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Post by gasify on Apr 22, 2024 14:12:29 GMT
Sadly many people laughed with Alf Garnett, not at him as the show intended. It appeared to be scripted to make him look the racist fool, however it did not work and many saw him as their racist hero. It failed and he is still lauded today by some as some sort of funny idol. 🤦🏾♀️ More of an Alan Partridge man myself. "AHA!" |
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Post by eric on Apr 22, 2024 14:27:39 GMT
Thanks, g but respectfully disagree... because the thrust of what I'm inferring from your post is: It's ok as it's under a comedic banner. Unfortunately cancel culture negates this. This world generally views abuse abuse, no matter what sentiment behind it. The thrust of what I was saying is how it makes that person feel. If that person finds it funny, it's Bants. If the person doesn't then it's bullying. What about those who are not personally offended (by a whole variety of things) but feel compelled to be offended on other peoples behalf because it makes them feel so good about themselves . Where do they fit in? There are a lot of those about these days 😀!! |
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Post by oldie on Apr 22, 2024 14:41:13 GMT
Here we go.
In jump those that hate those that are offended
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Post by oldie on Apr 22, 2024 14:45:54 GMT
Sadly many people laughed with Alf Garnett, not at him as the show intended. It appeared to be scripted to make him look the racist fool, however it did not work and many saw him as their racist hero. It failed and he is still lauded today by some as some sort of funny idol. 🤦🏾♀️ I disagree It very much did work, but what people laughed at was very much generational. My grandfather was born in 1887 and laughed with the character not at him. My own father, a racist dickhead (born 1930) also with, not at. A lot of us laughed at. And argued with the National Front in the 1970s |
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Post by eric on Apr 22, 2024 14:48:11 GMT
Here we go. In jump those that hate those that are offended Nope - sorry to disappoint your personal prejudices and preconceptions of people but I welcome initiatives to support those affected and genuinely offended in all walks of life - can’t stand those who claim to be offended on behalf of other people because it makes them feel superior and trendy. |
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Post by gasify on Apr 22, 2024 14:50:35 GMT
Here we go. In jump those that hate those that are offended Nope - sorry to disappoint your personal prejudices and preconceptions of people but I welcome initiatives to support those affected and genuinely offended in all walks of life - can’t stand those who claim to be offended on behalf of other people because it makes them feel superior and trendy. You gonna have to give an example as I have no idea what you are talking about. |
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Apr 22, 2024 14:59:10 GMT
What if many found Love Thy Neighbour as 'funny'? It ran for many series. Or, Alf Garnett character....? Is that Bantz!? Nope... because racial abuse is a protected abuse. Fat abuse amongst others isn't, but both can be funny and abusive. Can you see the point I'm making?No, not really. The point I was making is that is Akinfenwe thought it was funny, that is OK. If Akinfenwe thought it was out of order then that is not OK. It is about the person receiving the comment. If they voluntary believe is to be funny, then that's fine. If they are unhappy about the comment, then that is not fine. If a gay person used a gay slur to one of their friends, that is OK. If a heterosexual used that same word, it's not OK. Tim Minchin explains this very well: But it's not just about akinfenwa himself on his own is it? Many others in and around the stadium might have seen and heard it as a form of abuse, as well as, or opposed to comedy value: much like AG or LTN back in the day and taken huge offence. But where do you go if you take that form of abuse in public but it's not recognised as racist homophobic sexist misogynistic anti Semitic islamaphobic (curiously , not Christian phobic though?)? Like my original post alludes, some forms of abuse appear to be protected, others don't because it's funny or just not taken seriously. |
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Post by Midsomer Murderer on Apr 22, 2024 14:59:54 GMT
The thrust of what I was saying is how it makes that person feel. If that person finds it funny, it's Bants. If the person doesn't then it's bullying. What about those who are not personally offended (by a whole variety of things) but feel compelled to be offended on other peoples behalf because it makes them feel so good about themselves . Where do they fit in? There are a lot of those about these days 😀!! They can go do one - Snowflake wokes |
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Post by gasify on Apr 22, 2024 15:04:14 GMT
