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Post by Antonio Fargas on Nov 1, 2017 8:11:05 GMT
That's all common knowledge, though, isn't it? "we don't pay any of our bills , Court action instigated" that's about a dispute, though, right? Not an inability to pay. "lack of a new stadium," Yeah, we know this. Not really a new thing. "loans from their own bank," wouldn't you if you had a bank? Be mental to use a different bank. "debts mounted up significantly" Yeah, coz they're investing more in the team and infrastructure than previously. " the Colony is a pipe dream and so is a refurb of the Mem " That's an opinion, isn't it? Not a fact. What have your sources told you, coz everything above you could have got from here or the Evening Post? Okay fella you may have an answer for all this hype and believe our new owner(s) and their installed glove puppet but don't you really think that with all the negativity surrounding the supervision of our club including the rumours 'cough cough' etc that we should just let the carnage unfold . Don't mind having massive egg on my boat but I'm afraid it'll look like a " I told you so" . Perhaps reign my posts in in say 6 months time and pin it. Well, if you were to say something new and worrying then I might be worried, but all you've done is list a bunch of stuff that everyone on here knew already. If you come back and say I told you so in 6 months, I could say what did you tell us, and you would have to say something like, I told you it was worrying. And I would say but did you give us any solid info? And you would say, no, not really, I just listed a load of stuff that everyone knew anyway. And then I would say, why didn't you warn us properly with some facts so that we would know what was really going on and we could prepare ourselves for it, or protest about it, or something. And you would have to say, good point, I should have given you some decent facts. And I would then say, not much of an I told you so, then, is it? To be clear, I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying you haven't actually told us anything new. |
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Post by Feeling The Blues on Nov 1, 2017 8:17:38 GMT
Also not looking forward to saying I told you so when our club goes down the toilet . Too many fans on here that won't have a bad word to say against them as they refuse to believe the truth of what's actually happening at our beloved club. The same people who trusted in Higgs and his Bod when they proposed their bullshit upon us. Agree it's unbelievable how easy a ride the ALQs are getting from most fans but strangely it seems that some of those who were Higgs biggest critics are the ALQs biggest champions! There would be absolute meltdown if events since the beginning of August had happened on Higgs watch and you'd be hard pressed to find people to believe his version of the events! However if Wael says anything - and he's saying increasingly little - too many just believe it as the gospel of the Messiah. |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Nov 1, 2017 8:19:06 GMT
In the immediate aftermath of the UWE collapse I posted that I thought they were 'Fake Sheiks" and although that was heavily emotionally driven, 3 months on I still see it that way. More so in fact although clearly they aren't sheiks! Shoddy Qadis? |
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Post by justin blue on Nov 1, 2017 8:21:53 GMT
Okay fella you may have an answer for all this hype and believe our new owner(s) and their installed glove puppet but don't you really think that with all the negativity surrounding the supervision of our club including the rumours 'cough cough' etc that we should just let the carnage unfold . Don't mind having massive egg on my boat but I'm afraid it'll look like a " I told you so" . Perhaps reign my posts in in say 6 months time and pin it. Well, if you were to say something new and worrying then I might be worried, but all you've done is list a bunch of stuff that everyone on here knew already. If you come back and say I told you so in 6 months, I could say what did you tell us, and you would have to say something like, I told you it was worrying. And I would say but did you give us any solid info? And you would say, no, not really, I just listed a load of stuff that everyone knew anyway. And then I would say, why didn't you warn us properly with some facts so that we would know what was really going on and we could prepare ourselves for it, or protest about it, or something. And you would have to say, good point, I should have given you some decent facts. And I would then say, not much of an I told you so, then, is it? To be clear, I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying you haven't actually told us anything new. Well! if there was a prize for the best prediction of a conversation that hasn't yet happened this post wins hands down. |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Nov 1, 2017 8:23:22 GMT
Also not looking forward to saying I told you so when our club goes down the toilet . Too many fans on here that won't have a bad word to say against them as they refuse to believe the truth of what's actually happening at our beloved club. The same people who trusted in Higgs and his Bod when they proposed their bullshit upon us. Agree it's unbelievable how easy a ride the ALQs are getting from most fans but strangely it seems that some of those who were Higgs biggest critics are the ALQs biggest champions! There would be absolute meltdown if events since the beginning of August had happened on Higgs watch and you'd be hard pressed to find people to believe his version of the events! However if Wael says anything - and he's saying increasingly little - too many just believe it as the gospel of the Messiah. The huge difference is that if Higgs had pulled out of a deal he had created and worked on for ten years on, saying it wasn't a very good deal then he would rightly be criticised. If Wael pulls out of a deal he didn't create and had spent a year trying to improve coz it wasn't a very good deal, saying, it's not a very good deal, then that's more reasonable, surely? |
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Post by gasify on Nov 1, 2017 8:26:03 GMT
I have zero faith in them I'm afraid. Wael seems like a nice fellow but his communication skills have fallen off a cliff since those early months after the takeover when he was full of it regarding the future plans for the club. I do not believe for one minute that anything significant changed on the UWE side of things to cause them to pull out. I do not believe for one minute that the Colony isn't being developed because of tax complication. I do believe that both aren't going ahead because they either can't or don't want to invest the necessary capital. In the immediate aftermath of the UWE collapse I posted that I thought they were 'Fake Sheiks" and although that was heavily emotionally driven, 3 months on I still see it that way. More so in fact although clearly they aren't sheiks! I really don't understand how the ALQs are getting such an easy ride from the fans just because Wael seems like a nice fellow. We should judge people by their actions not their words, not that there are any words anymore! I think it's because: 1) There has been some change - Development squad and staff members. This at least shows a little more ambition than the last lot. 2) Fear - Who else is there? What's the guarantee they won't try and do what's happening at Torquay. |
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Post by bumble on Nov 1, 2017 8:27:09 GMT
Wack WAQ?
