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Post by peterparker on Aug 10, 2020 14:39:27 GMT
who are your approved media sources out of interest? I would be fine with The Guardian, if either people who quote it were silent on issues of race and equality, or the paper apologised and offered reparations for their association with the slave trade. In the main, as long as they use opinion pieces from lunatics like Owen Jones and Laurie Penny, it's a vote winner for the blue team, so let them carry on. I'm just interested so that I can find an appropriate source you might actually look at rather than just dismiss it out of hand
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 14:52:25 GMT
I would be fine with The Guardian, if either people who quote it were silent on issues of race and equality, or the paper apologised and offered reparations for their association with the slave trade. In the main, as long as they use opinion pieces from lunatics like Owen Jones and Laurie Penny, it's a vote winner for the blue team, so let them carry on. I'm just interested so that I can find an appropriate source you might actually look at rather than just dismiss it out of hand I didn't dismiss anything 'out of hand'. I looked at Oldie's piece from The Guardian, it was a waste of time, The Guardian trying to make bad news out of good, but I looked. I'm not sure if he's realised that The EU is a protectionist racket, in which case he's right, but I suspect that he didn't bother reading the entire thing and decided that there was something untoward going on. What the piece actually explains is that sugar beet can be imported, by any company, without the EU tariffs being applied. What his issue would be with companies not paying tax on imports so being able to produce cheaper product is hard to understand. It's possible that he read as far as the Greenpeace bit, where they've used to weasel words to suggest that the beet will be imported from countries with low production standards?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 14:54:34 GMT
And yet again we have a link to a piece in the disgusting Guardian. Some people have no shame. who are your approved media sources out of interest? Don't bite, it's a ludicrous proposition.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 15:17:59 GMT
Oh, OK, so the people who took down the Colston statue were wrong then.
Welcome to yet another hole that the left insist on digging themselves into.
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Post by Officer Barbrady on Aug 10, 2020 15:33:26 GMT
Well, it seems we have a mrk2 nobbygas then!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 15:36:21 GMT
Is there an argument that the problem starts along way before the rubber dinghies are launched from Calais? People (economic migrants rather than asylum seekers) travel to North Africa before then embarking on a dangerous sea journey to Europe having handed over their life savings to vile people traffickers. Instead of we’ll meaning charities and do-gooders helping them with their journey and escorting them to their chosen destination they should be returned to where they came from. Those tempted to fork out to the people traffickers in future will definitely have second thoughts if they see boat after returning back to their ports. People trafficking is a multi-billion dollar industry. Yes, the issue needs to be tackled at the source but... Rhetorical questions. 1. How are the authorities going to stop that billion dollar industry? 2. With the break down of international relations, who are the authorities that can stop the trafficking? 3. Who are the people making money by trafficking immigrants? At the moment too many countries are contributing to the trafficking. The trafficker gets paid thousands per person and then overloads them onto a boat. Part way into the journey someone, whether that be navy or charity etc, step in and help them safely complete their journey. The message that then gets back to the country of origin is that the payment to the trafficker was well spent and the journey successful. Therefore fuelling the illegal trade.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 15:38:31 GMT
Is there an argument that the problem starts along way before the rubber dinghies are launched from Calais? People (economic migrants rather than asylum seekers) travel to North Africa before then embarking on a dangerous sea journey to Europe having handed over their life savings to vile people traffickers. Instead of we’ll meaning charities and do-gooders helping them with their journey and escorting them to their chosen destination they should be returned to where they came from. Those tempted to fork out to the people traffickers in future will definitely have second thoughts if they see boat after returning back to their ports. You are right about the problems starting before they reach Calais. The problems are in their own country. Why are they running? What is the percentage split between those running, fleeing etc to those making a life and economic choice? (Btw I don’t blame individual economic migrants as I would be looking to do the same in their situation).
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 15:40:33 GMT
Is there an argument that the problem starts along way before the rubber dinghies are launched from Calais? People (economic migrants rather than asylum seekers) travel to North Africa before then embarking on a dangerous sea journey to Europe having handed over their life savings to vile people traffickers. Instead of we’ll meaning charities and do-gooders helping them with their journey and escorting them to their chosen destination they should be returned to where they came from. Those tempted to fork out to the people traffickers in future will definitely have second thoughts if they see boat after returning back to their ports. And if they have no papers to show where they came from? I don’t think it’s that hard when many are picked up in the early stages of their journey. Your message would presumably be to encourage illegal migrants to continue destroying all documentation of their existence?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 15:41:46 GMT
Well, it seems we have a mrk2 nobbygas then! Best round on him and drive him out then 😮
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 15:44:19 GMT
Well, it seems we have a mrk2 nobbygas then! It 'feels' like a reasonable point to me, if that statue had to go and the paper ran a headline saying that it was 'A long time coming' how can The Guardian's sub-editor excuse their association with the slave trade by just saying that the paper's founder's views were 'of his time'? What do they think Colston was, some kind of time traveller who had exposure to 21st century values in the 17th and 18th centuries but was still willing to operate in a trade that involved the buying and selling of human beings? I just like consistency, and would add, if I'm ever displaying this type of cognitive dissonance, please tell me and I'll work hard to correct it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 15:50:46 GMT
Well, it seems we have a mrk2 nobbygas then! Best round on him and drive him out then 😮 No real sign of that eric. One person keeps losing his temper, and throwing around personal insults, everybody else has their point of view which they put forward and defend robustly, as they should. I quite like it here.
