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Post by Gaswood on Sept 1, 2022 5:45:10 GMT
FWIW: Having just got back from the football tonight 2 points to make. 1. Are we not allowed to have a different opinion or ask questions about Wael? We’ve had a couple of posters who’ve come on and disagreed with many others. I hope we don’t get to a position where we don’t accept alternative views. I love many of the things Wael has done but the elephant in the room is the stadium (or rather no stadium). I would hope the debacle of tickets/capacity etc during the start of this season has given Wael and the board a large reminder that we need some progress in this area quickly if we aren’t going to remain in the League 1/League 2 cycle for the foreseeable future. This isn’t the thread obviously for this but I hope that those with alternative views aren’t shouted down or classified as “Barton-haters”. 2. Having watched the Shrewsbury match and driven home totally frustrated by the antics of Cotterill and his team I’ve had a shorter journey tonight after the AFCB v Wolves match but had the same frustrations. Wolves did exactly the same as Shrewsbury. They slowed the game down and on three occasions when AFCB had the ball and were attacking a Wolves player went down and the ref stopped play. They weren’t head injuries. Again they were the better team and I think slowing the game down at certain points wasn’t needed and it probably stopped them winning. But throughout the game the referee, tonight Anthony Taylor, wasn’t bothered about stopping the game or the time-wearing and he ignored pulls, pushes, players who stood in front of free kicks and most low level stuff. So perhaps referees have had some kind of directive to say something about not bothering with time wasting tactics and just add time on at the end. I don’t know but to have seen two matches in a week where the away team played well but seem determined to time waste was frustrating and we still haven’t reached September. I’ve just watched MOTD and it’s not even noticeable obviously, and not even mentioned which makes me that no one gives a monkey’s about time wasting in reality (Not that MOTD is a measure of that.) I don’t think anyone apart from fans cares about time-wasting, not teams because they all know they do it, not managers because they know the other team may have just done it better than them, not pundits, not refs. And fans only care if they are on the losing side. If they win they just call it “professionalism” or “game-management”. Hey ho! UTG! With the views from the footage on BT Sport watching the game last night I’d strongly disagree. Wolves were nothing like what we saw on Saturday. That last big challenge towards the end was a possible red as he didn’t clip him as he broke away, but swiped / hacked him dangerously which was like Roy Keane years back. I think you may change your view when you watch that game back!
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Post by rememberhalifax on Sept 1, 2022 6:58:20 GMT
FWIW: Having just got back from the football tonight 2 points to make. 1. Are we not allowed to have a different opinion or ask questions about Wael? We’ve had a couple of posters who’ve come on and disagreed with many others. I hope we don’t get to a position where we don’t accept alternative views. I love many of the things Wael has done but the elephant in the room is the stadium (or rather no stadium). I would hope the debacle of tickets/capacity etc during the start of this season has given Wael and the board a large reminder that we need some progress in this area quickly if we aren’t going to remain in the League 1/League 2 cycle for the foreseeable future. This isn’t the thread obviously for this but I hope that those with alternative views aren’t shouted down or classified as “Barton-haters”. 2. Having watched the Shrewsbury match and driven home totally frustrated by the antics of Cotterill and his team I’ve had a shorter journey tonight after the AFCB v Wolves match but had the same frustrations. Wolves did exactly the same as Shrewsbury. They slowed the game down and on three occasions when AFCB had the ball and were attacking a Wolves player went down and the ref stopped play. They weren’t head injuries. Again they were the better team and I think slowing the game down at certain points wasn’t needed and it probably stopped them winning. But throughout the game the referee, tonight Anthony Taylor, wasn’t bothered about stopping the game or the time-wearing and he ignored pulls, pushes, players who stood in front of free kicks and most low level stuff. So perhaps referees have had some kind of directive to say something about not bothering with time wasting tactics and just add time on at the end. I don’t know but to have seen two matches in a week where the away team played well but seem determined to time waste was frustrating and we still haven’t reached September. I’ve just watched MOTD and it’s not even noticeable obviously, and not even mentioned which makes me that no one gives a monkey’s about time wasting in reality (Not that MOTD is a measure of that.) I don’t think anyone apart from fans cares about time-wasting, not teams because they all know they do it, not managers because they know the other team may have just done it better than them, not pundits, not refs. And fans only care if they are on the losing side. If they win they just call it “professionalism” or “game-management”. Hey ho! UTG! Think we must all respect alternative views to our own , i think what frustrates folk is the way some threads deviate so far from the OP we forget what the question was in the first place! this thread being a classic example., now where was I?!
