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Post by stevek192 on Jul 22, 2019 9:10:19 GMT
Some teams can cover up their weaknesses but that is not something that GC can do because it is obvious straight away if a team lacks physical presence and further through our squad you go the worse it gets. Saturdays game was crying out for the things we all knew were missing last season- the creativity to really create chances and without Clarke-Harris it is even more evidend because other than Deon Moore and Rodman there is no physical presence whatsoever and we all know that we will again come up against numerous uncompromising defenders and lack the physique to match them or the ability to break them down with a midfield that in Upson,Ogogo and Ollie Clarke lacks the ability to change defence to attack.I would question the wisdom of running a Development squad because the only player who has really made any mark on the first team is Kelly and I have serious doubts as to whether he can make the grade. it seems that we are a team which is going to be made up of free transfers and loans rather than players coming through from a Development squad and when you see a loan like Tyler Smith come in who will obviously go in front of any Development players you really wonder about the worth of the Development team. Is ,for instance a player like Chris Hargreaves now going to make first team football at this level? maybe there is hope for Deon Moore and Alfie Kilgour but neither were really brought up by the Development squad.
Saturday clearly showed that we lack the same things we lacked last season and it doesn't matter if it was only a friendly or a training session or a proper match as it just showed what we all know and only three signings minimum in my view will give us any chance of being anything other than a mid- bottom four side. Some will say get rid of Bennett but in truth I really can't see GC getting anything better so what is the point? Pace is lacking too but that may be able to be covered over with two attacking wing backs.
It will be an interesting build up to the Blackpool game to see just what, if any, ambition there is by our owners as so far it seems that we lose flair players but do not have the resources to bring any in.
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Marshy
Proper Gas
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Post by Marshy on Jul 22, 2019 9:16:04 GMT
Oh dear, shall we just sign the Chippendales?
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Post by faggotygas on Jul 22, 2019 9:33:05 GMT
Is ,for instance a player like Chris Hargreaves now going to make first team football at this level? Agreed, if Chris Hargreaves was ever to make the step up to playing in the first team, at 47 years old he'd have done it by now. Get rid. |
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Post by yattongas on Jul 22, 2019 9:36:53 GMT
GC addressed this as a problem at end of last season saying we needed more of a physical presence. I expect him to sign players in the next week or two that will be in that mould.
Chill.
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Post by Topper Gas on Jul 22, 2019 9:42:37 GMT
How many threads do we need just to say we'll struggle if we don't bring in 2 or 3 new signings? As far as the Development Squad whether we have one or not is beyond our control but both DC & GC seem to support having one.
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Post by tommym9 on Jul 22, 2019 9:49:04 GMT
I might be in the minority here, but I think the attacking options we have are pretty decent. JCH and Moore as the target men, Reilly and Smith as the runners and Nichols doing whatever he does.
Smith really impressed me on Saturday. I think we could have a really good player on our hands there.
As for the rest we are crying out for a left winger, but I think the first half against Brum showed signs of what we can create against a decent side.
Swansea will be an interesting one as Nichols will be starting. Lets see if he can carry his form into a game against decent opposition
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Post by bluegas on Jul 22, 2019 10:36:09 GMT
I assume the last paragraph is the point you are really trying to make. As far as Saturday is concerned, I saw us competing reasonably with Championship players, although Brum aren't a big force there at the moment, until some first choice players went off. If the owners won't spend money on the team, there is very little you, I or GC can do about it. Except maybe get behind the limited players we do have.
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Post by baggins on Jul 22, 2019 10:50:09 GMT
Thought our pre-season had gone quite well to be honest, lost 2-1 against a multi million pound squad, and will probably lose against another one.
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Marshy
Proper Gas
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Post by Marshy on Jul 22, 2019 10:55:05 GMT
Thought our pre-season had gone quite well to be honest, lost 2-1 against a multi million pound squad, and will probably lose against another one. I agree, remember Exeter last year? 😱 |
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Post by Slide away on Jul 22, 2019 11:07:12 GMT
I'm not one to use our first real competitive friendly as a benchmark for how the season is going to pan out but I completely agree regarding the development squad and the impact that is having on our finances. How much does it cost to operate? 500k per annum? Say we get 1 player every year which is actually good enough to make the grade (very unlikely based on the output so far), in essence we have invested 500k in to that player who is extremely likely to disappear in to non league oblivion with 18 / 24 months.
