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Post by tylerdunnell03 on Jul 8, 2019 12:24:11 GMT
Also...we signed Adam Smith! He wasn't exactly the perfect role model for a family oriented club Can’t forget montano, he was convicted of rape in Colombia wasn’t he?
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Post by pucklegas on Jul 8, 2019 12:32:10 GMT
Saw a great hour long interview with Nile Ranger a couple of months ago. Seemed a lot more relatable than I'd have thought. He's clearly got ability but is so inconsistent. I think he revealed Holloway was a massive fan of him. Evans was found innocent so I don't know what else there is to say. Even if Ranger wasn't he's not good enough consistently. Nile Ranger has scored 20 goals from 54 starts at this level. Tin hat on think he could do a job for us needed to grow up probably has now I would trial him.
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Marshy
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Post by Marshy on Jul 8, 2019 12:34:42 GMT
Nile Ranger has scored 20 goals from 54 starts at this level. Tin hat on think he could do a job for us needed to grow up probably has now I would trial him. He’s already wasted enough tax payers money with trials. It’s a no from me I’m afraid.
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Post by spiess1 on Jul 8, 2019 12:38:51 GMT
Also...we signed Adam Smith! He wasn't exactly the perfect role model for a family oriented club Can’t forget montano, he was convicted of rape in Colombia wasn’t he? In December 2013, Montaño and two friends were charged with the rape of a woman in Romford, London. He appeared in court in March 2014, and admitted to having sex with the woman but maintained it was entirely consensual. No verdict was returned by the jury and the case was dropped by the prosecution. (Wiki)
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Post by Dirt Dogg on Jul 8, 2019 13:17:30 GMT
Also...we signed Adam Smith! He wasn't exactly the perfect role model for a family oriented club Can’t forget montano, he was convicted of rape in Colombia wasn’t he? Wasn’t he involved in some form of match fixing? Can’t remember it being rape
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Post by eastgas on Jul 8, 2019 13:26:00 GMT
Nile Ranger has scored 20 goals from 54 starts at this level. Tin hat on think he could do a job for us needed to grow up probably has now I would trial him. If the contract we give him protected the club against any future issues that may arise with him, I would have him here in a heartbeat. I seen the same interview and it seemed the penny may have finally dropped with him
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Post by cj on Jul 8, 2019 13:55:10 GMT
Ched Evans raped someone. He got an overturned ruling in a very strange case within which most of the evidence they had against this 19 year old woman would have been inadmissable in most courtrooms. His legal team was very very expensive and very skilled at finding technicalities to get his conviction overturned. There is actual concrete CCTV showing her completely out of it, he should have known. We should not be saying ‘it’s her fault for being drunk, ched has served his time as he’s a good footballer’. We should be holding footballers and men in general responsible as role models and say ‘Don’t rape women, and don’t take advantage of very drunk people who are vulnerable.’ If we signed Ched Evans i’d be very very upset at the club. We are a community based club and that signing would damage our reputation in the footballing world and the local community. There was NO actual CCTV showing her "out of it". That is complete BS.
Instead there was actual CCTV footage...
1) Showing her pay for a pizza takeaway with cash which included coinage - showing she was able to count her money, If she was "out of it", she wouldn't have been able to do that. 2) Showing her able to get in and out of a car unaided and walk into a hotel unaided while wearing high heels, which according to my wife, is not easy to do when "out of it". Oh and while holding a pizza box in one hand too.
These are actual facts.
Also think about this. If she was "out of it" then how was she able to consent to Clayton McDonald, who she had sex with just before Ched Evans got in on the act? You can't be sober enough to consent to have sex with one person then immediately claim to be "out of it" to be able to consent to the next person.
Now the only thing Ched is guilty of was cheating on his missus and she not only forgave him for that but supported him through his trial and dedicated herself to prove his innocence.
