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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2021 21:35:26 GMT
Didn’t even need it. It’s was pretty obvious. You obviously know the full in and outs of the case to know that. Do you have an ITK mole at the CPS? Eric, your wasting your time. Eighteen months or so ago I was accused by a mod on here of making a libelous comment on a certain topic. Today I was pulled up by a poster and called a bully for making a sarcastic remark about a spelling mistake. However over the last couple of days we have had to read one particular mods comments about Joey Barton which are clearly libelous and yet other mods are doing nothing about it. This forum is clearly going downhill rapidly and some of the drivers(mods) are not hitting the brakes and some in fact are accelerating it into deeper trouble.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2021 21:38:44 GMT
You obviously know the full in and outs of the case to know that. Do you have an ITK mole at the CPS? Eric, your wasting your time. Eighteen months or so ago I was accused by a mod on here of making a libelous comment on a certain topic. Today I was pulled up by a poster and called a bully for making a sarcastic remark about a spelling mistake. However over the last couple of days we have had to read one particular mods comments about Joey Barton which are clearly libelous and yet other mods are doing nothing about it. This forum is clearly going downhill rapidly and some of the drivers(mods) are not hitting the brakes and some in fact are accelerating it into deeper trouble. Me and Purdown would drive the forum over the cliff - just like Thelma and Louise
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2021 21:52:26 GMT
You obviously know the full in and outs of the case to know that. Do you have an ITK mole at the CPS? Let’s look at the basics, shall we? CPS brings a case of assault by beating, having been grabbed by the neck and kicked in the head, as stated at the time by the victim. As you clearly said there was a “good chance” of it being thrown out, I’d suggest it was actually you with the (wrong) insider knowledge of the case. What made you say it was a good chance? Was that from a random guess, or your “superior knowledge”? Then what actually happened? Barton pleaded not guilty, which is the only thing he could have done and guess what, it didn’t get thrown out. So please Eric, walk us through your thought process step by step about how there was a “good chance” of this being thrown out. After that, it would be good to hear your analysis of the result as to why they’ve come to the wrong decision, seeming as ‘good’ is pretty strong. Are you referring to when I said “If I believed I was totally innocent and thought there was a good chance the case would be dropped (meaning nobody would ever know) then I would have kept quiet too” ? If so you have read in to that what wanted. I’m saying that if I was arrested and thought the case against me wouldn’t proceed then I wouldn’t have told my employer, if JB (and more importantly his lawyers) thought that about his case then it explains why he probably didn’t tell the club until late last week. I know very little about the ins and outs of this case which is the same as everyone else on here and strongly believe in innocent until proven guilty. Not everyone believes in that and have made up their own minds that he is guilty - I prefer to let the justice system get on with their jobs.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2021 21:56:12 GMT
Wael has provided an explanation and apology. For me, whether we break with Barton or not depends if he is innocent or guilty. You cannot just sack someone based on an allegation. Kev Of course it wouldn't be right to sack someone on a single allegation. I now believe though that the general climate that surrounds Barton with his history, the ongoing allegations, and his apparent inability to realise his responsibilities and avoid controversy means that BRFC, for the good of the club, needs to part company with him. Rod, I know it's a horrible situation and one I'm uncomfortable about but due process needs to be followed. I do accept though that ultimately we may need to part company for everyone's sake but patience and calm heads are needed.
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Post by RD on Jul 27, 2021 21:59:35 GMT
Kev Of course it wouldn't be right to sack someone on a single allegation. I now believe though that the general climate that surrounds Barton with his history, the ongoing allegations, and his apparent inability to realise his responsibilities and avoid controversy means that BRFC, for the good of the club, needs to part company with him. Rod, I know it's a horrible situation and one I'm uncomfortable about but due process needs to be followed. I do accept though that ultimately we may need to part company for everyone's sake but patience and calm heads are needed. It is slightly ironic though, that we're asking for patient and calm heads when talking about Joey Barton. It is an odd one. It's obviously possible the bloke is innocent (albeit the phone call, golf ball sized lump etc are hard to explain) but even if so, trouble really does follow the bloke around. If I was Wael, you'd surely be wondering why on earth you bothered. It's not even like results have been great. What a sh*te situation the club finds itself in.... once again.
