|
Post by Topper Gas on Feb 5, 2017 9:40:41 GMT
Agree with this. I can't imagine we'll be paying much in rent as it's the owners way of trying to beat the system. In terms of if they were selling up. Even if it was owned by the football club, they still own the football club so why does it matter? If Bristol Rovers are worth £20m without the training ground and £25m with it, it doesn't matter who actually owns the training ground. Dwane Sports would sell the club for £25m with the training ground or £20m without it then sell the training ground for another £5m. It would all work out the same in the end. P.S these figures are just hypothetical btw. I'm sure my valuation of the club is way out. UTG! This crossed my mind, but .... If this were to be the case how would we benefit from income streams on the new stadium under FFP rules ? I've already asked a similar question, if we want to increase income streams for the FFP rules re turnover, then how are we going to gain from Dwane Sports spending the money/receiving the income? Perhaps that's a question for the AGM.
|
|
|
Post by Mr Pond on Feb 5, 2017 9:42:29 GMT
Agree with this. I can't imagine we'll be paying much in rent as it's the owners way of trying to beat the system. In terms of if they were selling up. Even if it was owned by the football club, they still own the football club so why does it matter? If Bristol Rovers are worth £20m without the training ground and £25m with it, it doesn't matter who actually owns the training ground. Dwane Sports would sell the club for £25m with the training ground or £20m without it then sell the training ground for another £5m. It would all work out the same in the end. P.S these figures are just hypothetical btw. I'm sure my valuation of the club is way out. UTG! This crossed my mind, but .... If this were to be the case how would we benefit from income streams on the new stadium under FFP rules ? I would also imagine it protects our infrastructure if BRFC ran into financial trouble??
|
|
|
Post by Antonio Fargas on Feb 5, 2017 9:48:36 GMT
This crossed my mind, but .... If this were to be the case how would we benefit from income streams on the new stadium under FFP rules ? I've already asked a similar question, if we want to increase income streams for the FFP rules re turnover, then how are we going to gain from Dwane Sports spending the money/receiving the income? Perhaps that's a question for the AGM. Because any income (or any money for that matter) can be invested in a club. FFP has a misleading name. It is not there to give financial fair play in the sense of a level playing field. It is there to stop clubs accruing debts they can't handle. That's why a few years ago SL had to write off a load of his City debt. Under FFP City were not able to owe the thirty million or so that they owed to SL coz they didn't have a high enough turnover. But there was nothing to stop SL just giving the money to City.
|
|
|
Post by gasincider on Feb 5, 2017 9:51:07 GMT
29 acres seems very big for a training facility alone... Yet it needs to be twice as big to gain category 1 status'
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2017 9:56:37 GMT
Agree with this. I can't imagine we'll be paying much in rent as it's the owners way of trying to beat the system. In terms of if they were selling up. Even if it was owned by the football club, they still own the football club so why does it matter? If Bristol Rovers are worth £20m without the training ground and £25m with it, it doesn't matter who actually owns the training ground. Dwane Sports would sell the club for £25m with the training ground or £20m without it then sell the training ground for another £5m. It would all work out the same in the end. P.S these figures are just hypothetical btw. I'm sure my valuation of the club is way out. UTG! This crossed my mind, but .... If this were to be the case how would we benefit from income streams on the new stadium under FFP rules ? I was going to say Dwayne sports might only charge a small rent and service charge...but this doesn't allow for where the investors in the stadium will get their money.A stadium life is probably only 30 years max before it needs refitting out to keep up with current expectations and technology so further investment is always required. Still not my problem ,I will just have to trust the Al Qadi family have it covered.
|
|
|
Post by Gas_Quarters on Feb 5, 2017 9:59:34 GMT
29 acres seems very big for a training facility alone... Yet it needs to be twice as big to gain category 1 status' Have you seen man city's academy? It cost £200m and has got a 7000 seater stadium in it. Don't think we're quite ready to compete with that yet. For anyone that hasn't seen it i'd suggest googling it. God it's impressive.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2017 9:59:58 GMT
So the tweet saying the "club" have purchased the training ground is technically incorrect as it should say the club's owners? Although unless the Al-Qadi's gave the club an interest free loan how would they ever afford themselves anyway? Any idea how this works for the FFP rules, can the club now include the income within their turnover as I assume Fleetwood do? I assume the club will occupy the ground under a lease or licence, the club will pay a rent possibly but the income streams that might be developed would flow to the club as they would undertake the activities from the ground they lease or licence. So there would be the opportunity to develop income streams that would count towards club income under FFP rules.