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Post by lpgas on Jul 8, 2019 14:12:52 GMT
Ched Evans raped someone. He got an overturned ruling in a very strange case within which most of the evidence they had against this 19 year old woman would have been inadmissable in most courtrooms. His legal team was very very expensive and very skilled at finding technicalities to get his conviction overturned. There is actual concrete CCTV showing her completely out of it, he should have known. We should not be saying ‘it’s her fault for being drunk, ched has served his time as he’s a good footballer’. We should be holding footballers and men in general responsible as role models and say ‘Don’t rape women, and don’t take advantage of very drunk people who are vulnerable.’ If we signed Ched Evans i’d be very very upset at the club. We are a community based club and that signing would damage our reputation in the footballing world and the local community. There was NO actual CCTV showing her "out of it". That is complete BS.
Instead there was actual CCTV footage...
1) Showing her pay for a pizza takeaway with cash which included coinage - showing she was able to count her money, If she was "out of it", she wouldn't have been able to do that. 2) Showing her able to get in and out of a car unaided and walk into a hotel unaided while wearing high heels, which according to my wife, is not easy to do when "out of it". Oh and while holding a pizza box in one hand too.
These are actual facts.
Also think about this. If she was "out of it" then how was she able to consent to Clayton McDonald, who she had sex with just before Ched Evans got in on the act? You can't be sober enough to consent to have sex with one person then immediately claim to be "out of it" to be able to consent to the next person.
Now the only thing Ched is guilty of was cheating on his missus and she not only forgave him for that but supported him through his trial and dedicated herself to prove his innocence.
Innocent unless proven guilty except on football forums. You are correct she was not out of it and that is why he was found not guilty. She even agreed to go to the hotel with McDonald from the Kebab shop. Me thinks the following morning she thought she could make some cash and when they said no then she went to the police.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 14:15:42 GMT
I wonder how many others have had sex whilst drunk and with a drunk woman ? Another example of trial by the mob. People really should read up on the case and then comment. Having read the transcripts that are available, he was very badly judged in the first case. Sadly, he will be tarnished for life now, regardless of the eventual overturn of verdict The media reporting at the time was an absolute disgrace. It was so clearly a poor verdict and normally even a sniff of injustice sees the media all over it - even if it's a technicality getting a terrorist or murderer off the hook. Becuse it was a footballer and a frenzy existed at the time about a desire to increase rape convictions nobody was willing to break from the PC masses and question the outcome. I remember at the time thinking something odd had gone on and it was very difficult to find any reporting of facts, everything was skewed to portray the nasty rapist rich footballer. The facts of the case including transcripts had to be made public on a website set up by Evans' supporters - even though it was purely facts as available to the courts public gallery there was a big effort to stop it being available. All three parties involved behaved in a morally deplorable manner but no crime was committed. One out of the three lost several years of freedom which remains an absolute scandal
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 14:23:37 GMT
There was NO actual CCTV showing her "out of it". That is complete BS.
Instead there was actual CCTV footage...
1) Showing her pay for a pizza takeaway with cash which included coinage - showing she was able to count her money, If she was "out of it", she wouldn't have been able to do that. 2) Showing her able to get in and out of a car unaided and walk into a hotel unaided while wearing high heels, which according to my wife, is not easy to do when "out of it". Oh and while holding a pizza box in one hand too.
These are actual facts.
Also think about this. If she was "out of it" then how was she able to consent to Clayton McDonald, who she had sex with just before Ched Evans got in on the act? You can't be sober enough to consent to have sex with one person then immediately claim to be "out of it" to be able to consent to the next person.
Now the only thing Ched is guilty of was cheating on his missus and she not only forgave him for that but supported him through his trial and dedicated herself to prove his innocence.
Innocent unless proven guilty except on football forums. You are correct she was not out of it and that is why he was found not guilty. She even agreed to go to the hotel with McDonald from the Kebab shop. Me thinks the following morning she thought she could make some cash and when they said no then she went to the police. From memory Evans admitted to sleeping with the girl when first spoken to by the police - he had nothing to hide as it was all consensual. If he had kept quiet nothing would have came of it as for some reason there was no DNA/forensics to link him to her. Your comment about cash is supported by her Facebook post where she joked with her friends about taking them on holiday when she gets her compo after the footballer case goes through! For some reason the police chose not to pursue Facebook for full access to their records, it would have weakened their case and I don't think they wanted truth to get in the way of a conviction.
