|
Post by stuart1974 on Feb 18, 2020 21:38:51 GMT
Good start! Michel Barnier: UK can't have Canada trade deal with EU But speaking to reporters as he arrived at the European Parliament, Mr Barnier cast doubt on the possibility. "We remain ready to offer the UK an ambitious partnership," he said. "A trade agreement that includes in particular fishing and includes a level playing field, with a country that has a very particular proximity - a unique territorial and economic closeness - which is why it can't be compared to Canada or South Korea or Japan." Mr Barnier said the EU remained "ready to work very quickly with the UK" on the basis of the agreement with Mr Johnson ahead of Brexit, adding: "We remain ready to propose this partnership if the UK wants it." www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51549662I have to say that I am getting very tired of the EUs dictorial approach.I don't buy the close proximity bullsh.t, it's just a stick to beat us with. I have a feeling that the EU fears a robust dynamic competitor and will do anything to drag us into their economic morass It's all rhetoric at this stage, for domestic consumption or personal advantage. Just look at Greece and the Elgin Marbles issue coming out tonight. We aren't any better either, politicians do what comes naturally. With 27 nations having a veto, plus Belgium's own regions and the EU itself, expect a lot of "briefings" before the adults get down to business.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2020 21:41:23 GMT
Good start! Michel Barnier: UK can't have Canada trade deal with EU But speaking to reporters as he arrived at the European Parliament, Mr Barnier cast doubt on the possibility. "We remain ready to offer the UK an ambitious partnership," he said. "A trade agreement that includes in particular fishing and includes a level playing field, with a country that has a very particular proximity - a unique territorial and economic closeness - which is why it can't be compared to Canada or South Korea or Japan." Mr Barnier said the EU remained "ready to work very quickly with the UK" on the basis of the agreement with Mr Johnson ahead of Brexit, adding: "We remain ready to propose this partnership if the UK wants it." www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51549662I have to say that I am getting very tired of the EUs dictorial approach.I don't buy the close proximity bullsh.t, it's just a stick to beat us with. I have a feeling that the EU fears a robust dynamic competitor and will do anything to drag us into their economic morass I think we need to adjust our thinking on this. For a start, drop the hyperbole. We left, they didn't force us to and they didn't want us to. We want a trade deal. We cannot dictate it's terms. If what they offer is not acceptable to the current government I guess they just walk away. We then live with the consequences, good or bad. I really don't understand what people expected.
|
|
|
Post by peterparker on Feb 19, 2020 6:45:41 GMT
|
|
|
Post by stuart1974 on Feb 19, 2020 8:00:45 GMT
The lack of even some form of implementation period for low skilled workers will be an issue. Farmers and carers will find the changes hard.
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Feb 19, 2020 8:30:31 GMT
The lack of even some form of implementation period for low skilled workers will be an issue. Farmers and carers will find the changes hard. What the migrants have done is keep the wages low for the people in those jobs, supply and demand.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 8:43:41 GMT
The lack of even some form of implementation period for low skilled workers will be an issue. Farmers and carers will find the changes hard. Maybe this is the start of a bigger change in the way things work. Why are the UK using cheap labour from abroad, yet paying people to stay at home and not work? I think we all agree that the welfare system is being exploited and it should be a safety net and not a lifestyle choice. I understand that there are some people on benefits who cannot work and these people do need the system, but there are many more sat at home who should be working. Let me give you an example of how it works in Germany. If you are a farmer, with a crop that needs picking, you can go to the local benefits office and ask for workers. Say the farmer need fifty people to work for two months. People who are unemployed and receiving benefits are then allocated to pick the crop. They get paid the minimum wage for the two months by the farmer. If those people fail to turn up for the work then their benefits get stopped. The result: The farmer gets his crop picked. The government save paying benefits for two months. The workers experience actually going to work to earn money. It's a win-win-win.
|
|
|
Post by stuart1974 on Feb 19, 2020 8:44:57 GMT
The lack of even some form of implementation period for low skilled workers will be an issue. Farmers and carers will find the changes hard. What the migrants have done is keep the wages low for the people in those jobs, supply and demand. Partly true. One of the factors credited with low inflation in the early 2000s was the influx of cheap labour. That cheap labour kept wages lower and in turn kept inflationary pressures down, the consequence of which was low interest rates on mortgages. Otherwise rates would have been higher. Looking at your point, what is the result of reducing supply?
|
|
|
Post by peterparker on Feb 19, 2020 8:49:18 GMT
What the migrants have done is keep the wages low for the people in those jobs, supply and demand. Partly true. One of the factors credited with low inflation in the early 2000s was the influx of cheap labour. That cheap labour kept wages lower and in turn kept inflationary pressures down, the consequence of which was low interest rates on mortgages. Otherwise rates would have been higher. Looking at your point, what is the result of reducing supply? the best part of the article is this
Instead, it said the 3.2 million EU citizens who have applied to continue staying in the UK could help meet labour market demands.
