Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2020 17:08:36 GMT
Oh no, yo said the anti-semitism word... That's a get out of jail free card for racist Tory's. Basically Tory logic is that they can do anything they want now because half the UK is anti-Semitic apparently. No racist in the Labour Party then? It is ingrained in to culture. Only a small minority are opposed to it sadly. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2020 19:31:18 GMT
I was actually quoting what the chap who wrote said, not defending it. Oh okay, fair enough! What has made me laugh out loud is the swathe of Tory MPs coming out on the media tonight, allegedly under instruction, like a bunch of Meerkats singing the praise of the infamous Ms Patel. Apparently she is direct, forceful, driven. She was so lacking in self awareness she claimed she had to be told her behaviour was unacceptable, nobody did she claims so it's not her fault she says. Another MP said she was very empathetic....really? So empathetic she couldn't spot the upset she was causing. Give me a break. Thing is, I cannot get excited by all this. I am more interested in her competence as a Home Secretary. Is there any evidence evidence that she is, competent? How about Johnson? Competent? Gove (who?) Competent? Hancock? Sharma, Williamson, Competent? Ffs. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2020 20:18:45 GMT
What has made me laugh out loud is the swathe of Tory MPs coming out on the media tonight, allegedly under instruction, like a bunch of Meerkats singing the praise of the infamous Ms Patel. Apparently she is direct, forceful, driven. She was so lacking in self awareness she claimed she had to be told her behaviour was unacceptable, nobody did she claims so it's not her fault she says. Another MP said she was very empathetic....really? So empathetic she couldn't spot the upset she was causing. Give me a break. Thing is, I cannot get excited by all this. I am more interested in her competence as a Home Secretary. Is there any evidence evidence that she is, competent? How about Johnson? Competent? Gove (who?) Competent? Hancock? Sharma, Williamson, Competent? Ffs. Post-modern conservatism |
|
|
|
Post by Officer Barbrady on Nov 20, 2020 20:32:00 GMT
What has made me laugh out loud is the swathe of Tory MPs coming out on the media tonight, allegedly under instruction, like a bunch of Meerkats singing the praise of the infamous Ms Patel. Apparently she is direct, forceful, driven. She was so lacking in self awareness she claimed she had to be told her behaviour was unacceptable, nobody did she claims so it's not her fault she says. Another MP said she was very empathetic....really? So empathetic she couldn't spot the upset she was causing. Give me a break. Thing is, I cannot get excited by all this. I am more interested in her competence as a Home Secretary. Is there any evidence evidence that she is, competent? How about Johnson? Competent? Gove (who?) Competent? Hancock? Sharma, Williamson, Competent? Ffs. Post-modern conservatism I guess if you are that full of sh**, eventually some of it is going to seep out? |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2020 22:15:18 GMT
What has made me laugh out loud is the swathe of Tory MPs coming out on the media tonight, allegedly under instruction, like a bunch of Meerkats singing the praise of the infamous Ms Patel. Apparently she is direct, forceful, driven. She was so lacking in self awareness she claimed she had to be told her behaviour was unacceptable, nobody did she claims so it's not her fault she says. Another MP said she was very empathetic....really? So empathetic she couldn't spot the upset she was causing. Give me a break. Thing is, I cannot get excited by all this. I am more interested in her competence as a Home Secretary. Is there any evidence evidence that she is, competent? How about Johnson? Competent? Gove (who?) Competent? Hancock? Sharma, Williamson, Competent? Ffs. It makes me sick how party politics overrules simple decency. Do you see any of us making excuses for anti-semitism? Yet the Tories all tow the party line. That massive prat Cleverly was on Qeustion Time last night. Firstly saying we should wait for the report (fair enough) then trying to defend her by saying if she is guilty then it’s probably because she’s a hard worker and demands high standards or some such bollocks. Why can’t they just admit that bullying in the work place is out of order? There isn’t a shred of moral fibre amongst the current government. I’m heartened because tonight my mother (who isn’t political at all) brought up the pay rise stuff vs spending on contracts and it sounds like her and the people she speaks to have all had enough. If my mum is waking up and getting watered off then maybe I under-estimated the depth of feeling that this government has created against it. Fingers crossed it’s not all swept under the carpet in 3 years amongst the usual invocations of “commies under the bed” and red peril to scare people into voting against their best interests. |
|
|
|
Post by yattongas on Nov 20, 2020 22:37:02 GMT
