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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 13:49:01 GMT
The immigration system is a mess and the Australian and Canadian examples you give would surely be the same regardless of the Brexit vote. I can't understand why the interpreters you mention have been treated so poorly when there are so many examples of bad apples managing to enter illegally and being allowed to stay whereas these guys served the UK at great personal risk. Leave voters get tarnished by the likes of Oldie as all being racist bigots. I take a different view. I would prefer to see fairness applied to potential immigrants from all over the world and not give preferential treatment to those who are members of the political club that is the EU. The Turkish issue has rumbled on for so long and to be honest I didn't take much notice of it during the referendum debates and it had no bearing on my vote. I mentioned the case of two friends of mine because as third country it shows how difficult it can be even when things are clearly fine to any reasonable person. Glad you didn't fall for Boris' misunderstanding š I totally agree it shouldn't be that difficult. Regardless of Brexit why do we fail to have any commen sense on immigration (and many other things for that matter!), we make life hard for genuine migrants who will add value and be of no detriment but seemingly let others stay who are clearly no good - btw I don't define a good migrant or bad migrant by the colour of their skin or place of birth but by their reason for coming.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 13:57:29 GMT
Liam Fox getting a kicking in parliament Shadow international trade secretary Barry Gardiner says that yesterday it was said of the 40 agreements Liam Fox said would be ready one minute after midnight on Brexit day, only four have been signed, nine are off track, 19 significantly off track, four are not possible to be completed by March 2019 and two aren't even being negotiated. "It will not be possible to fully replicate the terms of these agreements," he adds, asking Dr Fox if he will set out for each country what reasons have been given for objecting to a rollover of a trade deal, and what concessions have been given offering preferential access to UK markets. Going after Leavers is getting so easy it's almost being classified as a "cruel sport". It's getting so bad that serious questions are being asked as to whether Leavers are indeed sentient. Quote from the Cambridge Dictionary. "As a result, they are unlikely to enhanceĀ sentientĀ forms of reconciliation. FromĀ Cambridge English CorpusĀ " With that in mind Eric said "btw I don't define a good migrant or bad migrant by the colour of their skin or place of birth but by their reason for coming." How on earth can you form an opinion on the basis of something you cannot know in enough detail to cover 3million immigrants?š±š±
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 14:15:15 GMT
Liam Fox getting a kicking in parliament Shadow international trade secretary Barry Gardiner says that yesterday it was said of the 40 agreements Liam Fox said would be ready one minute after midnight on Brexit day, only four have been signed, nine are off track, 19 significantly off track, four are not possible to be completed by March 2019 and two aren't even being negotiated. "It will not be possible to fully replicate the terms of these agreements," he adds, asking Dr Fox if he will set out for each country what reasons have been given for objecting to a rollover of a trade deal, and what concessions have been given offering preferential access to UK markets. Going after Leavers is getting so easy it's almost being classified as a "cruel sport". It's getting so bad that serious questions are being asked as to whether Leavers are indeed sentient. Quote from the Cambridge Dictionary. "As a result, they are unlikely to enhance sentient forms of reconciliation. From Cambridge English Corpus " With that in mind Eric said "btw I don't define a good migrant or bad migrant by the colour of their skin or place of birth but by their reason for coming." How on earth can you form an opinion on the basis of something you cannot know in enough detail to cover 3million immigrants?š±š± Do you not think we could assess each individual application on its own merit like other non EU countries do? Where on earth do you get the idea that I advocate a retrospective assessment of 3 million people
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 14:36:02 GMT
Going after Leavers is getting so easy it's almost being classified as a "cruel sport". It's getting so bad that serious questions are being asked as to whether Leavers are indeed sentient. Quote from the Cambridge Dictionary. "As a result, they are unlikely to enhanceĀ sentientĀ forms of reconciliation. FromĀ Cambridge English CorpusĀ " With that in mind Eric said "btw I don't define a good migrant or bad migrant by the colour of their skin or place of birth but by their reason for coming." How on earth can you form an opinion on the basis of something you cannot know in enough detail to cover 3million immigrants?š±š± Do you not think we could assess each individual application on its own merit like other non EU countries do? Where on earth do you get the idea that I advocate a retrospective assessment of 3 million people I didn't. It was you who claimed you could define a good or a bad migrant by their reason for coming. You said "I dont", that is you personally, not a system based assessment. I repeat, you personally cannot, sensibly, make such a judgement. You have no evidence by which to do that.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 14:39:26 GMT
This made me laugh.