The Government do realise that most of the EU citizens here are already employed. They do don't they?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 9:03:29 GMT
Partly true. One of the factors credited with low inflation in the early 2000s was the influx of cheap labour. That cheap labour kept wages lower and in turn kept inflationary pressures down, the consequence of which was low interest rates on mortgages. Otherwise rates would have been higher. Looking at your point, what is the result of reducing supply? the best part of the article is this
Instead, it said the 3.2 million EU citizens who have applied to continue staying in the UK could help meet labour market demands.
The Government do realise that most of the EU citizens here are already employed. They do don't they?
That made me laugh. Almost as much as the David Davis interview on R4 this morning. He followed a lady who represented the care industry, (social, health etc) who quite succinctly pointed out two points. 1. If looking after the elderly, infirm, disabled or just plain ill is not a skill, what is? Data input or analytics? (My phrasing) 2. They pay the National Living Wage, as a minimum. So, my question to Al, is this. If these providers are paying the national living wage, how is that keeping down wages, other than suppressing inflation with supply, as Stuart points out? If all you good fellows think these good people deserve more, shouldn't we pay that anyway? By raising the living wage level? If we do that, who exactly is going to pay for this, and the subsequent inflationary cycle?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 9:07:03 GMT
I have to say that I am getting very tired of the EUs dictorial approach.I don't buy the close proximity bullsh.t, it's just a stick to beat us with. I have a feeling that the EU fears a robust dynamic competitor and will do anything to drag us into their economic morass It's all rhetoric at this stage, for domestic consumption or personal advantage. Just look at Greece and the Elgin Marbles issue coming out tonight. We aren't any better either, politicians do what comes naturally. With 27 nations having a veto, plus Belgium's own regions and the EU itself, expect a lot of "briefings" before the adults get down to business. I had to laugh at the Elgin Marbles one. In fact it is a lot more stuff as well as the Marbles involved. Just what this has to do with a Trade Deal is anyone's guess.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 9:24:34 GMT
I always laugh at what some people support on here...I mean..are you sure? A Counter-Revolution Is Brewing in the UK and Europe flip.it/L_EvJe
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 9:29:36 GMT
I always laugh at what some people support on here...I mean..are you sure? A Counter-Revolution Is Brewing in the UK and Europe flip.it/L_EvJeUm...err......you do realise that this article is just one man's opinion? How absurd to even think 'some people' on here 'support' this view? Why is everything just black & white in your world?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 9:53:21 GMT
I always laugh at what some people support on here...I mean..are you sure? A Counter-Revolution Is Brewing in the UK and Europe flip.it/L_EvJeUm...err......you do realise that this article is just one man's opinion? How absurd to even think 'some people' on here 'support' this view? Why is everything just black & white in your world? Regardless of this view are you contesting that Johnson appears to be about to ditch the Thatcherite Principle (Hayek) of small government involvement in the economy? If he follows through on what he is suggesting that he will not blow a hole in the government finances? You voted for that?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 10:02:52 GMT
Um...err......you do realise that this article is just one man's opinion? How absurd to even think 'some people' on here 'support' this view? Why is everything just black & white in your world? Regardless of this view are you contesting that Johnson appears to be about to ditch the Thatcherite Principle (Hayek) of small government involvement in the economy? If he follows through on what he is suggesting that he will not blow a hole in the government finances? You voted for that? Oldie, I repeat, the world is not black & white. No, I did not vote for every single thing the Johnson government does, or will do. Nobody did. You need to get a grip on reality. Your outrage is full of words like "appears", "If" and "suggest", so they are not facts are they? Just your interpretation. One question on your views though, as I am a bit confused about them. Are you in favour of this "Thatcher Principle" of smaller government, or the more Socialist view of big government?
