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Post by mariobalotelli on Sept 14, 2017 9:45:59 GMT
Just watch in the build up to the cross to see gaffney participation The footage starts with the throw-in, 14 seconds before the cross. He's not on screen, and doesn't appear at any time.
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Its any reason so that he can defend Ellis and slag down any one who may take his place. Whether Gaffers was involved or not, it's worth noting they're both strikers and so it's what they do at the other end of the pitch that's important.
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Post by faggotygas on Sept 14, 2017 12:54:33 GMT
Its all opinions but ive looked at the video and i was at the game and i dont think he had a chance with the 1st goal. But the manager blamed him for both goals and ripped him to pieces in the post match interview so maybe my opinion is a minority one? I agree ,if we're looking for blame first goal is starts with the midfield two closest to the ball not concentrating and seeing that it was held up in the wind and not making any effort to get under it, then you've got Lockyer and Seeeny running away from the on running scorer whilst both marking the same player. One of them should have gone with the runner and the other should have held his ground and tried to tackle him or block the shot. The shot was very good and it's no wonder he hit it so well he had an eternity to look up get it on his best foot and strike it. If any blame goes to the keeper for it then perhaps he should have kicked it wide not down the middle as he was clearly kicking in to a strong wind. The second goal was an injured keeper diving badly towards his injured side and he should have been off and Andre on by that point. Not sure you can blame Lockyer and Sweeney too much here, its a nightmare situation for a defender. If either have them had gone to the runner, it would have been an easy pass into the space they had just vacated.
I was asked about this very scenario more than once when I used to dabble in coaching, and the only answer I could give would be back off to the edge of the area to get rid of the space, watch the man with the ball to try to take advantage of a heavy touch if he takes one, and when its all over scream like hell at your midfield for allowing it to happen
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Post by socrates on Sept 14, 2017 13:22:48 GMT
I agree ,if we're looking for blame first goal is starts with the midfield two closest to the ball not concentrating and seeing that it was held up in the wind and not making any effort to get under it, then you've got Lockyer and Seeeny running away from the on running scorer whilst both marking the same player. One of them should have gone with the runner and the other should have held his ground and tried to tackle him or block the shot. The shot was very good and it's no wonder he hit it so well he had an eternity to look up get it on his best foot and strike it. If any blame goes to the keeper for it then perhaps he should have kicked it wide not down the middle as he was clearly kicking in to a strong wind. The second goal was an injured keeper diving badly towards his injured side and he should have been off and Andre on by that point. Not sure you can blame Lockyer and Sweeney too much here, its a nightmare situation for a defender. If either have them had gone to the runner, it would have been an easy pass into the space they had just vacated.
I was asked about this very scenario more than once when I used to dabble in coaching, and the only answer I could give would be back off to the edge of the area to get rid of the space, watch the man with the ball to try to take advantage of a heavy touch if he takes one, and when its all over scream like hell at your midfield for allowing it to happen
They were 15 yards away from him and both backed off to mark one man I'm sorry but that's crap defending. In a situation like that one player has to speak up and say you stay I'll go and meet the forward to block the shot or tackle not both just run away . Watch it again, Sweeney stays with his man Lockyer just backs off he's not marking anyone or cutting out any angles. I'm surprised DC is putting all the blame on the keeper for that goal maybe he needs to see it again because if he isn't picking up on defensive mistakes like that then we seriously aren't going to stop conceding goals.
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Post by faggotygas on Sept 14, 2017 13:26:17 GMT
Not sure you can blame Lockyer and Sweeney too much here, its a nightmare situation for a defender. If either have them had gone to the runner, it would have been an easy pass into the space they had just vacated.
I was asked about this very scenario more than once when I used to dabble in coaching, and the only answer I could give would be back off to the edge of the area to get rid of the space, watch the man with the ball to try to take advantage of a heavy touch if he takes one, and when its all over scream like hell at your midfield for allowing it to happen
They were 15 yards away from him and both backed off to mark one man I'm sorry but that's crap defending. In a situation like that one player has to speak up and say you stay I'll go and meet the forward to block the shot or tackle not both just run away . Watch it again. Ok, what if one had gone to meet the man? Before he would have got close to him, the forward would have run into the vacated space and easy pass and shot. Nothing the other defender could do about it, as he's already across the front of him. Chasing shadows.
I'd rather have a shot from distance than a shot from inside the area.