No, not really. The point I was making is that is Akinfenwe thought it was funny, that is OK. If Akinfenwe thought it was out of order then that is not OK. It is about the person receiving the comment. If they voluntary believe is to be funny, then that's fine. If they are unhappy about the comment, then that is not fine. If a gay person used a gay slur to one of their friends, that is OK. If a heterosexual used that same word, it's not OK. Tim Minchin explains this very well: Many others in and around the stadium might have seen and heard it as a form of abuse, as well as, or opposed to comedy value: much like AG or LTN back in the day and taken huge offence. But where do you go if you take that form of abuse in public but it's not recognised as racist homophobic sexist misogynistic anti Semitic islamaphobic (curiously , not Christian phobic though?)? Like my original post alludes, some forms of abuse appear to be protected, others don't because it's funny or just not taken seriously. As mentioned in an earlier post. I think your sentiment is correct, your examples aren't examples that work. Drop the Akinfenwa and use "Who ate all the pies". Then, yes you can continue with your approach. That particular chant make people feel uncomfortable if they are of a certain body type. We shouldn't have any fans that feel uncomfortable. I think essentially, we are in agreement. |
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Apr 22, 2024 15:04:21 GMT
Also on the subject of abusing refs, have you noticed the song 'you bald bar steward' has receded (see what I done there?) from our song vocabulary now our ageing fanbase rings one out from the Thatch End!?
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Apr 22, 2024 15:06:38 GMT
But it's not just about akinfenwa himself on his own is it?Many others in and around the stadium might have seen and heard it as a form of abuse, as well as, or opposed to comedy value: much like AG or LTN back in the day and taken huge offence. But where do you go if you take that form of abuse in public but it's not recognised as racist homophobic sexist misogynistic anti Semitic islamaphobic (curiously , not Christian phobic though?)? Like my original post alludes, some forms of abuse appear to be protected, others don't because it's funny or just not taken seriously. As mentioned in an earlier post. I think your sentiment is correct, your examples aren't examples that work. Drop the Akinfenwa and use "Who ate all the pies". Then, yes you can continue with your approach. That particular chant make people feel uncomfortable if they are of a certain body type. We shouldn't have any fans that feel uncomfortable. I think essentially, we are in agreement. Gasify... they're the same type of songs just one is more satirically witty than the other. Nice to come from different angles and agree though. You don't see that too often here. |
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Post by Midsomer Murderer on Apr 22, 2024 15:07:52 GMT
Sadly many people laughed with Alf Garnett, not at him as the show intended. It appeared to be scripted to make him look the racist fool, however it did not work and many saw him as their racist hero. It failed and he is still lauded today by some as some sort of funny idol. 🤦🏾♀️ I disagree It very much did work, but what people laughed at was very much generational. My grandfather was born in 1887 and laughed with the character not at him. My own father, a racist dickhead (born 1930) also with, not at. A lot of us laughed at. And argued with the National Front in the 1970s I think you are being a twat - People are entititled to their own views. You and I were not arounfdi in the 30's so have no idea of the feelings at that time. It is better to try and undersatand why people thing as they do rather than act supperior with your own comfertablke life feelings. And before you get all Woke on me - I'm 58, half Polish with grandparents that died in Camps in WW2 so obiviuley not racist - You should have had a chat with your Dad and understood why rather than acting so rightous |
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Post by yategasman on Apr 22, 2024 15:10:58 GMT
I wonder if Matty Taylor’s wife and children were at the match on the 13th 🤔
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Post by gasify on Apr 22, 2024 15:14:11 GMT
I disagree It very much did work, but what people laughed at was very much generational. My grandfather was born in 1887 and laughed with the character not at him. My own father, a racist dickhead (born 1930) also with, not at. A lot of us laughed at. And argued with the National Front in the 1970s I think you are being a twat - People are entititled to their own views. You and I were not arounfdi in the 30's so have no idea of the feelings at that time. It is better to try and undersatand why people thing as they do rather than act supperior with your own comfertablke life feelings. And before you get all Woke on me - I'm 58, half Polish with grandparents that died in Camps in WW2 so obiviuley not racist - You should have had a chat with your Dad and understood why rather than acting so rightous Does understanding a racist stop them from being a racist? Never known a racist to ever say, "you know what, you right. I'm being a racist here". |
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Post by yattongas on Apr 22, 2024 15:20:30 GMT
