no one else is interested in. The model at P'boro works because they pay good wages to start with and with better release clauses it means they don't sell star assets for peanuts! They also buy in players at quite a high price for a significant return like Jack Marriott for example. Its not often they sell one on they picked up for nothing or has come through their academy. So their model is nothing like what we have to do. Your second point you are trying to enforce makes no sense at all. My point is, we have a player on £4k a week knocking in 30 in a season or providing 10 assists or what ever outstanding visible week in week out quality he brings to the team, and he is only on a on a 1 year deal or low salary, we need to extend that contract and increase his salary with a better performance one. If we can't do that because our existing salary cap doesnt allow it, but as the ALQ's, as they say, want to evolve the club then part of that is giving DC the finances to keep his better players. This will then give the club a greater chance to push on from mid table to higher up the league. From what DC says, he is robbing Peter to pay Paul or is limited as to who he can attract etc. We could have made the play offs last year if Taylor had stayed, but because we didn't give him a better contract on promotion to L2, we got caught out the following summer and the tail wagged the dog when it came to negotiations meaning we lost a star player for peanuts. |
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Post by gashead1981 on Feb 1, 2018 13:32:40 GMT
I'm not talking about playing with our income streams. I am talking about the owners underpinning the investment or increasing the salary cap DC has to play with by giving him the budget he wants. I'm also not saying to sign a squad load of players on top money, like Orient did, but lock in your best assets and reward with achievement. Of course you can only hold on to players for so long if the club doesn't achieve, similar to Scott Hogan at Brentford, he committed himself there and then got himself a big move to Villa. And how do you expect the other players that are currently preforming so well to react. If someone doing the same job gets a 3 times pay increase- you’d expect something yourself. Also 10k? That certainly crazy money. It comes down to individual contribution and performance too doesnt it? In any team you will have star performers regardless of job it is. If you want out of this league and then compete in the Championship once you are there, that is the kind of figure you are looking at for star players. |
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Post by LJG on Feb 1, 2018 13:38:00 GMT
I didn't say every player there is home-grown. We spent £300k on Nicholls too, what's your point? I can quite easily deduce from what you've said that you want mediocre players. You don't want us to sell our best players. There are two ways to achieve that: 1) be at the top of the pile, 2) have players no one else is interested in. The model at P'boro works because they pay good wages to start with and with better release clauses it means they don't sell star assets for peanuts! They also buy in players at quite a high price for a significant return like Jack Marriott for example. Its not often they sell one on they picked up for nothing or has come through their academy. So their model is nothing like what we have to do. Your second point you are trying to enforce makes no sense at all. My point is, we have a player on £4k a week knocking in 30 in a season or providing 10 assists or what ever outstanding visible week in week out quality he brings to the team, and he is only on a on a 1 year deal or low salary, we need to extend that contract and increase his salary with a better performance one. If we can't do that because our existing salary cap doesnt allow it, but as the ALQ's, as they say, want to evolve the club then part of that is giving DC the finances to keep his better players. This will then give the club a greater chance to push on from mid table to higher up the league. From what DC says, he is robbing Peter to pay Paul or is limited as to who he can attract etc. We could have made the play offs last year if Taylor had stayed, but because we didn't give him a better contract on promotion to L2, we got caught out the following summer and the tail wagged the dog when it came to negotiations meaning we lost a star player for peanuts. The model at Peterborough is to pick up promising lower league players and develop them. Like George Boyd. Like Craig Mackail-Smith. Like they wanted with Ricky Miller. My second point makes perfect sense. Name a club that can retain players in the face of premier league interest. Your point regarding Taylor is moot since it was Taylor and his agent who enforced the inclusion of the release clause not the club. Taylor wouldn't sign a new contract without it. |
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Post by faggotygas on Feb 1, 2018 13:42:27 GMT
Basically, you wish you were suporting PSG or Real Madrid. 🙄🙄🤦🏼♂️🤦🏼♂️ There is no logical debate with some people. I’m not talking about signing Ronaldo for £80m and putting him on £500k a week. If we could have kept Bodin and Taylor on 10k per week or a higher wage plus a good bonus I think we would be at the sharp end of L1. A club that is pushing onto the championship will then draw a better caliber of player. I’m not saying we need a return to the halcyon days of paying anyone 4-8k per week on 3 year deals. But recognise your assets and invest in them to push forward. Example: City keeping hold of Flint in the summer. Hasn’t DC also said he can’t keep selling his best players? That message in effect is exactly what I have said. There's no way on earth we could afford to spend over a million quid a year on 2 players, that's like a third of our entire playing budget. And what would other players think - would Ellis, for example, not be demanding parity? Or Locks? Financial suicide, and suicide on the pitch too as all sence of 'in this together' is lost.
