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Post by gasheadbatesy on Dec 31, 2015 10:07:31 GMT
Looking like next year might just be the year then.
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Post by Topper Gas on Dec 31, 2015 11:53:17 GMT
I assume if you'd invested millions in Rovers, had spent countless hours working for them w/o pay, you'd just had over the club to the first investor who turned up and wipe off your investment? Whilst I'm no great fan of NH's time as Chairman we have to accept he's entitled to some return on his investment, particularly if the plans he's drawn up for the UWE are so attractive that an investor is prepared to invest £40/50m in his stadium plan?. How is a loan that gets paid back in full, with interest and at no risk to any poor decisions you make an investment? I'm not saying we could have done it without his money, nor am I saying I'm ungrateful but let's call it what it is. Its a risk free low interest loan that is secured against the club and will be repaid once he leaves regardless of where his leadership has left us either by new/current directors or any potential new buyer. Investment it isn't. From Wiki: Investment is time, energy, or matter spent in the hope of future benefits actualized within a specified date or time frame. Sounds like NH's involvement has been an "investment" to me, whether it was a good one for him & the club is still to be seen.
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Post by Topper Gas on Dec 31, 2015 11:56:12 GMT
Hugo I love you dearly. However, be it a loan or whatever, it a very high risk investment that nearly failed. It's also out of his capital so he's losing interest that he might otherwise be gaining by holding it in safer investments. Except that 2.5 to 4.0% above bank rate is risk interest for the risk investment. And what risk is there against the Mem equity? Problem for NH now is that our debts are getting closer to the equity value, plus I'm not sure it's that simple to sell the Mem to release equity and leave the club homeless?
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Post by simon1883 on Dec 31, 2015 12:09:25 GMT
Last time I had a nose on line, the Memorial Stadium Co. was owned in part by TW and GD (directors) can't remember seeing NH in there. Could be wrong tho
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Post by spiess1 on Dec 31, 2015 12:13:46 GMT
"...Last time I had a nose on line..." So you're a cokehead? (JOKE)
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Post by Topper Gas on Dec 31, 2015 14:13:32 GMT
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Dec 31, 2015 14:25:51 GMT
How is a loan that gets paid back in full, with interest and at no risk to any poor decisions you make an investment? I'm not saying we could have done it without his money, nor am I saying I'm ungrateful but let's call it what it is. Its a risk free low interest loan that is secured against the club and will be repaid once he leaves regardless of where his leadership has left us either by new/current directors or any potential new buyer. Investment it isn't. From Wiki: Investment is time, energy, or matter spent in the hope of future benefits actualized within a specified date or time frame. Sounds like NH's involvement has been an "investment" to me, whether it was a good one for him & the club is still to be seen. Sorry, as you said "invested millions" I assumed you meant pounds not minutes. My apologies.
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Post by Jon the Stripe on Dec 31, 2015 14:39:55 GMT
From Wiki: Investment is time, energy, or matter spent in the hope of future benefits actualized within a specified date or time frame. Sounds like NH's involvement has been an "investment" to me, whether it was a good one for him & the club is still to be seen. Sorry, as you said "invested millions" I assumed you meant pounds not minutes. My apologies. This always confuses me - supporters like yourself Hugo invest millions of minutes too following and supporting their team and although they invest only "Thousands" of pounds they don't have any chance of getting any back and have absolutely no say whatsoever on what happens at their club and don't get an opportunity to make any decisions - i respect those who put/lend money into the club but the real benefit is the power they get in return to basically do as they please with the club WE ALL love - to do all that and still expect all your money back even if you are culpable for losing much of it seems absolutely ludicrous - in my opinion - UTG
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Post by orgasmic on Dec 31, 2015 14:49:41 GMT
Sorry, as you said "invested millions" I assumed you meant pounds not minutes. My apologies. This always confuses me - supporters like yourself Hugo invest millions of minutes too following and supporting their team and although they invest only "Thousands" of pounds they don't have any chance of getting any back and have absolutely no say whatsoever on what happens at their club and don't get an opportunity to make any decisions - i respect those who put/lend money into the club but the real benefit is the power they get in return to basically do as they please with the club WE ALL love - to do all that and still expect all your money back even if you are culpable for losing much of it seems absolutely ludicrous - in my opinion - UTG Welcome to modern football Jon! I'm afraid it's a business which is why it is more difficult for us loyal fans to comprehend what goes on behind the scenes!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2015 15:07:47 GMT
Looking like next year might just be the year then. LOL, next year, the year after that or the year after that..? Any day now though, any day...
