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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2020 22:59:23 GMT
Does anyone know Widdrington's caravan number so I can post a turd through the letter box?
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Post by poorblue on Dec 4, 2020 0:23:24 GMT
Still can't believe the mods have let this thread to be highjacked from the title but here goes, I'll join in. I'm not ITK or qualified in finance but as I understand it Wael owns BRFC, Dwyanne Sports, The Quarters and The Mem. As I understand it all the debts (well mostly I suspect) are trading debts such as rent between these companies. Therefore he is/was in debt to himself. Therefore technically, even practically, he did not "pay" any debt off. I believe the legal term is "written off". That is he has foregone a claim for the debt from his other company. How was the debt accrued? Possibly by taking a loan at say 2% from a bank (family bank?) then charging his other company say 10% never fully expecting it to be paid thus no tax payable as there is no profit. It's my understanding this is how most clubs and perhaps many of non football companies are run. BRFC pays rent to The Mem Co just as it did when previous Directors ran the club. Lansdown I understand has twice "written off " £50m in exactly the same way. I cannot see an experienced billionaire would lose £100m just for the fun
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Post by oldgas on Dec 4, 2020 6:48:56 GMT
I have a great deal of time for Gerry the first time around. He gave me some of the best seasons in my Gas supporting life. However, every chance he gets he drones on about how he lent the club £10000 to buy Holloway. It was the first thing he said when they interviewed him following Geoff Dumfords death. We were all very grateful for the loan Gery, but you've never told us how much you got back when Holloway was sold.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2020 11:49:38 GMT
I have a great deal of time for Gerry the first time around. He gave me some of the best seasons in my Gas supporting life. However, every chance he gets he drones on about how he lent the club £10000 to buy Holloway. It was the first thing he said when they interviewed him following Geoff Dumfords death. We were all very grateful for the loan Gery, but you've never told us how much you got back when Holloway was sold. He said on the podcast he got it back without interest.
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Post by phillistine on Dec 4, 2020 12:38:14 GMT
Was he ever asked if he made money when Devon White, Nigel Martyn, Jason Roberts and Gary Penrice were sold?
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Post by toddy1953 on Dec 4, 2020 12:48:54 GMT
Jeez this thread has gone from Director of football, to whether Wael has really cleared the debt, on to Gerry Francis forking out £10k to bring Ollie back & whether he got a cut of transfers from other players - with a little bit of Bolders squeezed in 😱
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2020 12:58:03 GMT
Was he ever asked if he made money when Devon White, Nigel Martyn, Jason Roberts and Gary Penrice were sold? He said on the podcast we did with him that he got his 10k back after we sold Nigel and Penny with no interest
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2020 13:00:34 GMT
Also why would Gerry get money for Jason Robert’s?
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Post by wilmslowgas on Dec 4, 2020 13:02:05 GMT
Let's not get churlish about Gerry Francis. His first spell was great and that team was a joy to watch. His second spell did not go well - but there again second spells often go awry. I accept that comparing historical teams and players can be a little meaningless but that first team under Francis Mark 1 was vastly superior to the current bunch. I'm struggling to think of a single current player who would have got into Francis' team.
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Post by Quarters on Dec 4, 2020 13:33:02 GMT
I have a great deal of time for Gerry the first time around. He gave me some of the best seasons in my Gas supporting life. However, every chance he gets he drones on about how he lent the club £10000 to buy Holloway. It was the first thing he said when they interviewed him following Geoff Dumfords death. We were all very grateful for the loan Gery, but you've never told us how much you got back when Holloway was sold. He said on the podcast he got it back without interest. Read what he asked. It's well known that managers sometimes get a "cut" of transfer fees. It has been stated that Gerry Francis had such contracts. If true then the money he made from sales would be far greater than the interest on £10,000. So he was not hard done by!