What has made me laugh out loud is the swathe of Tory MPs coming out on the media tonight, allegedly under instruction, like a bunch of Meerkats singing the praise of the infamous Ms Patel. Apparently she is direct, forceful, driven. She was so lacking in self awareness she claimed she had to be told her behaviour was unacceptable, nobody did she claims so it's not her fault she says. Another MP said she was very empathetic....really? So empathetic she couldn't spot the upset she was causing. Give me a break. Thing is, I cannot get excited by all this. I am more interested in her competence as a Home Secretary. Is there any evidence evidence that she is, competent? How about Johnson? Competent? Gove (who?) Competent? Hancock? Sharma, Williamson, Competent? Ffs. It makes me sick how party politics overrules simple decency. Do you see any of us making excuses for anti-semitism? Yet the Tories all tow the party line. That massive prat Cleverly was on Qeustion Time last night. Firstly saying we should wait for the report (fair enough) then trying to defend her by saying if she is guilty then it’s probably because she’s a hard worker and demands high standards or some such bollocks. Why can’t they just admit that bullying in the work place is out of order? There isn’t a shred of moral fibre amongst the current government. I’m heartened because tonight my mother (who isn’t political at all) brought up the pay rise stuff vs spending on contracts and it sounds like her and the people she speaks to have all had enough. If my mum is waking up and getting watered off then maybe I under-estimated the depth of feeling that this government has created against it. Fingers crossed it’s not all swept under the carpet in 3 years amongst the usual invocations of “commies under the bed” and red peril to scare people into voting against their best interests. Boris in WhatsApp.....” let’s all form a protective square around the pritster “ . They all dutifully oblige . Ps ALL the anti semites should be kicked out of the Labour Party . |
|
|
|
Post by yattongas on Nov 20, 2020 23:32:32 GMT
The Times is reporting tonight that Boris Johnson tried to interfere in Sir Alex Allan’s report into Priti Patel’s behaviour. That would be a pretty incendiary violation of protocol.
EXCLUSIVE with @oliver_wright
Boris Johnson asked Sir Alex Allan to tone down report which found Priti Patel had bullied civil servants
‘He didn’t think Alex’s findings accorded with the evidence
‘He spoke to Alex and asked him if he’d change the tone of it. Alex said no
|
|
|
|
Post by axegas on Nov 20, 2020 23:35:38 GMT
It was interesting that they announced a rise in defence spending at the same time a pay freeze for 5 million public sector workers for the next three years is expected to be announced. I get that the MOD is underfunded as a result of previous defence reviews and probably needs the money but arguably don’t public sector workers that battled through COVID as front line workers need it more?
The money side of things seemed roughly equal too, £15.3bn savings, £23bn if nurses and doctors are included and £16.5bn extra made available to the MOD over the next four years, without being adjusted to inflation a rise in real terms of £24.1bn.
Oh and haven’t even mentioned that the tories attempted to block extending the scheme to provide free school meals over the holidays to disadvantaged children which cost £170m.
I just don’t get the government’s fiscal policy of giving cash out to some projects that will make it not good but not others, wanting to rack up massive public debt (just hit £2 trillion) but not wanting to give out money where it really matters to people who really need it.
Only way to get out of this will be finding ways to make extra revenue for the treasury whilst giving out grants to small businesses to prop them up so they still can open their doors and employ people. Austerity has already proved itself to be an ineffective and unnecessarily punitive policy.
|
|
|
|
Post by axegas on Nov 20, 2020 23:42:37 GMT
It was interesting that they announced a rise in defence spending at the same time a pay freeze for 5 million public sector workers for the next three years is expected to be announced. I get that the MOD is underfunded as a result of previous defence reviews and probably needs the money but arguably don’t public sector workers that battled through COVID as front line workers need it more? The money side of things seemed roughly equal too, £15.3bn savings, £23bn if nurses and doctors are included and £16.5bn extra made available to the MOD over the next four years, adjusted to inflation a rise of £24.1bn. Oh and haven’t even mentioned that the tories attempted to block extending the scheme to provide free school meals over the holidays to disadvantaged children which cost £170m. I just don’t get the government’s fiscal policy of giving cash out to some projects that will make it not good but not others, wanting to rack up massive public debt (just hit £2 trillion) but not wanting to give out money where it really matters to people who really need it. Only way to get out of this will be finding ways to make extra revenue for the treasury whilst giving out grants to small businesses to prop them up so they still can open their doors and employ people. Austerity has already proved itself to be an ineffective and unnecessarily punitive policy. As much as I believe that a pay freeze simply isn’t fair for millions of public sector workers who have endured a truly miserable year as it is, I also don’t believe that if one is imposed, it’s fair to exempt doctors and nurses but not other as equally hard working public sector workers just to avoid a bigger backlash of public opinion. |
|
|
|
Post by yattongas on Nov 20, 2020 23:42:56 GMT
It was interesting that they announced a rise in defence spending at the same time a pay freeze for 5 million public sector workers for the next three years is expected to be announced. I get that the MOD is underfunded as a result of previous defence reviews and probably needs the money but arguably don’t public sector workers that battled through COVID as front line workers need it more? The money side of things seemed roughly equal too, £15.3bn savings, £23bn if nurses and doctors are included and £16.5bn extra made available to the MOD over the next four years, adjusted to inflation a rise of £24.1bn. Oh and haven’t even mentioned that the tories attempted to block extending the scheme to provide free school meals over the holidays to disadvantaged children which cost £170m. I just don’t get the government’s fiscal policy of giving cash out to some projects that will make it not good but not others, wanting to rack up massive public debt (just hit £2 trillion) but not wanting to give out money where it really matters to people who really need it. Only way to get out of this will be finding ways to make extra revenue for the treasury whilst giving out grants to small businesses to prop them up so they still can open their doors and employ people. Austerity has already proved itself to be an ineffective and unnecessarily punitive policy. We’d of been much better off financially if we’d pooled our resources and pitched into an EU army/navy/airforce The headbangers will hate this ..... but it’s true |