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Post by lpgas on Dec 31, 2015 21:41:02 GMT
Still don't believe it
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Post by stuart1974 on Dec 31, 2015 22:00:39 GMT
I have thought about the situation and how things have developed over the last year or so, the following is partly tongue in cheek and partly serious. I will leave it you to you to decide which if any is plausible and whether this is more Inspector Clouseau or Miss Marple. The timeline is how I remember it so happy to be corrected.
In summer of 2014, fresh from relegation to the fifth tier for the first time ever and knowing how Sainsbury’s where behaving, NH was under pressure to have some good news. After a poor start to life in non league football, he struggled with even a basic interview with GT on Radio Bristol. Becoming desperate now he agreed to an interview with a former Post journalist based in the Gulf.
This article was read, either directly or indirectly by the investor (it may be the Jordanian gentleman who was following Fan Boy on Twitter or even the Malaysian business, YTL Utilities, who have just bought Filton Airfield) and they became interested and started to look deeper.
They realised the potential of not just the team and its fan base (sharing a population of over 1m people with only one other club) but also the UWE, their plans for expansion and the local area in general. This is where Henbury’s suggestion of Icon Group becoming interested fits in as they may be the ones who run the whole event once the agreements are reached. After some tentative talks through a mediator, they were knocked back and getting nowhere whilst the court case was pending.
The board chose to take out the commercial loan rather than the directors funding it privately as it would become a secured debt on the club/stadium which would have to be repaid as part of buying the club rather than a private loan which would be converted into shares. I am not too sure of the significance here but think it was more deliberate rather than desperate (although Barclays pulling out would have added to the urgency).
NH brought in Colin Sexstone to help. This may be for the potential Plan B which would be a part owned or wholly leased reduced stadium, possibly with a running track and would be more a UWE ran community facility rather than a dedicated football ground.
Fearing losing the investment opportunity of the whole site (not just the stadium), the investors or a member (or former member) of the board let it be known through a well regarded fan of their interest.
Think of this as a move in chess where a piece is strategically placed so movement by the other player is merely restricted, rather than a crude attempt to undermine NH directly. This allows NH to deny the consortium exist until he was ready and for the appeal to be held without prejudice. It also allows time to complete initial negotiations and due diligence requirements.
My personal view (well, more hope really) based on what I have read here and in the Post, is that I think we are just a small part of an overall investment in the area, but a significant one in that it opens up development. If the stadium does not go ahead then the whole project, such as they envision it, will not work financially.
Until we know the result of the appeal, no final agreement on value can be reached so expect no news other than the odd “keep the faith” article.
Looking at the fixture list, it seems to me that the 6 weeks from mid January to the end of February will be massive for us both on and off the pitch. 2014 was awful. 2015 was great. 2016?
Have a good New Year.
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Post by gasincider on Jan 1, 2016 14:39:35 GMT
Just for clarification, Tony Watola does not own a carrot of the Memorial Stadium. He has no shares whatsoever. The fact that he is listed as secretary at Companies House does not confer ownership rights on him. His job title is also referred to as Financial Director, which is also a misnomer. He is not even a director. Basically he is the company accountant. Remember ? The guy who said we were only in the relegation zone for a few minutes, so we didn't have to make provision for possible demotion into the non league abyss.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2016 14:59:46 GMT
Just for clarification, Tony Watola does not own a carrot of the Memorial Stadium. He has no shares whatsoever. The fact that he is listed as secretary at Companies House does not confer ownership rights on him. His job title is also referred to as Financial Director, which is also a misnomer. He is not even a director. Basically he is the company accountant. Remember ? The guy who said we were only in the relegation zone for a few minutes, so we didn't have to make provision for possible demotion into the non league abyss. Any day now though, any day...
