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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2020 12:27:24 GMT
Most of that is true Clive But I do despair at this debate, the terrible insults laid at people's door who find themselves having to resort to claiming benefits, as if they actually want to. But all of that ignores the real issues within our economy. At its very core are two main issues. 1) Income distribution: Surely it is blindingly obvious that our current economic model does not work. We have evolved into a system where so much of our national income is under the ownership of far to few of the citizens of this country. This is not caused particularly by the policies of the current regime, they just do not do anything about it. The last Labour regime did try, to their credit, by introducing working tax credits. The problem was that it was half assed and by trying to compromise made it so complicated it acted as a disincentive to work more than 16 hours. 2) The cost of maintaining a home. Either rental or outright ownership. Our housing market is broken, its dysfunctional nature being a hard brake on social mobility. Both of these issues re-enforce what is in fact economic apartheid. This itself then leads to poorer health outcomes, poorer educational outcomes and then the issue becomes systemic, growing by generation with time. Which is where we are today. Chucking rotten tomatoes at each other will not resolve the issue, equally neither will sticking collective heads in sand and using ignorant (my definition) depictions of people on benefits, nor will being critical without offering solutions. I agree Les particularly that because you come from a Council estate you are work shy,from my experience there are lazy work shy folk in all stratas of our society and folk at the bottom have from what I have seen less opportunity . To your economic point there are I believe a significant number of people in the UK who have no vested intrest in economic change,middle class home owners who have a level of comfort that they would not want disturbed by upheaval you are alluding to. If change is going to happen it needs an adult exchange with all of us about what we see as important and a priority and how we propose to fund accordingly,what are we prepared to give up to effect a paradigm shift. Alas I do not feel as a Society we have the maturity for a discussion of that nature and sadly neither are the Polticians. Exactly, Oldie mentions the economic model and I’m sure most of they were honest would agree that there is an issue where a country with our economic output needs funding from UNICEF to help feed kids or an Indian charity setting up in Britain to help feed kids. As I joked previously we are on the cusp of Ethiopia doing a Live Aid single for us because we can’t provide for our own because the wealth is trickling down less and less. But where we all differ is who has the appetite to do anything about it and sadly our governmental apparatus is still too steeped in the old ways for any serious change to take place. Then you have those lower down the social orders, as you say, the middle class who are disincentivised from supporting BLM and the like and parties who want social change because they don’t want to fall victim to it and yet they are stereotyped as being very socially conscious champagne socialists who all claim to be working class. You are spot on that we do not have the maturity, altruism or open mindedness needed to have that conversation. We are great at virtue signalling yet no-one is prepared to pay more tax to actually effect change. It comes back to printing T-shirts again. We take the knee and talk all day but no-one is prepared to actually *pay* to make things better. Add in to that, as Grover mentioned previously, that we have, for a long while, been fed a message that our neighbour is our enemy and is after what we have rather than a potential collaborator and we have a very individualistic, materialistic society and that only further compounds our inability to work together to solve the problem of declining living standards. As oldie so aptly puts it, economic apartheid. Lastly the think some people bury their head in the sand on this issue and still think we live in a world where factory work brings its own rewards. It doesn’t, as you highlighted with the reference to the pay fruit labouring generates. If it was simply about hard work then there are many cleaners in this country who could buy and sell the rest of us in a heartbeat. But as hard as they all work they are potless because our economy has moved on and to even achieve a reasonable standard of living you need solid education and a stable background and also a fair slice of luck in your associates who can give you a leg up. I read somewhere recently that most people find new employment through existing contacts rather than randomly applying for jobs off websites. A small fact that indicates the size of the problem for the cleaners trying to get ahead in life and convert their hard work into opportunity. We need to strive for much much better as a country and it makes me sad that while we are fed a message of competition amongst ourselves and on the world stage the one message of competition that we *AREN’T* being fed is “why can’t we be more like Denmark and Finland with their rates of economic equality and reported rates of happiness? We should be better than them!” Nobody wants to hear or propagate that message and it’s not hard to figure out why. We are content merely with not being the worst in Europe, not merely the worst when you are comparing yourselves with the likes of Poland and Romania is quite frankly pathetic though. |
