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Post by oldie on May 20, 2022 20:13:51 GMT
No insult intended. I sometimes have an abrupt tone. However, I stand by what I said. We shout crap at players. They react by going to peices like Taylor or by scoring and giving us some back. For me that's a brilliant part of the game. If people are unable to understand that dynamic then they do not understand football. There is really nothing a player can do (without getting sent off) that will ever warrant being attacked. To suggest they make idiots worse is just nonsense. They were already an idiot to begin with. The last bit is debatable. Most people have switches, we saw that with Darrell Clarke and Paul Heckingbottom this week. Fans who run on and do idiotic things have the idiot switch, obviously. Outside influences can definitely activate that side of a human Many of these idiots are often very decent people when they aren't decked in SI at a match. Family people with decent jobs but can become a numpty if the stars align. I can see getting over excited, I can see having a beer may lower one's threshold to acting like numpty. But that who ran at Billy Sharp with a flying headbutt, there is something seriously wrong there.
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Post by oliverhelmet on May 20, 2022 20:17:26 GMT
As an Everton fan who has personally never invaded a pitch in over 50 years of going to football but I am a tad angry about the abuse my club has received because one idiot thought it funny to get into Vieras face. The lad was an idiot and I dont blame Viera kicking out at him but it should also be noted other Everton fans escorted Viera away from the problem. Why were they on the pitch? This has been an absolute shitshow of a season for us starting with us employing a despised manager whos main claim to fame was winning trophies with the dark side this was never going to work.We also have to live with our biggest rivals potentially winning every trophy available while we were on the verge of relegation for the first time in 70 years. At half time we were 2 down on the verge of relegation then a miracle happened, you lads/lasses know what it is like to see a miracle played out in front of your eyes you saw one quite recently football is a game of emotions sometimes you laugh sometimes you cry but its like a drug and you cant walk away. Surely the issue isn't about fans going on the pitch it's what they do when they get there which has become the issue this season, there's clearly no easy way to protect 50(?) players and coaching staff from both teams so you can now see the EFL stating any club's fans who enter the pitch will receive a 3 pts penalty, possibly even denied promotion/a play off final place. That would be an open goal for a few of the 82 to infiltrate an important game for us and make themselves heroes for the sh**.
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2022 20:17:35 GMT
I actually think you raised some good points but your last sentence in regards to DC was rubbish , you’ve also then gone on to make yourself look a tad foolish by claiming to know that I don’t respect others posters views , I respect all views but it doesn’t mean i have to agree with you , ooops I almost forgot to add a patronising x For your information i was supposed end my post with the word views an x added instead of an s! I must admit I don't quite understand how I am considered to be a tad foolish in any way to be honest. The thing is the topic is about pitch invasions and I replied about that very subject and the reference to DC was purely a side issue. The main thrust of the topic has to be addressed by everyone associated with football in stamping out pitch invasions and particularly attacks on players by so called fans. I hope that makes sense now By you adding a patronising x now makes you a tad foolish ! This is great banter , it really is
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Post by fintanstack on May 20, 2022 20:20:34 GMT
No insult intended. I sometimes have an abrupt tone. However, I stand by what I said. We shout crap at players. They react by going to peices like Taylor or by scoring and giving us some back. For me that's a brilliant part of the game. If people are unable to understand that dynamic then they do not understand football. There is really nothing a player can do (without getting sent off) that will ever warrant being attacked. To suggest they make idiots worse is just nonsense. They were already an idiot to begin with. The last bit is debatable. Most people have switches, we saw that with Darrell Clarke and Paul Heckingbottom this week. Fans who run on and do idiotic things have the idiot switch, obviously. Outside influences can definitely activate that side of a human Many of these idiots are often very decent people when they aren't decked in SI at a match. Family people with decent jobs but can become a numpty if the stars align. Some of the stuff posted here comes across as victim blaming. There are no set of circumstances where pitch invasions and assaults are the players fault.
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Post by gashead79 on May 20, 2022 20:25:43 GMT
The last bit is debatable. Most people have switches, we saw that with Darrell Clarke and Paul Heckingbottom this week. Fans who run on and do idiotic things have the idiot switch, obviously. Outside influences can definitely activate that side of a human Many of these idiots are often very decent people when they aren't decked in SI at a match. Family people with decent jobs but can become a numpty if the stars align. Some of the stuff posted here comes across as victim blaming. There are no set of circumstances where pitch invasions and assaults are the players fault. Cantonas flying kick? Diouff spitting at fans? Richardson throwing a flare into crowd? BTW I am totally against fans being d1cks, but in support of pitch invasions.
