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Post by xplosivgas on Sept 1, 2016 21:55:15 GMT
An interesting read. Really like Wael and seems to be doing a good job in supporting DC on the pitch. Only criticism so far is the fans being kept so in the dark on stadium progress. Fingers crossed we'll be fed some crumbs of information soon.
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Post by BrightonGas on Sept 1, 2016 22:10:42 GMT
Wael must have been annoyed the new kit didnt arrive in time for the photo!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2016 22:27:34 GMT
an interesting read well done to the op for putting it on. steve lansdown always preaches making city a sustainable football club but so far has failed miserably on that. i wonder what our losses will be this season?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2016 5:25:41 GMT
Thought this was an interesting sentence. I read that as the price of the club being to pay off debts which I guess included directors loans. If correct I think Higgs and co did the right thing as it implies they got nothing for their share holding other than repayment of loans ..... Of course they may of had little choice by the point they sold, but no doubt they could have walked with more money by realising the asset value of the Mem. That was also the sentence I found interesting! Absorbing the the considerable debts by setting up an offshore company and,presumably,offsetting said debts against the Memorial Stadium. Hence not raiding his own personal piggy bank to do so. I have always found it strange how people can purchase something like a football club by securing the debt of purchase against the assets. There is a term for it but it escapes me.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2016 5:28:45 GMT
an interesting read well done to the op for putting it on. steve lansdown always preaches making city a sustainable football club but so far has failed miserably on that. i wonder what our losses will be this season? That will never happen,especially if they get to the premier League. As for our losses, I would have thought we would be near break even figures. Attendances are good,wages low etc.
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Post by chippenhamgas on Sept 2, 2016 6:15:47 GMT
Thought this was an interesting sentence. I read that as the price of the club being to pay off debts which I guess included directors loans. If correct I think Higgs and co did the right thing as it implies they got nothing for their share holding other than repayment of loans ..... Of course they may of had little choice by the point they sold, but no doubt they could have walked with more money by realising the asset value of the Mem. That was also the sentence I found interesting! Absorbing the the considerable debts by setting up an offshore company and,presumably,offsetting said debts against the Memorial Stadium. Hence not raiding his own personal piggy bank to do so. I have always found it strange how people can purchase something like a football club by securing the debt of purchase against the assets. There is a term for it but it escapes me. In other words they are doing exactly the same as higgs, although they supposedly have a lot more personal wealth. The equity in the mem will be gradually eroding away with debt interest and non football related wages. If uwe is built a sizeable chunk of the revenues generated will be used to pay off the debts incurred to third parties because it's clear wael doesn't want to spend his own cash. You can see why the stock market savages the shares of companies who go on acquisition sprees financed by debt, future revenues are variable but debt is always there like a noose.
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Post by BrightonGas on Sept 2, 2016 6:32:26 GMT
That was also the sentence I found interesting! Absorbing the the considerable debts by setting up an offshore company and,presumably,offsetting said debts against the Memorial Stadium. Hence not raiding his own personal piggy bank to do so. I have always found it strange how people can purchase something like a football club by securing the debt of purchase against the assets. There is a term for it but it escapes me. In other words they are doing exactly the same as higgs, although they supposedly have a lot more personal wealth. The equity in the mem will be gradually eroding away with debt interest and non football related wages. If uwe is built a sizeable chunk of the revenues generated will be used to pay off the debts incurred to third parties because it's clear wael doesn't want to spend his own cash. You can see why the stock market savages the shares of companies who go on acquisition sprees financed by debt, future revenues are variable but debt is always there like a noose. Have you got anything sensible to contribute? That is complete nonsense. How on earth can you read the article and arrive at that conclusion? Did you bother reading it? Or was it too positive for you?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2016 7:18:50 GMT
That was also the sentence I found interesting! Absorbing the the considerable debts by setting up an offshore company and,presumably,offsetting said debts against the Memorial Stadium. Hence not raiding his own personal piggy bank to do so. I have always found it strange how people can purchase something like a football club by securing the debt of purchase against the assets. There is a term for it but it escapes me. In other words they are doing exactly the same as higgs, although they supposedly have a lot more personal wealth. The equity in the mem will be gradually eroding away with debt interest and non football related wages. If uwe is built a sizeable chunk of the revenues generated will be used to pay off the debts incurred to third parties because it's clear wael doesn't want to spend his own cash. You can see why the stock market savages the shares of companies who go on acquisition sprees financed by debt, future revenues are variable but debt is always there like a noose. In a nutshell and to a point yes but without being totally blind and going into it Gung Ho. Wael is a clever man who is running the club in the right way so the debt the formed company has will soon be wiped clean,make no mistake about that. The stock market is just corrupt,full stop. Total bollocks where some clown can lose millions per week and earn millions per year in salary. And cost the hard working man his hard earned cash in the process.