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Post by Gassy on Jul 27, 2021 22:00:56 GMT
Let’s look at the basics, shall we? CPS brings a case of assault by beating, having been grabbed by the neck and kicked in the head, as stated at the time by the victim. As you clearly said there was a “good chance” of it being thrown out, I’d suggest it was actually you with the (wrong) insider knowledge of the case. What made you say it was a good chance? Was that from a random guess, or your “superior knowledge”? Then what actually happened? Barton pleaded not guilty, which is the only thing he could have done and guess what, it didn’t get thrown out. So please Eric, walk us through your thought process step by step about how there was a “good chance” of this being thrown out. After that, it would be good to hear your analysis of the result as to why they’ve come to the wrong decision, seeming as ‘good’ is pretty strong. Are you referring to when I said “If I believed I was totally innocent and thought there was a good chance the case would be dropped (meaning nobody would ever know) then I would have kept quiet too” ? If so you have read in to that what wanted. I’m saying that if I was arrested and thought the case against me wouldn’t proceed then I wouldn’t have told my employer, if JB (and more importantly his lawyers) thought that about his case then it explains why he probably didn’t tell the club until late last week. I know very little about the ins and outs of this case which is the same as everyone else on here and strongly believe in innocent until proven guilty. Not everyone believes in that and have made up their own minds that he is guilty - I prefer to let the justice system get on with their jobs. Fair enough, I stand corrected. However, your entire point is a bit naff though as there was never really a chance, on basic knowledge (that was backed up by the actual events), that it would get thrown out. If Joey was advised not to tell his employers because it would get thrown out then he needs a new legal team ASAP as he will get destroyed, based on that experience. I am actually with you on innocent until proven guilty, I would even go further to say that names/cases should not be made public until the case has finished, it’s not fair on either party. In addition to that, it looks like the police leaked information to the press in advance as well, shame on them if it was them - that’s surely a crime in itself that will disappear into nothing. I do think that realistically though he should he suspended whilst this all goes on, it’s the sensible thing to do. However, Wael has decided not to - which is his right, but he will live and die by that decision come December.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2021 22:17:38 GMT
Are you referring to when I said “If I believed I was totally innocent and thought there was a good chance the case would be dropped (meaning nobody would ever know) then I would have kept quiet too” ? If so you have read in to that what wanted. I’m saying that if I was arrested and thought the case against me wouldn’t proceed then I wouldn’t have told my employer, if JB (and more importantly his lawyers) thought that about his case then it explains why he probably didn’t tell the club until late last week. I know very little about the ins and outs of this case which is the same as everyone else on here and strongly believe in innocent until proven guilty. Not everyone believes in that and have made up their own minds that he is guilty - I prefer to let the justice system get on with their jobs. Fair enough, I stand corrected. However, your entire point is a bit naff though as there was never really a chance, on basic knowledge (that was backed up by the actual events), that it would get thrown out. If Joey was advised not to tell his employers because it would get thrown out then he needs a new legal team ASAP as he will get destroyed, based on that experience. I am actually with you on innocent until proven guilty, I would even go further to say that names/cases should not be made public until the case has finished, it’s not fair on either party. In addition to that, it looks like the police leaked information to the press in advance as well, shame on them if it was them - that’s surely a crime in itself that will disappear into nothing. I do think that realistically though he should he suspended whilst this all goes on, it’s the sensible thing to do. However, Wael has decided not to - which is his right, but he will live and die by that decision come December. Again, I’ve no idea whether there was any likelihood of the case being thrown out and don’t know how anyone without legal knowledge and access to the file would know either. Im not sure where you heard the police may have leaked something. Wasn’t it first reported by The Sun late on Friday and most likely found out by looking through the court listings for the following Monday? I totally agree about anonymity, especially when one of the parties is a publicly recognisable figure. In this case JB’s wife and family would have been spared the intrusion in to their lives, especially the kids who may have been facing comments from other kids. JB would be spared the trial by media and for us Gasheads business could have continued uninterrupted. If we think how this would have panned out with anonymity we could have first heard months down the road when JB was found guilty and the club sack him the same day. If he is found innocent the club will not have been compromised in their main business - trying to win football games.