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Post by trevorgas on Aug 10, 2020 16:04:33 GMT
Happy Monday everyone. Of course all this bollox about sovereign borders is an anachronism born of petty nationalist viewpoints. ERG anyone?. The real issue of course is the chaos and devastation wrought by our sorties into various continents. Our being the west in general. Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, the resulting chaos in Syria, Africa generally. Of course a system of trading which takes the natural resources of a country and enriches a tiny minority of that country because they are politically compliant to western demands. Lo betide they are not compliant, we might sanction your economy causing mayhem and even death, or we might just bomb you. If you are lucky we might buy product from you, as long as it is cheap and based upon slave, often unsafe, working conditions. Until we in the west address this, add in global warming, migration will just get worse. Trying to retreat into the 19th century will not stop it. There are other issues that will in my view increase economic migration and the West are not getting it. As global warming increases Africa,Afghanistan, Iraq ,India etc will become less inhabital due to lack of water,crop failures and significantly rising temperatures ,these places are densely populated and I can see widespread devastation within 25 years. The level of population shift will make the current situation look like a tea party. With no leadership from the US we are sitting on a ticking bomb.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 16:04:52 GMT
You are right about the problems starting before they reach Calais. The problems are in their own country. Why are they running? What is the percentage split between those running, fleeing etc to those making a life and economic choice? (Btw I don’t blame individual economic migrants as I would be looking to do the same in their situation). I don't know. The problem is defining "life & economic choice" I think. Take Iraq, Afghanistan and Iran. You will be persecuted for confronting their regimes, but the vast majority do not. They are running from a devastated economy with no jobs, a decimated health system, very poor educational standards and poor housing conditions. It was never great by Western standards, but made absolutely intolerable by invasion (by us) sanctions (by us), political and economic interference (by us). If we did none of that then perhaps they would not risk their lives to get here.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 16:06:48 GMT
Happy Monday everyone. Of course all this bollox about sovereign borders is an anachronism born of petty nationalist viewpoints. ERG anyone?. The real issue of course is the chaos and devastation wrought by our sorties into various continents. Our being the west in general. Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, the resulting chaos in Syria, Africa generally. Of course a system of trading which takes the natural resources of a country and enriches a tiny minority of that country because they are politically compliant to western demands. Lo betide they are not compliant, we might sanction your economy causing mayhem and even death, or we might just bomb you. If you are lucky we might buy product from you, as long as it is cheap and based upon slave, often unsafe, working conditions. Until we in the west address this, add in global warming, migration will just get worse. Trying to retreat into the 19th century will not stop it. There are other issues that will in my view increase economic migration and the West are not getting it. As global warming increases Africa,Afghanistan, Iraq ,India etc will become less inhabital due to lack of water,crop failures and significantly rising temperatures ,these places are densely populated and I can see widespread devastation within 25 years. The level of population shift will make the current situation look like a tea party. With no leadership from the US we are sitting on a ticking bomb. Absolutely...
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Post by baggins on Aug 10, 2020 16:35:26 GMT
And if they have no papers to show where they came from? I don’t think it’s that hard when many are picked up in the early stages of their journey. Your message would presumably be to encourage illegal migrants to continue destroying all documentation of their existence? Early stages of their journey? They left from France!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 17:24:19 GMT
I don’t think it’s that hard when many are picked up in the early stages of their journey. Your message would presumably be to encourage illegal migrants to continue destroying all documentation of their existence? Early stages of their journey? They left from France! The people being pulled from inflatables in the channel are French?
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Post by yattongas on Aug 10, 2020 17:28:31 GMT
Have I missed the tangible benefits of leaving bit ? 🤔
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 17:32:52 GMT
Have I missed the tangible benefits of leaving bit ? 🤔 Yatton We are still waiting for any quantifiable evidence of any tangible benefits. Any, something, anything. Anyone?
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Post by yattongas on Aug 10, 2020 17:41:42 GMT
Have I missed the tangible benefits of leaving bit ? 🤔 Yatton We are still waiting for any quantifiable evidence of any tangible benefits. Any, something, anything. Anyone? Ok thanks . I’ll look forward to reading about them when they do .
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2020 17:42:19 GMT
Yatton We are still waiting for any quantifiable evidence of any tangible benefits. Any, something, anything. Anyone? Ok thanks . I’ll look forward to reading about them when they do . We all will mate.
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