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Post by oldgas on Dec 21, 2020 12:38:14 GMT
So, rather th change course over Covid, you'd be happy to see possibly thousands more die from this new Covid strain? I wonder what Starmer would do? I don't have any problems with the decision, Oldgas, but backbenchers and ministers have been out defending a government position only to see that position take a 180 degree turn within a few days, plus some don't agree with the strategy and would prefer to follow a different path anyway. Boris is going to need a good 2021 otherwise he won't make the next election. Ministers etc were defending a position under certain circumstances. Those circumstances changed dramatically when the new strain was identified. What were they supposed to do? Stick to their guns, overwhelm the NHS and see thousands extra die? If 'by some preferring to follow a different path,' I assume you mean Starmer. So, let's imagine he's been to A&E to have the fence splinters removed from his arse, what would his solution be? In fact, has he ever set out an alternative plan with reasons and explanations? Its very easy in opposition to sit on the fence and criticise. Labour are very good at that. They've had a lot of practice. |
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Post by oldgas on Dec 21, 2020 12:44:12 GMT
Said the Marxist -in- Chief. Who’s sole aim is to lower everyone down to the same level. They tried that in Russia, killed about 20 million peasants in the process. It didn't work. Ah yes, but what was the solution proposed by the likes of the IMF? Short sharp shock capitalism. Tell me how that turned out again? Please explain? How many millions died as a result? Do you agree with what the heroic Chinese Communists are doing to the Uighar Muslims? |
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Post by Officer Barbrady on Dec 21, 2020 12:52:35 GMT
I don't have any problems with the decision, Oldgas, but backbenchers and ministers have been out defending a government position only to see that position take a 180 degree turn within a few days, plus some don't agree with the strategy and would prefer to follow a different path anyway. Boris is going to need a good 2021 otherwise he won't make the next election. Ministers etc were defending a position under certain circumstances. Those circumstances changed dramatically when the new strain was identified. What were they supposed to do? Stick to their guns, overwhelm the NHS and see thousands extra die? If 'by some preferring to follow a different path,' I assume you mean Starmer. So, let's imagine he's been to A&E to have the fence splinters removed from his arse, what would his solution be? In fact, has he ever set out an alternative plan with reasons and explanations? Its very easy in opposition to sit on the fence and criticise. Labour are very good at that. They've had a lot of practice. He would have done the same but on Wednesday, when Johnson was telling him he was a doom merchant for suggesting it. |
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Post by oldgas on Dec 21, 2020 12:54:51 GMT
I agree Les particularly that because you come from a Council estate you are work shy,from my experience there are lazy work shy folk in all stratas of our society and folk at the bottom have from what I have seen less opportunity . To your economic point there are I believe a significant number of people in the UK who have no vested intrest in economic change,middle class home owners who have a level of comfort that they would not want disturbed by upheaval you are alluding to. If change is going to happen it needs an adult exchange with all of us about what we see as important and a priority and how we propose to fund accordingly,what are we prepared to give up to effect a paradigm shift. Alas I do not feel as a Society we have the maturity for a discussion of that nature and sadly neither are the Polticians. Exactly, Oldie mentions the economic model and I’m sure most of they were honest would agree that there is an issue where a country with our economic output needs funding from UNICEF to help feed kids or an Indian charity setting up in Britain to help feed kids. As I joked previously we are on the cusp of Ethiopia doing a Live Aid single for us because we can’t provide for our own because the wealth is trickling down less and less. But where we all differ is who has the appetite to do anything about it and sadly our governmental apparatus is still too steeped in the old ways for any serious change to take place. Then you have those lower down the social orders, as you say, the middle class who are disincentivised from supporting BLM and the like and parties who want social change because they don’t want to fall victim to it and yet they are stereotyped as being very socially conscious champagne socialists who all claim to be working class. You are spot on that we do not have the maturity, altruism or open mindedness needed to have that conversation. We are great at virtue signalling yet no-one is prepared to pay more tax to actually effect change. It comes back to printing T-shirts again. We take the knee and talk all day but no-one is prepared to actually *pay* to make things better. Add in to that, as Grover mentioned previously, that we have, for a long while, been fed a message that our neighbour is our enemy and is after what we have rather