Check out @safeasfuckās Tweet:
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 14:58:12 GMT
Do you not think we could assess each individual application on its own merit like other non EU countries do? Where on earth do you get the idea that I advocate a retrospective assessment of 3 million people I didn't. It was you who claimed you could define a good or a bad migrant by their reason for coming. You said "I dont", that is you personally, not a system based assessment. I repeat, you personally cannot, sensibly, make such a judgement. You have no evidence by which to do that. I can't really be arsed with playing your silly games. I was making the point that our overall immigration system is a farce and we seem to let the wrong people in and make life hard for decent people with reasonable motives for coming/staying instead. i felt the need to clarify that I personally don't define a 'good or bad migrant' by their colour or place of birth because people like you throw racist accusations around - it's a shame but that's the situation people like you have created. It's why immigration has never been properly debated for so many years in the UK because fear of those accusations. I'm not a home office or immigration official and it's not for me to judge individual cases, that's for them to decide based on the evidence and application presented. Not that difficult to understand is it.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 15:29:43 GMT
There is some utter tosh being spouted on here.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 16:21:22 GMT
I didn't. It was you who claimed you could define a good or a bad migrant by their reason for coming. You said "I dont", that is you personally, not a system based assessment. I repeat, you personally cannot, sensibly, make such a judgement. You have no evidence by which to do that. I can't really be arsed with playing your silly games. I was making the point that our overall immigration system is a farce and we seem to let the wrong people in and make life hard for decent people with reasonable motives for coming/staying instead. i felt the need to clarify that I personally don't define a 'good or bad migrant' by their colour or place of birth because people like you throw racist accusations around - it's a shame but that's the situation people like you have created. It's why immigration has never been properly debated for so many years in the UK because fear of those accusations.Ā I'm not a home office or immigration official and it's not for me to judge individual cases, that's for them to decide based on the evidence and application presented. Not that difficult to understand is it.Ā Oh I get it.
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Post by jaggas on Feb 13, 2019 20:40:56 GMT
The BBC called the ExPats. Just wondered why that is the term used regarding the British abroad rather than say British Migrants in Spain.
As for voting. Depending on how long you had been out of the country (think it was 15 years) determined whether you could vote or not.
I am not saying they haven't voted for what theyĀ thought wasĀ best (no matter how well or ill informed anyone might be), but voting leave whilst living in an EU country and enjoying the benefits of being EU citizens just seem illogical to me from a starting position
Now it's hitting home that they might start losing benefits and protections and have to 'pay their way' in there (and to quote from a Brit abroad) 'Ghettos', where no Spanish is spoken...
Correct me if I'm wrong but haven't Brits been retiring to or spending winter in Spain for many years - long before open borders were introduced? Not really sure why how they choose to vote is of particular relevance. People vote on principles and what they think is right. As much as many remain voters want to believe it those who voted leave don't hate foreigners or specifically Europeans and European countries, it's just that they don't want to be under the jurisdiction of an EU superstate. Many will still look to emigrate to EU countries, apply to work in other EU countries and take their holidays in the many warm, beautiful EU countries post brexit.Ā Wasting your time as sprout cannot see the difference between the EU and Europe it's a common trait amongst people who love the EU and despise their own country.
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Post by jaggas on Feb 13, 2019 20:51:33 GMT
There is some utter tosh being spouted on here. Its quite funny sprout oldie and Stuart who all love the EU while ignoring all its flaws moaning working themselves into a frenzy about an event that looks unlikely to happen. Nobby have you seen the BBC series Inside Europe? It is done with no prejudice and shows the EU for the absolutely ridiculous folly it is....It is proving to be a great advertisement for leave.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 21:30:02 GMT
Correct me if I'm wrong but haven't Brits been retiring to or spending winter in Spain for many years - long before open borders were introduced? Not really sure why how they choose to vote is of particular relevance. People vote on principles and what they think is right. As much as many remain voters want to believe it those who voted leave don't hate foreigners or specifically Europeans and European countries, it's just that they don't want to be under the jurisdiction of an EU superstate. Many will still look to emigrate to EU countries, apply to work in other EU countries and take their holidays in the many warm, beautiful EU countries post brexit.Ā Wasting your time as sprout cannot see the difference between the EU and Europe it's a common trait amongst people who love the EU and despise their own country. š¤£š¤£š¤£ Proof, if proof was needed, that no sentient life lives amongst this group.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 21:30:32 GMT
There is some utter tosh being spouted on here. Its quite funny sprout oldie and Stuart who all love the EU while ignoring all its flaws moaning working themselves into a frenzy about an event that looks unlikely to happen. Nobby have you seen the BBC series Inside Europe? It is done with no prejudice and shows the EU for the absolutely ridiculous folly it is....It is proving to be a great advertisement for leave. š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 21:32:23 GMT
Ahhh, that's why. Post-Brexit trade partners ask UK to lower human rights standards flip.it/qITMFhAs if. 2 years to discover this...really??
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 21:38:44 GMT
Ahhh, that's why. Post-Brexit trade partners ask UK to lower human rights standards flip.it/qITMFhAs if. 2 years to discover this...really?? Why do you keep falling for all this fake news Oldie? We all know that the ECHR is not part of the EU, so therefore nothing will change with Human Rights.