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Post by socrates on Sept 14, 2017 13:28:54 GMT
They were 15 yards away from him and both backed off to mark one man I'm sorry but that's crap defending. In a situation like that one player has to speak up and say you stay I'll go and meet the forward to block the shot or tackle not both just run away . Watch it again. Ok, what if one had gone to meet the man? Before he would have got close to him, the forward would have run into the vacated space and easy pass and shot. Nothing the other defender could do about it, as he's already across the front of him. Chasing shadows.
I'd rather have a shot from distance than a shot from inside the area.
Yeah but the whole point is if Lockyer had closed the scorer down the shot would have been under pressure and may well have been blocked it's not like Locks would have left a forwRd unmarked because he wasn't near a defender leads had a man so did Sweeney but Locks is in no mans land running away from a player who was clearly looking up to tee up a shot
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Post by faggotygas on Sept 14, 2017 13:39:52 GMT
Ok, what if one had gone to meet the man? Before he would have got close to him, the forward would have run into the vacated space and easy pass and shot. Nothing the other defender could do about it, as he's already across the front of him. Chasing shadows.
I'd rather have a shot from distance than a shot from inside the area.
Yeah but the whole point is if Lockyer had closed the scorer down the shot would have been under pressure and may well have been blocked it's not like Locks would have left a forwRd unmarked because he wasn't near a defender leads had a man so did Sweeney but Locks is in no mans land running away from a player who was clearly looking up to tee up a shot He'd have left a great big space for Sweeny's man to run into, and he was already across the front of Sweeney. Centre halves are taught to keep shape, stay close to your partner, and not allow space behind you for forwards to run into, not to go charging off after every threat.
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Post by socrates on Sept 14, 2017 14:05:30 GMT
Yeah but the whole point is if Lockyer had closed the scorer down the shot would have been under pressure and may well have been blocked it's not like Locks would have left a forwRd unmarked because he wasn't near a defender leads had a man so did Sweeney but Locks is in no mans land running away from a player who was clearly looking up to tee up a shot He'd have left a great big space for Sweeny's man to run into, and he was already across the front of Sweeney. Centre halves are taught to keep shape, stay close to your partner, and not allow space behind you for forwards to run into, not to go charging off after every threat. Sweeneys man was peeling off the other shoulder of Sweeney away from Locks and leads had his man covered honestly watch it again and if you still feel the same then we'll have to agree to disagree. UTG
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Post by faggotygas on Sept 14, 2017 14:23:23 GMT
He'd have left a great big space for Sweeny's man to run into, and he was already across the front of Sweeney. Centre halves are taught to keep shape, stay close to your partner, and not allow space behind you for forwards to run into, not to go charging off after every threat. Sweeneys man was peeling off the other shoulder of Sweeney away from Locks and leads had his man covered honestly watch it again and if you still feel the same then we'll have to agree to disagree. UTG Ok mucker, I'll have another look when I get out of work.
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 14, 2017 15:22:16 GMT
He'd have left a great big space for Sweeny's man to run into, and he was already across the front of Sweeney. Centre halves are taught to keep shape, stay close to your partner, and not allow space behind you for forwards to run into, not to go charging off after every threat. Sweeneys man was peeling off the other shoulder of Sweeney away from Locks and leads had his man covered honestly watch it again and if you still feel the same then we'll have to agree to disagree. UTG Locks would have had to move from his right defensive role to cover Sweeney's left sided position, by the time he got there the goal scorer could have still shot at goal, think we were f####d as soon as OC mistimed his inception and the goal scorer had either a free run at goal or could have slipped the ball though to the striker Sweeney would have left unmarked if gone to close him down, still a Bodin type finish though which I doubt Lines would have scored from!
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Post by chilly1883 on Sept 14, 2017 15:29:27 GMT
Lots of experts on here!! Really Know there stuff😂
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Post by socrates on Sept 14, 2017 15:50:11 GMT
Lots of experts on here!! Really Know there stuff😂 Their not there.
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Post by chilly1883 on Sept 14, 2017 19:47:49 GMT
Lots of experts on here!! Really Know there stuff😂 Their not there. sorry wordy
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pirate
Forum Legend
Posts: 18,744
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Post by pirate on Sept 14, 2017 19:50:41 GMT
Capital s.
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Post by socrates on Sept 14, 2017 20:01:47 GMT
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Post by 2nd May 1990 on Sept 14, 2017 20:32:19 GMT
Just seen the goals. Is it just me or does anyone else think it was incredibly harsh of DC to put the blame at Smith's door for the first two goals. The first was a wind assisted rocket and the second was an excellent wrong-footing first time finish. If we had scored both of those we would have been rightly applauding both finishes.