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Post by Jon the Stripe on Jan 1, 2016 15:38:03 GMT
Just for clarification, Tony Watola does not own a carrot of the Memorial Stadium. He has no shares whatsoever. The fact that he is listed as secretary at Companies House does not confer ownership rights on him. His job title is also referred to as Financial Director, which is also a misnomer. He is not even a director. Basically he is the company accountant. Remember ? The guy who said we were only in the relegation zone for a few minutes, so we didn't have to make provision for possible demotion into the non league abyss. Any day now though, any day... That's the spirit. UTG
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Post by Topper Gas on Jan 1, 2016 15:43:08 GMT
Just for clarification, Tony Watola does not own a carrot of the Memorial Stadium. He has no shares whatsoever. The fact that he is listed as secretary at Companies House does not confer ownership rights on him. His job title is also referred to as Financial Director, which is also a misnomer. He is not even a director. Basically he is the company accountant. Remember ? The guy who said we were only in the relegation zone for a few minutes, so we didn't have to make provision for possible demotion into the non league abyss. I'm sensing you have a dislike for TW? However, he can hardly be blamed for using the title Financial Director as that's a commen business term/title, even though an FD is not a Director as such.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2016 15:46:23 GMT
Just for clarification, Tony Watola does not own a carrot of the Memorial Stadium. He has no shares whatsoever. The fact that he is listed as secretary at Companies House does not confer ownership rights on him. His job title is also referred to as Financial Director, which is also a misnomer. He is not even a director. Basically he is the company accountant. Remember ? The guy who said we were only in the relegation zone for a few minutes, so we didn't have to make provision for possible demotion into the non league abyss. I'm sensing you have a dislike for TW? However, he can hardly be blamed for using the title Financial Director as that's a commen business term/title, even though an FD is not a Director as such. Exactly, just as the Foreign Secretary isn't a secretary.
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Post by Topper Gas on Jan 1, 2016 15:54:06 GMT
I have thought about the situation and how things have developed over the last year or so, the following is partly tongue in cheek and partly serious. I will leave it you to you to decide which if any is plausible and whether this is more Inspector Clouseau or Miss Marple. The timeline is how I remember it so happy to be corrected. In summer of 2014, fresh from relegation to the fifth tier for the first time ever and knowing how Sainsbury’s where behaving, NH was under pressure to have some good news. After a poor start to life in non league football, he struggled with even a basic interview with GT on Radio Bristol. Becoming desperate now he agreed to an interview with a former Post journalist based in the Gulf. This article was read, either directly or indirectly by the investor (it may be the Jordanian gentleman who was following Fan Boy on Twitter or even the Malaysian business, YTL Utilities, who have just bought Filton Airfield) and they became interested and started to look deeper. They realised the potential of not just the team and its fan base (sharing a population of over 1m people with only one other club) but also the UWE, their plans for expansion and the local area in general. This is where Henbury’s suggestion of Icon Group becoming interested fits in as they may be the ones who run the whole event once the agreements are reached. After some tentative talks through a mediator, they were knocked back and getting nowhere whilst the court case was pending. The board chose to take out the commercial loan rather than the directors funding it privately as it would become a secured debt on the club/stadium which would have to be repaid as part of buying the club rather than a private loan which would be converted into shares. I am not too sure of the significance here but think it was more deliberate rather than desperate (although Barclays pulling out would have added to the urgency). NH brought in Colin Sexstone to help. This may be for the potential Plan B which would be a part owned or wholly leased reduced stadium, possibly with a running track and would be more a UWE ran community facility rather than a dedicated football ground. Fearing losing the investment opportunity of the whole site (not just the stadium), the investors or a member (or former member) of the board let it be known through a well regarded fan of their interest. Think of this as a move in chess where a piece is strategically placed so movement by the other player is merely restricted, rather than a crude attempt to undermine NH directly. This allows NH to deny the consortium exist until he was ready and for the appeal to be held without prejudice. It also allows time to complete initial negotiations and due diligence requirements. My personal view (well, more hope really) based on what I have read here and in the Post, is that I think we are just a small part of an overall investment in the area, but a significant one in that it opens up development. If the stadium does not go ahead then the whole project, such as they envision it, will not work financially. Until we know the result of the appeal, no final agreement on value can be reached so expect no news other than the odd “keep the faith” article. Looking at the fixture list, it seems to me that the 6 weeks from mid January to the end of February will be massive for us both on and off the pitch. 2014 was awful. 2015 was great. 2016? Have a good New Year. Unfortunately, there's no real evidence of a rich arab looking to invest millions or of Icon's involvement, other than vague hints by HG about the latter but even he seems to losing interest lately.
