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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2018 8:15:43 GMT
Tell us? How many clubs at our level are operating at a profit? Of those that are, how many started from a baseline of near zero investment for 25 years (at least) Answers on a post card to.. So why did Investment Bankers take us over? Good question. The answer to which is "I have no idea" |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jan 23, 2018 8:49:59 GMT
"bankers" didn't take us over though it was the Al-Qadi family, I'm pretty sure if they just wanted a good investment opportunity they could have found something more reliable than a lower league football club.
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Jan 23, 2018 8:52:56 GMT
"bankers" didn't take us over though it was the Al-Qadi family, I'm pretty sure if they just wanted a good investment opportunity they could have found something more reliable than a lower league football club. Yeah, like scratch cards. |
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stuart1974
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Post by stuart1974 on Jan 23, 2018 9:24:22 GMT
The only way I can understand it is that there really is a long term plan, after all. We are well set up for administration, coaching, youth development and stadium redevelopment staff. Once all those are in place, the club can then actually work on building training facilities and a redeveloped stadium. Having done that, they can then work on getting us into the Championship through releasing funds to sign Championship type players. We've seen countless examples of clubs who spent big on stadiums and players without getting the basics right first, and suffered as a result. I've suddenly become a convert to our owners. If it's not a long term sensible plan, then the alternative of just under-funding us until they sell us off cheaply makes no sense at all as an investment. That is pretty much my interpretation of what I think is their business plan. By using long term loans to build up the infrastructure which then generate sufficient return to pay for the day to day running costs, loan interest and profit to fund new investment in the team. The loans are genuinely long term (such as bonds, pension schemes) which will not need repaying in significant amounts in the short term and are repaid gradually over time (no 'bow wave' of expenditure). As the team progresses, the income streams also increase which then funds further investment and so on. It becomes a (well, almost) self financing model. It is something sustainable, but only once the stadium and its income generating facilities are up and running. That is why the stadium has to work and why there is little overt details coming out. They have to get this right first time. Of course, this is all dependent on them actually wanting to do this and I reserve the right to change my mind🤓 |
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Post by paulpirate on Jan 23, 2018 9:44:06 GMT
it all helps,look what other clubs get for their best players I like wael seems a top bloke who loves football but he and all around him seem to know about as much as previous owners about making the club a success Hope I’m wrong,at the end of the day I go to watch our team win and if they do I’m happy all week We must be the must patient fans in the league by miles I'm sure the fans of Oldham for example would disagree. How long since they last tasted a promotion? 30 years? they haven’t had the pain of dartford away though |
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Post by knowall on Jan 23, 2018 9:47:17 GMT
A salary cap can be increased if the directors gift the club the means in which to do so. That is no way to run a business properly unless the business is in trouble financially. (which the new owners did when they paid out to pay for the mistakes of the previous Board.) The correct way is to grow the business so that it is sustainable. With a banking background, our owners will know this and act accordingly. Watch and learn |
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Post by countygroundhotel on Jan 23, 2018 9:48:06 GMT
The only way I can understand it is that there really is a long term plan, after all. We are well set up for administration, coaching, youth development and stadium redevelopment staff. Once all those are in place, the club can then actually work on building training facilities and a redeveloped stadium. Having done that, they can then work on getting us into the Championship through releasing funds to sign Championship type players. We've seen countless examples of clubs who spent big on stadiums and players without getting the basics right first, and suffered as a result. I've suddenly become a convert to our owners. If it's not a long term sensible plan, then the alternative of just under-funding us until they sell us off cheaply makes no sense at all as an investment. That is pretty much my interpretation of what I think is their business plan. By using long term loans to build up the infrastructure which then generate sufficient return to pay for the day to day running costs, loan interest and profit to fund new investment in the team. The loans are genuinely long term (such as bonds, pension schemes) which will not need repaying in significant amounts in the short term and are repaid gradually over time (no 'bow wave' of expenditure). As the team progresses, the income streams also increase which then funds further investment and so on. It becomes a (well, almost) self financing model. It is something sustainable, but only once the stadium and its income generating facilities are up and running. That is why the stadium has to work and why there is little overt details coming out. They have to get this right first time. Of course, this is all dependent on them actually wanting to do this and I reserve the right to change my mind🤓 You could believe that except the accounts clearly make out that the money is loaned via a Revovling Credit Facility on 12 months notice. So exactly the opposite if long term loans. Hopefully you are in the know & the Revolving Credit Facility has now been converted to a long term loan. But I'm not holding my breath |
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Post by paulpirate on Jan 23, 2018 9:50:37 GMT
it all helps,look what other clubs get for their best players I like wael seems a top bloke who loves football but he and all around him seem to know about as much as previous owners about making the club a success Hope I’m wrong,at the end of the day I go to watch our team win and if they do I’m happy all week We must be the must patient fans in the league by miles So if we had stayed in the conference won most games and just missed out every season you would be happy? Were in league one much quicker than anyone could have imagined with lousy facilities and poor commercial revenue streams. whats the conference got to do with it? Funny how everyone mentions the conference to make us feel lucky now We’re a big city with average 9k gates and we can’t pay decent wages,it’s a joke even dc says it himself You can keep mentioning the conference,overachieving etc just excuses for owners with no money and no ambition |
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Post by rutlandgas on Jan 23, 2018 9:58:26 GMT
I thought Hami was brought into develop the UWE situation. Now that is dead what does he actually do, other than ruin the aspiration, effort and enthusiasm of all. Surely if he was a business man he would want to grow other than dilute the fragile roots he has built. Or am I blinkered???
