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Post by Gas Go Marching In on Sept 19, 2021 7:49:11 GMT
Somersetgas, Exprem failure- I hardly think so. At least get your facts right. How is that not right? He's ex-prem. Fact. He's failing at managing us (and in any case that's always subjective). I mean it is subjective, but if you don't think one relegation and bottom three of the league below is failing then I don't really get where you're coming from. Think you are crossed wires he in Steve's defence. I think Somerset was talking about Barton as a player and Steve is saying he isn't an ex prem failure as a player.
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Sept 19, 2021 8:07:06 GMT
How is that not right? He's ex-prem. Fact. He's failing at managing us (and in any case that's always subjective). I mean it is subjective, but if you don't think one relegation and bottom three of the league below is failing then I don't really get where you're coming from. Think you are crossed wires he in Steve's defence. I think Somerset was talking about Barton as a player and Steve is saying he isn't an ex prem failure as a player. Well, if you say something that is reasonable and true, in one interpretation, doesn't really make sense to interpret it in a way that is not true. I mean, you might be right, Somerset might be saying that Barton was a failure as a player, but seeing as he is a failure as a manager, what would be the point of that? Especially as we're talking about his management here, and his management is pertinent to our club, and the thread. eg. If someone were to say 'the sky is blue', you might be right to tell me that the satellite TV company is not necessarily sad, but it would be reasonable to suggest that that is not the sense it was intended, right? In any case, it's also arguable that he was set for very bright things as a player, but his temperament wrecked that and he didn't have the career he should have, so it's still an opinion that his playing career was a (relative) failure. That's always gonna be an opinion so Steve refuting that as a fact is still unreasonable.
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Post by Gas Go Marching In on Sept 19, 2021 8:10:50 GMT
Think you are crossed wires he in Steve's defence. I think Somerset was talking about Barton as a player and Steve is saying he isn't an ex prem failure as a player. Well, if you say something that is reasonable and true, in one interpretation, doesn't really make sense to interpret it in a way that is not true. I mean, you might be right, Somerset might be saying that Barton was a failure as a player, but seeing as he is a failure as a manager, what would be the point of that? Especially as we're talking about his management here, and his management is pertinent to our club, and the thread. eg. If someone were to say 'the sky is blue', you might be right to tell me that the satellite TV company is not necessarily sad, but it would be reasonable to suggest that that is not the sense it was intended, right? At the time of appointing him he wasn't a failure as a manager though was he, and that's the way it comes across to me.
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Sept 19, 2021 8:14:27 GMT
Well, if you say something that is reasonable and true, in one interpretation, doesn't really make sense to interpret it in a way that is not true. I mean, you might be right, Somerset might be saying that Barton was a failure as a player, but seeing as he is a failure as a manager, what would be the point of that? Especially as we're talking about his management here, and his management is pertinent to our club, and the thread. eg. If someone were to say 'the sky is blue', you might be right to tell me that the satellite TV company is not necessarily sad, but it would be reasonable to suggest that that is not the sense it was intended, right? At the time of appointing him he wasn't a failure as a manager though was he, and that's the way it comes across to me. It can come across as any way you like, to yourself, obviously. The idea that you're bothering to defend Barton as a success (in any sense) in the midst of one of the most calamitous spells of management in our club's history is what's coming across to me. I mean why bother interpreting the post in a very specific way that makes it incorrect, when there are any number of interpretations that make it either inarguably correct, or at least arguably reasonable?
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Post by wertongas on Sept 19, 2021 8:23:54 GMT
Chris Hargreaves or even Kevin Maher, when you look back at our most successful managers in the last 20years they have all come from within the club, Trollope, DC who both got us promotion and GC. Hargreaves win rate is about the same as JB at Fleetwood and Kenny Jackett when he started off with Watford. Let's be fare he couldn't do much worse than the last three, appoint him tomorrow as caretaker with his win record and the fact he knows the club having been here for some years he should get us a top half finish. Which I would take after the start we have had. Also bring back Mansell to help out, both are loyal and hard working.
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Post by Gas Go Marching In on Sept 19, 2021 8:34:43 GMT
At the time of appointing him he wasn't a failure as a manager though was he, and that's the way it comes across to me. It can come across as any way you like, to yourself, obviously. The idea that you're bothering to defend Barton as a success (in any sense) in the midst of one of the most calamitous spells of management in our club's history is what's coming across to me. I mean why bother interpreting the post in a very specific way that makes it incorrect, when there are any number of interpretations that make it either inarguably correct, or at least arguably reasonable? What's with the twisting? It's nothing to do with defending Barton for me. It's about Steve getting a hard time as it is without people twisting things that he has said, and now attempting to do the same with me. Not going to work mate.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 19, 2021 8:38:42 GMT
My choice would be: Chris Wilder.
Been there, done it and done it successfully.
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Post by RD on Sept 19, 2021 8:41:19 GMT
My choice would be: Chris Wilder. Been there, done it and done it successfully. and mine would be Tuschel. Just not realistic unfortunately - will no doubt get Championship - absolutely minimum of a top L1 team.
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 19, 2021 8:43:04 GMT
My choice would be: Chris Wilder. Been there, done it and done it successfully. We'd better move quickly then as he's rumoured to be replacing Houghton at Forest, I'd imagine we're a far more attractive club to join!!
