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Post by wiaww on Oct 29, 2020 15:09:49 GMT
A friend of mine is Argyle and wanted to know what I thought of Grant, which did actually require some thinking to be fair. Interested to hear what others have to say as I'm certainly not blown away, but it's clear he's very highly rated by Garner.
I told him the following:
I think it's probably still slightly too early to judge him properly. What I have seen so far I haven't been overly impressed, but that's not to say he's not a decent L1 midfielder. He's reasonably effective in the holding role - which is the only position he has played for us - and several times now I've seen him prevent the opposition breaking two or three on one, which is good. However, I think there's definitely aspects lacking from his game. He honestly doesn't seem the most mobile or the fittest of players, and I have at times been disappointed by his work-rate. I think for a fairly big lad he's not the strongest on the ball, either. We tend to play a three in the middle with him sat behind two more creative players, but I think he looks better in a three with one next to him and one in front.
He's probably a L1 player because of his positional and situational awareness as much as anything. Technically he's not sensational, although he did play a great first time ball out to our right back to cross in for an assist the other week. On the flip side he missed a bit of a sitter after about 5 minutes at Shrews. But I'm not sure that he's really in the mould of player that Garner has championed previously so I do wander what he sees that perhaps I can't.
I think he's one of two players (Hanlan being the other) that seems to slow our play down, and whether that's intentional/tactical I don't know. All in all, I can't see that he's any better than Ogogo was... Maybe marginally better with ball in to feet, but he doesn't offer the same energy or presence in the middle of the park. That being said, it's still very early days and I believe he took a while to settle with you also.
Not unimpressed, not overly impressed, just slightly ambivalent if truth be told. Perhaps feeling like that is not a bad sign for a player given his particular role, though.
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Post by simonj on Oct 29, 2020 15:23:36 GMT
A friend of mine is Argyle and wanted to know what I thought of Grant, which did actually require some thinking to be fair. Interested to hear what others have to say as I'm certainly not blown away, but it's clear he's very highly rated by Garner. I told him the following: I think it's probably still slightly too early to judge him properly. What I have seen so far I haven't been overly impressed, but that's not to say he's not a decent L1 midfielder. He's reasonably effective in the holding role - which is the only position he has played for us - and several times now I've seen him prevent the opposition breaking two or three on one, which is good. However, I think there's definitely aspects lacking from his game. He honestly doesn't seem the most mobile or the fittest of players, and I have at times been disappointed by his work-rate. I think for a fairly big lad he's not the strongest on the ball, either. We tend to play a three in the middle with him sat behind two more creative players, but I think he looks better in a three with one next to him and one in front.
He's probably a L1 player because of his positional and situational awareness as much as anything. Technically he's not sensational, although he did play a great first time ball out to our right back to cross in for an assist the other week. On the flip side he missed a bit of a sitter after about 5 minutes at Shrews. But I'm not sure that he's really in the mould of player that Garner has championed previously so I do wander what he sees that perhaps I can't.
I think he's one of two players (Hanlan being the other) that seems to slow our play down, and whether that's intentional/tactical I don't know. All in all, I can't see that he's any better than Ogogo was... Maybe marginally better with ball in to feet, but he doesn't offer the same energy or presence in the middle of the park. That being said, it's still very early days and I believe he took a while to settle with you also.
Not unimpressed, not overly impressed, just slightly ambivalent if truth be told. Perhaps feeling like that is not a bad sign for a player given his particular role, though. I would add he doesn't seem to good in the air but I think that seems a fair reflection, hopefully there is much more to come from him........
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Post by wallywalters on Oct 29, 2020 15:23:41 GMT
Imo I'd drop him Upson is much better than him on the ball and offers just as much defensive cover then he has so far demonstrated. Ogogo is far superior at ball winning and to be honest not much worse in his distribution.
Let's hope I'm proved wrong in the long term.
