|
Post by peterparker on Jan 22, 2020 12:23:36 GMT
So what is June Mummery moaning about then. nothing has changed There you go then Peter. If the UK had no power within the EU, if it could not influence any decisions, then it was absolutely the right thing to do and Leave! missing the point nobby.
Do/did we or do/did we not have influence within the EU?
BREXIT Party can't argue we no longer have a voice, if they say our voice didn't matter anyway
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 12:31:55 GMT
There you go then Peter. If the UK had no power within the EU, if it could not influence any decisions, then it was absolutely the right thing to do and Leave! missing the point nobby.
Do/did we or do/did we not have influence within the EU?
BREXIT Party can't argue we no longer have a voice, if they say our voice didn't matter anyway
It was long argued that the UK never had a real voice within the EU. You only had to look at what happened whenever a crisis occurred (and still does). The German Chancellor meets with the French President. They then decide what action the EU will take. That has always been the reality. As for the issue in question the EU can change the rules and regulations without ANY input from the UK during the Transition Period. Yes, of course the UK had some influence within the EU, but the UK were always sidelined by the German/French. During the Transition Period the UK has no voice whatsoever.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 16:43:05 GMT
missing the point nobby.
Do/did we or do/did we not have influence within the EU?
BREXIT Party can't argue we no longer have a voice, if they say our voice didn't matter anyway
It was long argued that the UK never had a real voice within the EU. You only had to look at what happened whenever a crisis occurred (and still does). The German Chancellor meets with the French President. They then decide what action the EU will take. That has always been the reality. As for the issue in question the EU can change the rules and regulations without ANY input from the UK during the Transition Period. Yes, of course the UK had some influence within the EU, but the UK were always sidelined by the German/French. During the Transition Period the UK has no voice whatsoever. I guess they wont be keen for us to remain a key security partner, they wont be keen on our financial market provision AND market for them, in fact they wont even notice we left.... The fact that we were instrumental in writing the rules of the single market, the writing of Human Rights legislation etc....nah, nobody even noticed us. But let's rewrite history. Trump anyone?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 16:57:49 GMT
Talking of financial markets...Trump anyone? Dimon says the only financial market bubble out there right now is in sovereign debt flip.it/_O3Em3And our resident geniuses in No 10 and No 11 are threatening to do the same
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Jan 22, 2020 17:36:31 GMT
Oldie, I know you find it pleasurable to have swipes at Boris and Trump, plus c & p any journalist that agrees with you, but what really is the alternative in this country? Labour completely mismanaged the election, they didn't have a clue what most people really wanted, can you imagine in your wildest dreams that lot trying to run this country? Then there were the anti-democratic Democrats whose own leader, telling everyone she was going to be PM couldn't even win her own seat. Are you really saying these alternatives would be more competent?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 20:23:58 GMT
Oldie, I know you find it pleasurable to have swipes at Boris and Trump, plus c & p any journalist that agrees with you, but what really is the alternative in this country? Labour completely mismanaged the election, they didn't have a clue what most people really wanted, can you imagine in your wildest dreams that lot trying to run this country? Then there were the anti-democratic Democrats whose own leader, telling everyone she was going to be PM couldn't even win her own seat. Are you really saying these alternatives would be more competent? I dont think, to the best of my recollection, I have promoted one party or personality over another over the course of this thread. It's about quantifiable policy, a policy that adds up and is based upon empirical evidence. People who have decided to choose a party or personality to support are the people, on this thread particularly, have in general, promoted policies without quantifiable or empirical evidence. To be honest my view is I dont care who does it, I just want them to do it properly without lying and without prejudice, without making it up. Yes, I have a view, (as you asked) but I follow the evidence in coming to my conclusions. Which is why I keep asking for it.
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Jan 22, 2020 21:07:40 GMT
Are you discussing science rather than politics? As I keep saying to you the future is unknown and decisions are based on calculations arrived at by the evidence and attitudes avaliable at the present time. Regarding politics we can only vote for the nearest party that is the nearest to our decision making. To not vote or align with no one just leaves us with a constant and eternal negativity which is a long way from reality and responsibility. Of course this is your decision, but the majority stand by the best political party amongst those that are available. The alternative is just to eternally grumble and forever to have a fluid and changeable decision making process which is really not any decision making at all.
|
|
stuart1974
Proper Gas
Posts: 11,628
Member is Online
|
Post by stuart1974 on Jan 22, 2020 23:24:50 GMT
So, the 'tech tax'. Potential sticking point with the US or a manifesto commitment that is being used as a bargaining chip and will be eventually dropped?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2020 6:32:01 GMT
So, the 'tech tax'. Potential sticking point with the US or a manifesto commitment that is being used as a bargaining chip and will be eventually dropped? The so-called 'tech tax' is just wrong anyway. What they need to do is sort out the whole tax system so no company can use the loopholes that the 'tech' companies (and many others) use.