I disagree It very much did work, but what people laughed at was very much generational. My grandfather was born in 1887 and laughed with the character not at him. My own father, a racist dickhead (born 1930) also with, not at. A lot of us laughed at. And argued with the National Front in the 1970s I think you are being a twat - People are entititled to their own views. You and I were not arounfdi in the 30's so have no idea of the feelings at that time. It is better to try and undersatand why people thing as they do rather than act supperior with your own comfertablke life feelings. And before you get all Woke on me - I'm 58, half Polish with grandparents that died in Camps in WW2 so obiviuley not racist - You should have had a chat with your Dad and understood why rather than acting so rightous You what ? |
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Post by aghast on Apr 22, 2024 16:07:44 GMT
I disagree It very much did work, but what people laughed at was very much generational. My grandfather was born in 1887 and laughed with the character not at him. My own father, a racist dickhead (born 1930) also with, not at. A lot of us laughed at. And argued with the National Front in the 1970s I think you are being a twat - People are entititled to their own views. You and I were not arounfdi in the 30's so have no idea of the feelings at that time. It is better to try and undersatand why people thing as they do rather than act supperior with your own comfertablke life feelings. And before you get all Woke on me - I'm 58, half Polish with grandparents that died in Camps in WW2 so obiviuley not racist - You should have had a chat with your Dad and understood why rather than acting so rightous Makes me chortle when people say "I'm obviously not a racist because my brother's wife is Indian/my grandfather was half Chinese/I met my wife in a bar in Bangkok". As if that proves anything..... |
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Post by Midsomer Murderer on Apr 22, 2024 16:13:40 GMT
I think you are being a twat - People are entititled to their own views. You and I were not arounfdi in the 30's so have no idea of the feelings at that time. It is better to try and undersatand why people thing as they do rather than act supperior with your own comfertablke life feelings. And before you get all Woke on me - I'm 58, half Polish with grandparents that died in Camps in WW2 so obiviuley not racist - You should have had a chat with your Dad and understood why rather than acting so rightous Makes me chortle when people say "I'm obviously not a racist because my brother's wife is Indian/my grandfather was half Chinese/I met my wife in a bar in Bangkok". As if that proves anything..... Chhortle away old son - I said that because, in this day and age, one hads to express their feelings when making a point. As for me ? well, my Grandmother was murdered in Dachau and my father forced into the German Army - And I could go on but you really dont derserve any explanation from me - Whoever you are. The point I am making, now try to keep up, is that people, form different times, and experiences, will have formed opions based on their own lives - If that is difficult to understand then I am more than happy to meet you in person and explain |
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Post by Midsomer Murderer on Apr 22, 2024 16:14:26 GMT
I think you are being a twat - People are entititled to their own views. You and I were not arounfdi in the 30's so have no idea of the feelings at that time. It is better to try and undersatand why people thing as they do rather than act supperior with your own comfertablke life feelings. And before you get all Woke on me - I'm 58, half Polish with grandparents that died in Camps in WW2 so obiviuley not racist - You should have had a chat with your Dad and understood why rather than acting so rightous You what ? Hmmm - Nothing to answer here |
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Post by Midsomer Murderer on Apr 22, 2024 16:15:48 GMT
I think you are being a twat - People are entititled to their own views. You and I were not arounfdi in the 30's so have no idea of the feelings at that time. It is better to try and undersatand why people thing as they do rather than act supperior with your own comfertablke life feelings. And before you get all Woke on me - I'm 58, half Polish with grandparents that died in Camps in WW2 so obiviuley not racist - You should have had a chat with your Dad and understood why rather than acting so rightous Does understanding a racist stop them from being a racist? Never known a racist to ever say, "you know what, you right. I'm being a racist here". You cant stop anyone nor should you want to - The point is undrstanding why - Until then, there is not argument to be made just two people experessing opposing views |
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Post by gasify on Apr 22, 2024 16:41:46 GMT
Does understanding a racist stop them from being a racist? Never known a racist to ever say, "you know what, you right. I'm being a racist here". - The point is undrstanding why - Until then, there is not argument to be made just two people experessing opposing views I want to stop people being racist and homophobic. |
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