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Post by warehamgas on Sept 1, 2022 8:01:22 GMT
FWIW: Having just got back from the football tonight 2 points to make. 1. Are we not allowed to have a different opinion or ask questions about Wael? We’ve had a couple of posters who’ve come on and disagreed with many others. I hope we don’t get to a position where we don’t accept alternative views. I love many of the things Wael has done but the elephant in the room is the stadium (or rather no stadium). I would hope the debacle of tickets/capacity etc during the start of this season has given Wael and the board a large reminder that we need some progress in this area quickly if we aren’t going to remain in the League 1/League 2 cycle for the foreseeable future. This isn’t the thread obviously for this but I hope that those with alternative views aren’t shouted down or classified as “Barton-haters”. 2. Having watched the Shrewsbury match and driven home totally frustrated by the antics of Cotterill and his team I’ve had a shorter journey tonight after the AFCB v Wolves match but had the same frustrations. Wolves did exactly the same as Shrewsbury. They slowed the game down and on three occasions when AFCB had the ball and were attacking a Wolves player went down and the ref stopped play. They weren’t head injuries. Again they were the better team and I think slowing the game down at certain points wasn’t needed and it probably stopped them winning. But throughout the game the referee, tonight Anthony Taylor, wasn’t bothered about stopping the game or the time-wearing and he ignored pulls, pushes, players who stood in front of free kicks and most low level stuff. So perhaps referees have had some kind of directive to say something about not bothering with time wasting tactics and just add time on at the end. I don’t know but to have seen two matches in a week where the away team played well but seem determined to time waste was frustrating and we still haven’t reached September. I’ve just watched MOTD and it’s not even noticeable obviously, and not even mentioned which makes me that no one gives a monkey’s about time wasting in reality (Not that MOTD is a measure of that.) I don’t think anyone apart from fans cares about time-wasting, not teams because they all know they do it, not managers because they know the other team may have just done it better than them, not pundits, not refs. And fans only care if they are on the losing side. If they win they just call it “professionalism” or “game-management”. Hey ho! UTG! With the views from the footage on BT Sport watching the game last night I’d strongly disagree. Wolves were nothing like what we saw on Saturday. That last big challenge towards the end was a possible red as he didn’t clip him as he broke away, but swiped / hacked him dangerously which was like Roy Keane years back. I think you may change your view when you watch that game back! As I said, alternative views. I saw the Wolves bench, even their subs when they got hold of the ball slowed it down. And when the trainers came in for one of the stops, the ref asked them to go off the pitch with the player. They just ignore him and carried on yet nothing happened. It was very similar to Saturday imo. You, of course, are welcomed to your view. 😉 And, with due respect, I was there, not the best game so don’t want to watch it again! 😉 UTG!
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Post by perryfenwick on Sept 1, 2022 9:56:21 GMT
FWIW: Having just got back from the football tonight 2 points to make. 1. Are we not allowed to have a different opinion or ask questions about Wael? We’ve had a couple of posters who’ve come on and disagreed with many others. I hope we don’t get to a position where we don’t accept alternative views. I love many of the things Wael has done but the elephant in the room is the stadium (or rather no stadium). I would hope the debacle of tickets/capacity etc during the start of this season has given Wael and the board a large reminder that we need some progress in this area quickly if we aren’t going to remain in the League 1/League 2 cycle for the foreseeable future. This isn’t the thread obviously for this but I hope that those with alternative views aren’t shouted down or classified as “Barton-haters”. Well bloody said. I haven't seen a lot of criticism of his tenure that is unfair, obviously you get one or two who take it too far but what I do see is people completely intolerant towards anything that isn't "Wael is brilliant". On the pitch we've taken a step back then stepped forward afterwards, e.g. stood still. Off it, great stuff about the training ground, more specialist staffing, doing things for the matchday experience, but not so great is the lack of stadium progress, the issues we've all seen with aspects of matchday (poor organisation, safety issues), choosing of a divisive manager (let's not do that one here again but it does affect our reputation), and some fans feeling switched off it all (either due to JB, or well known issues around how some people have been treated). I get that we're lucky to have someone putting their own money in, in this day and age where sustainable finances are basically impossible, but that can't mean he is above criticism when it's due.