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Post by rovers5charlton5 on May 20, 2022 20:38:16 GMT
As an Everton fan who has personally never invaded a pitch in over 50 years of going to football but I am a tad angry about the abuse my club has received because one idiot thought it funny to get into Vieras face. The lad was an idiot and I dont blame Viera kicking out at him but it should also be noted other Everton fans escorted Viera away from the problem. Why were they on the pitch? This has been an absolute shitshow of a season for us starting with us employing a despised manager whos main claim to fame was winning trophies with the dark side this was never going to work.We also have to live with our biggest rivals potentially winning every trophy available while we were on the verge of relegation for the first time in 70 years. At half time we were 2 down on the verge of relegation then a miracle happened, you lads/lasses know what it is like to see a miracle played out in front of your eyes you saw one quite recently football is a game of emotions sometimes you laugh sometimes you cry but its like a drug and you cant walk away. Yes, it must suck being an Everton fan, 70 years at the top level must've been really tough!
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Post by fintanstack on May 20, 2022 20:38:39 GMT
Some of the stuff posted here comes across as victim blaming. There are no set of circumstances where pitch invasions and assaults are the players fault. Cantonas flying kick? Diouff spitting at fans? Richardson throwing a flare into crowd? BTW I am totally against fans being d1cks, but in support of pitch invasions. Cantona was how many years ago? He was rightly banned for a very long time. Where did the flair Richardson threw come from? Obviously he should not have returned it to where it came from. Diouff was vile. You have had to go back thirty years to find equivalents to just three of this weekends games.
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Post by gashead79 on May 20, 2022 21:00:16 GMT
Cantonas flying kick? Diouff spitting at fans? Richardson throwing a flare into crowd? BTW I am totally against fans being d1cks, but in support of pitch invasions. Cantona was how many years ago? He was rightly banned for a very long time. Where did the flair Richardson threw come from? Obviously he should not have returned it to where it came from. Diouff was vile. You have had to go back thirty years to find equivalents to just three of this weekends games. Probably, those just came to me as examples to counter your point. It's out of hand. I've been reading g the Swindon forum xnd it seems like their fans got hammered last night. But again, if you go back 30 years it would have been the same..
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Post by fintanstack on May 20, 2022 21:09:45 GMT
Cantona was how many years ago? He was rightly banned for a very long time. Where did the flair Richardson threw come from? Obviously he should not have returned it to where it came from. Diouff was vile. You have had to go back thirty years to find equivalents to just three of this weekends games. Probably, those just came to me as examples to counter your point. It's out of hand. I've been reading g the Swindon forum xnd it seems like their fans got hammered last night. But again, if you go back 30 years it would have been the same.. In fairness my point earlier was that nothing a player can do that does not already earn a red card warrants what we are seeing. I cannot remember my exact wording. If a player goes over the top they are sent off, fined and banned. Celebration of a goal or cupping their ear (things that would not even get a yellow card) is never a justification for an assault. Anyone who feels that it is because a footballer made a rude gesture, probably should not be allowed out unescorted.
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Post by gashead79 on May 20, 2022 21:15:55 GMT
Probably, those just came to me as examples to counter your point. It's out of hand. I've been reading g the Swindon forum xnd it seems like their fans got hammered last night. But again, if you go back 30 years it would have been the same.. In fairness my point earlier was that nothing a player can do that does not already earn a red card warrants what we are seeing. I cannot remember my exact wording. If a player goes over the top they are sent off, fined and banned. Celebration of a goal or cupping their ear (things that would not even get a yellow card) is never a justification for an assault. Anyone who feels that it is because a footballer made a rude gesture, probably should not be allowed out unescorted. 😆 To reaffirm. I did say that players doing that were not helping. Not that they deserved to be assaulted.
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Post by Gasshole on May 20, 2022 22:19:00 GMT
Is there any other sport where you score a goal and run immediately to the corner flag and celebrate wildly in front of the opposition fans. Back in the day I used to trot nonchalantly back to my position after collecting a few hand shakes, high fives and an occasional @$$ pat.
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Post by yattongas on May 20, 2022 22:50:49 GMT
Is there any other sport where you score a goal and run immediately to the corner flag and celebrate wildly in front of the opposition fans. Back in the day I used to trot nonchalantly back to my position after collecting a few hand shakes, high fives and an occasional @$$ pat. Hmmm 🤔 ….. how many fans were watching you play for the Dog & Duck ?
