|
|
Post by bluebiro on Jan 23, 2023 18:18:13 GMT
Out of interest What is is that we can't have at a redeveloped mem that makes it commercially unviable?
|
|
|
|
Post by The Equaliser on Jan 23, 2023 18:19:26 GMT
Out of interest What is is that we can't have at a redeveloped mem that makes it commercially unviable? The money from its sale 👍🏾 |
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Jan 23, 2023 18:43:08 GMT
Out of interest What is is that we can't have at a redeveloped mem that makes it commercially unviable? An entertainment license after 10:30/11pm is what I've heard but if Sainsbury's wanted deliveries in the early hours then I'm not sure BCC would turn down a request for a later license? We seem to have got pp for virtually everything else in the past, student accommodation, a small, & large(!) supermarket, gym etc. Probably the real reason is it would cost £xm and without either somebody else paying for the build &/or selling the Mem to finance it then it's never going to happen, you do have to wonder how Oxford's new owners are going to finance their new stadium when they don't even own their present ground. |
|
|
|
Post by Feeling The Blues on Jan 23, 2023 19:15:04 GMT
Out of interest What is is that we can't have at a redeveloped mem that makes it commercially unviable? An entertainment license after 10:30/11pm is what I've heard but if Sainsbury's wanted deliveries in the early hours then I'm not sure BCC would turn down a request for a later license? We seem to have got pp for virtually everything else in the past, student accommodation, a small, & large(!) supermarket, gym etc. Probably the real reason is it would cost £xm and without either somebody else paying for the build &/or selling the Mem to finance it then it's never going to happen, you do have to wonder how Oxford's new owners are going to finance their new stadium when they don't even own their present ground. The student accommodation scheme should be revisited maybe. There was a recent radio documentary on R4 re the critical lack of student accommodation in Bristol for the 50,000 students we now have thanks to both universities continual expansion. |
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Jan 23, 2023 19:50:24 GMT
An entertainment license after 10:30/11pm is what I've heard but if Sainsbury's wanted deliveries in the early hours then I'm not sure BCC would turn down a request for a later license? We seem to have got pp for virtually everything else in the past, student accommodation, a small, & large(!) supermarket, gym etc. Probably the real reason is it would cost £xm and without either somebody else paying for the build &/or selling the Mem to finance it then it's never going to happen, you do have to wonder how Oxford's new owners are going to finance their new stadium when they don't even own their present ground. The student accommodation scheme should be revisited maybe. There was a recent radio documentary on R4 re the critical lack of student accommodation in Bristol for the 50,000 students we now have thanks to both universities continual expansion. We seem to be building a whole new town for them at Temple Gate etc already, you do wonder what advisers Wael employs, as the old student accommodation bakcked scheme looked a decent one given the Bristol uni's are still having to use accommodation in Newport etc. Likewise if he'd agreed a deal with the UWE we wouldn't now be concerned about steel & construction costs increasing. |
|
|
|
Post by aghast on Jan 23, 2023 20:03:34 GMT
Out of interest What is is that we can't have at a redeveloped mem that makes it commercially unviable? An entertainment license after 10:30/11pm is what I've heard but if Sainsbury's wanted deliveries in the early hours then I'm not sure BCC would turn down a request for a later license? We seem to have got pp for virtually everything else in the past, student accommodation, a small, & large(!) supermarket, gym etc. Probably the real reason is it would cost £xm and without either somebody else paying for the build &/or selling the Mem to finance it then it's never going to happen, you do have to wonder how Oxford's new owners are going to finance their new stadium when they don't even own their present ground. If the value of the Mem land is £40m, if a new stadium costs £70m plus land costs, and if a redeveloped Mem would come in at £30m, then the sums are less difficult. Obviously I've made these numbers up to fit my point, but the two crucial details are the value of the land and the fact that a redevelopment short of tearing the whole thing down would cost less than a new stadium. Obviously it wouldn't be as good, but if there is no alternative then it would be a hell of a lot better than what we have and where we are now and indeed in the foreseeable future. We can't just do nothing! ..Edited because my original made up numbers didn't fit my made up point.. |
|
|
|
Post by gasheadbatesy on Jan 23, 2023 21:02:33 GMT
Why can’t wael build is a new stadium with all he states we/he needs, (hotel, casino, blah, blah, blah) then he can re develop the mem for housing out his own pocket and claw back god knows how many millions.
That would go along way to paying for the stadium, and it would pay for itself a lot quicker than selling the mem land to a property developer.
A lot of houses, high risers, student accommodation, etc, can be built on the mem site.