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Post by perryfenwick on Sept 1, 2022 9:57:01 GMT
Anyway, Steve Cotterill eh. Good thing Jurgen Klopp didn't see that game Saturday, he'd have hit the roof
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Post by stuart1974 on Sept 1, 2022 10:15:46 GMT
FWIW: Having just got back from the football tonight 2 points to make. 1. Are we not allowed to have a different opinion or ask questions about Wael? We’ve had a couple of posters who’ve come on and disagreed with many others. I hope we don’t get to a position where we don’t accept alternative views. I love many of the things Wael has done but the elephant in the room is the stadium (or rather no stadium). I would hope the debacle of tickets/capacity etc during the start of this season has given Wael and the board a large reminder that we need some progress in this area quickly if we aren’t going to remain in the League 1/League 2 cycle for the foreseeable future. This isn’t the thread obviously for this but I hope that those with alternative views aren’t shouted down or classified as “Barton-haters”. Well bloody said. I haven't seen a lot of criticism of his tenure that is unfair, obviously you get one or two who take it too far but what I do see is people completely intolerant towards anything that isn't "Wael is brilliant". On the pitch we've taken a step back then stepped forward afterwards, e.g. stood still. Off it, great stuff about the training ground, more specialist staffing, doing things for the matchday experience, but not so great is the lack of stadium progress, the issues we've all seen with aspects of matchday (poor organisation, safety issues), choosing of a divisive manager (let's not do that one here again but it does affect our reputation), and some fans feeling switched off it all (either due to JB, or well known issues around how some people have been treated). I get that we're lucky to have someone putting their own money in, in this day and age where sustainable finances are basically impossible, but that can't mean he is above criticism when it's due. Constructive criticism and healthy debate is a good thing. What I think has caused this perception is that over the years there has been quite a bit of deliberate stoking of problems, some of it very overt whilst some has been subtle yet still (imho) designed to undermine confidence for whatever reason. I guess we've collectively become conscious of this and probably now overreact when legitimate concerns or genuine questions are raised. Wael and Tom aren't above criticism.
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Post by perryfenwick on Sept 1, 2022 13:35:53 GMT
Well bloody said. I haven't seen a lot of criticism of his tenure that is unfair, obviously you get one or two who take it too far but what I do see is people completely intolerant towards anything that isn't "Wael is brilliant". On the pitch we've taken a step back then stepped forward afterwards, e.g. stood still. Off it, great stuff about the training ground, more specialist staffing, doing things for the matchday experience, but not so great is the lack of stadium progress, the issues we've all seen with aspects of matchday (poor organisation, safety issues), choosing of a divisive manager (let's not do that one here again but it does affect our reputation), and some fans feeling switched off it all (either due to JB, or well known issues around how some people have been treated). I get that we're lucky to have someone putting their own money in, in this day and age where sustainable finances are basically impossible, but that can't mean he is above criticism when it's due. Constructive criticism and healthy debate is a good thing. What I think has caused this perception is that over the years there has been quite a bit of deliberate stoking of problems, some of it very overt whilst some has been subtle yet still (imho) designed to undermine confidence for whatever reason. I guess we've collectively become conscious of this and probably now overreact when legitimate concerns or genuine questions are raised. Wael and Tom aren't above criticism. Hard to argue with that. We've had a weird relationship with ownership for as long as I recall. Criticism of the things GD got wrong was always met with 'remember the 80s' as if the noble act of saving the club meant that every decision he made was right. And Nick - an unmitigated failure as chairman - always had his backers, the "if you don't like it buy the club yourself or shut it" mob. IMO Wael got a lot of unfair heat in the aftermath of UWE going belly up, suddenly people noticed he wasn't some local boy, which they didn't seem to mind when he came in. He backed DC in the market to the best of his ability and didn't deserve the lashing he got at that time. Maybe that's made people defensive towards him, or maybe people see the backing during COVID/the conversion of debt to equity as a second 1986, so we go back to 'he's saved us, how dare you slate him?' The talk of him having anterior motives is unwarranted IMO