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Post by alanrg on Jul 27, 2021 23:09:53 GMT
It was reported by the sh** stirring paper the Sun on Saturday night you can look at the court listings by you have to register
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Post by singupgas on Jul 28, 2021 5:57:36 GMT
Rod, I know it's a horrible situation and one I'm uncomfortable about but due process needs to be followed. I do accept though that ultimately we may need to part company for everyone's sake but patience and calm heads are needed. It is slightly ironic though, that we're asking for patient and calm heads when talking about Joey Barton. It is an odd one. It's obviously possible the bloke is innocent (albeit the phone call, golf ball sized lump etc are hard to explain) but even if so, trouble really does follow the bloke around. If I was Wael, you'd surely be wondering why on earth you bothered. It's not even like results have been great. What a sh*te situation the club finds itself in.... once again. You are so anti Barton it's there for everyone to see. Why don't you wait until the legal process has been carried out. All anyone doing on this forum is making assumptions and accusations, it's getting out of hand.
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Post by RD on Jul 28, 2021 6:01:58 GMT
It is slightly ironic though, that we're asking for patient and calm heads when talking about Joey Barton. It is an odd one. It's obviously possible the bloke is innocent (albeit the phone call, golf ball sized lump etc are hard to explain) but even if so, trouble really does follow the bloke around. If I was Wael, you'd surely be wondering why on earth you bothered. It's not even like results have been great. What a sh*te situation the club finds itself in.... once again. You are so anti Barton it's there for everyone to see. Why don't you wait until the legal process has been carried out. All anyone doing on this forum is making assumptions and accusations, it's getting out of hand. And you are so pro Barton it's there for everyone to see. Utterly delusional if you disagree with the post you've quoted. Blinded by your absolute love for your messiah. P.S., rather than shouting "wah wah anti Barton" maybe constructively pick out what you disagree with? Trouble follows Barton around - you disagree with that? You disagree with the police statement about the golfball size lump? Or you disagree that the club is in a sh*t situation? I look very forward to your thought out, reasoned response.
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Post by singupgas on Jul 28, 2021 6:12:02 GMT
You are so anti Barton it's there for everyone to see. Why don't you wait until the legal process has been carried out. All anyone doing on this forum is making assumptions and accusations, it's getting out of hand. And you are so pro Barton it's there for everyone to see. Utterly delusional if you disagree with the post you've quoted. Blinded by your absolute love for your messiah. P.s,rather than shouting "wah wah anti Barton" maybe constructively pick out what you disagree with? Trouble follows Barton around - you disagree with that? You disagree with the police statement about the golfball size lump? Or you disagree that the club is in a sh*t situation? I look very forward to your thought out, reasoned response. We are in difficult situation right now and it does not reflect well on the club. But equally you are saying Joey must be guilty when that is not the case. Has he been found guilty of either cases, please tell me? I get the impression you would like Joey sacked with immediate effect? I doubt Wael want to be sacking a third manager in 12 months, for one reason the cost, another reason the season starts in 2 weeks and all the players Brought in are Joeys. If Joey is found guilty then of course the club should act, but if the club sack him the he is found innocent for incidents, Wael the man who pays the bills is looking silly.
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Post by RD on Jul 28, 2021 6:15:50 GMT
And you are so pro Barton it's there for everyone to see. Utterly delusional if you disagree with the post you've quoted. Blinded by your absolute love for your messiah. P.s,rather than shouting "wah wah anti Barton" maybe constructively pick out what you disagree with? Trouble follows Barton around - you disagree with that? You disagree with the police statement about the golfball size lump? Or you disagree that the club is in a sh*t situation? I look very forward to your thought out, reasoned response. We are in difficult situation right now and it does not reflect well on the club. But equally you are saying Joey must be guilty when that is not the case. Has he been found guilty of either cases, please tell me? I get the impression you would like Joey sacked with immediate effect? I doubt Wael want to be sacking a third manager in 12 months, for one reason the cost, another reason the season starts in 2 weeks and all the players Brought in are Joeys. If Joey is found guilty then of course the club should act, but if the club sack him the he is found innocent for incidents, Wael the man who pays the bills is looking silly. I've made it very clear I think he should be suspended. That's the right thing to do on every level imo, not least as it seems he hasn't even told his own employer about the case (based on the common consensus surrounding Wael's open letter). So yes, I think for this alone, he should be suspended and quite obviously sacked if found guilty. Personally I think he's a completely inept manager, as evidenced (IMO) by the worst managerial record in our history. Some will disagree, but I don't think my opinion - given the results - is that "shocking". But that is not linked in any way to this charge. The other point is that trouble follows Barton around - that's not an accusation, it's a fact, as evidenced by his incredibly lengthy rap sheet and two current live criminal charges.
