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Post by oldgas on Jan 2, 2021 12:54:26 GMT
Moving this along, gently perhaps. This is my country also and I want the best for it and it's population. No let me rephrase that...I demand the best for it's population. Whether it's the best country to live in is in the eye of the beholder I would argue. In any event that's an argument about relativety which is pretty pointless. Surely, I would argue, it's how we make, get as close as we can, the country a great place for everybody. That I would argue is not the case. There is far to great a divide economically between regions of the UK. This is not a Marxist argument for equal incomes for everyone, but an argument that demands equality of service provision for health, education and social services for all. I would argue also that even that is not enough without provision of affordable housing. I would argue that these are the basics for any civilised society which, when provided, enable us to make claim to be one of the best to live in. Just a note to say that Marx was anti-egalitarian, he thought that everyone being equal would be a utopian nightmare. 'From each according to ability; to each according to need' Basically everyone should have access to basic needs as a right. Socialism is all very good until they run out of other people’s money. Margaret Thatcher. Probably the greatest Prime Minister since Winston Churchill.
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Post by yattongas on Jan 2, 2021 12:59:56 GMT
Day 2 of all our sovereignty....... what are you guys doing with all yours today ? I’m taking mine out for a walk with the wife & kids and the dog 🐕. If I see any forineeeers I’m going to ram it down their throats 🇬🇧 Ram what down their throats? The mind boggles, although probably not half as much as their throats will. Still following me around you weirdo ?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2021 13:05:08 GMT
Just a note to say that Marx was anti-egalitarian, he thought that everyone being equal would be a utopian nightmare. 'From each according to ability; to each according to need' Basically everyone should have access to basic needs as a right. Socialism is all very good until they run out of other people’s money. Margaret Thatcher. Probably the greatest Prime Minister since Winston Churchill. Shhhh...don't tell Sunak Oldgas😉
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Post by yattongas on Jan 2, 2021 13:10:13 GMT
Socialism is all very good until they run out of other people’s money. Margaret Thatcher. Probably the greatest Prime Minister since Winston Churchill. Shhhh...don't tell Sunak Oldgas😉 Surely you’re not talking about the Tory party that has created more debt in the last 10 yrs than all Labour governments in history ?
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Post by yattongas on Jan 2, 2021 13:18:18 GMT
Steve Baker ( Brexit Hard man) ; “ I’m delighted that after years of fighting for it we have axed the hated #Tampontax
Fact check : Steve Baker voted against removing the Tampon tax in 2015 along with every other Tory MP bar three.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2021 13:52:47 GMT
It really really isn’t. Make no mistake the plight of young people in this country is going to highlight that in due course if it hasn’t already. For those of the boomer generation who had some opportunities today’s young haven’t been afforded and profited from yeah I can see they probably think they have got it whipped living in Britain but you have to look outside your own world view and comforts to see the social issues coming up the tracks, not least high cost of living vs wages so sh** that the government has to spend 12 billion a year making sure they can be housed because their wages won’t cover food, heating and housing adequately. That doesn’t seem to me to the sign of a fully functioning economy. And that’s just for starters, we could move on to talk about food banks etc. Then there is the social issue in general that Covid has highlighted of how venal our government is (as evidenced but the office of auditing findings that Yatton Gas posted about) and how the people of this country when push came to shove rebelled against Covid measures where other countries got behind them and saw them as being for the greater good. Instead we painted our faces blue and white and gave it the old “FREEEEEEEDOOOOOOM!” bollocks, everyone a little Braveheart acting like they are upholding some fine British tradition of civil disobedience even though it’s a flaming pandemic and asserting your freedoms for no other reason than “just because” is a highly idiotic thing to be doing. Ultimately Britain has got problems because from the average man on the street corner all the way up to the plank in Downing Street we’re a nation of selfish assholes who are in it for themselves and couldn’t give a monkey’s about the wider social issues that are serious dangers to British society because the standard refrain across the country is “hey, as long as I’m alright Jack!”. Absolutely nothing to be proud of. And before people come back with the “hurr durr why don’t you leave then?” well you’ve voted to take that away! SO basically what you’re saying is that Britain is a ah1t place to live, the main reason being that from the average man on the street to the plank in Downing Street we’re a bunch of selfish assholes, the worst in the world. Simple then really. Quite clearly, we’re doomed. You should have taken the opportunity to leave before 31st December 2020. It’s circumspect that you aren’t bothering to try and debate the issues raised, instead resorting to trite comebacks. I’ve said before I would have gone already if jobs were plentiful in Spain. The U.K has to be thankful in a sense that unemployment is so high in Spain because if jobs were ten a penny over there a lot more Brits who have very little to look forward to in the U.K. in terms of prospects would have left for Spain by now as the cheaper cost of living, high ex-pat count and ability to use English to get by would be quite attractive I’m sure. The best countries to move to right now are the Scandinavian countries who seem to have a far more progressive outlook, low income inequality and high identifications of happiness among it’s citizens but there are cultural issues there and of course the language which creates a high barrier to entry for someone from England looking to relocate. The U.K. is a dinosaur on the world stage in the grand scheme of things. Europe is discussing the UBI but we continue to myopically stumble on under conservative values of working people of low privilege to the bone and having no sort of plan for when the jobs those people do are replaced by automation. Hopefully the dinosaurs in charge will be extinct by the end of the decade and we can start to shift our focus because our implantation of capitalism is dying and we need to be part of the conversation with Europe about how we adapt.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2021 13:54:08 GMT
Steve Baker ( Brexit Hard man) ; “ I’m delighted that after years of fighting for it we have axed the hated #Tampontax Fact check : Steve Baker voted against removing the Tampon tax in 2015 along with every other Tory MP bar three. Love it. I hope people remember this
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Post by oldgas on Jan 2, 2021 14:01:47 GMT
Shhhh...don't tell Sunak Oldgas😉 Surely you’re not talking about the Tory party that has created more debt in the last 10 yrs than all Labour governments in history ? You have a split personality old boy. You accuse me of following your around then follow me around! By the way, have you rammed anything down anyone's throat yet? YOu Should be careful what you do in front of the Missus, she might have to arrest you. Ill leave the subsequent scenario to others imagination.