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Post by Topper Gas on Oct 29, 2020 16:29:23 GMT
A friend of mine is Argyle and wanted to know what I thought of Grant, which did actually require some thinking to be fair. Interested to hear what others have to say as I'm certainly not blown away, but it's clear he's very highly rated by Garner. I told him the following: I think it's probably still slightly too early to judge him properly. What I have seen so far I haven't been overly impressed, but that's not to say he's not a decent L1 midfielder. He's reasonably effective in the holding role - which is the only position he has played for us - and several times now I've seen him prevent the opposition breaking two or three on one, which is good. However, I think there's definitely aspects lacking from his game. He honestly doesn't seem the most mobile or the fittest of players, and I have at times been disappointed by his work-rate. I think for a fairly big lad he's not the strongest on the ball, either. We tend to play a three in the middle with him sat behind two more creative players, but I think he looks better in a three with one next to him and one in front.
He's probably a L1 player because of his positional and situational awareness as much as anything. Technically he's not sensational, although he did play a great first time ball out to our right back to cross in for an assist the other week. On the flip side he missed a bit of a sitter after about 5 minutes at Shrews. But I'm not sure that he's really in the mould of player that Garner has championed previously so I do wander what he sees that perhaps I can't.
I think he's one of two players (Hanlan being the other) that seems to slow our play down, and whether that's intentional/tactical I don't know. All in all, I can't see that he's any better than Ogogo was... Maybe marginally better with ball in to feet, but he doesn't offer the same energy or presence in the middle of the park. That being said, it's still very early days and I believe he took a while to settle with you also.
Not unimpressed, not overly impressed, just slightly ambivalent if truth be told. Perhaps feeling like that is not a bad sign for a player given his particular role, though. Any chance you could publish what your friend had to say in response, as it'll be interesting to see what he had to say given he was apparently impressive for them last season?
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Post by warehamgas on Oct 29, 2020 17:30:39 GMT
Fair enough wiaww. Sometimes he is caught out of position but I guess that’s part of the BG-way, to be mobile (not get caught out of position!). Didn’t have a good match Tuesday but think he’s been getting better and he’s still learning, so I’m hopeful he will prove to be a good player. UTG!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2020 17:35:14 GMT
A little bit of a slow start but I reckon he’ll be playing Championship level within 3 or 4 years. The game is changing and so are Rovers. The blood and thunder, 100mph, flying in to challenges style may still appease many fans but a bit more is needed as we hopefully move up the pyramid. IMO a holding or defensive midfielder is more about positional sense than ferocious tackling these days.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2020 17:41:27 GMT
A little bit of a slow start but I reckon he’ll be playing Championship level within 3 or 4 years. The game is changing and so are Rovers. The blood and thunder, 100mph, flying in to challenges style may still appease many fans but a bit more is needed as we hopefully move up the pyramid. IMO a holding or defensive midfielder is more about positional sense than ferocious tackling these days. Completely agree. I like the look of him, but he needs time I think. Perhaps why we have Liddle waiting in the wings. Why Garner built a squad.
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Post by pucklegas on Oct 29, 2020 17:52:03 GMT
I like him, sometimes sloppy in possession but he needs constant game time and will improve that, will definitely play at a higher level. I would rest McCormick for this weekend, and select Nicholson.
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Post by Gas-Ed on Oct 29, 2020 17:52:14 GMT
My main gripe with Grant is his distribution. He doesn’t need to be trying 40-yard, defence-splitting passes. I’d like to see Grant get around like he does but keep it simple with a short pass to one of our more creative players. He gave it away time and time again on Tuesday.
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Post by yesimcornish on Oct 29, 2020 19:02:23 GMT
Too tired (lazy) to read all of it, but don’t know if anyone else noticed this but I think he is one of the laziest players I’ve seen for Rovers... might just be me but when he loses the ball he never tries to win it back or runs after it (the 5 second rule) unless it’s a super easy tackle. Especially the last game against Hull. I saw him lose the ball so many times and just jog or walk back whilst they broke away into a counter :/ definitely frustrated me a lot. But apart from that looks good and must be doing a good job to keep others out even though we are lacking in the CDM position.
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Post by Jomo on Oct 29, 2020 19:55:41 GMT
Too tired (lazy) to read all of it, but don’t know if anyone else noticed this but I think he is one of the laziest players I’ve seen for Rovers... might just be me but when he loses the ball he never tries to win it back or runs after it (the 5 second rule) unless it’s a super easy tackle. Especially the last game against Hull. I saw him lose the ball so many times and just jog or walk back whilst they broke away into a counter :/ definitely frustrated me a lot. But apart from that looks good and must be doing a good job to keep others out even though we are lacking in the CDM position. I've only been able to watch the last 2 matches, but I disagree with your view of him being lazy. He's a trier as far as I can see, and gets involved in a lot of areas of the pitch. He does seem to struggle to execute what he tries though to be fair!