A lot of money to be made.
|
|
|
|
Post by legas on Jan 23, 2023 21:03:34 GMT
An entertainment license after 10:30/11pm is what I've heard but if Sainsbury's wanted deliveries in the early hours then I'm not sure BCC would turn down a request for a later license? We seem to have got pp for virtually everything else in the past, student accommodation, a small, & large(!) supermarket, gym etc. Probably the real reason is it would cost £xm and without either somebody else paying for the build &/or selling the Mem to finance it then it's never going to happen, you do have to wonder how Oxford's new owners are going to finance their new stadium when they don't even own their present ground. If the value of the Mem land is £40m, if a new stadium costs £50m and if a redeveloped Mem would come in at £30m, then the sums are less difficult. Obviously I've made these numbers up to fit my point, but the two crucial details are the value of the land and the fact that a redevelopment short of tearing the whole thing down would cost less than a new stadium. Obviously it wouldn't be as good, but if there is no alternative then it would be a hell of a lot better than what we have and where we are now and indeed in the foreseeable future. We can't just do nothing! You can probably work out the value of the Mem to a developer by estimating how many properties could be built, the averaged build cost, the demolition cost, the property resale values and any other other fees/taxes etc. A buyer would want a reasonable ROI. |
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Jan 23, 2023 21:09:07 GMT
How could you redevelop the Mem without tearing it down, the grandstand has to go, as does the north terracing and south stand, the west stand might have been OK in the short to medium term if it had run the entire length of the pitch but it clearly doesn't. We also have the issue that the pitch really needs moving if we're going to build a decent stand to replace the south stand.
Finally there's the issue of where we play whilst the Mem is being redeveloped and how much that would cost the club in reduced attendances and also renting another club's ground for a couple of seasons.
|
|
|
|
Post by darkbluegas on Jan 23, 2023 21:12:05 GMT
Out of interest What is is that we can't have at a redeveloped mem that makes it commercially unviable? The money from its sale 👍🏾 but wouldnt we need that money to buy another site so we'd be back where we are now. Unless we buy at £2 50 an acre on the somerset levels |
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Jan 23, 2023 21:14:40 GMT
If the value of the Mem land is £40m, if a new stadium costs £50m and if a redeveloped Mem would come in at £30m, then the sums are less difficult. Obviously I've made these numbers up to fit my point, but the two crucial details are the value of the land and the fact that a redevelopment short of tearing the whole thing down would cost less than a new stadium. Obviously it wouldn't be as good, but if there is no alternative then it would be a hell of a lot better than what we have and where we are now and indeed in the foreseeable future. We can't just do nothing! You can probably work out the value of the Mem to a developer by estimating how many properties could be built, the averaged build cost, the demolition cost, the property resale values and any other other fees/taxes etc. A buyer would want a reasonable ROI. Problem with that is we've no idea what could be built on the Mem, we'd probably just go for houses but a developer could well go for low rise flats/student accommodation, if they did then would that then make the land far more valuable? Although it seems irrelevant what the land is worth if we can't find an alternative site anyway and, unless we moved to somewhere like Avonmouth, then land elsewhere would cost similar money to the Mem? |
|
|
|
Post by legas on Jan 23, 2023 21:21:38 GMT
You can probably work out the value of the Mem to a developer by estimating how many properties could be built, the averaged build cost, the demolition cost, the property resale values and any other other fees/taxes etc. A buyer would want a reasonable ROI. Problem with that is we've no idea what could be built on the Mem, we'd probably just go for houses but a developer could well go for low rise flats/student accommodation, if they did then would that then make the land far more valuable? Although it seems irrelevant what the land is worth if we can't find an alternative site anyway and, unless we moved to somewhere like Avonmouth, then land elsewhere would cost similar money to the Mem? Yeah, good point. I was bored the other day and just trying to work it out. I guess too many variables to come to an accurate figure. Also occurs to me that higher building materials costs making a new stadium more expensive could, at the same time, reduce what a developer might pay for the Mem site. |
|
|
|
Post by The Equaliser on Jan 23, 2023 21:32:18 GMT
The money from its sale 👍🏾 but wouldnt we need that money to buy another site so we'd be back where we are now. Unless we buy at £2 50 an acre on the somerset levels Not if we purchase/build our new stadium with a commercial mortgage. For example, we sell our Mem for circa. £30 million, pay off some debt, say £10 million which leaves us £20 million as deposit on a £60 million new stadium. The increased income from a new 7 day a week use stadium could hopefully pay the payments and increase our own turnover. Just hypothetically of course but I think it could work. |