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Post by Marshy on Jan 23, 2018 10:02:38 GMT
I thought Hami was brought into develop the UWE situation. Now that is dead what does he actually do, other than ruin the aspiration, effort and enthusiasm of all. Surely if he was a business man he would want to grow other than dilute the fragile roots he has built. Or am I blinkered??? Perhaps Hami the hamster has gone back to star in Tales From The Riverbank? |
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Post by stuart1974 on Jan 23, 2018 10:07:18 GMT
That is pretty much my interpretation of what I think is their business plan. By using long term loans to build up the infrastructure which then generate sufficient return to pay for the day to day running costs, loan interest and profit to fund new investment in the team. The loans are genuinely long term (such as bonds, pension schemes) which will not need repaying in significant amounts in the short term and are repaid gradually over time (no 'bow wave' of expenditure). As the team progresses, the income streams also increase which then funds further investment and so on. It becomes a (well, almost) self financing model. It is something sustainable, but only once the stadium and its income generating facilities are up and running. That is why the stadium has to work and why there is little overt details coming out. They have to get this right first time. Of course, this is all dependent on them actually wanting to do this and I reserve the right to change my mind🤓 You could believe that except the accounts clearly make out that the money is loaned via a Revovling Credit Facility on 12 months notice. So exactly the opposite if long term loans. Hopefully you are in the know & the Revolving Credit Facility has now been converted to a long term loan. But I'm not holding my breath I'm talking about how the stadium funding could work, not the credit facility which I see as the short term working capital. Different loans for different uses. |
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Post by countygroundhotel on Jan 23, 2018 10:08:29 GMT
You could believe that except the accounts clearly make out that the money is loaned via a Revovling Credit Facility on 12 months notice. So exactly the opposite if long term loans. Hopefully you are in the know & the Revolving Credit Facility has now been converted to a long term loan. But I'm not holding my breath I'm talking about how the stadium funding could work, not the credit facility which I see as the short term working capital. Different loans for different uses. Haven't we only got one sort of loan? |
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Post by Henbury Gas on Jan 23, 2018 10:21:54 GMT
2 points I want to pick up on... 1) We do actually offer one some of the cheapest tickets in this league. (Rightly so, the facilities are close to the worst). 2) The ‘gifting’ is not as straight forward as mentioned. Clubs ruled to break the rules suffer fines and transfer embargoes. Furthermore, ‘a gift’ is never truely a gift- yes, it is written off in the books, and by virtue no payment is due back. But an ‘on-the-pitch-return’ is expected. Throwing money is not necessarily a guarantee to success. Until we are profitable it is extremely unlikely that such a gift would be forthcoming. Take a gift of a million. What would that buy you? DC has quoted that top end players are asking for up to 6k. That will get you 2 years this player with 375k to buy them. That’s it. The strategy for this club has to longer term, has be about improving turnover and creating a profit. Those calling out for handouts are crazy. yeah like selling our best players for peanuts,they are really heading in the right direction So we need to make Moore's contract longer then ? |
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Post by stuart1974 on Jan 23, 2018 10:25:50 GMT
I'm talking about how the stadium funding could work, not the credit facility which I see as the short term working capital. Different loans for different uses. Haven't we only got one sort of loan? Not sure I understand your point, I was talking about how it could work not how we are today (or at least at the last set of accounts). How do you see it? |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2018 10:36:00 GMT
So if we had stayed in the conference won most games and just missed out every season you would be happy? Were in league one much quicker than anyone could have imagined with lousy facilities and poor commercial revenue streams. whats the conference got to do with it? Funny how everyone mentions the conference to make us feel lucky now We’re a big city with average 9k gates and we can’t pay decent wages,it’s a joke even dc says it himself You can keep mentioning the conference,overachieving etc just excuses for owners with no money and no ambition You want to be happy seeing your team win games,its pretty obvious to me that 2 successive promotions has made that harder. Its just not all about attendances in the modern game,look at derby co and sheff wed stuck in the championship for years while bournemouth,watford and huddersfield are in the premier league. There are also plenty of steve lansdowns out there throwing their own money at the football club they own to value of millions of pounds. Whether we like it or not we havnt got one of those type of owners. Back to the conference and like i said if we just kept getting pipped for promotion you would be well pleased because we would be winning most games but its not for me thanks. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2018 10:45:11 GMT
