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Post by phillistine on Jul 8, 2024 9:13:58 GMT
Yes I fully agree, that as a fans owned club, with home gates about 25% lower than ours they do remarkably well. Before transfers fees they wouldn't have lost more than £1.4m in any of the last three years (to June 23) and with transfer fees they made a profit each year. I'm not sure how many activities are undertaken voluntary at Exeter, but with very similar numbers of employees, the Gas appear to spend about double on wages, which i'd guess is largely on players. So basically they followed the Dunford model, with the directors (and wives) getting their hands dirty and being actively involved together with a few trusted loyal employees (who were mostly also fans) and the help of volunteers support groups (SC, Presidents Club, YP, Helpline etc). Is the TG "professional" model working much better? The CT seem to follow a hybrid model with excellent employees, supporters and volunteers and young people helping them on the first rung of careers. Maybe the FC should look at a similar approach as no doubt the CT are a leading light with regards to most things related to Rovers. The problem with any model that relies on volunteers there is only so far you can go with it simply because you cannot impose professional standards on people who are giving their time for nothing. A friend of mine was involved in the charity sector and the problem that they experienced was that they would invest in training volunteers and then they would simply stop coming or give up if something happened that was more appealing. Most compaints in their shops were about volunteers and generally the management time spent on those people greatly exceeded the paid staff who could be depended upon. After just 3 years he gave up and moved back to the private sector simply because of the difficulty in managing a business that relied so much on volunteers |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jul 8, 2024 10:06:00 GMT
Imagine the uproar it would create if the owners announced that the model of running the club going forward would be based on volunteers working for free, when fans even moan about being asked to pay just £15 for a physical season ticket.
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Post by curlywurly on Jul 8, 2024 10:11:23 GMT
Yes I fully agree, that as a fans owned club, with home gates about 25% lower than ours they do remarkably well. Before transfers fees they wouldn't have lost more than £1.4m in any of the last three years (to June 23) and with transfer fees they made a profit each year. I'm not sure how many activities are undertaken voluntary at Exeter, but with very similar numbers of employees, the Gas appear to spend about double on wages, which i'd guess is largely on players. So basically they followed the Dunford model, with the directors (and wives) getting their hands dirty and being actively involved together with a few trusted loyal employees (who were mostly also fans) and the help of volunteers support groups (SC, Presidents Club, YP, Helpline etc). Is the TG "professional" model working much better? The CT seem to follow a hybrid model with excellent employees, supporters and volunteers and young people helping them on the first rung of careers. Maybe the FC should look at a similar approach as no doubt the CT are a leading light with regards to most things related to Rovers. Plenty of people have praised the Exeter model over the years and I'm not going to dissent. They appear well run and make the best of the resources at hand to do reasonably well in the 3rd tier.
My only problem with the fan owned/ community model is that they have effectively reached their ceiling. It is very difficult to see them competing at the top end of L1 and getting to the Championship, let alone sustaining at that level. Of course, we've done no better than that in the last 20 years and a Championship push from Rovers seems no more likely at the moment - but I think our potential ceiling is higher with our current ownership model.
I was pretty supportive of the Rovers Agenda for Change back in 2006 [web.archive.org/web/20130815015812/http://roversagendaforchange.org.uk/docs/Rovers%20Agenda%20for%20Change.pdf] but I'm less convinced now that the model will provide success beyond where Rovers currently sit. |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jul 8, 2024 10:54:28 GMT
Just look at Burton, and to a lesser extent Wycombe, this summer both taken over by billionaire owners, you have to sense if a club is not spending big money this summer they will struggle in L1 next season.
You can easily see L1 this season mirroring the Premiership, with half a dozen big spending clubs at the top, a core of club spending reasonable sums in the middle, and clubs like Cambridge & Crawley struggling at the bottom.
Although I've no idea what the attraction is for foreign based billionaires/multi millionaires to spend their money on mid table L1 sides with little real hope of ever getting a return on their money.
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Post by madridgas on Jul 8, 2024 12:20:29 GMT
So basically they followed the Dunford model, with the directors (and wives) getting their hands dirty and being actively involved together with a few trusted loyal employees (who were mostly also fans) and the help of volunteers support groups (SC, Presidents Club, YP, Helpline etc). Is the TG "professional" model working much better? The CT seem to follow a hybrid model with excellent employees, supporters and volunteers and young people helping them on the first rung of careers. Maybe the FC should look at a similar approach as no doubt the CT are a leading light with regards to most things related to Rovers. Plenty of people have praised the Exeter model over the years and I'm not going to dissent. They appear well run and make the best of the resources at hand to do reasonably well in the 3rd tier.
My only problem with the fan owned/ community model is that they have effectively reached their ceiling. It is very difficult to see them competing at the top end of L1 and getting to the Championship, let alone sustaining at that level. Of course, we've done no better than that in the last 20 years and a Championship push from Rovers seems no more likely at the moment - but I think our potential ceiling is higher with our current ownership model.