|
|
|
Post by Antonio Fargas on Feb 5, 2017 10:06:17 GMT
Yet it needs to be twice as big to gain category 1 status' Have you seen man city's academy? It cost £200m and has got a 7000 seater stadium in it. Don't think we're quite ready to compete with that yet. For anyone that hasn't seen it i'd suggest googling it. God it's impressive. Also, done on reclaimed industrial brown field, so fair play to them for that. Bristol definitely has a lack of decent-size brownfield sites compared to the industrial northern wastelands, which is one of the reasons we've had trouble finding somewhere to put a stadium.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2017 11:47:41 GMT
Have you seen man city's academy? It cost £200m and has got a 7000 seater stadium in it. Don't think we're quite ready to compete with that yet. For anyone that hasn't seen it i'd suggest googling it. God it's impressive. Also, done on reclaimed industrial brown field, so fair play to them for that. Bristol definitely has a lack of decent-size brownfield sites compared to the industrial northern wastelands, which is one of the reasons we've had trouble finding somewhere to put a stadium. In fairness there has been a derelict brownfield site opposite morrisons in fishponds for a long time. The problem would be the road infrastructure and the fact it will no doubt end up as more lucrative housing.
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Feb 5, 2017 11:58:36 GMT
Have you seen man city's academy? It cost £200m and has got a 7000 seater stadium in it. Don't think we're quite ready to compete with that yet. For anyone that hasn't seen it i'd suggest googling it. God it's impressive. Also, done on reclaimed industrial brown field, so fair play to them for that. Bristol definitely has a lack of decent-size brownfield sites compared to the industrial northern wastelands, which is one of the reasons we've had trouble finding somewhere to put a stadium. True, it's just a pity we don't have something like a disused airport nearby!!
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Feb 5, 2017 12:06:41 GMT
This crossed my mind, but .... If this were to be the case how would we benefit from income streams on the new stadium under FFP rules ? I was going to say Dwayne sports might only charge a small rent and service charge...but this doesn't allow for where the investors in the stadium will get their money.A stadium life is probably only 30 years max before it needs refitting out to keep up with current expectations and technology so further investment is always required. Still not my problem ,I will just have to trust the Al Qadi family have it covered.
I assume investors in the UWE will just be happy with, say, a 5/6% return which I recall is what the Wasps RFC bond owners received, plus there's always a chance the Dwane Sport will be sold for £m's if Rovers ever reach the Premiership/become a top Championship side.
|
|
|
Post by Severncider on Feb 5, 2017 16:15:03 GMT
I was going to say Dwayne sports might only charge a small rent and service charge...but this doesn't allow for where the investors in the stadium will get their money.A stadium life is probably only 30 years max before it needs refitting out to keep up with current expectations and technology so further investment is always required. Still not my problem ,I will just have to trust the Al Qadi family have it covered.
I assume investors in the UWE will just be happy with, say, a 5/6% return which I recall is what the Wasps RFC bond owners received, plus there's always a chance the Dwane Sport will be sold for £m's if Rovers ever reach the Premiership/become a top Championship side. I'll ask them when I visit the USA in five weeks time.
|
|
|
Post by faggotygas on Feb 5, 2017 16:36:44 GMT
It's something done by many clubs , if rovers ever go into financial trouble the training ground won't be listed as a club asset and will be protected. Likewise the uwe stadium will never be owned by Bristol rovers it will belong to Dwane sports to protect it incase we ever go into administration etc . Serious question, what happens though if Dwayne Sports gets in to financial trouble? Then Rovers will be in trouble, because the clubs owners are in trouble. This structure of operating companies being owned by a holding company is normal, look at Alphabet and Google. It exists for tax management purposes.
