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Post by oldgas on Jun 30, 2020 11:30:04 GMT
It's really up to the individual. When I see those people on those black lives marches and destroying Bristols heritage when we were supposed to be in lockdown it kind of makes you despair of the human race really.
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Post by straighouttabristol on Jun 30, 2020 11:39:49 GMT
It's really up to the individual. When I see those people on those black lives marches and destroying Bristols heritage when we were supposed to be in lockdown it kind of makes you despair of the human race really. What about all the people at the beach? Or the right wing lads so say protecting Churchill’s statue? Don’t let systematic racism by the media cloud your brain |
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Post by straighouttabristol on Jun 30, 2020 11:41:57 GMT
I would I’m pretty young and in good health and I’m not worried about it. The death toll figures have been hugely inflated on top of how many people have no symptoms so unknowingly have had it I don’t think the death rate is any higher than your average flu and buy sept Oct I believe it will largely be gone anyway. But I do respect and understand people who see it differently and want to self isolate as a precaution. It's people like you who would make me think twice about returning to Rovers, as you'll probably have total disregard for the social distancing rules. Why do you think there's been an extra 30,000+ deaths this summer than the norm? Nope I still respect social distancing out of respect for other people haven’t seen my Nan or parents due to it but I’m also not knocked by the media. Also those figures are wrong deaths from other illnesses have actually gone down and I know many people whose died or relatives have from illness not connected with covid but have had covid put on the death certificate |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Jun 30, 2020 11:47:55 GMT
Any more gratuitously non-football stuff and we'll be off to General Quarantine.
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Post by Westy on Jun 30, 2020 12:08:37 GMT
I totally hear everybody when people say they don't want to infect their vulnerable friends and family, and want to social distance to avoid passing it on. The only issue I have with this is that vulnerable people will and do die from things like shingles, seasonal flu, the common cold. The logic that we should shut down the economy and not leave the house needs to be applied universally if it is to have any credibility.
Those who distance to protect their family, do you self isolate for 3 months every winter? When the seasonal flu is going around. Because if you don't; you're a hypocrite. The best course of action to protect the vulnerable from transmittable disease is literally for nobody to leave their house ever again.
Unfortunately, it is what it is. There is always a flu going around (there's actually trillions of flu strains floating in the air), and as compassionate and empathetic as I am, if you're 97 with terminal cancer, something's going to push you over the edge. I'd put it down to the cancer and the age. But we're happy to blame the flu now.
Elon Musk said, with his tongue firmly in his cheek but with his finger on the pulse:
"If you got eaten by a shark and tested positive for Covid, you'd be marked as a Covid death".
To satisfy some, I can't see any problem with 2m distancing on the terraces. Queuing up for the bar and the turnstiles might be problematic but that's something we've managed to do elsewhere.
Another point people need to realise is that when they say "I'm following the science" is that supermarkets are open, power stations are open. So people are going to work, they aren't closed. If we "followed the science with lockdown" that would literally mean EVERYBODY, so - no lights, no food, no water etc. So you're not following the science by enforcing double standards, you're taking a political stance.
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Post by gasandelectricity on Jun 30, 2020 12:10:58 GMT
Personally I read the stats which are coming out of the Bristol Post and I feel like geographically we’d be safe to go back to a normal sense of life. We have a case here or there every now and then which are most likely bought in from other areas. Feels like the best thing for us is if lockdowns in areas such as Leicester are applied more liberally (for want of a less ironic term to describe that).
Whilst the impacts are terrible in terms of loss of loved ones we’re going to have to accept that we have to make a choice between living in fear or returning to some semblance of normality, with appropriate management of the virus to mitigate it as best as possible with appropriate contact tracing and local lockdowns to prevent NHS being overwhelmed.
Whilst to some it seems like it’s a simple case of a bit of money here or there the impact of a global depression is widespread poverty like we’ve not seen in many of our lifetimes. Indeed the last global depression gave rise to the Nazis. It is possible the economic fall out could be even more horrific than the virus.
An economist will tell you to reopen, and a scientist will tell you to lockdown completely for as long as possible. Whilst they’re experts in their fields they aren’t fit to make a decision on both and that’s where we have to trust that they’ve advised our governments to make the best decisions which will balance the two.
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Post by Westy on Jun 30, 2020 12:14:14 GMT
It's people like you who would make me think twice about returning to Rovers, as you'll probably have total disregard for the social distancing rules. Why do you think there's been an extra 30,000+ deaths this summer than the norm? Nope I still respect social distancing out of respect for other people haven’t seen my Nan or parents due to it but I’m also not knocked by the media. Also those figures are wrong deaths from other illnesses have actually gone down and I know many people whose died or relatives have from illness not connected with covid but have had covid put on the death certificate Did you see your parents or your nan last winter? When people were getting the flu? Don't mean to @ your post personally, but once lockdown is over and you can see your parents and your nan, what's to stop you picking up another influenza strain and passing it on to them? |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Jun 30, 2020 12:21:33 GMT
What I would suggest is that anyone considering going to a game is to educate yourself and find a range of credible medical sources to base your decision on, and not take any notice of anything in this thread.