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Post by oldgas on Jul 8, 2019 14:42:14 GMT
Ched Evans raped someone. He got an overturned ruling in a very strange case within which most of the evidence they had against this 19 year old woman would have been inadmissable in most courtrooms. His legal team was very very expensive and very skilled at finding technicalities to get his conviction overturned. There is actual concrete CCTV showing her completely out of it, he should have known. We should not be saying ‘it’s her fault for being drunk, ched has served his time as he’s a good footballer’. We should be holding footballers and men in general responsible as role models and say ‘Don’t rape women, and don’t take advantage of very drunk people who are vulnerable.’ If we signed Ched Evans i’d be very very upset at the club. We are a community based club and that signing would damage our reputation in the footballing world and the local community. 'Holier Than Thou' springs to mind here. Are you a Baptist Minister or something?
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Post by BelieveItWhenIAmSatInIt on Jul 8, 2019 14:51:06 GMT
Why / how has this descended into a thread about rape?
Any danger of getting this back on subject chaps?
Anyone heard anything more about this illusive striker we were so say in for??
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Post by oldgas on Jul 8, 2019 14:52:05 GMT
Innocent unless proven guilty except on football forums. You are correct she was not out of it and that is why he was found not guilty. She even agreed to go to the hotel with McDonald from the Kebab shop. Me thinks the following morning she thought she could make some cash and when they said no then she went to the police. From memory Evans admitted to sleeping with the girl when first spoken to by the police - he had nothing to hide as it was all consensual. If he had kept quiet nothing would have came of it as for some reason there was no DNA/forensics to link him to her. Your comment about cash is supported by her Facebook post where she joked with her friends about taking them on holiday when she gets her compo after the footballer case goes through! For some reason the police chose not to pursue Facebook for full access to their records, it would have weakened their case and I don't think they wanted truth to get in the way of a conviction. Your last sentence goes straight to he nub of this. Evans case was being heard at a time when the Police and CPS were under intense pressure to secure convictions for rape as a result of the feminist lobby jumping up and down, stamping their feet and demanding that every allegation result in a conviction. A professional footballer was a high-profile gift from the gods and one they were eager to pursue to a successful conclusion. Luckily for justice Ched Evans is made of stern stuff, faced the quisling authorities down and got the conviction overturned. Chd Evans May have not been a very pleasant or mature person on the night in question, but he wasn't a rapist. It's just a shame that people like Jessica Ennis and her sort can't be as quick to apologise as they were to accuse, but then again the Right-On brigade never consider themselves in the wrong. A bit like the Remoaners really.
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Post by RD on Jul 8, 2019 14:54:32 GMT
From memory Evans admitted to sleeping with the girl when first spoken to by the police - he had nothing to hide as it was all consensual. If he had kept quiet nothing would have came of it as for some reason there was no DNA/forensics to link him to her. Your comment about cash is supported by her Facebook post where she joked with her friends about taking them on holiday when she gets her compo after the footballer case goes through! For some reason the police chose not to pursue Facebook for full access to their records, it would have weakened their case and I don't think they wanted truth to get in the way of a conviction. Your last sentence goes straight to he nub of this. Evans case was being heard at a time when the Police and CPS were under intense pressure to secure convictions for rape as a result of the feminist lobby jumping up and down, stamping their feet and demanding that every allegation result in a conviction. A professional footballer was a high-profile gift from the gods and one they were eager to pursue to a successful conclusion. Luckily for justice Ched Evans is made of stern stuff, faced the quisling authorities down and got the conviction overturned. Chd Evans May have not been a very pleasant or mature person on the night in question, but he wasn't a rapist. It's just a shame that people like Jessica Ennis and her sort can't be as quick to apologise as they were to accuse, but then again the Right-On brigade never consider themselves in the wrong. A bit like the Remoaners really. Funny, I'd say it was more like the Brexiteers given the case was built on lies....
