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Post by cagastrophy on Aug 8, 2020 10:40:56 GMT
When we played Brighton there was only one bloke trying to start homophobic chants on the East Terrace where I was. A greying, fat man, slurring his words, falling about and generally being a nause. No one joined in and he loudly kept affirming to those around him that it was really funny. No one smiled. Think this about sums up the state of play with these chants and the folk who insist on them. They think they're really funny and everyone loves how un-PC they're being but they're increasingly just being seen as sad old Special lady gardens. Just my opinion. No need to take offence. Too true, takes one bad apple to ruin the bunch and we are up the creek without a paddle.
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Post by gassince1957 on Aug 8, 2020 10:50:22 GMT
The point of my OP was the danger of rival fans turning up at a ground to make racist/homophobic etc. chants to ensure their rivals ground gets closed for a few games. Obviously, for the new season it will only be ST holders, but once grounds are opened and anyone can go into a home end, I can easily see this becoming a great way to screw over rival teams. Let's face it, the 'teds have a bit of history in their actions e.g. Twerton stand, Memorial Gate etc. But not just them, Swindon/Oxford, Exeter/Plymouth, Cardiff/Swansea, the list of hatred between clubs goes on and on!
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Post by yaz on Aug 8, 2020 10:55:25 GMT
That’s just a fact / true so can it be discriminatory? Doesn’t discriminatory in this case imply derogatory? Can we chant Yellows or not? Colour? It will be some time before fans are allowed anyway! EFL and Premier League and broadcasters would be best suited to sorting out their own institutionalised discriminatory practices first and set an example before such a “stupid” Idea is put in practice? It will be too difficult to enforce and would be unfair on most clubs as they will not be able to enforce it while a game is going on; once done, too late. UTG You've made a massive assumption here, surely this is aimed at racism and stuff which is flatly offensive rather than little petty slights? Surely stopping racism isn't a stupid idea? The stupidity was meant to be the enforcement side of any such decree? Of course, racism and stuff is offensive; I have been on the wrong end of it from a young age at school, streets, playing and watching football, etc. We played Chelsea away a few seasons ago. Where I was sitting, an A/C condenser started leaking before the game and gradually got worse. Stewards checked it before the game, did nothing, complained to head steward at half time, nothing doing (Stewards were under instruction not to come into the away end as soon as the game started) and watched the whole game in lower shed in the wet. So, it may be hard to enforce anything under these circumstances? NB: I put a formal complaint about this to the club; no response! Further, in that same game, there was a Middle Eastern looking guy in the Chelsea stand on th LHS of the Shed end by the touch line who was sitting on 2 chairs. Our fans started on him and kept going for some time; chanting about his size / weight. It was so obvious who it was aimed at; offensive - certainly for him and his companions. Any need for it - No. Just a few "fun" words but it's effects?
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Post by yaz on Aug 8, 2020 11:01:15 GMT
Whilst I completely agree with the sentiment, as I would never personally chant racist/sexist/homophobic chants as that's not me, I do worry that even in this day and age when prejudice is not as openly prevalent as it once was (a good thing), there is a sensitive and careful line to be drawn in regards to stopping it. It's like pushing back the tide, or damming up a river. My fear is with all these movements and changes in policy/tradition (and I'm not saying change is wrong), is that its likely to lead to a "blow out" of hatred/prejudice, which is the tide being held back. What the answer is, I don't know, as doing nothing certainly isn't either. Drawing a line in stopping it? Should there be a line? Should there be a line in stopping crime? Or anything else that is illegal or hurtful or ......
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Post by Jomo on Aug 8, 2020 11:03:57 GMT
Whilst I completely agree with the sentiment, as I would never personally chant racist/sexist/homophobic chants as that's not me, I do worry that even in this day and age when prejudice is not as openly prevalent as it once was (a good thing), there is a sensitive and careful line to be drawn in regards to stopping it. It's like pushing back the tide, or damming up a river. My fear is with all these movements and changes in policy/tradition (and I'm not saying change is wrong), is that its likely to lead to a "blow out" of hatred/prejudice, which is the tide being held back. What the answer is, I don't know, as doing nothing certainly isn't either. Drawing a line in stopping it? Should there be a line? Should there be a line in stopping crime? Or anything else that is illegal or hurtful or ...... A line is the wrong word to use, basically I mean more of a transition, to prevent a blow out which then risks undoing all the healthy progress made. I am totally against prejudice, and I would put a stop to it immediately if I could, but it's not that simple, and I just want the progress made in stopping it, to be sustainable.
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Post by yaz on Aug 8, 2020 11:14:02 GMT
Whilst I completely agree with the sentiment, as I would never personally chant racist/sexist/homophobic chants as that's not me, I do worry that even in this day and age when prejudice is not as openly prevalent as it once was (a good thing), there is a sensitive and careful line to be drawn in regards to stopping it. It's like pushing back the tide, or damming up a river. My fear is with all these movements and changes in policy/tradition (and I'm not saying change is wrong), is that its likely to lead to a "blow out" of hatred/prejudice, which is the tide being held back. What the answer is, I don't know, as doing nothing certainly isn't either. "Blow out"; you are probably right here judging from: - the anti racism campaign recently started in the USA and the people objecting to this campaign - Brexit; a clear reaction, some may say reactionary, vote. The effects of this vote on this country will take years to come into effect and judge? Hopefully, we will be in the Premier League sitting in a nice stadium and won't be affected by it? - Trump; the negative messages he puts out and promulgated / propelled rapidly? Would someone in this country be liable to prosecution if they did the same? Is there a line for him?