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Post by straighouttabristol on Jun 30, 2020 12:47:50 GMT
Nope I still respect social distancing out of respect for other people haven’t seen my Nan or parents due to it but I’m also not knocked by the media. Also those figures are wrong deaths from other illnesses have actually gone down and I know many people whose died or relatives have from illness not connected with covid but have had covid put on the death certificate Did you see your parents or your nan last winter? When people were getting the flu? Don't mean to @ your post personally, but once lockdown is over and you can see your parents and your nan, what's to stop you picking up another influenza strain and passing it on to them? Yep but as people who religiously watch the news and read the paper they’re quite worried so I respect that. I believe in people can form their own opinions on it and respect whether they choose to self isolate or not, I’ve gone to work through out it been on the bus there and back and I’ve been fine I also believe washing your hands too much and using hand gels is going to do more harm than good by weakening your immune system but people are still following that and that’s 100% up to them. I don’t take no offence at you directly asking me I get your point and am open to healthy debate. |
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Post by pepsi on Jun 30, 2020 12:59:08 GMT
Did you see your parents or your nan last winter? When people were getting the flu? Don't mean to @ your post personally, but once lockdown is over and you can see your parents and your nan, what's to stop you picking up another influenza strain and passing it on to them? Yep but as people who religiously watch the news and read the paper they’re quite worried so I respect that. I believe in people can form their own opinions on it and respect whether they choose to self isolate or not, I’ve gone to work through out it been on the bus there and back and I’ve been fine I also believe washing your hands too much and using hand gels is going to do more harm than good by weakening your immune system but people are still following that and that’s 100% up to them. I don’t take no offence at you directly asking me I get your point and am open to healthy debate. I understand you. I actually wondered how this thread would go as I've not seen this debate on here. I decided to not post my opinion and I've stopped talking to many friends and family on this subject. I now listen if I must and nod/agree quietly and change the subject 😂 |
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Post by Westy on Jun 30, 2020 13:07:29 GMT
Did you see your parents or your nan last winter? When people were getting the flu? Don't mean to @ your post personally, but once lockdown is over and you can see your parents and your nan, what's to stop you picking up another influenza strain and passing it on to them? Yep but as people who religiously watch the news and read the paper they’re quite worried so I respect that. I believe in people can form their own opinions on it and respect whether they choose to self isolate or not, I’ve gone to work through out it been on the bus there and back and I’ve been fine I also believe washing your hands too much and using hand gels is going to do more harm than good by weakening your immune system but people are still following that and that’s 100% up to them. I don’t take no offence at you directly asking me I get your point and am open to healthy debate. That makes sense on other people like family being more worried than us, and respecting their feelings! Good point there! I didn't really mean to take this whole thread and turn it into a projection of my thoughts on the science and economics, guess this is just pent up conversations that I haven't been able to get out of my system at the pub! |
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Post by straighouttabristol on Jun 30, 2020 13:24:00 GMT
Yep but as people who religiously watch the news and read the paper they’re quite worried so I respect that. I believe in people can form their own opinions on it and respect whether they choose to self isolate or not, I’ve gone to work through out it been on the bus there and back and I’ve been fine I also believe washing your hands too much and using hand gels is going to do more harm than good by weakening your immune system but people are still following that and that’s 100% up to them. I don’t take no offence at you directly asking me I get your point and am open to healthy debate. That makes sense on other people like family being more worried than us, and respecting their feelings! Good point there! I didn't really mean to take this whole thread and turn it into a projection of my thoughts on the science and economics, guess this is just pent up conversations that I haven't been able to get out of my system at the pub! Same here but I’ll stop with my views as i know people don’t like the chat going away from football. In response to the op I think by the time season starts there will be less reported cases and spectators will be allowed in but with a lot of different safety measures involved |
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Post by daniel300380 on Jun 30, 2020 14:13:47 GMT
Will be 1m rule by the time any crowds are allowed in. Isn't it 1 metre from the 4th July?? This is an economic limitation, not a health one. The virus isn't transmitted less distance as time goes on. Anyone that may have vulnerabilities will not be able to attend (unless they accept the risks). I appreciate people will be outside, but the risks remain, and just think if you were stood next to an asymptomatic person, caught it, and took it home to your nearest and dearest? To me it just doesn't bare thinking about. Only when an effective vaccine is administered to a majority of the population, will we return to any type of normality. (as long as this new pig virus thingy from China isn't a go'er! and it starts all over again.) They might never find a vaccine. They never have for any of the previous coronavirus's. Eventually we will have to try and get things back to as close as normal, as possible. That could mean smaller crowds, 1 metre apart. |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jun 30, 2020 14:48:47 GMT
The 2m rule can only be relaxed if the following are used instead:
"A “1-metre-plus” approach will mean members of the public can be 1 metre away from each other as long as other measures are put in place to limit the transmission of the virus. These include wearing a face covering, installing screens, making sure people face away from each other and providing extra handwashing facilities"
None of those seem likely to be available in a football ground, so the existing 2m rule is likely to apply until the Government ever decides to relax that rule, which is unlikely before next winter is over.