|
|
stuart1974
Proper Gas
Posts: 11,628
Member is Online
|
Post by stuart1974 on Jan 23, 2020 7:16:06 GMT
So, the 'tech tax'. Potential sticking point with the US or a manifesto commitment that is being used as a bargaining chip and will be eventually dropped? The so-called 'tech tax' is just wrong anyway. What they need to do is sort out the whole tax system so no company can use the loopholes that the 'tech' companies (and many others) use. Perhaps, but the Government is committed to introducing it from April. Should raise £1.5bn or so I read. Trump dislikes it, so will it br a problem for UK/US trade talks? It seems to be an issue, whether it gets negotiated away or blurred in some way will be interesting.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2020 7:34:44 GMT
The so-called 'tech tax' is just wrong anyway. What they need to do is sort out the whole tax system so no company can use the loopholes that the 'tech' companies (and many others) use. Perhaps, but the Government is committed to introducing it from April. Should raise £1.5bn or so I read. Trump dislikes it, so will it br a problem for UK/US trade talks? It seems to be an issue, whether it gets negotiated away or blurred in some way will be interesting. The French introduced a Digital Tax last Summer, and as far as I know it has been 'suspended' after the US threatened to retaliate. It is now subject to 'ongoing talks'.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2020 12:29:45 GMT
Are you discussing science rather than politics? As I keep saying to you the future is unknown and decisions are based on calculations arrived at by the evidence and attitudes avaliable at the present time. Regarding politics we can only vote for the nearest party that is the nearest to our decision making. To not vote or align with no one just leaves us with a constant and eternal negativity which is a long way from reality and responsibility. Of course this is your decision, but the majority stand by the best political party amongst those that are available. The alternative is just to eternally grumble and forever to have a fluid and changeable decision making process which is really not any decision making at all. Al "As I keep saying to you the future is unknown and decisions are based on calculations arrived at by the evidence and attitudes avaliable at the present time." Taking out the word "attitudes", I completely agree. So taking the now defunct debate over leaving the EU, what was the evidence you used to calculate that leaving the EU was in the best interests of the people of the UK? Not your opinion, the evidence, as you correctly say.
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Jan 24, 2020 17:44:35 GMT
Are you discussing science rather than politics? As I keep saying to you the future is unknown and decisions are based on calculations arrived at by the evidence and attitudes avaliable at the present time. Regarding politics we can only vote for the nearest party that is the nearest to our decision making. To not vote or align with no one just leaves us with a constant and eternal negativity which is a long way from reality and responsibility. Of course this is your decision, but the majority stand by the best political party amongst those that are available. The alternative is just to eternally grumble and forever to have a fluid and changeable decision making process which is really not any decision making at all. Al "As I keep saying to you the future is unknown and decisions are based on calculations arrived at by the evidence and attitudes avaliable at the present time." Taking out the word "attitudes", I completely agree. So taking the now defunct debate over leaving the EU, what was the evidence you used to calculate that leaving the EU was in the best interests of the people of the UK? Not your opinion, the evidence, as you correctly say. Evidence on any decision for the future is only going to be based on experience of similar as could be, life experience and intuition. You seem to be asking for facts for the future which isn't going to ever happen.
|
|
|
Post by brads213 on Jan 26, 2020 23:26:02 GMT
A few days left now till independence thank you Boris
|
|
|
Post by aghast on Jan 27, 2020 23:23:10 GMT
A few days left now till independence thank you Boris You won't be celebrating in two years when you realise the deal leaves us pretty much in the EU anyway. Which is all Boris ever wanted, despite his bluster.
|
|
stuart1974
Proper Gas
Posts: 11,628
Member is Online
|
Post by stuart1974 on Jan 28, 2020 0:33:40 GMT
|
|
stuart1974
Proper Gas
Posts: 11,628
Member is Online
|
Post by stuart1974 on Jan 28, 2020 0:58:05 GMT
A few days left now till independence thank you Boris You won't be celebrating in two years when you realise the deal leaves us pretty much in the EU anyway. Which is all Boris ever wanted, despite his bluster. Those MFN clauses will be interesting during negotiations.
|
|
|
Post by peterparker on Jan 29, 2020 8:43:40 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2020 9:04:39 GMT
We just have to wait and see what develops. I see that the EU want UK fishing rights in exchange for financial service access to the European Market...........and I'm sure Oldie will agree with me that it is the EU Access to the London Market's which is the biggest worry for the EU. The UK negotiating position should be , "let's forget about the fishing rights to UK waters, and instead let's talk about what you, the EU, are going to concede so that you (the EU) still have access to the London Financial Markets". The London Financial Market, in terms of size and numbers, makes the European Financial Market look like a Pawn Shop !
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2020 12:01:52 GMT
We just have to wait and see what develops. I see that the EU want UK fishing rights in exchange for financial service access to the European Market...........and I'm sure Oldie will agree with me that it is the EU Access to the London Market's which is the biggest worry for the EU. The UK negotiating position should be , "let's forget about the fishing rights to UK waters, and instead let's talk about what you, the EU, are going to concede so that you (the EU) still have access to the London Financial Markets". The London Financial Market, in terms of size and numbers, makes the European Financial Market look like a Pawn Shop ! Let's trade the London financial Market for free wine...it's the way to go. f**k the fishermen, that's long gone. Anyway who cares. Free wine I say
|
|