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Post by yattongas on Jan 2, 2021 14:05:07 GMT
He’s not the brightest spark is he ? 😂
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Post by oldgas on Jan 2, 2021 14:10:03 GMT
SO basically what you’re saying is that Britain is a ah1t place to live, the main reason being that from the average man on the street to the plank in Downing Street we’re a bunch of selfish assholes, the worst in the world. Simple then really. Quite clearly, we’re doomed. You should have taken the opportunity to leave before 31st December 2020. It’s circumspect that you aren’t bothering to try and debate the issues raised, instead resorting to trite comebacks. I’ve said before I would have gone already if jobs were plentiful in Spain. The U.K has to be thankful in a sense that unemployment is so high in Spain because if jobs were ten a penny over there a lot more Brits who have very little to look forward to in the U.K. in terms of prospects would have left for Spain by now as the cheaper cost of living, high ex-pat count and ability to use English to get by would be quite attractive I’m sure. The best countries to move to right now are the Scandinavian countries who seem to have a far more progressive outlook, low income inequality and high identifications of happiness among it’s citizens but there are cultural issues there and of course the language which creates a high barrier to entry for someone from England looking to relocate. The U.K. is a dinosaur on the world stage in the grand scheme of things. Europe is discussing the UBI but we continue to myopically stumble on under conservative values of working people of low privilege to the bone and having no sort of plan for when the jobs those people do are replaced by automation. Hopefully the dinosaurs in charge will be extinct by the end of the decade and we can start to shift our focus because our implantation of capitalism is dying and we need to be part of the conversation with Europe about how we adapt. It's also circumspect that you talk about there being very high unemployment in Spain although the pay there is very poor. Why is Spain suffering such low wages and unemployment. Could it be because they're part of the EUand in the Euro? I work on the railway. There are numerous Spanish and Portugese people working with us, plus a multitude of Eastern Europeans. Many of them manage to send money home to help out. Whatever next, Iberians and Eastern Europeans all working over here and sending money home and poor old 365 can't get a job that pays him enough. Your argument is taking on the appearance of a colander.
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Post by oldgas on Jan 2, 2021 14:15:31 GMT
Socialism is all very good until they run out of other people’s money. Margaret Thatcher. Probably the greatest Prime Minister since Winston Churchill. Shhhh...don't tell Sunak Oldgas😉 So are you saying the government are wrong in trying to ease people's financial pain through this pandemic. And as for sarcastic comments about the Tories spending more than Labour, please be honest with me and yourself and estimate whether Labour spending would have been less over that same period.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2021 14:37:09 GMT
It’s circumspect that you aren’t bothering to try and debate the issues raised, instead resorting to trite comebacks. I’ve said before I would have gone already if jobs were plentiful in Spain. The U.K has to be thankful in a sense that unemployment is so high in Spain because if jobs were ten a penny over there a lot more Brits who have very little to look forward to in the U.K. in terms of prospects would have left for Spain by now as the cheaper cost of living, high ex-pat count and ability to use English to get by would be quite attractive I’m sure. The best countries to move to right now are the Scandinavian countries who seem to have a far more progressive outlook, low income inequality and high identifications of happiness among it’s citizens but there are cultural issues there and of course the language which creates a high barrier to entry for someone from England looking to relocate. The U.K. is a dinosaur on the world stage in the grand scheme of things. Europe is discussing the UBI but we continue to myopically stumble on under conservative values of working people of low privilege to the bone and having no sort of plan for when the jobs those people do are replaced by automation. Hopefully the dinosaurs in charge will be extinct by the end of the decade and we can start to shift our focus because our implantation of capitalism is dying and we need to be part of the conversation with Europe about how we adapt. It's also circumspect that you talk about there being very high unemployment in Spain although the pay there is very poor. Why is Spain suffering such low wages and unemployment. Could it be because they're part of the EUand in the Euro? I work on the railway. There are numerous Spanish and Portugese people working with us, plus a multitude of Eastern Europeans. Many of them manage to send money home to help out. Whatever next, Iberians and Eastern Europeans all working over here and sending money home and poor old 365 can't get a job that pays him enough. Your argument is taking on the appearance of a colander. You’ve blown my argument apart (using the 12 billion housing benefit bill as evidence of low wages and cost of living) using an anecdote about people you work with whose finances you don’t have access to that they might have surplus income to send back home? Ok then.