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stuart1974
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Post by stuart1974 on Feb 13, 2019 22:01:42 GMT
Ahhh, that's why. Post-Brexit trade partners ask UK to lower human rights standards flip.it/qITMFhAs if. 2 years to discover this...really?? Why do you keep falling for all this fake news Oldie? We all know that the ECHR is not part of the EU, so therefore nothing will change with Human Rights. Not quite. Membership if the ECHR is mandatory for EU membership. Whilst nobody has suggested it, we would in theory be able to withdrawal from the ECHR after Brexit.
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Post by stuart1974 on Feb 13, 2019 22:07:02 GMT
Correct me if I'm wrong but haven't Brits been retiring to or spending winter in Spain for many years - long before open borders were introduced? Not really sure why how they choose to vote is of particular relevance. People vote on principles and what they think is right. As much as many remain voters want to believe it those who voted leave don't hate foreigners or specifically Europeans and European countries, it's just that they don't want to be under the jurisdiction of an EU superstate. Many will still look to emigrate to EU countries, apply to work in other EU countries and take their holidays in the many warm, beautiful EU countries post brexit.Ā Wasting your time as sprout cannot see the difference between the EU and Europe it's a common trait amongst people who love the EU and despise their own country. āFear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.ā
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 22:54:40 GMT
Why do you keep falling for all this fake news Oldie? We all know that the ECHR is not part of the EU, so therefore nothing will change with Human Rights. Not quite. Membership if the ECHR is mandatory for EU membership. Whilst nobody has suggested it, we would in theory be able to withdrawal from the ECHR after Brexit. Exactly Which is why future potential non EU countries appear to demand we lower our standards. Personally I cannot think why, or is it a question of the UK being forced to negotiate with countries that do not respect such standards? Hello China. Ffs.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 22:57:57 GMT
Wasting your time as sprout cannot see the difference between the EU and Europe it's a common trait amongst people who love the EU and despise their own country. āFear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.ā Hello Stuart. I had no idea that you and I despise our country! Who would have thought it. On the other hand is this further evidence that the person called Jaggas is not a sentient human being? People need to know.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2019 9:37:39 GMT
Why do you keep falling for all this fake news Oldie? We all know that the ECHR is not part of the EU, so therefore nothing will change with Human Rights. Not quite. Membership if the ECHR is mandatory for EU membership. Whilst nobody has suggested it, we would in theory be able to withdrawal from the ECHR after Brexit. Nobody has suggested withdrawal so I will. We should allow our own courts to make decisions solely affecting the UK and its citizens. Our judges are already soft and take into account human rights in their decisions. Isn't it something like a third of all cases bought to ECHR are by terrorists and other criminals? Examples are family of IRA members deemed to have their rights to life infringed by being shot by the SAS, quite ironic when their purpose for being on Gibraltar was to set a bomb to kill and maim as many innocent people as possible. A convicted paedophile winning Ā£3000 because delays in bring his trial caused him stress and infringed his human rights. A man who shot a police officer winning Ā£7000 for a minor delay in his release from prison. The millions wasted in trying to deport Bin-Ladens European lieutenant Abu Qatada with efforts being frustrated by courts looking to protect his rights. We should start from scratch and re-design it under our own jurisdiction once we leave the EU. The principles would still apply but put the human rights of the law abiding public ahead of the rights of criminal and terrorist scum.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2019 10:47:19 GMT
Not quite. Membership if the ECHR is mandatory for EU membership. Whilst nobody has suggested it, we would in theory be able to withdrawal from the ECHR after Brexit. Nobody has suggested withdrawal so I will. We should allow our own courts to make decisions solely affecting the UK and its citizens. Our judges are already soft and take into account human rights in their decisions. Isn't it something like a third of all cases bought to ECHR are by terrorists and other criminals?Ā Examples are family of IRA members deemed to have their rights to life infringed by being shot by the SAS, quite ironic when their purpose for being on Gibraltar was to set a bomb to kill and maim as many innocent people as possible. A convicted paedophile winning Ā£3000 because delays in bring his trial caused him stress and infringed his human rights. A man who shot a police officer winning Ā£7000 for a minor delay in his release from prison. The millions wasted in trying to deport Bin-Ladens European lieutenant Abu Qatada with efforts being frustrated by courts looking to protect his rights.Ā We should start from scratch and re-design it under our own jurisdiction once we leave the EU. The principles would still apply but put the human rights of the law abiding public ahead of the rights of criminal and terrorist scum. Ā Oh god. The UK was an original signatory and our highly regarded legal professionals were fundamental to writing the treaty. Those were the days. The days before simplistic, Ill informed opinion was the norm.
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