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Post by singupgas on Jul 28, 2021 6:26:03 GMT
We are in difficult situation right now and it does not reflect well on the club. But equally you are saying Joey must be guilty when that is not the case. Has he been found guilty of either cases, please tell me? I get the impression you would like Joey sacked with immediate effect? I doubt Wael want to be sacking a third manager in 12 months, for one reason the cost, another reason the season starts in 2 weeks and all the players Brought in are Joeys. If Joey is found guilty then of course the club should act, but if the club sack him the he is found innocent for incidents, Wael the man who pays the bills is looking silly. I've made it very clear I think he should be suspended. That's the right thing to do on every level imo, not least as it seems he hasn't even told his own employer about the case (based on the common consensus surrounding Wael's open letter). So yes, I think for this alone, he should be suspended and quite obviously sacked if found guilty. Personally I think he's a completely inept manager, as evidenced (IMO) by the worst managerial record in our history. Some will disagree, but I don't think my opinion - given the results - is that "shocking". But that is not linked in any way to this charge. The other point is that trouble follows Barton around - that's not an accusation, it's a fact, as evidenced by his incredibly lengthy rap sheet and two current live criminal charges. I don't know who benefits from suspending him, he has not been found guilty of anything and the club would be paying him to sit at home 2 weeks before the league season starts. Regarding his managerial ability, I think he came in and was too honest and told the players they weren't good enough too soon. I find it hard to disagree with that though having painfully sat through nearly every game last season. We were pathetic. I ain't saying no more on this matter. Utg.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2021 6:41:14 GMT
I've made it very clear I think he should be suspended. That's the right thing to do on every level imo, not least as it seems he hasn't even told his own employer about the case (based on the common consensus surrounding Wael's open letter). So yes, I think for this alone, he should be suspended and quite obviously sacked if found guilty. Personally I think he's a completely inept manager, as evidenced (IMO) by the worst managerial record in our history. Some will disagree, but I don't think my opinion - given the results - is that "shocking". But that is not linked in any way to this charge. The other point is that trouble follows Barton around - that's not an accusation, it's a fact, as evidenced by his incredibly lengthy rap sheet and two current live criminal charges. I don't know who benefits from suspending him, he has not been found guilty of anything and the club would be paying him to sit at home 2 weeks before the league season starts. Regarding his managerial ability, I think he came in and was too honest and told the players they weren't good enough too soon. I find it hard to disagree with that though having painfully sat through nearly every game last season. We were pathetic. I ain't saying no more on this matter. Utg. The fans were giving the players loads of abuse last season and many called for a tougher management who would give them a few home truths. When we get one that gets stuck in to the players it’s considered out of order. Weird.
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Post by Gassy on Jul 28, 2021 7:01:50 GMT
Fair enough, I stand corrected. However, your entire point is a bit naff though as there was never really a chance, on basic knowledge (that was backed up by the actual events), that it would get thrown out. If Joey was advised not to tell his employers because it would get thrown out then he needs a new legal team ASAP as he will get destroyed, based on that experience. I am actually with you on innocent until proven guilty, I would even go further to say that names/cases should not be made public until the case has finished, it’s not fair on either party. In addition to that, it looks like the police leaked information to the press in advance as well, shame on them if it was them - that’s surely a crime in itself that will disappear into nothing. I do think that realistically though he should he suspended whilst this all goes on, it’s the sensible thing to do. However, Wael has decided not to - which is his right, but he will live and die by that decision come December. Again, I’ve no idea whether there was any likelihood of the case being thrown out and don’t know how anyone without legal knowledge and access to the file would know either. Im not sure where you heard the police may have leaked something. Wasn’t it first reported by The Sun late on Friday and most likely found out by looking through the court listings for the following Monday? I totally agree about anonymity, especially when one of the parties is a publicly recognisable figure. In this case JB’s wife and family would have been spared the intrusion in to their lives, especially the kids who may have been facing comments from other kids. JB would be spared the trial by media and for us Gasheads business could have continued uninterrupted. If we think how this would have panned out with anonymity we could have first heard months down the road when JB was found guilty and the club sack him the same day. If he is found innocent the club will not have been compromised in their main business - trying to win football games. Howd they know the specifics on his wife, amongst other things reported?