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 2, 2016 7:22:04 GMT
In other words they are doing exactly the same as higgs, although they supposedly have a lot more personal wealth. The equity in the mem will be gradually eroding away with debt interest and non football related wages. If uwe is built a sizeable chunk of the revenues generated will be used to pay off the debts incurred to third parties because it's clear wael doesn't want to spend his own cash. You can see why the stock market savages the shares of companies who go on acquisition sprees financed by debt, future revenues are variable but debt is always there like a noose. Have you got anything sensible to contribute? That is complete nonsense. How on earth can you read the article and arrive at that conclusion? Did you bother reading it? Or was it too positive for you? I guess if Wael announced today we were building the UWE and he was gifted us the £50m build cost certain posters would still find a negative out of it, as far as the equity in the Mem, NH managed to lose most of that if the loans he built up weren't paid off by Wael.
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Post by beaver132 on Sept 2, 2016 7:55:06 GMT
Stock market valuations, added value, realisation of assets, absorption of debt. Forget it. There is only one clear message from the article that we need, as supporters, to understand. We were in a hole financially, one that could have seen the end of the club. Now we're not, and our immediate future is secure.
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Post by gasincider on Sept 2, 2016 7:59:32 GMT
A good find Lulworth and a very interesting read. Re-enforces my already pretty high opinion of Wael. I can't take credit. Someone posted it on Bristol rovers fb appreciation. It was actually posted on the supporters club website a short while before. With regard to 10 previous offers, I only know of two, namely Agombar and the 'other' consortium. The others I am unaware of. Anyway, here's to the future under Wael.
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Post by gasincider on Sept 2, 2016 8:06:41 GMT
In other words they are doing exactly the same as higgs, although they supposedly have a lot more personal wealth. The equity in the mem will be gradually eroding away with debt interest and non football related wages. If uwe is built a sizeable chunk of the revenues generated will be used to pay off the debts incurred to third parties because it's clear wael doesn't want to spend his own cash. You can see why the stock market savages the shares of companies who go on acquisition sprees financed by debt, future revenues are variable but debt is always there like a noose. Have you got anything sensible to contribute? That is complete nonsense. How on earth can you read the article and arrive at that conclusion? Did you bother reading it? Or was it too positive for you? Actually Brightongas there is a lot of truth in what Chippenhamgas posted. Wael is an investment banker, and they utilise other people's money not their own. Wael has made no secret of that, so perhaps you didn't catch his meaning when he said he was looking for investors to pay for the new stadium.