|
|
|
Post by axegas on Nov 20, 2020 23:48:05 GMT
It was interesting that they announced a rise in defence spending at the same time a pay freeze for 5 million public sector workers for the next three years is expected to be announced. I get that the MOD is underfunded as a result of previous defence reviews and probably needs the money but arguably don’t public sector workers that battled through COVID as front line workers need it more? The money side of things seemed roughly equal too, £15.3bn savings, £23bn if nurses and doctors are included and £16.5bn extra made available to the MOD over the next four years, adjusted to inflation a rise of £24.1bn. Oh and haven’t even mentioned that the tories attempted to block extending the scheme to provide free school meals over the holidays to disadvantaged children which cost £170m. I just don’t get the government’s fiscal policy of giving cash out to some projects that will make it not good but not others, wanting to rack up massive public debt (just hit £2 trillion) but not wanting to give out money where it really matters to people who really need it. Only way to get out of this will be finding ways to make extra revenue for the treasury whilst giving out grants to small businesses to prop them up so they still can open their doors and employ people. Austerity has already proved itself to be an ineffective and unnecessarily punitive policy. We’d of been much better off financially if we’d pooled our resources and pitched into an EU army/navy/airforce The headbangers will hate this ..... but it’s true Eh I’m very pro EU but I’m not sure that’s true. We only spend roughly 2% of GDP on defence as it is and I’m sure we’d be expected by other European countries to commit that amount to such a scheme if we were part of it. We’d get much better value for money though from more efficient procurement and a pooled research and development budget. Being part of the common market and taking advantage of existing trade agreements on the other hand, that would make us better off financially. |
|
|
|
Post by yattongas on Nov 21, 2020 0:04:50 GMT
We’d of been much better off financially if we’d pooled our resources and pitched into an EU army/navy/airforce The headbangers will hate this ..... but it’s true Eh I’m very pro EU but I’m not sure that’s true. We only spend roughly 2% of GDP on defence as it is and I’m sure we’d be expected by other European countries to commit that amount to such a scheme if we were part of it. We’d get much better value for money though from more efficient procurement and a pooled research and development budget. Being part of the common market and taking advantage of existing trade agreements on the other hand, that would make us better off financially. But we have to spend 2% on everything..... most of the other eu doesn’t . If we all did I’m sure we’d be better armed and better off . I must confess on this I don’t really have a scooby but going it alone when we’ll never be a big player seems fruitless to me |
|
|
|
Post by Gassy on Nov 21, 2020 0:18:49 GMT
Problem is that everything with the Tories gets brushed under the carpet and the turkeys keep lapping it up. What have they actually owned up to? Bad reaction to Covid? Nah Russian interference? Nah Islamophobia? Nah Cummings? Nah Patel? Nah At what point will this government reflect on their failings or mistakes? Either it’ll never happen or it’ll be one of those situations that every Tory likes to drive gone right now, “when this is all over” - AKA in 30+ years when I can finally turn my back and say I had no support of it Come on Gassy has any Government admitted to its mistakes and failings. Not just a Tory thing that you seem to think it is. Probably very true FG, however the first time I could vote was the 2010 election, which is when I became interested. Couldn't stand Cameron at the time, but tbh I think he did ok overall. May was obviously a mess and this government is just an absolute joke. If previous governments did the same then I'll throw them under that same bus, if this was Labour doing the same i'd be just as annoyed by the whole thing. I think we can all agree that we need to hold all parties accountable to the same standards. Sadly not the case though, on both sides most likely. |
|
|
|
Post by Gassy on Nov 21, 2020 0:21:00 GMT
Problem is that everything with the Tories gets brushed under the carpet and the turkeys keep lapping it up. What have they actually owned up to? Bad reaction to Covid? Nah Russian interference? Nah Islamophobia? Nah Cummings? Nah Patel? Nah At what point will this government reflect on their failings or mistakes? Either it’ll never happen or it’ll be one of those situations that every Tory likes to drive gone right now, “when this is all over” - AKA in 30+ years when I can finally turn my back and say I had no support of it Really bit like every other government both before and the future,how do you know they aren't reflecting do you want public hanging and flogging See post above on previous governments. If all we can say is 'yeah but the previous lot did it' then god help us, we deserve every negative thing that'll come at us. When will a government stand up and try to do better? When will the voters actually say thats not good enough, instead of yeah but they did it too? We will never move forward as a country with these attitudes unfortunately and governments will continue to take the water. |