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Post by francegas on Jan 2, 2021 14:38:21 GMT
Surprised no one has commented on the monumental cock up by the EU on ordering and the roll out of the covid vaccine.
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Post by yattongas on Jan 2, 2021 14:48:16 GMT
Surprised no one has commented on the monumental cock up by the EU on ordering and the roll out of the covid vaccine. I wouldn’t even go there from a UK point of view....
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2021 15:13:46 GMT
Shhhh...don't tell Sunak Oldgas😉 So are you saying the government are wrong in trying to ease people's financial pain through this pandemic. And as for sarcastic comments about the Tories spending more than Labour, please be honest with me and yourself and estimate whether Labour spending would have been less over that same period. For clarity Oldgas I totally support Sunaks fiscal policies in response to the pandemic induced recession. Absolutely the right thing to do. But I made the tongue in cheek comment in response to your quote of Thatcher. Sunak has had to borrow £100's of billions to finance this, and, the Bank of England has printed a shedload to provide the loans. He needs to be careful, the Weimar Republic beckons. And yes, any Labour government would have done the same.
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Post by oldgas on Jan 2, 2021 15:56:38 GMT
Surprised no one has commented on the monumental cock up by the EU on ordering and the roll out of the covid vaccine. Who's surprised?
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Post by oldgas on Jan 2, 2021 16:05:10 GMT
So are you saying the government are wrong in trying to ease people's financial pain through this pandemic. And as for sarcastic comments about the Tories spending more than Labour, please be honest with me and yourself and estimate whether Labour spending would have been less over that same period. For clarity Oldgas I totally support Sunaks fiscal policies in response to the pandemic induced recession. Absolutely the right thing to do. But I made the tongue in cheek comment in response to your quote of Thatcher. Sunak has had to borrow £100's of billions to finance this, and, the Bank of England has printed a shedload to provide the loans. He needs to be careful, the Weimar Republic beckons. And yes, any Labour government would have done the same. I agree that the Chancellors response is fraught, but I think it's vital to keep as many people with a decent proportion of their income as possible. We have to hope that the vaccination programme will enable the country to return to normal. I think the recovery will be helped enormously by us being out of the EU. We are not having to pay them £12+ billion for the 'priveledge' of membership, we will not be on the hook for the EU Covid recovery fund, and if certain basket case EU economies have financial problems we will not be expected to contribute to another Euro recovery fund. I don't care what has been said about the vaccine licensing, there is no doubt we got ahead of the game because we were leaving, and the Oxford vaccine is coming on stream to give additional hope. I read that the EU have dropped a bit of a bollock over vaccine procurement as well. Thoroughly enjoying the game Nicholson is superb, as is Hanlan and McCormack.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2021 16:34:25 GMT
So are you saying the government are wrong in trying to ease people's financial pain through this pandemic. And as for sarcastic comments about the Tories spending more than Labour, please be honest with me and yourself and estimate whether Labour spending would have been less over that same period. For clarity Oldgas I totally support Sunaks fiscal policies in response to the pandemic induced recession. Absolutely the right thing to do. But I made the tongue in cheek comment in response to your quote of Thatcher. Sunak has had to borrow £100's of billions to finance this, and, the Bank of England has printed a shedload to provide the loans. He needs to be careful, the Weimar Republic beckons. And yes, any Labour government would have done the same. Would labour have given out contracts to their mates for billions with little/nothing in return? That’s the big question.
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Post by trevorgas on Jan 2, 2021 16:35:44 GMT
For clarity Oldgas I totally support Sunaks fiscal policies in response to the pandemic induced recession. Absolutely the right thing to do. But I made the tongue in cheek comment in response to your quote of Thatcher. Sunak has had to borrow £100's of billions to finance this, and, the Bank of England has printed a shedload to provide the loans. He needs to be careful, the Weimar Republic beckons. And yes, any Labour government would have done the same. Would labour have given out contracts to their mates for billions with little/nothing in return? That’s the big question. History says yes
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2021 16:53:13 GMT
Would labour have given out contracts to their mates for billions with little/nothing in return? That’s the big question. History says yes History yes but I’d like to think Corbyn for all his faults would be a lot more honourable in that respect than what we have seen from the Tories during this pandemic
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