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Post by CrispPusher on Oct 29, 2020 20:13:57 GMT
Bit anonymous really, never going to take any game by the scruff of the neck but then that's why he's playing at this level.
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Post by mrwarboys on Oct 29, 2020 21:02:34 GMT
Does a lot of the Donkey work, while Westbrooke is marauding around taking the plaudits, both will be quality players eventually for the Gas.
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Post by LJG on Oct 29, 2020 21:45:21 GMT
A friend of mine is Argyle and wanted to know what I thought of Grant, which did actually require some thinking to be fair. Interested to hear what others have to say as I'm certainly not blown away, but it's clear he's very highly rated by Garner. I told him the following: I think it's probably still slightly too early to judge him properly. What I have seen so far I haven't been overly impressed, but that's not to say he's not a decent L1 midfielder. He's reasonably effective in the holding role - which is the only position he has played for us - and several times now I've seen him prevent the opposition breaking two or three on one, which is good. However, I think there's definitely aspects lacking from his game. He honestly doesn't seem the most mobile or the fittest of players, and I have at times been disappointed by his work-rate. I think for a fairly big lad he's not the strongest on the ball, either. We tend to play a three in the middle with him sat behind two more creative players, but I think he looks better in a three with one next to him and one in front.
He's probably a L1 player because of his positional and situational awareness as much as anything. Technically he's not sensational, although he did play a great first time ball out to our right back to cross in for an assist the other week. On the flip side he missed a bit of a sitter after about 5 minutes at Shrews. But I'm not sure that he's really in the mould of player that Garner has championed previously so I do wander what he sees that perhaps I can't.
I think he's one of two players (Hanlan being the other) that seems to slow our play down, and whether that's intentional/tactical I don't know. All in all, I can't see that he's any better than Ogogo was... Maybe marginally better with ball in to feet, but he doesn't offer the same energy or presence in the middle of the park. That being said, it's still very early days and I believe he took a while to settle with you also.
Not unimpressed, not overly impressed, just slightly ambivalent if truth be told. Perhaps feeling like that is not a bad sign for a player given his particular role, though. Any chance you could publish what your friend had to say in response, as it'll be interesting to see what he had to say given he was apparently impressive for them last season? "Oh ... cheers, mate ... I was just making small talk while we were waiting for the kettle to boil to be honest. Anyway ... I better go, Darren in accounts is waiting for these reports".
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Post by Gas-Ed on Oct 29, 2020 21:53:03 GMT
Too tired (lazy) to read all of it, but don’t know if anyone else noticed this but I think he is one of the laziest players I’ve seen for Rovers... might just be me but when he loses the ball he never tries to win it back or runs after it (the 5 second rule) unless it’s a super easy tackle. Especially the last game against Hull. I saw him lose the ball so many times and just jog or walk back whilst they broke away into a counter :/ definitely frustrated me a lot. But apart from that looks good and must be doing a good job to keep others out even though we are lacking in the CDM position. Harsh in my opinion. I’ve seen him do a lot of chasing since he joined us and he does get stuck in at times. I’d say it’s on the ball where he needs to improve rather than off it.
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Post by yaz on Oct 29, 2020 22:29:47 GMT
A little bit of a slow start but I reckon he’ll be playing Championship level within 3 or 4 years. The game is changing and so are Rovers. The blood and thunder, 100mph, flying in to challenges style may still appease many fans but a bit more is needed as we hopefully move up the pyramid. IMO a holding or defensive midfielder is more about positional sense than ferocious tackling these days. I disagree at the present and for the next few years; he is not strong enough to be a defensive midfielder and he is not “aware enough” of his surroundings. I hope he proves me wrong? I don’t think he will come anywhere near shooting or scoring for us; how many shots has he had so far this season? We will be lucky if he scores 2 or more this season.
