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Post by Hugo the Elder on Mar 13, 2018 15:17:52 GMT
And a lot of that debt was caused by Higgs with extortionate Wonga loans and costs for UWE that have had to be added back to P&L because they can't be capitalised and bills outstanding. A little bit of the eyes wide open that you are harping on about wouldn't go amiss..... I've probably forgotten more about company accounts over a thirty year career than you ever learnt pal. So take your condescension elsewhere. The losses occurred under the Al Qadi regime when the stadium failed. It failed on their watch, and even now the truth about why has never been disclosed. Remember that old chestnut 'secrecy agreement'. I agree with you, but for different reasons. The AQs have to have failed to do proper due diligence on the UWE deal. They were handed a pup, but they paid for it without looking so must bare that responsibility.
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Post by gasincider on Mar 13, 2018 15:19:09 GMT
Are you saying debts are no longer debts? In the banking world it wont look to good to tell folks that you bought a business and saw it double its indebtedness in two years. Unless of course, debts are no longer debts. To Have a debt you need to owe money to another party can you identify who that party is please ? If not the AQ's why haven't they been written off?
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Post by onefindunford on Mar 13, 2018 15:19:22 GMT
And a lot of that debt was caused by Higgs with extortionate Wonga loans and costs for UWE that have had to be added back to P&L because they can't be capitalised and bills outstanding. A little bit of the eyes wide open that you are harping on about wouldn't go amiss..... I've probably forgotten more about company accounts over a thirty year career than you ever learnt pal. So take your condescension elsewhere. The losses occurred under the Al Qadi regime when the stadium failed. It failed on their watch, and even now the truth about why has never been disclosed. Remember that old chestnut 'secrecy agreement'. So do you honestly think, that the current owners should have pushed on with the UWE deal that NH had negotiated?
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Post by albaron on Mar 13, 2018 15:19:29 GMT
Just to show you aren't being picked on by peterparker and also because you never answered his question.... Rescue us from what? From people who on arrival said the club had to leave the Mem, then changed their mind and now say that the Mem being redeveloped is the plan B. No it isn't, they know it and those who can think for themselves know it. The only hope of this club becoming viable at championship level is to move to a purpose built stadium elsewhere. They also know it, as do those of us who can think for themselves. Cant believe how many people sleep walk into oblivion. There is no doubt a training ground is important to the club, but it's being used as a sop because the real requirement to move this club forward is a new stadium. You've hit the nail on the head. The bloody Mem is an embarrassment.
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Post by Henbury Gas on Mar 13, 2018 15:20:23 GMT
To Have a debt you need to owe money to another party can you identify who that party is please ? If not the AQ's why haven't they been written off? i could use that dirty word on here - Tax Purposes ?
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Post by gasincider on Mar 13, 2018 15:22:43 GMT
I've probably forgotten more about company accounts over a thirty year career than you ever learnt pal. So take your condescension elsewhere. The losses occurred under the Al Qadi regime when the stadium failed. It failed on their watch, and even now the truth about why has never been disclosed.Remember that old chestnut 'secrecy agreement'. Care to enlighten us ? More info from the "Corridors of Power" ? Were you not aware it was a stipulation in the talks that were held with the UWE?.
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Post by yattongas on Mar 13, 2018 15:24:04 GMT
And a lot of that debt was caused by Higgs with extortionate Wonga loans and costs for UWE that have had to be added back to P&L because they can't be capitalised and bills outstanding. A little bit of the eyes wide open that you are harping on about wouldn't go amiss..... I've probably forgotten more about company accounts over a thirty year career than you ever learnt pal. So take your condescension elsewhere. The losses occurred under the Al Qadi regime when the stadium failed. It failed on their watch, and even now the truth about why has never been disclosed. Remember that old chestnut 'secrecy agreement'. This could be interesting....