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 19, 2021 8:43:16 GMT
My choice would be: Chris Wilder. Been there, done it and done it successfully. and mine would be Tuschel. Just not realistic unfortunately - will no doubt get Championship - absolutely minimum of a top L1 team. Yes good post tend to agree but Wilder owes us: as he took Northampton out of the flames the season we were relegated into Conference.
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Sept 19, 2021 8:44:01 GMT
It can come across as any way you like, to yourself, obviously. The idea that you're bothering to defend Barton as a success (in any sense) in the midst of one of the most calamitous spells of management in our club's history is what's coming across to me. I mean why bother interpreting the post in a very specific way that makes it incorrect, when there are any number of interpretations that make it either inarguably correct, or at least arguably reasonable? What's with the twisting? It's nothing to do with defending Barton for me. It's about Steve getting a hard time as it is without people twisting things that he has said, and now attempting to do the same with me. Not going to work mate. Don't be silly. Read it carefully, I haven't twisted anything. Here's the fundamentals coz you obviously are out for a fight this morning. Steve said 'get your facts right.' This is fundamental and very obvious, there are no facts in regard to success and failure as a player. It's about an opinion. Footballers don't line up at the end of their careers waiting for the success/failure verdict from the official footballers success and failure awards committee. Obviously some careers and more successful than others but fundamentally anyone can have an opinion about any footballer's career. Look at all the Man U fans who used to go one about Bryan Robson's failure as a player. So, saying get your facts right over a matter of opinion is plainly wrong, fundamentally mistaken, and ironic. And that's before we even get into any of the issues of interpretation about what was meant. That's not twisting. If anything, Steve was twisting (not the word I would use, but your brought it here) by implying that an opinion about JB's playing career, if that's what was meant, was a matter of fact.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 19, 2021 8:45:31 GMT
In all honesty, it's pretty obvious isn't it?
Bond. Not, James...
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 19, 2021 8:46:17 GMT
Chris Hargreaves or even Kevin Maher, when you look back at our most successful managers in the last 20years they have all come from within the club, Trollope, DC who both got us promotion and GC. Hargreaves win rate is about the same as JB at Fleetwood and Kenny Jackett when he started off with Watford. Let's be fare he couldn't do much worse than the last three, appoint him tomorrow as caretaker with his win record and the fact he knows the club having been here for some years he should get us a top half finish. Which I would take after the start we have had. Also bring back Mansell to help out, both are loyal and hard working. Hargreaves has shown no previous interest in taking the Rovers job, perhaps he's content just running the Academy whilst regularly appearing on BT Sport?
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Post by Gas Go Marching In on Sept 19, 2021 8:47:16 GMT
What's with the twisting? It's nothing to do with defending Barton for me. It's about Steve getting a hard time as it is without people twisting things that he has said, and now attempting to do the same with me. Not going to work mate. Don't be silly. Read it carefully, I haven't twisted anything. Here's the fundamentals coz you obviously are out for a fight this morning. Steve said 'get your facts right.' This is fundamental and very obvious, there are no facts in regard to success and failure as a player. It's about an opinion. Footballers don't line up at the end of their careers waiting for the success/failure verdict from the official footballers success and failure awards committee. Obviously some careers and more successful than others but fundamentally anyone can have an opinion about any footballers career. Look at all the Man U fans who used ot go one about Bryan Robson's failure as a player. So, saying get your facts right over a matter of opinion is plainly wrong, fundamentally mistaken, and ironic. And that's before we even get into any of the issues of interpretation about what was meant. That's not twisting. If anything, Steve was twisting (not the word I would use, but your brought it here) by implying that an opinion about JB's playing career, if that's what was meant, was a matter of fact. I would say as a player, Barton was successful. Made the most of his ability, played in the prem. As a manager pre Rovers, he was neither a success or a failure. At this present time, a definite failure. P.S is a mod going to do anything about a certain poster consistently disclosing personal info on here or am I wasting my time?
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Post by gashead1981 on Sept 19, 2021 8:51:00 GMT
My choice would be: Chris Wilder. Been there, done it and done it successfully. We can only dream. Likely going to Nottingham Forest.
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Biggsy
Reserve Team
Posts: 323
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Post by Biggsy on Sept 19, 2021 8:54:08 GMT
my 4 year old Greyhound !
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 19, 2021 8:55:10 GMT
Given how we've performed in recent seasons I'd call us ever reaching the EFL play offs again a massive success! We can only dream about playing in the L1 playoffs.
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Post by kampucheagas on Sept 19, 2021 8:56:39 GMT
My choice would be: Chris Wilder. Been there, done it and done it successfully. We can only dream. Likely going to Nottingham Forest. They are also reportedly looking at Alex Neil. I’ve always liked him. If they go for Wilder, get on the blower, offer him a 5 year contract, nice pad in Bristol and free sausage rolls for all of his family members.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2021 8:59:16 GMT
Anyone. I can take being sh**, I’d rather be sh** with a decent human in charge rather than this terrible w**ker.
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Post by kampucheagas on Sept 19, 2021 9:03:54 GMT
Anyone. I can take being sh**, I’d rather be sh** with a decent human in charge rather than this terrible w**ker. Agree The toxic nature around the club needs to be sorted and fast I genuinely think a decent, honest manager now would galvanise the fan base and give us new hope At present, I’m staying away (for my sons sake) and it hurts to say, I’m not proud to be a gashead with JB in charge.
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