I still I have the faith. Though to be fair, I still believe in Santa and the Easter bunny where the general consensus of opinion says that they don't exist.
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Post by Feeling The Blues on Nov 1, 2017 8:35:28 GMT
Agree it's unbelievable how easy a ride the ALQs are getting from most fans but strangely it seems that some of those who were Higgs biggest critics are the ALQs biggest champions! There would be absolute meltdown if events since the beginning of August had happened on Higgs watch and you'd be hard pressed to find people to believe his version of the events! However if Wael says anything - and he's saying increasingly little - too many just believe it as the gospel of the Messiah. The huge difference is that if Higgs had pulled out of a deal he had created and worked on for ten years on, saying it wasn't a very good deal then he would rightly be criticised. If Wael pulls out of a deal he didn't create and had spent a year trying to improve coz it wasn't a very good deal, saying, it's not a very good deal, then that's more reasonable, surely? Yes, save for the fact that the ALQs didn't buy the club blind and had many meetings with UWE before they bought the club (according to Wael) so knew exactly what the deal was and it didn't stop them from buying. All of their rhetoric at the time was of developing a new stadium and moving forward with UWE from a position that they knew what the deal Higgs had agreed was before they bought the club. They even let the court case appeal with Sainsbury's run on despite Hamer telling us at the time that it was no longer important to win that to build UWE. All this shows is that on the balance of probability it is the ALQs rather than UWE who have significantly changed their position to cause it all to collapse. |
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Post by faggotygas on Nov 1, 2017 8:38:35 GMT
Technically not instigating legal proceedings, but notification of intention to instigate proceedings. Proceedings are not instigated until they are lodged with a court.
Anyway.
When was it issued?
As it is between 2 companies, is it really anyone else business currently? Depends if it is a sign of problems at Bristol Rovers. A football club is more than just a business.
However, we must all remember - that which can be asserted without proof, can be dismissed without proof.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2017 8:45:50 GMT
The huge difference is that if Higgs had pulled out of a deal he had created and worked on for ten years on, saying it wasn't a very good deal then he would rightly be criticised. If Wael pulls out of a deal he didn't create and had spent a year trying to improve coz it wasn't a very good deal, saying, it's not a very good deal, then that's more reasonable, surely? Yes, save for the fact that the ALQs didn't buy the club blind and had many meetings with UWE before they bought the club (according to Wael) so knew exactly what the deal was and it didn't stop them from buying. All of their rhetoric at the time was of developing a new stadium and moving forward with UWE from a position that they knew what the deal Higgs had agreed was before they bought the club. They even let the court case appeal with Sainsbury's run on despite Hamer telling us at the time that it was no longer important to win that to build UWE. All this shows is that on the balance of probability it is the ALQs rather than UWE who have significantly changed their position to cause it all to collapse. For what it's worth I will throw something into the debate. I'm led to believe amongst other things that the UWE would not move from their position of wanting a substantial percentage of the gate receipts from all events including all Rovers games at the UWE. I will leave the experts on here to debate whether this was acceptable, our owners obviously thought not. |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Nov 1, 2017 8:47:56 GMT
Yes, save for the fact that the ALQs didn't buy the club blind and had many meetings with UWE before they bought the club (according to Wael) so knew exactly what the deal was and it didn't stop them from buying. All of their rhetoric at the time was of developing a new stadium and moving forward with UWE from a position that they knew what the deal Higgs had agreed was before they bought the club. They even let the court case appeal with Sainsbury's run on despite Hamer telling us at the time that it was no longer important to win that to build UWE. All this shows is that on the balance of probability it is the ALQs rather than UWE who have significantly changed their position to cause it all to collapse. For what it's worth I will throw something into the debate. I'm led to believe amongst other things that the UWE would not move from their position of wanting a substantial percentage of the gate receipts from all events including all Rovers games at the UWE. I will leave the experts on here to debate whether this was acceptable, our owners obviously thought not. Well, if that's true, we didn't dodge a bullet, we dodged a (something bigger than a bullet, and explosive)! |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2017 8:48:49 GMT