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Post by peterparker on Sept 2, 2016 8:25:42 GMT
Have you got anything sensible to contribute? That is complete nonsense. How on earth can you read the article and arrive at that conclusion? Did you bother reading it? Or was it too positive for you? Actually Brightongas there is a lot of truth in what Chippenhamgas posted. Wael is an investment banker, and they utilise other people's money not their own. Wael has made no secret of that, so perhaps you didn't catch his meaning when he said he was looking for investors to pay for the new stadium. No worse than the lot before than who wanted someone else to pay for the stadium but who did put us in the sh** in trying to do it
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Post by slam on Sept 2, 2016 8:46:37 GMT
Under the previous Board of Directors, the club had been financed in two different ways: As Equity (or shares in the Company). The main blocks of shares in the company were owned by a few individuals (NH and some of the other Board Members) and a small percentage of the shares were owned by the Supporters Trust. The control of the Club is vested in the owners of the shares. When NH etc purchased their shares at whatever price they bought them for, the only way that they can get their money back is to sell their shares to another interested party at a price that the purchaser and seller mutually agree. That price might be higher or lower than the seller originally paid. As Debt (or loans made to the Company). In our case, the previous Directors had made various loans to the club and the size of these loans were included in the year end Company Accounts. Interest is usually payable by the Club to the Lendor BUT, as I understand it, the Club did not have enough money to pay the interest in recent years and the interest receivable from these loans was waived by the Directors. In addition, the club had also taken a loan from the Wonga Company (I forget its name). The Wonga Loan was for approximately £2 Million BUT had such a high rate of interest that the amount outstanding had risen to closer to £3 Million by the end. The Wonga Loan was also short term, and had to be repaid at some time during 2016. Before, Wael took over the club we were making an annual operating loss and it is my reading that the previous directors were finding it more and more difficult to raise the additional funds to cover these losses (hence the Wonga Loan). When Wael purchased the Club, it was announced that the club was now "debt free". From this I understood that Wael had repaid, in full, all of the Loans to all of the Directors (with or without interest? ?) AND had repaid Wonga with interest. Wael also had to purchase the shares in the Company from the existing owners. I suspect that nobody will ever know the price agreed for this but it would have taken account of the assets of the club (principally the value of the Memorial Stadium). Wael's up front costs therefore consisted of the repayment of all loans and the purchase of the shares. However, he also made a commitment to develop a new stadium which will represent an ongoing cost and we are waiting to see if he will fund that himself or bring in external funding. If he does bring in external funding it will be interesting to see the form this takes (whether it is Debt or New Shares or even some different form of financial arrangement). Where we have been really lucky with wael, is that he is genuinely interested in the development of this club. He wants what we want and is putting in place all of the things that he thinks are required to push us forward. He has done this for all the same reasons that we support the club - although I guess, that he feels that there is the possibility of a profit at the end of it if he gets it right. In the meantime Sustainability means that WE are no longer in the position to fear that the club might go bankrupt in the short term and we have a rosy future to look forward to.
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Post by BrightonGas on Sept 2, 2016 9:12:00 GMT
Have you got anything sensible to contribute? That is complete nonsense. How on earth can you read the article and arrive at that conclusion? Did you bother reading it? Or was it too positive for you? Actually Brightongas there is a lot of truth in what Chippenhamgas posted. Wael is an investment banker, and they utilise other people's money not their own. Wael has made no secret of that, so perhaps you didn't catch his meaning when he said he was looking for investors to pay for the new stadium. I think its a stretch to say "lot of"...i'm struggling with "any". Wael is an investment banker, NH was not, we've moved on. I don't want to be negative about NH in this, he did his best and we wouldn't have DC without him, history will remember him for that! Wael isn't doing exactly the same as NH, its insulting to Wael to suggest he is.
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Post by 2nd May 1990 on Sept 2, 2016 9:14:17 GMT
True, but I don't think we're anywhere near sustainability yet. We're very likely to make a loss to this year, I would have thought, and getting the new ground is still vital to our progress. If we are challenging for promotion this year - I don't think we will be but it's not beyond the realms of possibility - then Wael will be under a lot of pressure to get things right off the pitch. He must be confident, otherwise I don't think we would have brought in the players we did on Tuesday.
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Post by Severncider on Sept 2, 2016 9:23:18 GMT
The "Wonga" loan has not disappeared, it is just off BRFC's accounts.
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Post by BrightonGas on Sept 2, 2016 9:24:28 GMT
The players show ambition from Wael, he isn't content to tread water while the stadium is sorted out. With the Wonga loan, are you saying the club are still paying crazy interest on it?
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Post by casey12a on Sept 2, 2016 9:28:53 GMT
The "Wonga" loan has not disappeared, it is just off BRFC's accounts. If this is true then at least the club won't be paying the crippling Wonga style interest rates.
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Post by slam on Sept 2, 2016 9:30:25 GMT
The "Wonga" loan has not disappeared, it is just off BRFC's accounts. where did it go? I thought that it had to be repaid by just about now (even if it wasn't repaid early)
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