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Post by yaz on Aug 8, 2020 11:26:45 GMT
Drawing a line in stopping it? Should there be a line? Should there be a line in stopping crime? Or anything else that is illegal or hurtful or ...... A line is the wrong word to use, basically I mean more of a transition, to prevent a blow out which then risks undoing all the healthy progress made. I am totally against prejudice, and I would put a stop to it immediately if I could, but it's not that simple, and I just want the progress made in stopping it, to be sustainable. I agree wrt stopping it. It is, and has been very difficult to stop in modern times (since the 70s?). Laws and regulations will not. It imay be a question of education, environment, etc. To be pessimistic, I don't see much hope? It may just become more hidden so you may not see it openly on the terraces and grounds but in "dark" corners away from the ground, at work, etc. I look at our institutions; as an example, you hear so much about how there are so many Eastern Europeans in this country yet how many does one see or hear in prime or model roles on our broadcasting channels, as MPs, judges, home grown footballers, sports pundits, etc. And immigration from these areas has been happening for decades now. One wonders why there are so few such people in high places? But is it a surprise?
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Post by lpgas1 on Aug 8, 2020 18:08:31 GMT
Chants under threat.
You're Welsh and you know you are Does your boyfriend know you're here? We can see you holding hands. Sheep sheep shaggers. He's fat, he's queer, he likes it up the rear. The slums of (insert name here) Shithead, shithead Whose the w**ker in the (black/ green /yellow)
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Post by badengas on Aug 8, 2020 19:12:32 GMT
If you think that your Mother would slap you for singing it then don't sing it. What If your mother has a bigger potty mouth than you? My Mother is an angel obviously. We've enjoyed an afternoon of socially distanced cocktails and Chinese food today without a problem.
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Post by badengas on Aug 8, 2020 19:15:34 GMT
If you think that your Mother would slap you for singing it then don't sing it. But I thought that slapping had been banned? 😝 I would definitely lose this fight.
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Post by badengas on Aug 8, 2020 19:19:53 GMT
If you think that your Mother would slap you for singing it then don't sing it. These days, wouldn't be surprised if they were the ones who started the chanting? Am I allowed to refer to Karens? She's called Olive but I love the idea of my 86 today Mum starting something funny.
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Post by Gas-Ed on Aug 9, 2020 11:07:12 GMT
The point of my OP was the danger of rival fans turning up at a ground to make racist/homophobic etc. chants to ensure their rivals ground gets closed for a few games. Obviously, for the new season it will only be ST holders, but once grounds are opened and anyone can go into a home end, I can easily see this becoming a great way to screw over rival teams. Let's face it, the 'teds have a bit of history in their actions e.g. Twerton stand, Memorial Gate etc. But not just them, Swindon/Oxford, Exeter/Plymouth, Cardiff/Swansea, the list of hatred between clubs goes on and on! There are without question a minority of absolute morons who follow ever league club up and down the country. Personally though, I just can’t see someone risking a criminal record and banning order to try to sabotage another club’s reputation or right to have fans inside their stadium. It would be a bizarre way to spend your Saturday, standing amongst your rivals supporters singing deliberately offensive songs. For what’s it’s worth, I don’t see anything wrong with a bit of bad language but anything that helps to stop vile discriminative language at football is a good thing. Standing up against racism, sexism and hate towards others doesn’t make you a snowflake or a big girl’s blouse. On the flipside, joining in with it makes you a twat.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2020 11:31:26 GMT
The point of my OP was the danger of rival fans turning up at a ground to make racist/homophobic etc. chants to ensure their rivals ground gets closed for a few games. Obviously, for the new season it will only be ST holders, but once grounds are opened and anyone can go into a home end, I can easily see this becoming a great way to screw over rival teams. Let's face it, the 'teds have a bit of history in their actions e.g. Twerton stand, Memorial Gate etc. But not just them, Swindon/Oxford, Exeter/Plymouth, Cardiff/Swansea, the list of hatred between clubs goes on and on! There are without question a minority of absolute morons who follow ever league club up and down the country. Personally though, I just can’t see someone risking a criminal record and banning order to try to sabotage another club’s reputation or right to have fans inside their stadium. It would be a bizarre way to spend your Saturday, standing amongst your rivals supporters singing deliberately offensive songs. For what’s it’s worth, I don’t see anything wrong with a bit of bad language but anything that helps to stop vile discriminative language at football is a good thing. Standing up against racism, sexism and hate towards others doesn’t make you a snowflake or a big girl’s blouse. On the flipside, joining in with it makes you a twat. Well put.
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Post by yaz on Aug 9, 2020 21:51:10 GMT
Good to see everyone's taking this so seriously. Especially after what went on versus Brighton, and page upon page of tedious "but it's just banter" thread on here. We can see you holding hands chant is hilarious. People need to stop being offended so easily, it’s a joke and a funny 1 not an aggressive 1. We ain’t premier league supporting tourists. We’re a hardcore bunch of idiots who want to enjoy our football. If your offended by above chant you need to stop being a big girl’s blouse. Far to easy to offend when it’s not actually offensive, it’s humour. So we should now get humorous chants more often that are well thought out and intelligent without being offensive? Sounds good to me but does that mean that the "type" of hardcore supporters that clubs have and follow them through thick and thin will change slowly? Most fans go to watch their team and the football being played. The best chants are those that support your team and not those that denigrate the opposition team and supporters? Of course, there will be a few matches that have history ..... and even more kudos in winning for the fans. Humour is best when it is shared and we can ALL laugh at it together without being / feeling offended. "Is This A Library" is one that I like (especially when it was sung at Southend a few seasons ago and we won 2-1) because it usually gets the other team's fans to start responding with their own chants? "xxxxx is a shiiii....hole, I wanna go home ....." may need sun me adjustment at the start? Looking forward to some imaginative chants this season!! UTG
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