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Post by wilmslowgas on Dec 4, 2020 13:37:00 GMT
Well, on the positive side, there's little chance that BG, TW or PT will get a "cut" of a transfer fee for any of the current first team squad.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2020 15:26:29 GMT
Still can't believe the mods have let this thread to be highjacked from the title but here goes, I'll join in. I'm not ITK or qualified in finance but as I understand it Wael owns BRFC, Dwyanne Sports, The Quarters and The Mem. As I understand it all the debts (well mostly I suspect) are trading debts such as rent between these companies. Therefore he is/was in debt to himself. Therefore technically, even practically, he did not "pay" any debt off. I believe the legal term is "written off". That is he has foregone a claim for the debt from his other company. How was the debt accrued? Possibly by taking a loan at say 2% from a bank (family bank?) then charging his other company say 10% never fully expecting it to be paid thus no tax payable as there is no profit. It's my understanding this is how most clubs and perhaps many of non football companies are run. BRFC pays rent to The Mem Co just as it did when previous Directors ran the club. Lansdown I understand has twice "written off " £50m in exactly the same way. I cannot see an experienced billionaire would lose £100m just for the fun No rent was paid to Mem Co after Bristol Rovers became 100% owners and Mem co is now a dormant company. The debt has been incurred from trading losses, spending more than we earn, and Dwayne Sports has loaned that money to Bristol Rovers 1883 ltd hence the charge on the stadium which that company owns. Ignoring who owns what and owes what to who, the overspent cash has left both the club and the owners pockets. Steve Lansdown has explained several times that the billions he made before retirement is safe and secure with his family. What he spends each year is new cash earned from his vast shareholding in Hargrave Lansdown and other investments since he accrued his vast wealth. In other words, new money. Both clubs are fortunate to have owners who are able to convert large loans into equity knowing that they will probably never see it back again.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2020 16:36:26 GMT
He said on the podcast he got it back without interest. Read what he asked. It's well known that managers sometimes get a "cut" of transfer fees. It has been stated that Gerry Francis had such contracts. If true then the money he made from sales would be far greater than the interest on £10,000. So he was not hard done by! Never said he was, just posted what he said about the ten grand loan.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2020 17:38:37 GMT
Thought we weren't supposed to hijack threads on here?
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Post by gashead1981 on Dec 4, 2020 18:00:09 GMT
Still can't believe the mods have let this thread to be highjacked from the title but here goes, I'll join in. I'm not ITK or qualified in finance but as I understand it Wael owns BRFC, Dwyanne Sports, The Quarters and The Mem. As I understand it all the debts (well mostly I suspect) are trading debts such as rent between these companies. Therefore he is/was in debt to himself. Therefore technically, even practically, he did not "pay" any debt off. I believe the legal term is "written off". That is he has foregone a claim for the debt from his other company. How was the debt accrued? Possibly by taking a loan at say 2% from a bank (family bank?) then charging his other company say 10% never fully expecting it to be paid thus no tax payable as there is no profit. It's my understanding this is how most clubs and perhaps many of non football companies are run. BRFC pays rent to The Mem Co just as it did when previous Directors ran the club. Lansdown I understand has twice "written off " £50m in exactly the same way. I cannot see an experienced billionaire would lose £100m just for the fun No rent was paid to Mem Co after Bristol Rovers became 100% owners and Mem co is now a dormant company. The debt has been incurred from trading losses, spending more than we earn, and Dwayne Sports has loaned that money to Bristol Rovers 1883 ltd hence the charge on the stadium which that company owns. Ignoring who owns what and owes what to who, the overspent cash has left both the club and the owners pockets. Steve Lansdown has explained several times that the billions he made before retirement is safe and secure with his family. What he spends each year is new cash earned from his vast shareholding in Hargrave Lansdown and other investments since he accrued his vast wealth. In other words, new money. Both clubs are fortunate to have owners who are able to convert large loans into equity knowing that they will probably never see it back again. It’s also worth noting that some of the debt was the inherited debt accrued by the last board (£8m I think). The bottom line is, the usual posters that like to throw stones are continuing to do so without any hard evidence to back up their theorise only than what might not be in the public domain just yet for a plethora of good reasons. Either way, the debt accrued is internally owned by the owner of the club so there is no great drama unless he calls that debt in with no alternative ownership or plan in the pipeline.
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Post by Topper Gas on Dec 4, 2020 18:11:34 GMT
G1981 I sense then"hard evidence" are the Companies House records, it can't be denied that they've never been updated to show the debts been cleared as Wael suggested they would be back in September.