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Post by peterparker on Mar 13, 2018 15:24:14 GMT
And a lot of that debt was caused by Higgs with extortionate Wonga loans and costs for UWE that have had to be added back to P&L because they can't be capitalised and bills outstanding. A little bit of the eyes wide open that you are harping on about wouldn't go amiss..... I've probably forgotten more about company accounts over a thirty year career than you ever learnt pal. So take your condescension elsewhere. The losses occurred under the Al Qadi regime when the stadium failed. It failed on their watch, and even now the truth about why has never been disclosed. Remember that old chestnut 'secrecy agreement'. I think Chesh might know a bit about finance and obviously you would probably know the legal fees involved in the purchase would have been capitalised as an asset of 1883Ltd
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Post by faggotygas on Mar 13, 2018 15:25:09 GMT
People watch football to be entertained - that's what they are buying. People are entertained best by telling them a story. People have been telling stories for 10s of thousands of years.
Even more entertaining is when a person can relate to the story, feel a part of it. But the story needs to move along, with the person's being reminded of their part in the story. They feel a need to understand where the story is going, and why. Otherwise, they get bored, frustrated, and eventually apathetic. Goodwill is lost.
If you haven't got a story, then what have you got?
After watching the progress of DC and the team over the last 2-3 years, boring and frustrating are certainly not words I would associate with following this football club, maybe a club stuck in the doldrums of league one such as Walsall but not us. Surely the real "story" and entertainment come from on the pitch play rather than boardroom decisions as after we pay to get ourselves onto the terraces of a football match not the corridors of some office. I'd much rather be bored by off the pitch happenings if it's ultimately going to give us success and entertainment on the field of play, certainly no loss of goodwill from me. The last 4-5 years off the pitch have provided me enough "excitement", I'll only be interested again when tangible things start to become apparent which will happen over time, we are in capable hands. I don't think you can separate out the club and the playing side in that way, they come as a package. If every fan was only worried about the playing side then a downturn would see fans buggering off in droves. It's the story of the club that the fans follow, of which the playing side is just the sharp edge. Of course, every supporter is different.
Of course the playing side has been the most important factor in the improvement in attendances, but don't underestimate the story that has occurred off the field - the takeover of the al-Qadis caused a great deal of optimism and interest for a while.
However, it's hard to see how we can improve much on the pitch with current resources. It's therefore vital that the club work had to keep the fans engaged in other ways. Treating them like mere paying customers, as per Asda, isn't going to do that.
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Post by gasincider on Mar 13, 2018 15:25:41 GMT
I've probably forgotten more about company accounts over a thirty year career than you ever learnt pal. So take your condescension elsewhere. The losses occurred under the Al Qadi regime when the stadium failed. It failed on their watch, and even now the truth about why has never been disclosed. Remember that old chestnut 'secrecy agreement'. I agree with you, but for different reasons. The AQs have to have failed to do proper due diligence on the UWE deal. They were handed a pup, but they paid for it without looking so must bare that responsibility. You are right Hugo. Hence the start of my worries over the AQ's. They are financial wizards, yet failed at the most fundamental level.
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Post by Henbury Gas on Mar 13, 2018 15:26:06 GMT
Care to enlighten us ? More info from the "Corridors of Power" ? Were you not aware it was a stipulation in the talks that were held with the UWE?. I don't walk in the "Corridors of Power" like you But i was told by somebody outside the corridor of power ( East Stand terrace) that the build cost of the UWE was in excess of £60m so the numbers did not add up. Who Knows, Do you ?