than a potential collaborator and we have a very individualistic, materialistic society and that only further compounds our inability to work together to solve the problem of declining living standards. As oldie so aptly puts it, economic apartheid. Lastly the think some people bury their head in the sand on this issue and still think we live in a world where factory work brings its own rewards. It doesn’t, as you highlighted with the reference to the pay fruit labouring generates. If it was simply about hard work then there are many cleaners in this country who could buy and sell the rest of us in a heartbeat. But as hard as they all work they are potless because our economy has moved on and to even achieve a reasonable standard of living you need solid education and a stable background and also a fair slice of luck in your associates who can give you a leg up. I read somewhere recently that most people find new employment through existing contacts rather than randomly applying for jobs off websites. A small fact that indicates the size of the problem for the cleaners trying to get ahead in life and convert their hard work into opportunity. We need to strive for much much better as a country and it makes me sad that while we are fed a message of competition amongst ourselves and on the world stage the one message of competition that we *AREN’T* being fed is “why can’t we be more like Denmark and Finland with their rates of economic equality and reported rates of happiness? We should be better than them!” Nobody wants to hear or propagate that message and it’s not hard to figure out why. We are content merely with not being the worst in Europe, not merely the worst when you are comparing yourselves with the likes of Poland and Romania is quite frankly pathetic though. The UNICEF nonsense was nothing more than political posturing. A shameless stunt. JRM wiped the floor with them in the H of C. Where does UNICEF get a huge proportion of its funding? Oh yes, Great Britain. How much did they donate? 25k. Oh wow, that should make every problem go away! You do talk some utter rubbish at times. The worrying thing is you get taken in by this crap. Now, I've got a distant relative in Nigerea who is a prince. He has a huge stash of money he needs to move out of his country. If you could just supply him with your bank details he will reward you with 10% of every million he shifts. Heres his email address: ropeadope@conmail.com |
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Post by stuart1974 on Dec 21, 2020 12:57:43 GMT
I don't have any problems with the decision, Oldgas, but backbenchers and ministers have been out defending a government position only to see that position take a 180 degree turn within a few days, plus some don't agree with the strategy and would prefer to follow a different path anyway. Boris is going to need a good 2021 otherwise he won't make the next election. Ministers etc were defending a position under certain circumstances. Those circumstances changed dramatically when the new strain was identified. What were they supposed to do? Stick to their guns, overwhelm the NHS and see thousands extra die? If 'by some preferring to follow a different path,' I assume you mean Starmer. So, let's imagine he's been to A&E to have the fence splinters removed from his arse, what would his solution be? In fact, has he ever set out an alternative plan with reasons and explanations? Its very easy in opposition to sit on the fence and criticise. Labour are very good at that. They've had a lot of practice. As I said, on this there was little choice but even the other day Boris was vilifying those calling for the 5 day window to be closed, then overnight he does just that. Was there really an epiphany? It's the drip-drip effect. Whenever an MP fronts up to defend a position they'll have in the back of their minds 'will what I say be contradicted within hours?' As for Starmer, he did call for a firebreak back in October. This isn't easy by any means and many problems would happen to whomever was in charge, but they aren't helping themselves by overpromising and then reneging. |
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Post by trevorgas on Dec 21, 2020 13:03:18 GMT
I agree Les particularly that because you come from a Council estate you are work shy,from my experience there are lazy work shy folk in all stratas of our society and folk at the bottom have from what I have seen less opportunity . To your economic point there are I believe a significant number of people in the UK who have no vested intrest in economic change,middle class home owners who have a level of comfort that they would not want disturbed by upheaval you are alluding to. If change is going to happen it needs an adult exchange with all of us about what we see as important and a priority and how we propose to fund accordingly,what are we prepared to give up to effect a paradigm shift. Alas I do not feel as a Society we have the maturity for a discussion of that nature and sadly neither are the Polticians. Exactly, Oldie mentions the economic model and I’m sure most of they were honest would agree that there is an issue where a country with our economic output needs funding from UNICEF to help feed kids or an Indian charity setting up in Britain to help feed kids. As I joked previously we are on the cusp of Ethiopia doing a Live Aid single for us because we can’t provide for our own because the wealth is trickling down less and less. But where we all differ is who has the appetite to do anything about it