I have been hearing nothing but negative stories about the board for the past few months. Are any of you still optimistic they are in it for the long haul and are going to deliver ? I hated the period of slow decline following the failed promotion season of 99-00 and all the ill feeling towards the board that followed and i really hoped for a period of all pulling together and some relative success. I very much still have faith.... 3 main reasons: 1. I haven't seen a shred of evidence that backs up the numerous disruptive stories and rumours that have been brought up on here - only hearsay and comments like 'my source' or a friend of a friend. That's not to say they are wrong but if they were true I would have expected parties to either go to press, court etc by now and even if notices of intent are issued then the press would have picked it up and the assumption that we aren't paying bills as we have no money is too far fetched for me especially as if staff and players etc weren't paid or paid late, again it would be lodged with PFA etc 2. Whilst it may not be as quick as some want, I've only seen the regime do what they said they would. Buy land for a training ground, invest in players, invest in the infrastructure by get a more professional back room set up in, start work in our commercial space, secure our best manager in years on a long term contract and make small and reasonable changes to an expensive to run, dated ground in the 2nd or 3rd most expensive place to live and run a business in the land. 3. There isn't anyone else knocking our door down saying I'll buy you and wipe out all your debts, invest multi-millions in the team and spend £50-60m building a new stadium and state of the art training complex. I respect everyone's opinion but I think sometimes we all have to get a bit more realistic with our expectations and how long things can take |
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Post by Topper Gas on Nov 1, 2017 8:50:32 GMT
investing what in the team exactly? Using the club transfer funds to sanction Nichols and also what infrastructure do you talk of ? Not our cat2 training facility or our stadium lol? Perhaps you talk of our b team but then furnish me with FACTS where they've invested their own money in this venture . ' Evolution ' f&cking don't make me laugh . Not much more, but a bit more, istm. Doing up small things around the stadium, employing more staff, paying more (on average) for players. You might not like it, or you might not consider it very much (it isn't that much, imo) but you can't just say it didn't happen. That is where the rising debt comes from I would think. You can't just complain about the rising debt and then deny we're spending more money. The rising debt comes from spending more money. That's not just a fact, that's mathematics. So they are not actually investing their own money but simply increasing the debt against the Mem that's hardly a great business plan? What happens when our debts start to exceed the assets/the Mem value? I fear there's no Plan B. |
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Post by Feeling The Blues on Nov 1, 2017 8:51:18 GMT
Yes, save for the fact that the ALQs didn't buy the club blind and had many meetings with UWE before they bought the club (according to Wael) so knew exactly what the deal was and it didn't stop them from buying. All of their rhetoric at the time was of developing a new stadium and moving forward with UWE from a position that they knew what the deal Higgs had agreed was before they bought the club. They even let the court case appeal with Sainsbury's run on despite Hamer telling us at the time that it was no longer important to win that to build UWE. All this shows is that on the balance of probability it is the ALQs rather than UWE who have significantly changed their position to cause it all to collapse. For what it's worth I will throw something into the debate. I'm led to believe amongst other things that the UWE would not move from their position of wanting a substantial percentage of the gate receipts from all events including all Rovers games at the UWE. I will leave the experts on here to debate whether this was acceptable, our owners obviously thought not. Thanks for that Bideford but it doesn't stack up. Do you think that the ALQs would have bought the club had that been UWEs position and they thought they had to get them to move from that position for it to be viable? |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Nov 1, 2017 8:56:11 GMT
So they are not actually investing their own money but simply increasing the debt against the Mem that's hardly a great business plan? Why's that? |
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Post by gasincider on Nov 1, 2017 9:00:33 GMT
I have been hearing nothing but negative stories about the board for the past few months. Are any of you still optimistic they are in it for the long haul and are going to deliver ? I hated the period of slow decline following the failed promotion season of 99-00 and all the ill feeling towards the board that followed and i really hoped for a period of all pulling together and some relative success. I very much still have faith.... 3 main reasons: 1. I haven't seen a shred of evidence that backs up the numerous disruptive stories and rumours that have been brought up on here - only hearsay and comments like 'my source' or a friend of a friend. That's not to say they are wrong but if they were true I would have expected parties to either go to press, court etc by now and even if notices of intent are issued then the press would have picked it up and the assumption that we aren't paying bills as we have no money is too far fetched for me especially as if staff and players etc weren't paid or paid late, again it would be lodged with PFA etc 2. Whilst it may not be as quick as some want, I've only seen the regime do what they said they would. Buy land for a training ground, invest in players, invest in the infrastructure by get a more professional back room set up in, start work in our commercial space, secure our best manager in years on a long term contract and make small and reasonable changes to an expensive to run, dated ground in the 2nd or 3rd most expensive place to live and run a business in the land. 3. There isn't anyone else knocking our door down saying I'll buy you and wipe out all your debts, invest multi-millions in the team and spend £50-60m building a new stadium and state of the art training complex. I respect everyone's opinion but I think sometimes we all have to get a bit more realistic with our expectations and how long things can take 1) Unpaid bills. Outstanding for months. 2) Training ground just growing grass. More staff employed but no income to cover costs: result bankruptcy. Only reason for giving DC a five year deal is to maximise compensation if he gets poached. He still only gets 1 years pay if we sack him. 3) Who knows. The Mem would be worth millions to a developer. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2017 9:05:15 GMT