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Jan 23, 2023 22:06:19 GMT
The money from its sale 👍🏾 but wouldnt we need that money to buy another site so we'd be back where we are now. Unless we buy at £2 50 an acre on the somerset levels We were apparently not going to buy the land at the UWE nor the FM. It all now seems pie in the sky and it's not clear how we'll ever afford to build a new stadium or redevelop the Mem. |
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Jan 23, 2023 22:08:06 GMT
but wouldnt we need that money to buy another site so we'd be back where we are now. Unless we buy at £2 50 an acre on the somerset levels Not if we purchase/build our new stadium with a commercial mortgage. For example, we sell our Mem for circa. £30 million, pay off some debt, say £10 million which leaves us £20 million as deposit on a £60 million new stadium. The increased income from a new 7 day a week use stadium could hopefully pay the payments and increase our own turnover. Just hypothetically of course but I think it could work. What happens if we get relegated and can't then afford the mortgage payments?? |
|
|
|
Post by stuart1974 on Jan 23, 2023 22:21:24 GMT
Not if we purchase/build our new stadium with a commercial mortgage. For example, we sell our Mem for circa. £30 million, pay off some debt, say £10 million which leaves us £20 million as deposit on a £60 million new stadium. The increased income from a new 7 day a week use stadium could hopefully pay the payments and increase our own turnover. Just hypothetically of course but I think it could work. What happens if we get relegated and can't then afford the mortgage payments?? The 7 day a week use is separate from our on the field success (or lack of it) and a reliable income. |
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Jan 24, 2023 6:34:36 GMT
What happens if we get relegated and can't then afford the mortgage payments?? The 7 day a week use is separate from our on the field success (or lack of it) and a reliable income. In that case why does any football club have money issues when they are relegated, as surely they should all just continue without any problems, with the non football related income paying all the bills? |
|
|
|
Post by darkbluegas on Jan 24, 2023 8:48:23 GMT
but wouldnt we need that money to buy another site so we'd be back where we are now. Unless we buy at £2 50 an acre on the somerset levels Not if we purchase/build our new stadium with a commercial mortgage. For example, we sell our Mem for circa. £30 million, pay off some debt, say £10 million which leaves us £20 million as deposit on a £60 million new stadium. The incre been herased income from a new 7 day a week use stadium could hopefully pay the payments and increase our own turnover. Just hypothetically of course but I think it could work. I think if it was financially viable in Bristol it would have been done years ago. Even Pantsdown couldn't make it work with his limitless tax free Guernsey money. I think if you tendered to build the stadium for 60 million the club would bite your hand off and most of your arm with it. Without funding well beyond Wael's capacity it won't be happening here I'm afraid. In the meantime our actual home is on a spiral of decay which will potentially see it's capacity reduced year on year |
|
|
|
Post by heartofgas on Jan 24, 2023 9:19:54 GMT
I am a firm believer in where there's a will there's a way.
Why can't the club set out a 10 year plan and communicate this with fans. I'm sure something could be said on the Stadium. Unless Wael is happy with fans being disillusioned. I just don't see why a club statement can't be made on the progress or lack of progress with the FM site. Even something like dialogue is still on going and further updates will be provided when appropriate or we are now looking at other sites. Without it people are going to loose hope. I just don't see how the club will progress.
As for financing it's a case of going out and get it if you can't afford it. Build a business case, Sell the idea and get loans. The extra revenue will pay back the loans.
10th Tier clubs are doing it for goodness sake.
|
|
|
|
Post by heartofgas on Jan 24, 2023 9:24:00 GMT
Not if we purchase/build our new stadium with a commercial mortgage. For example, we sell our Mem for circa. £30 million, pay off some debt, say £10 million which leaves us £20 million as deposit on a £60 million new stadium. The incre been herased income from a new 7 day a week use stadium could hopefully pay the payments and increase our own turnover. Just hypothetically of course but I think it could work. I think if it was financially viable in Bristol it would have been done years ago. Even Pantsdown couldn't make it work with his limitless tax free Guernsey money. I think if you tendered to build the stadium for 60 million the club would bite your hand off and most of your arm with it. Without funding well beyond Wael's capacity it won't be happening here I'm afraid. In the meantime our actual home is on a spiral of decay which will potentially see it's capacity reduced year on year I think Lansdown's problem wasn't money. It was because we have a law that allowed a bloke, who's dog once took a sh*t on a piece of grass near the proposed stadium, stop a multimillion pound development. |
|