|
|
|
Post by althepirate on Feb 19, 2020 10:22:48 GMT
What the migrants have done is keep the wages low for the people in those jobs, supply and demand. Partly true. One of the factors credited with low inflation in the early 2000s was the influx of cheap labour. That cheap labour kept wages lower and in turn kept inflationary pressures down, the consequence of which was low interest rates on mortgages. Otherwise rates would have been higher. Looking at your point, what is the result of reducing supply? We are all looking after ourselves as individuals though aren't we Stuart. It's ok to talk about low inflation but the wages are so low, I'm talking £3 per hour that migrants accept, that if you are British and in these jobs then your standard of living will plummet. It's ok if a person is in a well paid job, but not at the lower end.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 10:33:37 GMT
Partly true. One of the factors credited with low inflation in the early 2000s was the influx of cheap labour. That cheap labour kept wages lower and in turn kept inflationary pressures down, the consequence of which was low interest rates on mortgages. Otherwise rates would have been higher. Looking at your point, what is the result of reducing supply? We are all looking after ourselves as individuals though aren't we Stuart. It's ok to talk about low inflation but the wages are so low, I'm talking £3 per hour that migrants accept, that if you are British and in these jobs then your standard of living will plummet. It's ok if a person is in a well paid job, but not at the lower end. If and employer is paying £3 an hour Al, that's illegal.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 10:34:25 GMT
Regardless of this view are you contesting that Johnson appears to be about to ditch the Thatcherite Principle (Hayek) of small government involvement in the economy? If he follows through on what he is suggesting that he will not blow a hole in the government finances? You voted for that? Oldie, I repeat, the world is not black & white. No, I did not vote for every single thing the Johnson government does, or will do. Nobody did. You need to get a grip on reality. Your outrage is full of words like "appears", "If" and "suggest", so they are not facts are they? Just your interpretation. One question on your views though, as I am a bit confused about them. Are you in favour of this "Thatcher Principle" of smaller government, or the more Socialist view of big government? Neither.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 10:43:25 GMT
Regardless of this view are you contesting that Johnson appears to be about to ditch the Thatcherite Principle (Hayek) of small government involvement in the economy? If he follows through on what he is suggesting that he will not blow a hole in the government finances? You voted for that? Oldie, I repeat, the world is not black & white. No, I did not vote for every single thing the Johnson government does, or will do. Nobody did. You need to get a grip on reality. Your outrage is full of words like "appears", "If" and "suggest", so they are not facts are they? Just your interpretation. One question on your views though, as I am a bit confused about them. Are you in favour of this "Thatcher Principle" of smaller government, or the more Socialist view of big government? My grip on reality will be the reality of Johnson's policies, acts and then outcomes. Like I said we can then compare that to promises made in campaigns. But to make that comparison we have to wait to see what he actually does. Let's take this proposed immigration bill which, to be fair to him is pretty much what he said he would do. Let's now see, once it's in place, what the outcome is for Agriculture and the Care industry. Things to look out for 1. Will the cost of the product or service rise, as a result? 2. Will the service or industry shrink as a result of labour shortages. 3. What will be outcomes be for the consumer or the end user. There, nice and easy. No need for argument, it will be there in black and white. You never know, Johnson may have uncovered the new "Paradigm" to quote my Greenspan. Cut the labour supply, raise wages, zero inflation and expand the provision. Was that a pig I just spotted?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2020 10:50:40 GMT
Oldie, I repeat, the world is not black & white. No, I did not vote for every single thing the Johnson government does, or will do. Nobody did. You need to get a grip on reality. Your outrage is full of words like "appears", "If" and "suggest", so they are not facts are they? Just your interpretation. One question on your views though, as I am a bit confused about them. Are you in favour of this "Thatcher Principle" of smaller government, or the more Socialist view of big government? My grip on reality will be the reality of Johnson's policies, acts and then outcomes. Like I said we can then compare that to promises made in campaigns. But to make that comparison we have to wait to see what he actually does. Let's take this proposed immigration bill which, to be fair to him is pretty much what he said he would do. Let's now see, once it's in place, what the outcome is for Agriculture and the Care industry. Things to look out for 1. Will the cost of the product or service rise, as a result? 2. Will the service or industry shrink as a result of labour shortages. 3. What will be outcomes be for the consumer or the end user. There, nice and easy. No need for argument, it will be there in black and white. You never know, Johnson may have uncovered the new "Paradigm" to quote my Greenspan. Cut the labour supply, raise wages, zero inflation and expand the provision. Was that a pig I just spotted? What if the intention is not to cut the labour supply, but instead to use labour that exists in the country instead of importing that labour?
|
|
|
Post by stuart1974 on Feb 19, 2020 10:56:42 GMT
Partly true. One of the factors credited with low inflation in the early 2000s was the influx of cheap labour. That cheap labour kept wages lower and in turn kept inflationary pressures down, the consequence of which was low interest rates on mortgages. Otherwise rates would have been higher. Looking at your point, what is the result of reducing supply? We are all looking after ourselves as individuals though aren't we Stuart. It's ok to talk about low inflation but the wages are so low, I'm talking £3 per hour that migrants accept, that if you are British and in these jobs then your standard of living will plummet. It's ok if a person is in a well paid job, but not at the lower end. Where do you get £3 per hour from? The point I was making is that if applicants reduce then wages rise. Good, they deserve it. If wages rise, then costs rise. For the care sector that means the elderly and inferm will have to pay more or government pays more to compensate. I'm not saying that cheap labour in the care sector is good, but changes have to be managed responsibly and it will mean more has to be spent.
|
|