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Post by axegas on Mar 13, 2018 15:26:59 GMT
Isn't that what they are working towards though? It's just that people like you don't have the patience to wait and bemoan the clubs inability to retain players in the meantime. We go again purely because the deal at UWE wasn't right for the club, there's no conspiracy to it. We have mixed messages all the time or nowt at all. We are told we need to leave the Mem, then told it was plan b. It wasn't. It never was. They simply didnt have a plan b. If they have any sense, and remain as owners, they will know we have to move to a purpose built stadium elsewhere. And don't tell me to gave patience. Who do you think you are, Paul Buckle? This club has watched just about the entire league get better grounds, and still the wait goes on. How long do you want to wait, I've waited 39-49 years. For the board to have given mixed messages, they would have to had said 2 contrasting things at the same time, they haven't. When UWE was a possibility, they said the club needed to leave the mem, probably to stress the importance of the deal more than anything and now it's clear UWE is not a possibility, the board now say redeveloping the Mem is best for the clubs future, perhaps they have received more information or just realised how bad the alternatives are but I don't see what is mixed about it at all, how can you know that redeveloping the mem wasn't plan b from the start. I wouldn't get too hung up on it personally. I agree with you that getting new facilities is a priority for the club but I am content to wait 3/4/5 years which to me is long enough for the club to finally make serious steps to achieve something. It seems like some on here can't wait more than two weeks.
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Post by Henbury Gas on Mar 13, 2018 15:29:36 GMT
I've probably forgotten more about company accounts over a thirty year career than you ever learnt pal. So take your condescension elsewhere. The losses occurred under the Al Qadi regime when the stadium failed. It failed on their watch, and even now the truth about why has never been disclosed. Remember that old chestnut 'secrecy agreement'. I think Chesh might know a bit about finance and obviously you would probably know the legal fees involved in the purchase would have been capitalised as an asset of 1883Ltd He must certainly will ! My Money is on Cheshire Gas
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Post by gasincider on Mar 13, 2018 15:29:58 GMT
I've probably forgotten more about company accounts over a thirty year career than you ever learnt pal. So take your condescension elsewhere. The losses occurred under the Al Qadi regime when the stadium failed. It failed on their watch, and even now the truth about why has never been disclosed. Remember that old chestnut 'secrecy agreement'. So do you honestly think, that the current owners should have pushed on with the UWE deal that NH had negotiated? Not Nicke deal. That was patently flawed. Then the AQ's renegotiated the whole thing, and the feasibility study confirmed it was then viable. After that it failed. I don't know why because the reasons were never disclosed. But I've wondered why the two sides couldn't come together just to disclose this element of what happened. It would hardly be earth shattering, but the blame could then be fairly apportioned.
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Post by singupgas on Mar 13, 2018 15:33:51 GMT
We have mixed messages all the time or nowt at all. We are told we need to leave the Mem, then told it was plan b. It wasn't. It never was. They simply didnt have a plan b. If they have any sense, and remain as owners, they will know we have to move to a purpose built stadium elsewhere. And don't tell me to gave patience. Who do you think you are, Paul Buckle? This club has watched just about the entire league get better grounds, and still the wait goes on. How long do you want to wait, I've waited 39-49 years. For the board to have given mixed messages, they would have to had said 2 contrasting things at the same time, they haven't. When UWE was a possibility, they said the club needed to leave the mem, probably to stress the importance of the deal more than anything and now it's clear UWE is not a possibility, the board now say redeveloping the Mem is best for the clubs future, perhaps they have received more information or just realised how bad the alternatives are but I don't see what is mixed about it at all, how can you know that redeveloping the mem wasn't plan b from the start. I wouldn't get too hung up on it personally. I agree with you that getting new facilities is a priority for the club but I am content to wait 3/4/5 years which to me is long enough for the club to finally make serious steps to achieve something. It seems like some on here can't wait more than two weeks. But it hasn't been two weeks, it has been 8 months.
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Post by Henbury Gas on Mar 13, 2018 15:36:39 GMT
For the board to have given mixed messages, they would have to had said 2 contrasting things at the same time, they haven't. When UWE was a possibility, they said the club needed to leave the mem, probably to stress the importance of the deal more than anything and now it's clear UWE is not a possibility, the board now say redeveloping the Mem is best for the clubs future, perhaps they have received more information or just realised how bad the alternatives are but I don't see what is mixed about it at all, how can you know that redeveloping the mem wasn't plan b from the start. I wouldn't get too hung up on it personally. I agree with you that getting new facilities is a priority for the club but I am content to wait 3/4/5 years which to me is long enough for the club to finally make serious steps to achieve something. It seems like some on here can't wait more than two weeks. But it hasn't been two weeks, it has been 8 months. I fully expect it to take 2 years to explore all possible options for a new ground, get agreements etc before anything is announced to the Public. How Long did Sir Nick negotiate with the UWE before it became common knowledge
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Post by singupgas on Mar 13, 2018 15:39:23 GMT
On Wiki, the UWE stadium was described as this..