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Post by spiess1 on Oct 29, 2020 22:35:20 GMT
A little bit of a slow start but I reckon he’ll be playing Championship level within 3 or 4 years. The game is changing and so are Rovers. The blood and thunder, 100mph, flying in to challenges style may still appease many fans but a bit more is needed as we hopefully move up the pyramid. IMO a holding or defensive midfielder is more about positional sense than ferocious tackling these days. I disagree at the present and for the next few years; he is not strong enough to be a defensive midfielder and he is not “aware enough” of his surroundings. I hope he proves me wrong? I don’t think he will come anywhere near shooting or scoring for us; how many shots has he had so far this season? We will be lucky if he scores 2 or more this season. Well, that's clear, then.
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Post by yaz on Oct 29, 2020 22:37:57 GMT
Too tired (lazy) to read all of it, but don’t know if anyone else noticed this but I think he is one of the laziest players I’ve seen for Rovers... might just be me but when he loses the ball he never tries to win it back or runs after it (the 5 second rule) unless it’s a super easy tackle. Especially the last game against Hull. I saw him lose the ball so many times and just jog or walk back whilst they broke away into a counter :/ definitely frustrated me a lot. But apart from that looks good and must be doing a good job to keep others out even though we are lacking in the CDM position. Harsh in my opinion. I’ve seen him do a lot of chasing since he joined us and he does get stuck in at times. I’d say it’s on the ball where he needs to improve rather than off it. Midfielders, in my view, should be the best controllers and passers of the ball as they form the creative hub. Not defenders and most forwards! He plays in the middle. If he is not good on the ball, why is he there? Him and Westbrook are very ineffectual at stopping opposing attacks. Our midfield must be one of the weakest in L1 / L2 so far this season? Let’s see how many goals this season our midfield score in supporting our forwards? Way below average in L1? Unless our midfield changes radically.
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Post by yaz on Oct 29, 2020 22:44:12 GMT
I disagree at the present and for the next few years; he is not strong enough to be a defensive midfielder and he is not “aware enough” of his surroundings. I hope he proves me wrong? I don’t think he will come anywhere near shooting or scoring for us; how many shots has he had so far this season? We will be lucky if he scores 2 or more this season. Well, that's clear, then. I think you know what I meant?👍😀 It would be interesting to see some data on how many goals, shots and assists Westbrook and Grant have done so far this season? Westbrook for the Hanlan header but he takes virtually all our set pieces so ..... PS I would love to see them shooting and scoring. Rovers shooting over the last few seasons percentage wise is poor by any standard; guaranteed to go over the bar or way wide? But it is L1 as one former Gas striker said to me.😂
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Post by yaz on Oct 29, 2020 22:48:07 GMT
A friend of mine is Argyle and wanted to know what I thought of Grant, which did actually require some thinking to be fair. Interested to hear what others have to say as I'm certainly not blown away, but it's clear he's very highly rated by Garner. I told him the following: I think it's probably still slightly too early to judge him properly. What I have seen so far I haven't been overly impressed, but that's not to say he's not a decent L1 midfielder. He's reasonably effective in the holding role - which is the only position he has played for us - and several times now I've seen him prevent the opposition breaking two or three on one, which is good. However, I think there's definitely aspects lacking from his game. He honestly doesn't seem the most mobile or the fittest of players, and I have at times been disappointed by his work-rate. I think for a fairly big lad he's not the strongest on the ball, either. We tend to play a three in the middle with him sat behind two more creative players, but I think he looks better in a three with one next to him and one in front.
He's probably a L1 player because of his positional and situational awareness as much as anything. Technically he's not sensational, although he did play a great first time ball out to our right back to cross in for an assist the other week. On the flip side he missed a bit of a sitter after about 5 minutes at Shrews. But I'm not sure that he's really in the mould of player that Garner has championed previously so I do wander what he sees that perhaps I can't.
I think he's one of two players (Hanlan being the other) that seems to slow our play down, and whether that's intentional/tactical I don't know. All in all, I can't see that he's any better than Ogogo was... Maybe marginally better with ball in to feet, but he doesn't offer the same energy or presence in the middle of the park. That being said, it's still very early days and I believe he took a while to settle with you also.
Not unimpressed, not overly impressed, just slightly ambivalent if truth be told. Perhaps feeling like that is not a bad sign for a player given his particular role, though. Ask your mate what he / she thought of Ruben Lameras? In my opinion, 2 seasons ago he was as good as Ozthumer was a few years before. Took us apart up front with his left foot at the 2-2 draw at their place? I wish we had him and would not be surprised if he came back to a higher level of English football in next few years?
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