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Post by oldgas on Jul 8, 2019 15:17:33 GMT
Your last sentence goes straight to he nub of this. Evans case was being heard at a time when the Police and CPS were under intense pressure to secure convictions for rape as a result of the feminist lobby jumping up and down, stamping their feet and demanding that every allegation result in a conviction. A professional footballer was a high-profile gift from the gods and one they were eager to pursue to a successful conclusion. Luckily for justice Ched Evans is made of stern stuff, faced the quisling authorities down and got the conviction overturned. Chd Evans May have not been a very pleasant or mature person on the night in question, but he wasn't a rapist. It's just a shame that people like Jessica Ennis and her sort can't be as quick to apologise as they were to accuse, but then again the Right-On brigade never consider themselves in the wrong. A bit like the Remoaners really. Funny, I'd say it was more like the Brexiteers given the case was built on lies.... 😉😉😉
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Post by geddongas on Jul 8, 2019 15:54:33 GMT
Ched Evans raped someone. He got an overturned ruling in a very strange case within which most of the evidence they had against this 19 year old woman would have been inadmissable in most courtrooms. His legal team was very very expensive and very skilled at finding technicalities to get his conviction overturned. There is actual concrete CCTV showing her completely out of it, he should have known. We should not be saying ‘it’s her fault for being drunk, ched has served his time as he’s a good footballer’. We should be holding footballers and men in general responsible as role models and say ‘Don’t rape women, and don’t take advantage of very drunk people who are vulnerable.’ If we signed Ched Evans i’d be very very upset at the club. We are a community based club and that signing would damage our reputation in the footballing world and the local community. 'Holier Than Thou' springs to mind here. Are you a Baptist Minister or something? Nope, just don’t want my potential daughters to grow up in a world where this sort of behaviour is normalised / looked upon so softly. it’s just as it disproportionately effects women. It’s easy to teach young men not to take advantage of drunk women, yet as a society we so readily blame female victims for what men do very regularly with no repercussions. Rape cases are extremely hard to nail down and so many get quashed because of lack of evidence whether they happen or not. Whether that’s happened in this case I do not know, but it wouldn’t surprise me if the original verdict was the correct one and now simply enough doubt has been cast on it to quash it. Either way, I’d personally not want the club to be linked to it because it is still so contentious. Note Edit: Although having looked at some more details of the CCTV i will admit she doesn’t look that out of it. Maybe Ched himself was victimised and I was wrong. But the point still stands that too many people are compassionate to men on the grounds of them being good at something (in the states there are way too many cases where rich kids with scholarships get off with full on sexual assault charges). I will hold my hands up though and say I was too far the other way. Sorry Ched. If you sign for us please score 25 goals this season.
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Post by Baxtinho on Jul 8, 2019 16:39:31 GMT
Ched Evans raped someone. He got an overturned ruling in a very strange case within which most of the evidence they had against this 19 year old woman would have been inadmissable in most courtrooms. His legal team was very very expensive and very skilled at finding technicalities to get his conviction overturned. There is actual concrete CCTV showing her completely out of it, he should have known. We should not be saying ‘it’s her fault for being drunk, ched has served his time as he’s a good footballer’. We should be holding footballers and men in general responsible as role models and say ‘Don’t rape women, and don’t take advantage of very drunk people who are vulnerable.’ If we signed Ched Evans i’d be very very upset at the club. We are a community based club and that signing would damage our reputation in the footballing world and the local community. There was NO actual CCTV showing her "out of it". That is complete BS.
Instead there was actual CCTV footage...
1) Showing her pay for a pizza takeaway with cash which included coinage - showing she was able to count her money, If she was "out of it", she wouldn't have been able to do that. 2) Showing her able to get in and out of a car unaided and walk into a hotel unaided while wearing high heels, which according to my wife, is not easy to do when "out of it". Oh and while holding a pizza box in one hand too.
These are actual facts.
Also think about this. If she was "out of it" then how was she able to consent to Clayton McDonald, who she had sex with just before Ched Evans got in on the act? You can't be sober enough to consent to have sex with one person then immediately claim to be "out of it" to be able to consent to the next person.
Now the only thing Ched is guilty of was cheating on his missus and she not only forgave him for that but supported him through his trial and dedicated herself to prove his innocence.
Why are you so keen to defend this man who felt that his actions, no matter whether she was "out of it" or not, were an appropriate thing to do?