The only way I can understand it is that there really is a long term plan, after all. We are well set up for administration, coaching, youth development and stadium redevelopment staff. Once all those are in place, the club can then actually work on building training facilities and a redeveloped stadium. Having done that, they can then work on getting us into the Championship through releasing funds to sign Championship type players. We've seen countless examples of clubs who spent big on stadiums and players without getting the basics right first, and suffered as a result. I've suddenly become a convert to our owners. If it's not a long term sensible plan, then the alternative of just under-funding us until they sell us off cheaply makes no sense at all as an investment. That is pretty much my interpretation of what I think is their business plan. By using long term loans to build up the infrastructure which then generate sufficient return to pay for the day to day running costs, loan interest and profit to fund new investment in the team. The loans are genuinely long term (such as bonds, pension schemes) which will not need repaying in significant amounts in the short term and are repaid gradually over time (no 'bow wave' of expenditure). As the team progresses, the income streams also increase which then funds further investment and so on. It becomes a (well, almost) self financing model. It is something sustainable, but only once the stadium and its income generating facilities are up and running. That is why the stadium has to work and why there is little overt details coming out. They have to get this right first time. Of course, this is all dependent on them actually wanting to do this and I reserve the right to change my mind🤓 I must admit that does seem congruent with the big question that I have always had about why they wanted to buy Gillingham. The idea that they were only ever interested in Rovers because they saw an investment opportunity to make a killing on the UWE deal never really meshed with their interest in another potless club before they turned to us. So that would make sense that they were only ever interested in a slow re-build over some 15-20 years. A nice idea but frustratingly limiting in the short to medium term while our neighbours disappear over the horizon never to be seen again. *sigh* |
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Post by countygroundhotel on Jan 23, 2018 10:50:17 GMT
Haven't we only got one sort of loan? Not sure I understand your point, I was talking about how it could work not how we are today (or at least at the last set of accounts). How do you see it? I see that they have loaned nearly £10m to the football club with no plan to improve the infrastructure yet. How are they expecting to get that £10m repaid? Any views on that? |
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Post by Marshy on Jan 23, 2018 10:55:55 GMT
Not sure I understand your point, I was talking about how it could work not how we are today (or at least at the last set of accounts). How do you see it? I see that they have loaned nearly £10m to the football club with no plan to improve the infrastructure yet. How are they expecting to get that £10m repaid? Any views on that? I think we all know the answer to that question. Sell the Mem and ride off into the sunset on their camels. Let’s hope it doesn’t come to that, but there seems to be no plan to suggest otherwise? I’m still optimistic but we need some planning and some direction to be finally shared with us, if indeed any actually exists. |
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Post by stuart1974 on Jan 23, 2018 11:07:05 GMT
Not sure I understand your point, I was talking about how it could work not how we are today (or at least at the last set of accounts). How do you see it? I see that they have loaned nearly £10m to the football club with no plan to improve the infrastructure yet. How are they expecting to get that £10m repaid? Any views on that? One or two. |
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Post by knowall on Jan 23, 2018 11:18:24 GMT
Not sure I understand your point, I was talking about how it could work not how we are today (or at least at the last set of accounts). How do you see it? I see that they have loaned nearly £10m to the football club with no plan to improve the infrastructure yet. How are they expecting to get that £10m repaid? Any views on that? Why would they want the loan repaid? Bankers make money from interest - they do not make money from loans being repaid And infrastructure in football surely includes Academy and training support? which has been improved |
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