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Post by oldgas on Jun 30, 2020 14:51:42 GMT
It's really up to the individual. When I see those people on those black lives marches and destroying Bristols heritage when we were supposed to be in lockdown it kind of makes you despair of the human race really. What about all the people at the beach? Or the right wing lads so say protecting Churchill’s statue? Don’t let systematic racism by the media cloud your brain Sorry, to be clear I'd also like to add all the people who went to the beach, protected war memorials and any other lockdown rule breakers who I haven't mentioned, just to ensure you understand that my original post wasn't written as a result of my brain being conditioned by some systematic manipulation by the media. F@ck me, the Thought Police stalk this forum night and day. Don't you self-righteous twats ever take a day off? |
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Post by curlywurly on Jun 30, 2020 15:05:42 GMT
I totally hear everybody when people say they don't want to infect their vulnerable friends and family, and want to social distance to avoid passing it on. The only issue I have with this is that vulnerable people will and do die from things like shingles, seasonal flu, the common cold. The logic that we should shut down the economy and not leave the house needs to be applied universally if it is to have any credibility. Those who distance to protect their family, do you self isolate for 3 months every winter? When the seasonal flu is going around. Because if you don't; you're a hypocrite. The best course of action to protect the vulnerable from transmittable disease is literally for nobody to leave their house ever again. Unfortunately, it is what it is. There is always a flu going around (there's actually trillions of flu strains floating in the air), and as compassionate and empathetic as I am, if you're 97 with terminal cancer, something's going to push you over the edge. I'd put it down to the cancer and the age. But we're happy to blame the flu now. Elon Musk said, with his tongue firmly in his cheek but with his finger on the pulse: "If you got eaten by a shark and tested positive for Covid, you'd be marked as a Covid death". To satisfy some, I can't see any problem with 2m distancing on the terraces. Queuing up for the bar and the turnstiles might be problematic but that's something we've managed to do elsewhere. Another point people need to realise is that when they say "I'm following the science" is that supermarkets are open, power stations are open. So people are going to work, they aren't closed. If we "followed the science with lockdown" that would literally mean EVERYBODY, so - no lights, no food, no water etc. So you're not following the science by enforcing double standards, you're taking a political stance. I really don't see myself as a hypocrite. The flaw in your argument is that Covid 19 has a significantly higher case fatality rate than the other diseases that you mention. We won't know the overall figures until later, but put simply the general % of people that will die having caught Covid 19 is much higher than shingles, seasonal flu or the common cold.
Moreover, the inherent reproductive number - or if you prefer the likelihood that a person with the disease is going to pass it on to someone else - is also much higher for Covid-19 than the others. Bring people into close contact again and the number of cases will inevitibly rise until we vaccinate or achieve herd immunity.
It is not a political stance. It is basic epidemiology.
Finally, believe anything Elon Musk says at your peril.
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Post by axegas on Jun 30, 2020 15:10:48 GMT
Didn't want to do this but seeing as this threads lurched off topic to become a discussion about politics and the coronavirus, it's getting moved to the general chat. Don't say you weren't warned.
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Post by curlywurly on Jun 30, 2020 15:20:52 GMT
Didn't want to do this but seeing as this threads lurched off topic to become a discussion about politics and the coronavirus, it's getting moved to the general chat. Don't say you weren't warned. Trigger happy modding IMO.
This relates to whether you would be happy to return to watching Rovers sooner rather than later. It is directly Rovers related and needs to consider the specific of Covid-19.
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Post by straighouttabristol on Jun 30, 2020 15:22:21 GMT
What about all the people at the beach? Or the right wing lads so say protecting Churchill’s statue? Don’t let systematic racism by the media cloud your brain Sorry, to be clear I'd also like to add all the people who went to the beach, protected war memorials and any other lockdown rule breakers who I haven't mentioned, just to ensure you understand that my original post wasn't written as a result of my brain being conditioned by some systematic manipulation by the media. F@ck me, the Thought Police stalk this forum night and day. Don't you self-righteous twats ever take a day off? Nope being self righteous is a full time job |
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Post by Westy on Jun 30, 2020 18:06:50 GMT
Didn't want to do this but seeing as this threads lurched off topic to become a discussion about politics and the coronavirus, it's getting moved to the general chat. Don't say you weren't warned. Trigger happy modding IMO.
This relates to whether you would be happy to return to watching Rovers sooner rather than later. It is directly Rovers related and needs to consider the specific of Covid-19.
Nah to be fair I'll put my hands up and admit I did turn it into something other than football! |
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