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Post by socrates on Sept 14, 2017 20:43:40 GMT
Just seen the goals. Is it just me or does anyone else think it was incredibly harsh of DC to put the blame at Smith's door for the first two goals. The first was a wind assisted rocket and the second was an excellent wrong-footing first time finish. If we had scored both of those we would have been rightly applauding both finishes. He was slow getting down to the second but I thought the first was a great finish with bad defending. Thing is he was injured and shouldn't have been on the pitch anyway , that knock he got first half really effected his kicking diving everything.
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daz
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Post by daz on Sept 14, 2017 21:27:02 GMT
No, don't normally post on here due to people replying trying to start an argument! Been watching the gas since the 70's and go to nearly all home games and some away games, enough of a cv to post on here if I choose to. Said it every time it happened during DC's reign to the people I go with. DC has done an amazing job and had success we could only have dreamed of, but that does not mean people have to agree with everything he does. From my angle in the West enclosure, I would expect any professional keeper to save that first goal. The midfield appeared to be taken by surprise the goal kick help up in the wind and as a result weren't in a position to get near the guy, so poor positioning by our midfield and bad keeping for me. Whatever style and funny ways a manager has its always fine if your winning but its the wrong way when your losing,so you get people saying why change the team? but they never mentioned it when we won and made changes. I agree with with what you're saying. However, when he makes 4 or 5 changes, which include dropping players in form, I am never in agreement with it, whether we win or not. But you're right if we win, people don't mention all the changes, because it would seem like moaning unnecessarily, and they would get plenty of grief on here! It's not a coincidence that Chelsea last season and Leicester the season before made the fewest changes in the premier league. It's about opinions, and I feel you should always pick players in form.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2017 23:19:57 GMT
I agree ,if we're looking for blame first goal is starts with the midfield two closest to the ball not concentrating and seeing that it was held up in the wind and not making any effort to get under it, then you've got Lockyer and Seeeny running away from the on running scorer whilst both marking the same player. One of them should have gone with the runner and the other should have held his ground and tried to tackle him or block the shot. The shot was very good and it's no wonder he hit it so well he had an eternity to look up get it on his best foot and strike it. If any blame goes to the keeper for it then perhaps he should have kicked it wide not down the middle as he was clearly kicking in to a strong wind. The second goal was an injured keeper diving badly towards his injured side and he should have been off and Andre on by that point. Not sure you can blame Lockyer and Sweeney too much here, its a nightmare situation for a defender. If either have them had gone to the runner, it would have been an easy pass into the space they had just vacated.
I was asked about this very scenario more than once when I used to dabble in coaching, and the only answer I could give would be back off to the edge of the area to get rid of the space, watch the man with the ball to try to take advantage of a heavy touch if he takes one, and when its all over scream like hell at your midfield for allowing it to happen
The defenders who are marking have to cover the situation they consider most dangerous,stay with your marker or close down the shooter as quick as possible and leave your marker. The shooter was 30 yards out so unlikely to score so for me the defenders still made the right decision despite the cracking shot which caught the wind and flew in. For me it was midfield players who were slow to close the shooter down. Just my take on it anyway.
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Post by faggotygas on Sept 15, 2017 9:14:23 GMT
Not sure you can blame Lockyer and Sweeney too much here, its a nightmare situation for a defender. If either have them had gone to the runner, it would have been an easy pass into the space they had just vacated.
I was asked about this very scenario more than once when I used to dabble in coaching, and the only answer I could give would be back off to the edge of the area to get rid of the space, watch the man with the ball to try to take advantage of a heavy touch if he takes one, and when its all over scream like hell at your midfield for allowing it to happen
The defenders who are marking have to cover the situation they consider most dangerous,stay with your marker or close down the shooter as quick as possible and leave your marker. The shooter was 30 yards out so unlikely to score so for me the defenders still made the right decision despite the cracking shot which caught the wind and flew in. For me it was midfield players who were slow to close the shooter down. Just my take on it anyway. Yeah, that's what I was trying to put across. Basically the centre half's job in that situation is to reduce the space between him and the goalkeeper, to prevent the pass behind. Long shots are the midfield's job.
If a centre half comes charging out and doesnt get there in time anyway, it leaves them in no mans land
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Post by chilly1883 on Sept 15, 2017 14:26:15 GMT
Just seen the goals. Is it just me or does anyone else think it was incredibly harsh of DC to put the blame at Smith's door for the first two goals. The first was a wind assisted rocket and the second was an excellent wrong-footing first time finish. If we had scored both of those we would have been rightly applauding both finishes. Sorry, but the second was an awful goal to give away. Keepers shouldn't get beaten at there near post, Smith was very slow to react.
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