and sadly our governmental apparatus is still too steeped in the old ways for any serious change to take place. Then you have those lower down the social orders, as you say, the middle class who are disincentivised from supporting BLM and the like and parties who want social change because they don’t want to fall victim to it and yet they are stereotyped as being very socially conscious champagne socialists who all claim to be working class. You are spot on that we do not have the maturity, altruism or open mindedness needed to have that conversation. We are great at virtue signalling yet no-one is prepared to pay more tax to actually effect change. It comes back to printing T-shirts again. We take the knee and talk all day but no-one is prepared to actually *pay* to make things better. Add in to that, as Grover mentioned previously, that we have, for a long while, been fed a message that our neighbour is our enemy and is after what we have rather than a potential collaborator and we have a very individualistic, materialistic society and that only further compounds our inability to work together to solve the problem of declining living standards. As oldie so aptly puts it, economic apartheid. Lastly the think some people bury their head in the sand on this issue and still think we live in a world where factory work brings its own rewards. It doesn’t, as you highlighted with the reference to the pay fruit labouring generates. If it was simply about hard work then there are many cleaners in this country who could buy and sell the rest of us in a heartbeat. But as hard as they all work they are potless because our economy has moved on and to even achieve a reasonable standard of living you need solid education and a stable background and also a fair slice of luck in your associates who can give you a leg up. I read somewhere recently that most people find new employment through existing contacts rather than randomly applying for jobs off websites. A small fact that indicates the size of the problem for the cleaners trying to get ahead in life and convert their hard work into opportunity. We need to strive for much much better as a country and it makes me sad that while we are fed a message of competition amongst ourselves and on the world stage the one message of competition that we *AREN’T* being fed is “why can’t we be more like Denmark and Finland with their rates of economic equality and reported rates of happiness? We should be better than them!” Nobody wants to hear or propagate that message and it’s not hard to figure out why. We are content merely with not being the worst in Europe, not merely the worst when you are comparing yourselves with the likes of Poland and Romania is quite frankly pathetic though. Excellent post 365,I have spent 40 years contributing financially to Shelter after I once tripped over a rough sleeper when I was walking to work in Baldwin St.in the early 80s,I do not post this for applause/thanks but for two reasons. - that one interaction slapped me in the face and I became aware of something I knew nothing about - even when like most people I have had difficult personal and financial issues and I have had to make difficult choices I maintained my commitment to Shelter as I knew there were folk much worse of than me. I say this to your point that it doesn't take much to make a difference and millions of small steps can make giant strides,I just wish we had leaders who can galvanise and inspire us to be better than we currently are rather than divide and rule |
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yattongas
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Post by yattongas on Dec 21, 2020 13:11:45 GMT
Exactly, Oldie mentions the economic model and I’m sure most of they were honest would agree that there is an issue where a country with our economic output needs funding from UNICEF to help feed kids or an Indian charity setting up in Britain to help feed kids. As I joked previously we are on the cusp of Ethiopia doing a Live Aid single for us because we can’t provide for our own because the wealth is trickling down less and less. But where we all differ is who has the appetite to do anything about it and sadly our governmental apparatus is still too steeped in the old ways for any serious change to take place. Then you have those lower down the social orders, as you say, the middle class who are disincentivised from supporting BLM and the like and parties who want social change because they don’t want to fall victim to it and yet they are stereotyped as being very socially conscious champagne socialists who all claim to be working class. You are spot on that we do not have the maturity, altruism or open mindedness needed to have that conversation. We are great at virtue signalling yet no-one is prepared to pay more tax to actually effect change. It comes back to printing T-shirts again. We take the knee and talk all day but no-one is prepared to actually *pay* to make things better. Add in to that, as Grover mentioned previously, that we have, for a long while, been fed a message that our neighbour is our enemy and is after what we have rather than a potential collaborator and we have a very individualistic, materialistic society and that only further compounds our inability to work together to solve the problem of declining living standards. As oldie so aptly puts it, economic apartheid. Lastly the think some people bury their head in the sand on this issue and still think we live in a world where factory work brings its own rewards. It