The reason I give those examples is that every club, except them, will sell their best players for the right offer. Just last month Liverpool sold Coutinho, Arsenal sold Sanchez.
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Post by Topper Gas on Feb 1, 2018 13:44:02 GMT
And how do you expect the other players that are currently preforming so well to react. If someone doing the same job gets a 3 times pay increase- you’d expect something yourself. Also 10k? That certainly crazy money. It comes down to individual contribution and performance too doesnt it? In any team you will have star performers regardless of job it is. If you want out of this league and then compete in the Championship once you are there, that is the kind of figure you are looking at for star players. We can only pay what we can afford, there's no point in sending the club into Admin just to keep players like Harrison at the club. Plus even if we offered Harrison etc a contract doubling their wages we can't force him to sign it if they fancy playing at an higher grade. The fact Locks and Broadbent have already signed improved contracts suggest we're trying to do the right thing. |
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Post by baggins on Feb 1, 2018 13:45:05 GMT
And how do you expect the other players that are currently preforming so well to react. If someone doing the same job gets a 3 times pay increase- you’d expect something yourself. Also 10k? That certainly crazy money. It comes down to individual contribution and performance too doesnt it? In any team you will have star performers regardless of job it is. If you want out of this league and then compete in the Championship once you are there, that is the kind of figure you are looking at for star players. And we simply don't have that sort of cash hanging about. |
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Post by madgas on Feb 2, 2018 0:26:53 GMT
I didn't say every player there is home-grown. We spent £300k on Nicholls too, what's your point? I can quite easily deduce from what you've said that you want mediocre players. You don't want us to sell our best players. There are two ways to achieve that: 1) be at the top of the pile, 2) have players no one else is interested in. The model at P'boro works because they pay good wages to start with and with better release clauses it means they don't sell star assets for peanuts! They also buy in players at quite a high price for a significant return like Jack Marriott for example. Its not often they sell one on they picked up for nothing or has come through their academy. So their model is nothing like what we have to do. Your second point you are trying to enforce makes no sense at all. My point is, we have a player on £4k a week knocking in 30 in a season or providing 10 assists or what ever outstanding visible week in week out quality he brings to the team, and he is only on a on a 1 year deal or low salary, we need to extend that contract and increase his salary with a better performance one. If we can't do that because our existing salary cap doesnt allow it, but as the ALQ's, as they say, want to evolve the club then part of that is giving DC the finances to keep his better players. This will then give the club a greater chance to push on from mid table to higher up the league. From what DC says, he is robbing Peter to pay Paul or is limited as to who he can attract etc. We could have made the play offs last year if Taylor had stayed, but because we didn't give him a better contract on promotion to L2, we got caught out the following summer and the tail wagged the dog when it came to negotiations meaning we lost a star player for peanuts. The football club also owe their owner 18m. Not sure that’s desirable, |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2018 3:55:13 GMT
Im not convinced by people using peterborough as a good model in the football world.
I mean they have sold all these players at fantastic profit and their 4 points above us in league 1!
They had 2 seasons in the championship which resulted in instant relegation.
So whats the point of peterborough?
Even burton have got a 2nd season in the championship on 3,000 crowds.
They were desperate to sell marriot in the transfer window but nobody was interested,in contrast after bodin left dc plainly stated nobody else was going and true to his word they didnt.
Menayese got a brilliant loan to swindon but thats about a young player maybe getting game time in league 2.
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