Why did Evans, upon receiving a text from McDonald saying "I've got a bird" head to the hotel at all - irrespective of whether you buy his claim of going to tell McDonald that one of their pals had been arrested? It sounds like he's a certain type of character, and like geddongas , I'd be mortified if we signed him.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 16:40:59 GMT
'Holier Than Thou' springs to mind here. Are you a Baptist Minister or something? Nope, just don’t want my potential daughters to grow up in a world where this sort of behaviour is normalised / looked upon so softly. it’s just as it disproportionately effects women. It’s easy to teach young men not to take advantage of drunk women, yet as a society we so readily blame female victims for what men do very regularly with no repercussions. Rape cases are extremely hard to nail down and so many get quashed because of lack of evidence whether they happen or not. Whether that’s happened in this case I do not know, but it wouldn’t surprise me if the original verdict was the correct one and now simply enough doubt has been cast on it to quash it. Either way, I’d personally not want the club to be linked to it because it is still so contentious. Note Edit: Although having looked at some more details of the CCTV i will admit she doesn’t look that out of it. Maybe Ched himself was victimised and I was wrong. But the point still stands that too many people are compassionate to men on the grounds of them being good at something (in the states there are way too many cases where rich kids with scholarships get off with full on sexual assault charges). I will hold my hands up though and say I was too far the other way. Sorry Ched. If you sign for us please score 25 goals this season. I'd recommend you take some time to investigate the full circumstances, I challenge anyone to do that and conclude that justice was served in the original trial. It was a baffling and scandalous miscarriage of justice. Rather than benefitting from any compassion or benefit of doubt the facts of the case were ignored and he was treated appallingly as a political scapegoat and to make an example of a footballer.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 16:49:12 GMT
There was NO actual CCTV showing her "out of it". That is complete BS.
Instead there was actual CCTV footage...
1) Showing her pay for a pizza takeaway with cash which included coinage - showing she was able to count her money, If she was "out of it", she wouldn't have been able to do that. 2) Showing her able to get in and out of a car unaided and walk into a hotel unaided while wearing high heels, which according to my wife, is not easy to do when "out of it". Oh and while holding a pizza box in one hand too.
These are actual facts.
Also think about this. If she was "out of it" then how was she able to consent to Clayton McDonald, who she had sex with just before Ched Evans got in on the act? You can't be sober enough to consent to have sex with one person then immediately claim to be "out of it" to be able to consent to the next person.
Now the only thing Ched is guilty of was cheating on his missus and she not only forgave him for that but supported him through his trial and dedicated herself to prove his innocence.
Why are you so keen to defend this man who felt that his actions, no matter whether she was "out of it" or not, were an appropriate thing to do?
Why did Evans, upon receiving a text from McDonald saying "I've got a bird" head to the hotel at all - irrespective of whether you buy his claim of going to tell McDonald that one of their pals had been arrested? It sounds like he's a certain type of character, and like geddongas , I'd be mortified if we signed him. Did he think his actions were an appropriate thing to do? From what I've heard he's apologised to everyone and shown nothing other than remorse. Nobody is defending his behaviour - however poor his morals on the night in question he never committed a crime and yet lost several years of his freedom. Fair enough if you want to set a very high moral tariff for any new signings, I've no problem with that, but do you not think he was punished enough? Losing several years of his life due to an inappropriate, drink fuelled but not illegal activity?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 16:50:54 GMT
Your last sentence goes straight to he nub of this. Evans case was being heard at a time when the Police and CPS were under intense pressure to secure convictions for rape as a result of the feminist lobby jumping up and down, stamping their feet and demanding that every allegation result in a conviction. A professional footballer was a high-profile gift from the gods and one they were eager to pursue to a successful conclusion. Luckily for justice Ched Evans is made of stern stuff, faced the quisling authorities down and got the conviction overturned. Chd Evans May have not been a very pleasant or mature person on the night in question, but he wasn't a rapist. It's just a shame that people like Jessica Ennis and her sort can't be as quick to apologise as they were to accuse, but then again the Right-On brigade never consider themselves in the wrong. A bit like the Remoaners really. Funny, I'd say it was more like the Brexiteers given the case was built on lies.... Ooooh, careful
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