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pirate
Forum Legend
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Post by pirate on Jul 22, 2019 11:14:28 GMT
I'm not one to use our first real competitive friendly as a benchmark for how the season is going to pan out but I completely agree regarding the development squad and the impact that is having on our finances. How much does it cost to operate? 500k per annum? Say we get 1 player every year which is actually good enough to make the grade (very unlikely based on the output so far), in essence we have invested 500k in to that player who is extremely likely to disappear in to non league oblivion with 18 / 24 months. The players in the development squad are earning "peanuts". |
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Post by gashead1981 on Jul 22, 2019 11:28:46 GMT
I didnt realise we were in the relegation zone with no chance of survial already...?? Lets see how the first few games pan out and also what we really look like once the transfer window closes. No need to be so negative just yet. The players we have signed are equivilant to or an upgrade on what we had previously IMO.
As regards the development squad, I would say it probably cost somewhere more in the region of £1m to operate once you take into consideration all the coaches fees, wages, physio support, scouting etc. Micheal Kelly and Alfie Kilgour both stepped up last year. Deon Moore has short term contract after spending the last 6 months in the U23's and Luke Russe also has potential to improve and has been in a few matchday squads. So its not as dramatic as you are making out. Dont forget the dev squad games are also used for 1st team players to play to keep them match sharp or gain match fitness without exhausting your first team squad and arranging fixtures purely for that purpose. That will then enable the dev squad to play with and learn from them.
I think the main problem is we release players far too early previously without giving them time to develop properly. What if we had kept Tyrone Mings until he was 22, it could have been a different story.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2019 11:34:31 GMT
I find it strange that posters are so keen to scrap the development squad.
Scrapping it would simply mean we could bring an average league one player like ed upson but keeping it gives us the chance of finding a real gem.
Regarding signing better players we cannot just ignore the fact that were losing very significant sums of money.
I dont think the club can afford to sign even average strikers like ched evans or the ageing leon clarke.
The situation is what it is.
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Post by rememberhalifax on Jul 22, 2019 11:37:30 GMT
I think the amount of game time given to development squad players pre-season points to GC and the coaches trying to give them every chance of fighting for places in the squad, something we seemed reluctant to do in the past, I fully expect as many as 4 or 5 to feature and make an impact in the first team squad this season, lets not moan to much before a ball has been kicked in anger , we don't want any panic signings aka Stefan like last season do we? up the Rovers !!
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Post by Rovers 12th Man on Jul 22, 2019 11:53:23 GMT
Lockyer, Clarke, Lines and Harrison have been some of our best players in the last few seasons and 2 of them have now gone on to better their careers else where (and a further 1 of them did and then came back). The fact that a couple of years ago we had over a 3rd of starting XI having come up through our youth ranks to me shows we should most definitely continue to invest in it. I can't understand how some people want to get rid of it when it has shown its importance in very recent times.
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Post by worrelsterlingalbion on Jul 22, 2019 11:56:05 GMT
IMO it's still far too early to write off the development squad, if players recruited were good enough to go straight into the first team they wouldn't have been development players in the first place. Surely the reason it was put in place was for there to be a clear pathway from the academy sides into the first team squad, that's going to take time. Players such as Tomlinson & Hoole are really the first batch through so lets give it a chance before writing it off, it's another example of the all too familiar 'instant success' demands of modern football.
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Post by Topper Gas on Jul 22, 2019 12:07:38 GMT
I'm not one to use our first real competitive friendly as a benchmark for how the season is going to pan out but I completely agree regarding the development squad and the impact that is having on our finances. How much does it cost to operate? 500k per annum? Say we get 1 player every year which is actually good enough to make the grade (very unlikely based on the output so far), in essence we have invested 500k in to that player who is extremely likely to disappear in to non league oblivion with 18 / 24 months. The players in the development squad are earning "peanuts". How many as actual Development Squad players rather than Academy youngsters, 10? if they are on £10k p.a. (which I doubt?) that's £100,000 a season which with the coaches etc seems to fall in line with the £300K a season previously suggested. So probably the cost of recruiting one more 1st team player. |
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Post by baggins on Jul 22, 2019 12:22:19 GMT
Thought our pre-season had gone quite well to be honest, lost 2-1 against a multi million pound squad, and will probably lose against another one. I agree, remember Exeter last year? 😱 I can't remember yesterday. |
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Marshy
Proper Gas
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Post by Marshy on Jul 22, 2019 12:25:52 GMT
I agree, remember Exeter last year? 😱 I can't remember yesterday. Good, that was definitely one to forget! |
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Post by stroudgas93 on Jul 22, 2019 12:28:19 GMT
I think we are okay in terms of physicality tbh, Davies and Craig are known for putting their bodies on the line, Mark Little is a barnstorming right back and isn’t easily shrugged off the ball, then with Agogo and Ollie in the middle both willing to fly into tackles, the only place we lack it is on the wings, Bennett is my only worry as it does look like he’s staying, never seen him win a physical battle and I hope we can replace him with a better and more consistent willing player who will actually put himself into the mix
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