|
|
|
Post by paulpirate on Feb 5, 2017 18:32:16 GMT
Have you seen man city's academy? It cost £200m and has got a 7000 seater stadium in it. Don't think we're quite ready to compete with that yet. For anyone that hasn't seen it i'd suggest googling it. God it's impressive. Also, done on reclaimed industrial brown field, so fair play to them for that. Bristol definitely has a lack of decent-size brownfield sites compared to the industrial northern wastelands, which is one of the reasons we've had trouble finding somewhere to put a stadium. theres a gert brownfield of sh**e 💩In Ashton
|
|
|
Post by Strange Gas on Feb 5, 2017 18:39:26 GMT
Also, done on reclaimed industrial brown field, so fair play to them for that. Bristol definitely has a lack of decent-size brownfield sites compared to the industrial northern wastelands, which is one of the reasons we've had trouble finding somewhere to put a stadium. True, it's just a pity we don't have something like a disused airport nearby!! Silly idea, you'd never find such a thing anywhere. And even if you did, it would need excellent road / motorway links and a train line. And if it had that it would be perfect for a fantastic regional airport so would never become disused. Unless a tiny council owned airstrip on top of a foggy hill 15 miles from Bristol and miles from a motorway or train line was given some bizarre preference . . .
|
|
|
Post by pirateman on Feb 5, 2017 18:48:28 GMT
True, it's just a pity we don't have something like a disused airport nearby!! Silly idea, you'd never find such a thing anywhere. And even if you did, it would need excellent road / motorway links and a train line. And if it had that it would be perfect for a fantastic regional airport so would never become disused. Unless a tiny council owned airstrip on top of a foggy hill 15 miles from Bristol and miles from a motorway or train line was given some bizarre preference . . . Made I laff.
|
|
|
Post by pirateman on Feb 5, 2017 18:50:45 GMT
True, it's just a pity we don't have something like a disused airport nearby!! Silly idea, you'd never find such a thing anywhere. And even if you did, it would need excellent road / motorway links and a train line. And if it had that it would be perfect for a fantastic regional airport so would never become disused. Unless a tiny council owned airstrip on top of a foggy hill 15 miles from Bristol and miles from a motorway or train line was given some bizarre preference . . . Although I have to admit, the fogbound/rain/win closed airport is only a few miles from me so it is useful. Cr@p location though really.
|
|
|
Post by long john silver on Feb 6, 2017 0:25:18 GMT
This crossed my mind, but .... If this were to be the case how would we benefit from income streams on the new stadium under FFP rules ? I've already asked a similar question, if we want to increase income streams for the FFP rules re turnover, then how are we going to gain from Dwane Sports spending the money/receiving the income? Perhaps that's a question for the AGM. Dwane sports can give the money to rovers and it will still count as revenue under ffp . In fact any chairman, owner or president of a football club can give their club money and it goes down as revenue. Just look at city. Steve lansdown does it all the time, it's just not a very sustainable business model especially for a club with as poor infrastructure as rovers.
|
|
|
Post by baggins on Feb 6, 2017 11:16:05 GMT
Serious question, what happens though if Dwayne Sports gets in to financial trouble? Then Rovers will be in trouble, because the clubs owners are in trouble. This structure of operating companies being owned by a holding company is normal, look at Alphabet and Google. It exists for tax management purposes. To protect against liability as well?
|
|
|
Post by Topper Gas on Feb 6, 2017 11:39:07 GMT
I've already asked a similar question, if we want to increase income streams for the FFP rules re turnover, then how are we going to gain from Dwane Sports spending the money/receiving the income? Perhaps that's a question for the AGM. Dwane sports can give the money to rovers and it will still count as revenue under ffp . In fact any chairman, owner or president of a football club can give their club money and it goes down as revenue. Just look at city. Steve lansdown does it all the time, it's just not a very sustainable business model especially for a club with as poor infrastructure as rovers. The only way an owner can give money is as a gift not a loan etc, so far I don't think we've seen any evidence of DS gifting Rovers any money?
|
|