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Post by Congas on May 21, 2022 4:34:55 GMT
Here's an interesting take by Jonathan Wilson of the Guardian in which he concludes: "We live in a world in which mockery and taunting the Other is commonplace. Anybody not of our tribe is contemptible. Everything is reduced to Them and Us. Football has to put immediate safety measures in place to protect players, but the truth is pitch invasions wouldn’t be a problem, these moments of anarchic fun could still be permitted, if people could just stop being idiots." He also mentioned the increased use of cocaine by fans, which sort of verified what I thought when I first saw some of our fans prancing across the pitch like fairies, arms up bent at the elbow and fingers wiggling downwards like toddlers learning how to walk. I said then, they're not drunk but high. I'm sure this behaviour started at the Scunthorpe game at the Mem, but we don't get a mention. www.theguardian.com/football/2022/may/20/football-fans-ugly-behaviour-society-pitch-invasions
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Post by aforce on May 21, 2022 6:56:33 GMT
Difference is when we invaded the pitch we celebrated with our players didn’t goad any Scunthorpe fans or did we do anything to their players or staff. How it should be done. And these playoff pitch invasions are pathetic as they’ve only done half the job
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Post by gashead79 on May 21, 2022 7:11:35 GMT
Here's an interesting take by Jonathan Wilson of the Guardian in which he concludes: "We live in a world in which mockery and taunting the Other is commonplace. Anybody not of our tribe is contemptible. Everything is reduced to Them and Us. Football has to put immediate safety measures in place to protect players, but the truth is pitch invasions wouldn’t be a problem, these moments of anarchic fun could still be permitted, if people could just stop being idiots." He also mentioned the increased use of cocaine by fans, which sort of verified what I thought when I first saw some of our fans prancing across the pitch like fairies, arms up bent at the elbow and fingers wiggling downwards like toddlers learning how to walk. I said then, they're not drunk but high. I'm sure this behaviour started at the Scunthorpe game at the Mem, but we don't get a mention. www.theguardian.com/football/2022/may/20/football-fans-ugly-behaviour-society-pitch-invasionsHow does he explain the fact that pitch invasions have been happening for 50 years. Plus back in the 70s and 80s rival fans would fight in the stands and on the pitch? Thus isn't anything new. It's the media foung it's thing backed up by mobile phone footage and multi-cameras catching every detail.
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Post by yattongas on May 21, 2022 7:15:37 GMT
Here's an interesting take by Jonathan Wilson of the Guardian in which he concludes: "We live in a world in which mockery and taunting the Other is commonplace. Anybody not of our tribe is contemptible. Everything is reduced to Them and Us. Football has to put immediate safety measures in place to protect players, but the truth is pitch invasions wouldn’t be a problem, these moments of anarchic fun could still be permitted, if people could just stop being idiots." He also mentioned the increased use of cocaine by fans, which sort of verified what I thought when I first saw some of our fans prancing across the pitch like fairies, arms up bent at the elbow and fingers wiggling downwards like toddlers learning how to walk. I said then, they're not drunk but high. I'm sure this behaviour started at the Scunthorpe game at the Mem, but we don't get a mention. www.theguardian.com/football/2022/may/20/football-fans-ugly-behaviour-society-pitch-invasionsHow does he explain the fact that pitch invasions have been happening for 50 years. Plus back in the 70s and 80s rival fans would fight in the stands and on the pitch? Thus isn't anything new. It's the media foung it's thing backed up by mobile phone footage and multi-cameras catching every detail. Trouble at and around grounds is on the rise , on newsnight last night I think they said trouble was up 36% since fans returned to grounds after Covid lockdowns.
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Post by A Source (aka Angry Badger) on May 21, 2022 8:07:31 GMT
Difference is when we invaded the pitch we celebrated with our players didn’t goad any Scunthorpe fans or did we do anything to their players or staff. How it should be done. And these playoff pitch invasions are pathetic as they’ve only done half the job Proved by the footage doing the rounds from the Scunthorpe away end. FGR almost ruined by a couple of the goading and a few of our lot deciding to respond. Below quote short, sweet and spot on. Don't like his antics but at least he's prepared to take back the stuff he dishes out Swindon forward Harry McKirdy said on Instagram: "I'll take the stick and the songs. But bottles, coins, lighters thrown [at] me, running on and hitting and kicking me/team-mates. Too far."
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Post by gashead79 on May 21, 2022 8:23:48 GMT
How does he explain the fact that pitch invasions have been happening for 50 years. Plus back in the 70s and 80s rival fans would fight in the stands and on the pitch? Thus isn't anything new. It's the media foung it's thing backed up by mobile phone footage and multi-cameras catching every detail. Trouble at and around grounds is on the rise , on newsnight last night I think they said trouble was up 36% since fans returned to grounds after Covid lockdowns. Over what time period? Measured since covid lockdowns isn't a good sample. There's not a chance in hell that there's more trouble in 2022 than there was in 1982. Difference is reporting, cctv, mobile phones etc.
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Post by fintanstack on May 21, 2022 8:28:33 GMT
Trouble at and around grounds is on the rise , on newsnight last night I think they said trouble was up 36% since fans returned to grounds after Covid lockdowns. Over what time period? Measured since covid lockdowns isn't a good sample. There's not a chance in hell that there's more trouble in 2022 than there was in 1982. Difference is reporting, cctv, mobile phones etc. I think "trouble" also had a different meaning in the seventies. What was once seen as high jinks is now a micro-aggression thought crime. Crime statistics are not a fair comparison.
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Post by yattongas on May 21, 2022 8:32:12 GMT
Trouble at and around grounds is on the rise , on newsnight last night I think they said trouble was up 36% since fans returned to grounds after Covid lockdowns. Over what time period? Measured since covid lockdowns isn't a good sample. There's not a chance in hell that there's more trouble in 2022 than there was in 1982. Difference is reporting, cctv, mobile phones etc. I think it was from the season before covid compared to this season .
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