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Post by peterparker on Jul 28, 2021 7:07:13 GMT
If I believed I was totally innocent and thought there was a good chance the case would be dropped (meaning nobody would ever know) then I would have kept quiet too. You me and the majority on here Eric. Some afraid to admit it though. I am assuming he was going to tell the club something at some point or was he just going to call in sick on Monday?
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Post by peterparker on Jul 28, 2021 7:14:32 GMT
Let’s look at the basics, shall we? CPS brings a case of assault by beating, having been grabbed by the neck and kicked in the head, as stated at the time by the victim. As you clearly said there was a “good chance” of it being thrown out, I’d suggest it was actually you with the (wrong) insider knowledge of the case. What made you say it was a good chance? Was that from a random guess, or your “superior knowledge”? Then what actually happened? Barton pleaded not guilty, which is the only thing he could have done and guess what, it didn’t get thrown out. So please Eric, walk us through your thought process step by step about how there was a “good chance” of this being thrown out. After that, it would be good to hear your analysis of the result as to why they’ve come to the wrong decision, seeming as ‘good’ is pretty strong. Are you referring to when I said “If I believed I was totally innocent and thought there was a good chance the case would be dropped (meaning nobody would ever know) then I would have kept quiet too” ? If so you have read in to that what wanted. I’m saying that if I was arrested and thought the case against me wouldn’t proceed then I wouldn’t have told my employer, if JB (and more importantly his lawyers) thought that about his case then it explains why he probably didn’t tell the club until late last week. I know very little about the ins and outs of this case which is the same as everyone else on here and strongly believe in innocent until proven guilty. Not everyone believes in that and have made up their own minds that he is guilty - I prefer to let the justice system get on with their jobs. depends doesn't it I was arrested and bailed for Assault, ABH and Robbery for over 12 months. I didn't do it, everything was dropped, but I told my manager because their were things I had to do, like do a video for a line-up which I gave my consent for them to use for future line-ups and for the fact that if it impacted my work Barton is a different person though, and has been through all this stuff before so who knows how it affects him. A DV claim if innocent could affect him differently though despite his past misdemeanours or maybe it's all water off a ducks back to him
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Post by chilly1883 on Jul 28, 2021 7:20:55 GMT
what a great idea! So Barton’s got all his players in, but let’s make him stay away from them? We might as well sack him, and let a manager do his job! Good idea! Let's do that, let's get an actual manager to manage the team rather than someone who is incapable of avoiding a dust up with the cops every five minutes and as such is a liability to the club. For what it's worth until now I've not had a bad word to say about JB although I'll confess I had reservations over his appointment. I hate what is happening to us right now which is a direct result of guys behaviour and attitude and I can't help but feel that if JB was the manager of any other club there would barely be a voice on here saying he should stay in his position. I agree with most of what you say! I was happy for Barton to start a rebuild, but it’s hard to back him, with this constant negative bad press. I think he should be judged on the courts outcome, but for us, as a club, it’s an absolute joke.
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Post by yetigas on Jul 28, 2021 7:40:49 GMT
I don't know who benefits from suspending him, he has not been found guilty of anything and the club would be paying him to sit at home 2 weeks before the league season starts. Regarding his managerial ability, I think he came in and was too honest and told the players they weren't good enough too soon. I find it hard to disagree with that though having painfully sat through nearly every game last season. We were pathetic. I ain't saying no more on this matter. Utg. The fans were giving the players loads of abuse last season and many called for a tougher management who would give them a few home truths. When we get one that gets stuck in to the players it’s considered out of order. Weird. Some fans may have called for 'tougher management' (whatever that means) but not all. JBs job was simply to avoid relegation last season - not only did he fail, but he gave every impression of giving up several games before the end of the season. The fact that we went down with a whimper is mainly down to the 'tougher management' of JB. If he ever starts to manage the team again (and I hope that is not until after the a court finds him not guilty) then I hope he has learnt some managerial lessons. He now has no excuses, no one else to blame.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2021 8:07:07 GMT
You me and the majority on here Eric. Some afraid to admit it though. I am assuming he was going to tell the club something at some point or was he just going to call in sick on Monday? It's a shame his case wasn't listed a few weeks earlier. "Wael, I'd like to take Monday, off as I've managed to get a Court-side seat at Wimbledon."
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