The bowl-shaped stadium would have been all-seated with an initial capacity of 21,700. The stadium has been designed to adhere to international standards for both football and rugby.
The stadium was designed to minimise the impact on the local environment, including using the topography of the site to effectively enclose the stadium and minimise noise and light disruption, as well as being designed to allow the capacity to be increased to 26,000 without making any external changes and up to 35,000 should it be needed.
Now, if 60 million is presumed to be too much, could WAQ deliver anything remotely close?
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Post by singupgas on Mar 13, 2018 15:40:13 GMT
But it hasn't been two weeks, it has been 8 months. I fully expect it to take 2 years to explore all possible options for a new ground, get agreements etc before anything is announced to the Public. How Long did Sir Nick negotiate with the UWE before it became common knowledge So greatness isnt that close is it.
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Post by axegas on Mar 13, 2018 15:40:46 GMT
After watching the progress of DC and the team over the last 2-3 years, boring and frustrating are certainly not words I would associate with following this football club, maybe a club stuck in the doldrums of league one such as Walsall but not us. Surely the real "story" and entertainment come from on the pitch play rather than boardroom decisions as after we pay to get ourselves onto the terraces of a football match not the corridors of some office. I'd much rather be bored by off the pitch happenings if it's ultimately going to give us success and entertainment on the field of play, certainly no loss of goodwill from me. The last 4-5 years off the pitch have provided me enough "excitement", I'll only be interested again when tangible things start to become apparent which will happen over time, we are in capable hands. I don't think you can separate out the club and the playing side in that way, they come as a package. If every fan was only worried about the playing side then a downturn would see fans buggering off in droves. It's the story of the club that the fans follow, of which the playing side is just the sharp edge. Of course, every supporter is different.
Of course the playing side has been the most important factor in the improvement in attendances, but don't underestimate the story that has occurred off the field - the takeover of the al-Qadis caused a great deal of optimism and interest for a while.
However, it's hard to see how we can improve much on the pitch with current resources. It's therefore vital that the club work had to keep the fans engaged in other ways. Treating them like mere paying customers, as per Asda, isn't going to do that.
Yeah but let's be honest, can you name a single gashead who is not interested in the football and only cares about off the field matters, perhaps some on here give that illusion at times but really it is the team playing in blue and white that unites us. You say that if every fan only cared about the playing side a downturn would result in people leaving in their droves but isn't that what happens anyway? We are all stakeholders of Bristol Rovers FC so the interest in the off the matters will be mutual that is indisputable. The last thing I want is for the club to treat us like paying customers, my point was just that I don't think we should expect the level of communication see under Higgs and the Dunfords and that I think it's perfectly fine for the club to only announce stuff when there is stuff to announce.
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Post by Henbury Gas on Mar 13, 2018 15:42:18 GMT
On Wiki, the UWE stadium was described as this.. The bowl-shaped stadium would have been all-seated with an initial capacity of 21,700. The stadium has been designed to adhere to international standards for both football and rugby. The stadium was designed to minimise the impact on the local environment, including using the topography of the site to effectively enclose the stadium and minimise noise and light disruption, as well as being designed to allow the capacity to be increased to 26,000 without making any external changes and up to 35,000 should it be needed. Now, if 60 million is presumed to be too much, could WAQ deliver anything remotely close? I think the best we could get would be along the lines of other new Stadiums in our league ( Doncaster, Shrewsbury etc
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