doesn’t, as you highlighted with the reference to the pay fruit labouring generates. If it was simply about hard work then there are many cleaners in this country who could buy and sell the rest of us in a heartbeat. But as hard as they all work they are potless because our economy has moved on and to even achieve a reasonable standard of living you need solid education and a stable background and also a fair slice of luck in your associates who can give you a leg up. I read somewhere recently that most people find new employment through existing contacts rather than randomly applying for jobs off websites. A small fact that indicates the size of the problem for the cleaners trying to get ahead in life and convert their hard work into opportunity. We need to strive for much much better as a country and it makes me sad that while we are fed a message of competition amongst ourselves and on the world stage the one message of competition that we *AREN’T* being fed is “why can’t we be more like Denmark and Finland with their rates of economic equality and reported rates of happiness? We should be better than them!” Nobody wants to hear or propagate that message and it’s not hard to figure out why. We are content merely with not being the worst in Europe, not merely the worst when you are comparing yourselves with the likes of Poland and Romania is quite frankly pathetic though. The UNICEF nonsense was nothing more than political posturing. A shameless stunt. JRM wiped the floor with them in the H of C. Where does UNICEF get a huge proportion of its funding? Oh yes, Great Britain. How much did they donate? 25k. Oh wow, that should make every problem go away! You do talk some utter rubbish at times. The worrying thing is you get taken in by this crap. Now, I've got a distant relative in Nigerea who is a prince. He has a huge stash of money he needs to move out of his country. If you could just supply him with your bank details he will reward you with 10% of every million he shifts. Heres his email address: ropeadope@conmail.com There are now more food banks than McDonald’s in the uk . Something to be really proud of I think . 🇬🇧 |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2020 13:12:37 GMT
Exactly, Oldie mentions the economic model and I’m sure most of they were honest would agree that there is an issue where a country with our economic output needs funding from UNICEF to help feed kids or an Indian charity setting up in Britain to help feed kids. As I joked previously we are on the cusp of Ethiopia doing a Live Aid single for us because we can’t provide for our own because the wealth is trickling down less and less. But where we all differ is who has the appetite to do anything about it and sadly our governmental apparatus is still too steeped in the old ways for any serious change to take place. Then you have those lower down the social orders, as you say, the middle class who are disincentivised from supporting BLM and the like and parties who want social change because they don’t want to fall victim to it and yet they are stereotyped as being very socially conscious champagne socialists who all claim to be working class. You are spot on that we do not have the maturity, altruism or open mindedness needed to have that conversation. We are great at virtue signalling yet no-one is prepared to pay more tax to actually effect change. It comes back to printing T-shirts again. We take the knee and talk all day but no-one is prepared to actually *pay* to make things better. Add in to that, as Grover mentioned previously, that we have, for a long while, been fed a message that our neighbour is our enemy and is after what we have rather than a potential collaborator and we have a very individualistic, materialistic society and that only further compounds our inability to work together to solve the problem of declining living standards. As oldie so aptly puts it, economic apartheid. Lastly the think some people bury their head in the sand on this issue and still think we live in a world where factory work brings its own rewards. It doesn’t, as you highlighted with the reference to the pay fruit labouring generates. If it was simply about hard work then there are many cleaners in this country who could buy and sell the rest of us in a heartbeat. But as hard as they all work they are potless because our economy has moved on and to even achieve a reasonable standard of living you need solid education and a stable background and also a fair slice of luck in your associates who can give you a leg up. I read somewhere recently that most people find new employment through existing contacts rather than randomly applying for jobs off websites. A small fact that indicates the size of the problem for the cleaners trying to get ahead in life and convert their hard work into opportunity. We need to strive for much much better as a country and it makes me sad that while we are fed a message of competition amongst ourselves and on the world stage the one message of competition that we *AREN’T* being fed is “why can’t we be more like Denmark and Finland with their rates of economic equality and reported rates of happiness? We should be better than them!” Nobody wants to hear or propagate that message and it’s not hard to figure out why. We are content merely with not being the worst in Europe, not merely the worst when you are comparing yourselves with the likes of Poland and Romania is quite frankly pathetic though. The UNICEF nonsense was nothing more than political posturing. A shameless stunt. JRM wiped the floor with them in the H of C. Where does UNICEF get a huge proportion of its funding? Oh yes, Great Britain. How much did they donate? 