I was pretty supportive of the Rovers Agenda for Change back in 2006 [web.archive.org/web/20130815015812/http://roversagendaforchange.org.uk/docs/Rovers%20Agenda%20for%20Change.pdf] but I'm less convinced now that the model will provide success beyond where Rovers currently sit. Yes, I fully agree that the fan owned model on the one side probably keeps a club sustainable and on the other side limits it's potential, but for me I think, but can't prove (their accounts break out wages and salaries, representing 85% of their total costs. our's don't) , that Exeter have managed to out perform us for the last two seasons on a far lower wages / coaches salary bill. They have virtually the same number of employees as us, but I guess if they have qualified volunteers at board level that is a reasonable saving, but (assuming our wages are also 85% of total costs) nothing like the c£4.5m more we spend |
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Post by gasmania on Jul 8, 2024 12:59:52 GMT
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Post by percy on Jul 8, 2024 13:06:20 GMT
another one with a lot of flexibility in position. Up top, either wing or 2nd striker. Sure not worth £500k with those stats tho! £200k max with a sell on. |
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Post by lastminutewinner on Jul 8, 2024 13:15:30 GMT
Double swoop for Omochere and Wiredu please
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Post by madridgas on Jul 8, 2024 13:42:54 GMT
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Post by lastminutewinner on Jul 8, 2024 13:44:24 GMT
Dont think it will be that much but probably sold for more than 'league one POTS' Aaron Collins who is the same age |
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Post by nortongas1 on Jul 8, 2024 13:47:07 GMT
£750k + add ons apparently |
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Post by gasmania on Jul 8, 2024 13:49:21 GMT
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Post by pucklegas on Jul 8, 2024 13:51:47 GMT
Matt said hopefully 2 in this week, hoping it's two attacking threats. I don't for one minute think we ll be challenging, so let's get Jed Ward some experience with the hope of selling him for millions, later on.
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Post by madgas on Jul 8, 2024 14:16:21 GMT
Matt said hopefully 2 in this week, hoping it's two attacking threats. I don't for one minute think we ll be challenging, so let's get Jed Ward some experience with the hope of selling him for millions, later on. Slightly more optimistic... If Grant Ward starts 35 league games and we sign a half decent striker we'll be playoff close. |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jul 8, 2024 14:57:57 GMT
I wonder if Martin wasn't fit enough to start on Friday or just not being risked in case he's sold, as it seems unlikely Omochere and Martin would both be in a Rovers starting 11, and I can't see Martin being caught to just be a back up striker at this stage of his career. |
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Post by Wembley_Gas on Jul 8, 2024 15:17:33 GMT
I wonder if Martin wasn't fit enough to start on Friday or just not being risked in case he's sold, as it seems unlikely Omochere and Martin would both be in a Rovers starting 11, and I can't see Martin being caught to just be a back up striker at this stage of his career. Crumbs I remember when we had Hayles, Ipoua, Roberts, Cureton, Zamora and Ellington on the books at very nearly the same time and now if we get one striker in that must mean the departure of the other one! Martin is a lethal weapon at this level but we need to manage his workload especially given the amount of first line of defence tasks he undertakes, getting someone in to share that load is what we need. |
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Post by percy on Jul 8, 2024 15:27:58 GMT
I wonder if Martin wasn't fit enough to start on Friday or just not being risked in case he's sold, as it seems unlikely Omochere and Martin would both be in a Rovers starting 11, and I can't see Martin being caught to just be a back up striker at this stage of his career. No, MT said he is managing him and Ward as older or injury prone, they need to get up to fitness first. Expect CM to be an impact sub option mainly, but with some speed, direct running and crosses flying in all around him he may be in dreamland! |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jul 8, 2024 15:32:55 GMT
MT was hardly going to say CM wasn't playing as he might be off this week! Given he's already missing the first two games of the season then unless he's returned to pre-season hopelessly unfit, it just seemed odd he didn't figure at all.
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Post by Topper Gas on Jul 8, 2024 15:34:17 GMT
I wonder if Martin wasn't fit enough to start on Friday or just not being risked in case he's sold, as it seems unlikely Omochere and Martin would both be in a Rovers starting 11, and I can't see Martin being caught to just be a back up striker at this stage of his career. Crumbs I remember when we had Hayles, Ipoua, Roberts, Cureton, Zamora and Ellington on the books at very nearly the same time and now if we get one striker in that must mean the departure of the other one! Martin is a lethal weapon at this level but we need to manage his workload especially given the amount of first line of defence tasks he undertakes, getting someone in to share that load is what we need. I can't recall in recent years when we've ever had two expensive No 9's, assuming the Fleetwood striker is seen as a No 9 rather than AC replacement. |
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pirate
Forum Legend
Posts: 19,461 
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Post by pirate on Jul 8, 2024 15:47:56 GMT
Crumbs I remember when we had Hayles, Ipoua, Roberts, Cureton, Zamora and Ellington on the books at very nearly the same time and now if we get one striker in that must mean the departure of the other one! Martin is a lethal weapon at this level but we need to manage his workload especially given the amount of first line of defence tasks he undertakes, getting someone in to share that load is what we need. I can't recall in recent years when we've ever had two expensive No 9's, assuming the Fleetwood striker is seen as a No 9 rather than AC replacement. Omochere plays quite often from a wider role. Attachment Deleted |
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