|
|
|
Post by stuart1974 on Nov 21, 2020 0:26:44 GMT
Eh I’m very pro EU but I’m not sure that’s true. We only spend roughly 2% of GDP on defence as it is and I’m sure we’d be expected by other European countries to commit that amount to such a scheme if we were part of it. We’d get much better value for money though from more efficient procurement and a pooled research and development budget. Being part of the common market and taking advantage of existing trade agreements on the other hand, that would make us better off financially. But we have to spend 2% on everything..... most of the other eu doesn’t . If we all did I’m sure we’d be better armed and better off . I must confess on this I don’t really have a scooby but going it alone when we’ll never be a big player seems fruitless to me The 2% is a NATO minimum which few actually do, and not all EU countries are in NATO. There would be issues on neutrality with Ireland and Sweden for instance. The "EU army" would really be a command headquarters thing to coordinate operations such as in the Balkans or off Africa rather than a standing force. Procurement wise we already had that through OCCAR which is designed to help cross border manufacture. We are (and always were) free to do joint procurement, even though the Germans were buggers with Typhoon and A400 projects. 🙄 |
|
|
|
Post by trevorgas on Nov 21, 2020 9:06:43 GMT
Really bit like every other government both before and the future,how do you know they aren't reflecting do you want public hanging and flogging See post above on previous governments. If all we can say is 'yeah but the previous lot did it' then god help us, we deserve every negative thing that'll come at us. When will a government stand up and try to do better? When will the voters actually say thats not good enough, instead of yeah but they did it too? We will never move forward as a country with these attitudes unfortunately and governments will continue to take the water. I think you will find that most Organisations and i include Governments do their reflecting and change planning in private,it doesn't need to be a step by step commentary in the full glare of the public,in the end it's the changes they make that are important not the process to get there. |
|
|
|
Post by Gassy on Nov 21, 2020 10:34:26 GMT
See post above on previous governments. If all we can say is 'yeah but the previous lot did it' then god help us, we deserve every negative thing that'll come at us. When will a government stand up and try to do better? When will the voters actually say thats not good enough, instead of yeah but they did it too? We will never move forward as a country with these attitudes unfortunately and governments will continue to take the water. I think you will find that most Organisations and i include Governments do their reflecting and change planning in private,it doesn't need to be a step by step commentary in the full glare of the public,in the end it's the changes they make that are important not the process to get there. I agree with you, but the charges are consistently nothing and brushed under the carpet! As you say, that is the important thing and we see too many people letting them get away with it |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2020 13:15:55 GMT
It was interesting that they announced a rise in defence spending at the same time a pay freeze for 5 million public sector workers for the next three years is expected to be announced. I get that the MOD is underfunded as a result of previous defence reviews and probably needs the money but arguably don’t public sector workers that battled through COVID as front line workers need it more? The money side of things seemed roughly equal too, £15.3bn savings, £23bn if nurses and doctors are included and £16.5bn extra made available to the MOD over the next four years, without being adjusted to inflation a rise in real terms of £24.1bn. Oh and haven’t even mentioned that the tories attempted to block extending the scheme to provide free school meals over the holidays to disadvantaged children which cost £170m. I just don’t get the government’s fiscal policy of giving cash out to some projects that will make it not good but not others, wanting to rack up massive public debt (just hit £2 trillion) but not wanting to give out money where it really matters to people who really need it. Only way to get out of this will be finding ways to make extra revenue for the treasury whilst giving out grants to small businesses to prop them up so they still can open their doors and employ people. Austerity has already proved itself to be an ineffective and unnecessarily punitive policy. With respect why don’t you get it? This is standard modern Conservatism, rob from the poor to give to the rich. It is so blatant they are doing it in front of our face and are not daring to hide it. In the few short months this cabinet have been in existence they have committed so many acts of scandal and they’ve done it in plain sight because they think they can get away with it at the ballot box. We thought lying to the Queen was the worst it could get, but since then we’ve had kick backs to donors, failing to sack Cummings, failing to sack Patel, taking food away from kids while giving fat contracts to mates etc etc etc. But more than that they are laughing at the likes of you and me because they know we are stupid enough to keep voting for them. And you know what? They are absolutely right. |
|
|
|
Post by stuart1974 on Nov 21, 2020 14:37:27 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2020 19:21:31 GMT
On the same day as they give 100s of millions to rugby union and horse racing and 12 million to rugby league and claim there is no north south divide. |
|