25k. Oh wow, that should make every problem go away! You do talk some utter rubbish at times. The worrying thing is you get taken in by this crap. Now, I've got a distant relative in Nigerea who is a prince. He has a huge stash of money he needs to move out of his country. If you could just supply him with your bank details he will reward you with 10% of every million he shifts. Heres his email address: ropeadope@conmail.com Au contraire- the 25k you quote was just for Cornwall, you’re the one who has been taken in. They are providing 700k U.K. wide. If you’re so proud of Britain you should be ashamed that we even need a single penny of UNICEF aid for our kids. The mere concept should be abhorrent but sadly people have no pride and so accept concepts like food banks and countries we like to think we dragged up from the dirt now turning to us and helping us feed our kids because we are so venal as a society we don’t want to do it ourselves. And as if Jacob Rees Mogg is going to tell us the truth about child poverty - does he look like a man who has ever missed a meal in his life? It’s like the fox telling us the hen house is secure and he should know because he’s fitted the locks himself. |
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yattongas
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Post by yattongas on Dec 21, 2020 13:19:13 GMT
The UNICEF nonsense was nothing more than political posturing. A shameless stunt. JRM wiped the floor with them in the H of C. Where does UNICEF get a huge proportion of its funding? Oh yes, Great Britain. How much did they donate? 25k. Oh wow, that should make every problem go away! You do talk some utter rubbish at times. The worrying thing is you get taken in by this crap. Now, I've got a distant relative in Nigerea who is a prince. He has a huge stash of money he needs to move out of his country. If you could just supply him with your bank details he will reward you with 10% of every million he shifts. Heres his email address: ropeadope@conmail.com Au contraire- the 25k you quote was just for Cornwall, you’re the one who has been taken in. They are providing 700k U.K. wide. If you’re so proud of Britain you should be ashamed that we even need a single penny of UNICEF aid for our kids. The mere concept should be abhorrent but sadly people have no pride and so accept concepts like food banks and countries we like to think we dragged up from the dirt now turning to us and helping us feed our kids because we are so venal as a society we don’t want to do it ourselves. And as if Jacob Rees Mogg is going to tell us the truth about child poverty - does he look like a man who has ever missed a meal in his life? It’s like the fox telling us the hen house is secure and he should know because he’s fitted the locks himself. Rees Mogg is a bag of bones ! 😂 |
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Post by peterparker on Dec 21, 2020 13:25:59 GMT
The UNICEF nonsense was nothing more than political posturing. A shameless stunt. JRM wiped the floor with them in the H of C. Where does UNICEF get a huge proportion of its funding? Oh yes, Great Britain. How much did they donate? 25k. Oh wow, that should make every problem go away! You do talk some utter rubbish at times. The worrying thing is you get taken in by this crap. Now, I've got a distant relative in Nigerea who is a prince. He has a huge stash of money he needs to move out of his country. If you could just supply him with your bank details he will reward you with 10% of every million he shifts. Heres his email address: ropeadope@conmail.com Au contraire- the 25k you quote was just for Cornwall, you’re the one who has been taken in. They are providing 700k U.K. wide. If you’re so proud of Britain you should be ashamed that we even need a single penny of UNICEF aid for our kids. The mere concept should be abhorrent but sadly people have no pride and so accept concepts like food banks and countries we like to think we dragged up from the dirt now turning to us and helping us feed our kids because we are so venal as a society we don’t want to do it ourselves. And as if Jacob Rees Mogg is going to tell us the truth about child poverty - does he look like a man who has ever missed a meal in his life? It’s like the fox telling us the hen house is secure and he should know because he’s fitted the locks himself. Even if Unicef was a political stunt. it's not like Marcus Rashford hasn't embarrassed the Government twice on feeding hungry kids. So for Rees-Mogg to come out and say what he said, given the position the Tories took and voted on feeding kids is a bit f**king rich |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2020 14:40:06 GMT