Okay fella you may have an answer for all this hype and believe our new owner(s) and their installed glove puppet but don't you really think that with all the negativity surrounding the supervision of our club including the rumours 'cough cough' etc that we should just let the carnage unfold . Don't mind having massive egg on my boat but I'm afraid it'll look like a " I told you so" . Perhaps reign my posts in in say 6 months time and pin it. Well, if you were to say something new and worrying then I might be worried, but all you've done is list a bunch of stuff that everyone on here knew already. If you come back and say I told you so in 6 months, I could say what did you tell us, and you would have to say something like, I told you it was worrying. And I would say but did you give us any solid info? And you would say, no, not really, I just listed a load of stuff that everyone knew anyway. And then I would say, why didn't you warn us properly with some facts so that we would know what was really going on and we could prepare ourselves for it, or protest about it, or something. And you would have to say, good point, I should have given you some decent facts. And I would then say, not much of an I told you so, then, is it? To be clear, I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying you haven't actually told us anything new. Here's a couple of new things you may not of realised , the PR announcement from the club that had said we had turned down £500k from a championship club on deadline day for Bill to lead us to think that the club at least/ at last has ambition, or the fact that Avon and Somerset have been waiting to be paid for last season, there's more but to be brutally honest most on here won't believe unless you can provide printed transcripts no doubt but it doesn't stop it all being true. As I've said in an earlier post I have always been an optimist not a doom monger when it comes to Rovers but all these murmurings emanating from the club are extremely concerning indeed, they want out because they haven't shown due diligence when acquiring the club and now realise the deal is not for them which is dumbfounding when you consider they are supposed to be successful business men. A couple of other things some of which you do know Dwayne sports is channel island based nothing new there but because for some unknown reason (sh1t advisors or have a go heroes) they don't know British tax law i.e. They thought that the building of the Colony and that of the UWE would be VAT free which it would be because new builds are VAT exempt but that only applies to British mainland based companies not those who are based in Guernsay. That would mean that our £40million pound plus pipe dream would've cost nearer to £50 million and the same rules apply to the state of the art training complex , none of it is going to happen. |
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Nov 1, 2017 9:08:22 GMT
Here's a couple of new things you may not of realised , the PR announcement from the club that had said we had turned down £500k from a championship club on deadline day for Bill to lead us to think that the club at least/ at last has ambition, ... Are you saying, we announced we rejected a half-million bid but that wasn't true? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2017 9:08:58 GMT
Yes, save for the fact that the ALQs didn't buy the club blind and had many meetings with UWE before they bought the club (according to Wael) so knew exactly what the deal was and it didn't stop them from buying. All of their rhetoric at the time was of developing a new stadium and moving forward with UWE from a position that they knew what the deal Higgs had agreed was before they bought the club. They even let the court case appeal with Sainsbury's run on despite Hamer telling us at the time that it was no longer important to win that to build UWE. All this shows is that on the balance of probability it is the ALQs rather than UWE who have significantly changed their position to cause it all to collapse. For what it's worth I will throw something into the debate. I'm led to believe amongst other things that the UWE would not move from their position of wanting a substantial percentage of the gate receipts from all events including all Rovers games at the UWE. I will leave the experts on here to debate whether this was acceptable, our owners obviously thought not. it's not worth a lot as it's hearsay |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2017 9:10:43 GMT
Well Dwane has invested more than the previous regime (year on year). Not much more, but a bit more, istm. Doing up small things around the stadium, employing more staff, paying more (on average) for players. You might not like it, or you might not consider it very much (it isn't that much, imo) but you can't just say it didn't happen. That is where the rising debt comes from I would think. You can't just complain about the rising debt and then deny we're spending more money. The rising debt comes from spending more money. That's not just a fact, that's mathematics. So they are not actually investing their own money but simply increasing the debt against the Mem that's hardly a great business plan? What happens when our debts start to exceed the assets/the Mem value? I fear there's no Plan B. thats the danger topper our only asset will be sold and off to trumpton we trot if we're lucky |
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