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Post by dinsdale on Jan 1, 2016 18:34:55 GMT
I have thought about the situation and how things have developed over the last year or so, the following is partly tongue in cheek and partly serious. I will leave it you to you to decide which if any is plausible and whether this is more Inspector Clouseau or Miss Marple. The timeline is how I remember it so happy to be corrected. In summer of 2014, fresh from relegation to the fifth tier for the first time ever and knowing how Sainsbury’s where behaving, NH was under pressure to have some good news. After a poor start to life in non league football, he struggled with even a basic interview with GT on Radio Bristol. Becoming desperate now he agreed to an interview with a former Post journalist based in the Gulf. This article was read, either directly or indirectly by the investor (it may be the Jordanian gentleman who was following Fan Boy on Twitter or even the Malaysian business, YTL Utilities, who have just bought Filton Airfield) and they became interested and started to look deeper. They realised the potential of not just the team and its fan base (sharing a population of over 1m people with only one other club) but also the UWE, their plans for expansion and the local area in general. This is where Henbury’s suggestion of Icon Group becoming interested fits in as they may be the ones who run the whole event once the agreements are reached. After some tentative talks through a mediator, they were knocked back and getting nowhere whilst the court case was pending. The board chose to take out the commercial loan rather than the directors funding it privately as it would become a secured debt on the club/stadium which would have to be repaid as part of buying the club rather than a private loan which would be converted into shares. I am not too sure of the significance here but think it was more deliberate rather than desperate (although Barclays pulling out would have added to the urgency). NH brought in Colin Sexstone to help. This may be for the potential Plan B which would be a part owned or wholly leased reduced stadium, possibly with a running track and would be more a UWE ran community facility rather than a dedicated football ground. Fearing losing the investment opportunity of the whole site (not just the stadium), the investors or a member (or former member) of the board let it be known through a well regarded fan of their interest. Think of this as a move in chess where a piece is strategically placed so movement by the other player is merely restricted, rather than a crude attempt to undermine NH directly. This allows NH to deny the consortium exist until he was ready and for the appeal to be held without prejudice. It also allows time to complete initial negotiations and due diligence requirements. My personal view (well, more hope really) based on what I have read here and in the Post, is that I think we are just a small part of an overall investment in the area, but a significant one in that it opens up development. If the stadium does not go ahead then the whole project, such as they envision it, will not work financially. Until we know the result of the appeal, no final agreement on value can be reached so expect no news other than the odd “keep the faith” article. Looking at the fixture list, it seems to me that the 6 weeks from mid January to the end of February will be massive for us both on and off the pitch. 2014 was awful. 2015 was great. 2016? Have a good New Year. Unfortunately, there's no real evidence of a rich arab looking to invest millions or of Icon's involvement, other than vague hints by HG about the latter but even he seems to losing interest lately. HG just makes things up doesn't he ? :-)
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Jan 1, 2016 19:38:54 GMT
I'm sensing you have a dislike for TW? However, he can hardly be blamed for using the title Financial Director as that's a commen business term/title, even though an FD is not a Director as such. Exactly, just as the Foreign Secretary isn't a secretary. Maybe we could think of a job title for him that better reflects what he brings to the club....
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