Au contraire- the 25k you quote was just for Cornwall, you’re the one who has been taken in. They are providing 700k U.K. wide. If you’re so proud of Britain you should be ashamed that we even need a single penny of UNICEF aid for our kids. The mere concept should be abhorrent but sadly people have no pride and so accept concepts like food banks and countries we like to think we dragged up from the dirt now turning to us and helping us feed our kids because we are so venal as a society we don’t want to do it ourselves. And as if Jacob Rees Mogg is going to tell us the truth about child poverty - does he look like a man who has ever missed a meal in his life? It’s like the fox telling us the hen house is secure and he should know because he’s fitted the locks himself. Even if Unicef was a political stunt. it's not like Marcus Rashford hasn't embarrassed the Government twice on feeding hungry kids. So for Rees-Mogg to come out and say what he said, given the position the Tories took and voted on feeding kids is a bit f**king rich The fact we are even bickering over feeding kids at all tells you the state we are in. You would think people would put ideology aside and we’d all agree that Britain needs to tackle basic issues with regards to the cost of living for people on low wages. But still oldgas is objectionable, pointing to Rees-Mogg of all people. This is exactly why Britain is so badly f**ked because the people who vote Tory refuse to give any sort of ground on the issue of how expensive it is to live in this country when wages are subsidised by the state to keep them artificially low to benefit big corporations, thus the wealth fails to trickle down. Hey, the wealth trickling down wouldn’t be so bad in and of itself if key prices weren’t consequently inflating. So you have a static minimum wage topped up by static benefits while the cost of basic items continues to increase, never mind the cost of housing. We spend an eye watering 12 billion pounds a year on housing benefit to private landlords. 12 billion. Let that sink in for a moment. All because wages do not even attempt to keep up with the cost of housing (thanks to Blair’s minimum wage which the Tories were only too keen to continue with) so the tax payer then pays Tory landlords to house people. Why isn’t oldgas angry about that waste of public funds? Just imagine also if we had saved that 12 billion for 10 years and used it to build social housing. It would be paying for itself in the money saved from the housing benefit bill....but oh no, that would under cut the housing market and we can’t be having that can we... |
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Post by oldgas on Dec 21, 2020 17:47:56 GMT
The UNICEF nonsense was nothing more than political posturing. A shameless stunt. JRM wiped the floor with them in the H of C. Where does UNICEF get a huge proportion of its funding? Oh yes, Great Britain. How much did they donate? 25k. Oh wow, that should make every problem go away! You do talk some utter rubbish at times. The worrying thing is you get taken in by this crap. Now, I've got a distant relative in Nigerea who is a prince. He has a huge stash of money he needs to move out of his country. If you could just supply him with your bank details he will reward you with 10% of every million he shifts. Heres his email address: ropeadope@conmail.com Au contraire- the 25k you quote was just for Cornwall, you’re the one who has been taken in. They are providing 700k U.K. wide. If you’re so proud of Britain you should be ashamed that we even need a single penny of UNICEF aid for our kids. The mere concept should be abhorrent but sadly people have no pride and so accept concepts like food banks and countries we like to think we dragged up from the dirt now turning to us and helping us feed our kids because we are so venal as a society we don’t want to do it ourselves. And as if Jacob Rees Mogg is going to tell us the truth about child poverty - does he look like a man who has ever missed a meal in his life? It’s like the fox telling us the hen house is secure and he should know because he’s fitted the locks himself. Can you provide your source for this £700k donation please. |
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yattongas
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Post by yattongas on Dec 21, 2020 17:53:34 GMT
Au contraire- the 25k you quote was just for Cornwall, you’re the one who has been taken in. They are providing 700k U.K. wide. If you’re so proud of Britain you should be ashamed that we even need a single penny of UNICEF aid for our kids. The mere concept should be abhorrent but sadly people have no pride and so accept concepts like food banks and countries we like to think we dragged up from the dirt now turning to us and helping us feed our kids because we are so venal as a society we don’t want to do it ourselves. And as if Jacob Rees Mogg is going to tell us the truth about child poverty - does he look like a man who has ever missed a meal in his life? It’s like the fox telling us the hen house is secure and he should know because he’s fitted the locks himself. Can you provide your source for this £700k donation please. UNICEF UK STATEMENT ON FUNDING OF UK FOOD PROGRAMMES In response to comments made in the Commons about Unicef UK’s funding of UK food programmes today, Anna Kettley, Unicef UK’s Director of Programmes and Advocacy, said: “Unicef UK is responding to this unprecedented crisis and building on our 25 years’ experience of working on children’s rights in the UK with a one-off domestic response, launched in August, to provide support to vulnerable children and families around the country during this crisis period. In partnership with Sustain, the food and farming alliance, over £700k of Unicef UK funds is being granted to community groups around the country to support their vital work helping children and families at risk of food insecurity during the coronavirus pandemic. Unicef will continue to spend our international funding helping the world’s poorest children. We believe that every child is important and deserves to survive and thrive no matter where they are born.” ENDSl Took me all of 30 secs 😮 |
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Post by oldgas on Dec 21, 2020 18:52:33 GMT