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Post by warehamgas on Sept 2, 2022 10:54:09 GMT
FWIW: Having just got back from the football tonight 2 points to make. 1. Are we not allowed to have a different opinion or ask questions about Wael? We’ve had a couple of posters who’ve come on and disagreed with many others. I hope we don’t get to a position where we don’t accept alternative views. I love many of the things Wael has done but the elephant in the room is the stadium (or rather no stadium). I would hope the debacle of tickets/capacity etc during the start of this season has given Wael and the board a large reminder that we need some progress in this area quickly if we aren’t going to remain in the League 1/League 2 cycle for the foreseeable future. This isn’t the thread obviously for this but I hope that those with alternative views aren’t shouted down or classified as “Barton-haters”. 2. Having watched the Shrewsbury match and driven home totally frustrated by the antics of Cotterill and his team I’ve had a shorter journey tonight after the AFCB v Wolves match but had the same frustrations. Wolves did exactly the same as Shrewsbury. They slowed the game down and on three occasions when AFCB had the ball and were attacking a Wolves player went down and the ref stopped play. They weren’t head injuries. Again they were the better team and I think slowing the game down at certain points wasn’t needed and it probably stopped them winning. But throughout the game the referee, tonight Anthony Taylor, wasn’t bothered about stopping the game or the time-wearing and he ignored pulls, pushes, players who stood in front of free kicks and most low level stuff. So perhaps referees have had some kind of directive to say something about not bothering with time wasting tactics and just add time on at the end. I don’t know but to have seen two matches in a week where the away team played well but seem determined to time waste was frustrating and we still haven’t reached September. I’ve just watched MOTD and it’s not even noticeable obviously, and not even mentioned which makes me that no one gives a monkey’s about time wasting in reality (Not that MOTD is a measure of that.) I don’t think anyone apart from fans cares about time-wasting, not teams because they all know they do it, not managers because they know the other team may have just done it better than them, not pundits, not refs. And fans only care if they are on the losing side. If they win they just call it “professionalism” or “game-management”. Hey ho! UTG! With the views from the footage on BT Sport watching the game last night I’d strongly disagree. Wolves were nothing like what we saw on Saturday. That last big challenge towards the end was a possible red as he didn’t clip him as he broke away, but swiped / hacked him dangerously which was like Roy Keane years back. I think you may change your view when you watch that game back! Gaswood, I read my reply again and I might have sounded grumpy. Apologies! But perhaps when it comes to time-wasting I wonder if it seems more frustrating if you’re actually in the ground watching the antics of the subs, trainers, bench and everything like that live. And if you have an emotional connection it does make it more frustrating imo. I was mightily p***** off with the Wolves team and the way every opportunity was taken to slow the game down. Anyway, apologies. UTG!
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Post by lastminutewinner on Sept 2, 2022 11:02:07 GMT
At least Shrewsbury know that their new players will hit the ground running, literally
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Post by Gaswood on Sept 2, 2022 22:04:40 GMT
With the views from the footage on BT Sport watching the game last night I’d strongly disagree. Wolves were nothing like what we saw on Saturday. That last big challenge towards the end was a possible red as he didn’t clip him as he broke away, but swiped / hacked him dangerously which was like Roy Keane years back. I think you may change your view when you watch that game back! Gaswood, I read my reply again and I might have sounded grumpy. Apologies! But perhaps when it comes to time-wasting I wonder if it seems more frustrating if you’re actually in the ground watching the antics of the subs, trainers, bench and everything like that live. And if you have an emotional connection it does make it more frustrating imo. I was mightily p***** off with the Wolves team and the way every opportunity was taken to slow the game down. Anyway, apologies. UTG! Never need to apologise to me buddy 👍👍👍
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