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Post by phillistine on Dec 5, 2020 12:06:13 GMT
G1981 I sense then"hard evidence" are the Companies House records, it can't be denied that they've never been updated to show the debts been cleared as Wael suggested they would be back in September. If the debt has been written off then that will show on the balance sheet which is published with the annual accounts - nowhere else. They have not been published since Wael made his comments. What is more - if Wael did it after 30th June 2020 then it will be on the balance sheet published in March 2022 - so expect more scaremongering if it does not appear in the next set of accounts. Many assumptions are being made just because Rovers have a continuing facility to draw down £10 million from Dwane Sports. They may not even be using it although i suspect that they are otherwise Wael will need to be continuing to pump money in as they go along - that is not the way to run a business. I cannot think of any valid reason why they should opt to close the facility. Dont get me wrong, Wael may not have cleared the debt, but then equally he may have done so. It is down to whether you trust him. You simply cannot tell from the inmformation lodged with Companies House. i am not sure whether the comments being made are by people who just havent really thought what they are saying or whether they are deliberately stirring up ill feeling and panic within true supporters. If someone would like to tell me why my comments are invalid then please do so!!
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Post by phillistine on Dec 5, 2020 12:08:08 GMT
G1981 I sense then"hard evidence" are the Companies House records, it can't be denied that they've never been updated to show the debts been cleared as Wael suggested they would be back in September. If the debt has been written off then that will show on the balance sheet which is published with the annual accounts - nowhere else. They have not been published since Wael made his comments. What is more - if Wael did it after 30th June 2020 then it will be on the balance sheet published in March 2022 - so expect more scaremongering if it does not appear in the next set of accounts. Many assumptions are being made just because Rovers have a continuing facility to draw down £10 million from Dwane Sports. They may not even be using it although i suspect that they are otherwise Wael will need to be continuing to pump money in as they go along - that is not the way to run a business. I cannot think of any valid reason why they should opt to close the facility. Dont get me wrong, Wael may not have cleared the debt, but then equally he may have done so. It is down to whether you trust him. You simply cannot tell from the inmformation lodged with Companies House. i am not sure whether the comments being made are by people who just havent really thought what they are saying or whether they have information that is not available to the general public or are deliberately stirring up ill feeling and panic within true supporters. If someone would like to tell me what they know that I dont then i would be pleased to hear!!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2020 12:40:17 GMT
G1981 I sense then"hard evidence" are the Companies House records, it can't be denied that they've never been updated to show the debts been cleared as Wael suggested they would be back in September. If the debt has been written off then that will show on the balance sheet which is published with the annual accounts - nowhere else. They have not been published since Wael made his comments. What is more - if Wael did it after 30th June 2020 then it will be on the balance sheet published in March 2022 - so expect more scaremongering if it does not appear in the next set of accounts. Many assumptions are being made just because Rovers have a continuing facility to draw down £10 million from Dwane Sports. They may not even be using it although i suspect that they are otherwise Wael will need to be continuing to pump money in as they go along - that is not the way to run a business. I cannot think of any valid reason why they should opt to close the facility. Dont get me wrong, Wael may not have cleared the debt, but then equally he may have done so. It is down to whether you trust him. You simply cannot tell from the inmformation lodged with Companies House. i am not sure whether the comments being made are by people who just havent really thought what they are saying or whether they are deliberately stirring up ill feeling and panic within true supporters. If someone would like to tell me why my comments are invalid then please do so!! Completely agree.... it’s all conjecture and speculation... the 2 main protagonists G.I. and Swiss have form for this and I’m not saying they are wrong but rather than speculate on here, why don’t they ask the people who will know the answer directly and if they don’t get an answer chase it up and then if they don’t get an answer again then post what was asked and the fact they didn’t get an answer on here as the issue rather than put a lot of speculative information on here, dress it up as fact, do it on a completely non related thread to hijack it and ask others to ask questions for them purely (from what I can see) to create ill feeling towards the board and conflict amongst the posters on here.... I have asked both why they distrust the board/Wael so much, but as always that question remains unanswered.... It becomes increasingly tiresome and frustrating and in my eyes really diminishes their posting credibility....
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Post by albaron on Dec 5, 2020 12:44:04 GMT
Can we please revert this discussion back to " Director of Football " please.
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