Ministers etc were defending a position under certain circumstances. Those circumstances changed dramatically when the new strain was identified. What were they supposed to do? Stick to their guns, overwhelm the NHS and see thousands extra die? If 'by some preferring to follow a different path,' I assume you mean Starmer. So, let's imagine he's been to A&E to have the fence splinters removed from his arse, what would his solution be? In fact, has he ever set out an alternative plan with reasons and explanations? Its very easy in opposition to sit on the fence and criticise. Labour are very good at that. They've had a lot of practice. He would have done the same but on Wednesday, when Johnson was telling him he was a doom merchant for suggesting it. He SAID he would do it. One thing saying, another thing entirely doing. Has he ever said he’d do anything about Saville when he was DPP? |
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Post by Officer Barbrady on Dec 21, 2020 19:08:39 GMT
He would have done the same but on Wednesday, when Johnson was telling him he was a doom merchant for suggesting it. He SAID he would do it. One thing saying, another thing entirely doing. Has he ever said he’d do anything about Saville when he was DPP? Sorry, what dimension were you visiting where Starmer was PM on Wednesday? As for the Saville comment, I mean drag yourself out of the gutter won't you. Cheap point scoring for that?? Sicko |
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Post by oldgas on Dec 21, 2020 19:09:27 GMT
Can you provide your source for this £700k donation please. UNICEF UK STATEMENT ON FUNDING OF UK FOOD PROGRAMMES In response to comments made in the Commons about Unicef UK’s funding of UK food programmes today, Anna Kettley, Unicef UK’s Director of Programmes and Advocacy, said: “Unicef UK is responding to this unprecedented crisis and building on our 25 years’ experience of working on children’s rights in the UK with a one-off domestic response, launched in August, to provide support to vulnerable children and families around the country during this crisis period. In partnership with Sustain, the food and farming alliance, over £700k of Unicef UK funds is being granted to community groups around the country to support their vital work helping children and families at risk of food insecurity during the coronavirus pandemic. Unicef will continue to spend our international funding helping the world’s poorest children. We believe that every child is important and deserves to survive and thrive no matter where they are born.” ENDSl Took me all of 30 secs 😮 Hmmm. The Guardian, 4 days ago, had this to say on the matter......https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/16/unicef-feed-hungry-children-uk-first-time-history It’s not like The Guardian to miss an opportunity to bash a Tory government, especially over something as emotive as child poverty. I would have thought the editor would have been standing on the office rooftop shouting his mouth off about this £700k. Which, in context is a paltry amount and stinks of political posturing. Never mind, that bastion of truth, the BBC can be relied on to give an accurate report, but no, they only mention £25k as well. |
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Post by oldgas on Dec 21, 2020 19:12:47 GMT
He SAID he would do it. One thing saying, another thing entirely doing. Has he ever said he’d do anything about Saville when he was DPP? Sorry, what dimension were you visiting where Starmer was PM on Wednesday? As for the Saville comment, I mean drag yourself out of the gutter won't you. Cheap point scoring for that?? Sicko Stuart and I were discussing the differences in decision making whilst in government versus the ease with which opposition parties, without having to take responsibility, can make all sorts of suggestions. Why are you being so ontuse? |
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Post by Officer Barbrady on Dec 21, 2020 19:16:52 GMT
Sorry, what dimension were you visiting where Starmer was PM on Wednesday? As for the Saville comment, I mean drag yourself out of the gutter won't you. Cheap point scoring for that?? Sicko Stuart and I were discussing the differences in decision making whilst in government versus the ease with which opposition parties, without having to take responsibility, can make all sorts of suggestions. Why are you being so ontuse? So you critique Starmer and when you find out he did suggest the action on Wednesday you ask why he didn't enforce it and then for some bizarre reason pull Saville out of your psyche and on to the table. When reminded that Starmer isn't PM and cant enforce any of this, you have no answer. You been on the port or something? |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2020 19:26:48 GMT
Sorry, what dimension were you visiting where Starmer was PM on Wednesday? As for the Saville comment, I mean drag yourself out of the gutter won't you. Cheap point scoring for that?? Sicko Stuart and I were discussing the differences in decision making whilst in government versus the ease with which opposition parties, without having to take responsibility, can make all sorts of suggestions. Why are you being so ontuse? Well yes, it’s identical to the way in which certain posters in this section of the board say with some authority “Well Corbyn would have been worse” thus transferring responsibility from an actual government to an imaginary one with ease. |
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