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Post by baggins on Mar 16, 2018 12:56:18 GMT
It's all very, very odd.
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Post by scoobydoogas on Mar 16, 2018 14:22:53 GMT
The Yellow Pages? You are so 1970's. J R Hartley? His name is a jam His name is a jam J R Hartley His name is a jam
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Marshy
Proper Gas
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Post by Marshy on Mar 16, 2018 14:30:00 GMT
His name is a jam His name is a jam J R Hartley His name is a jam
Are you alright Scoob? Have you been chasing your tail around and around again? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 14:34:54 GMT
23 Russian spies expelled,I've heard that a few times.No word on how many UK diplomats are on their way out yet.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 15:56:18 GMT
You don't really know how things work do you. Oh god,that old smug i know best line. I believe in this instance, I do actually. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 17:47:08 GMT
Maybe if we really wanted to sanction the russians we could stop selling them weapons grade nuclear material.
But guess what? that wont happen.
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Post by inee on Mar 16, 2018 20:27:30 GMT
So, my knowledge of Nerve Agents and all that malarky is just based on my NBC training while employed by Queen Liz, so I am no expert and my knowledge may be well out of date. I've heard that Novichok is a 'persistent' agent. Basically, NA's fall into two categories, persistent or non-persistent. A non-persistent agent is one that when deployed, disappears pretty quickly. A persistent agent is one that say, falls to the ground and stays there for long periods, meaning people could still be affected a long time after the agent was deployed. I think this is the reason why we are still seeing a clean-up operation underway. Don't forget, in liquid form just one drop of this stuff on your skin can kill you, unless you are carrying something like Atropine which you inject into your thigh to counteract the agent, and to be fair Atropine is not the sort of stuff you can pick up at Boots. Oh, word of warning. If you do get hold of some Atropine, and you think you are under Nerve Agent attack, then please do use it. Be aware though, that if you do use it and you are not under Nerve Agent attack, the Atropine will probably kill you ! It's a dodgy game eh! Did the Russians do it? Well, if they are innocent, wouldn't you think that they'd try to identify how the agent came to be used in the UK, and how someone got hold of it? Instead of ramping up International tension, don't you think they'd say, "hey, hold on. Let's work together to find out how this happened!". From the Russian reaction I don't think there is any doubt that they did this. Nobs you can stick your atropine jab up yer arse, i would rather die than propel that needle into my thigh, if i remember rightly you save the needle and put it through the arm of your noddy suit ,3 max wasn't it, Apparently the NA was designed to bypass nato nbc equipment, so it beggars the question if it was as claimed Novichok, how did we detect it and more importantly how did it not penetrate the very equipment it was designed to penetrate ,and how did we know what it was if its never been seen before, yes it could be those pesky ruskies however it it government or organised crime who deployed it, you have to admit a lot of it doesn't add up, one reason being that whoever deployed the na left some behind. Does may or others really believe that the measures they have taken against russia are going to do any good, they sail their ships openly in our waters. It's quite feasible that the na was obtained on the black market as the average soldier /guard over there isn't exactly flush with cash |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 20:31:10 GMT
Maybe it would be best if the conservative party stopped accepting donations from russian billionaires.
But that wont happen.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 20:55:03 GMT
Maybe it would be best if the conservative party stopped accepting donations from russian billionaires. But that wont happen. That is just a deflection argument. You didn't mention the Russian cash that goes to Labour or the Unions. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 20:57:01 GMT
So, my knowledge of Nerve Agents and all that malarky is just based on my NBC training while employed by Queen Liz, so I am no expert and my knowledge may be well out of date. I've heard that Novichok is a 'persistent' agent. Basically, NA's fall into two categories, persistent or non-persistent. A non-persistent agent is one that when deployed, disappears pretty quickly. A persistent agent is one that say, falls to the ground and stays there for long periods, meaning people could still be affected a long time after the agent was deployed. I think this is the reason why we are still seeing a clean-up operation underway. Don't forget, in liquid form just one drop of this stuff on your skin can kill you, unless you are carrying something like Atropine which you inject into your thigh to counteract the agent, and to be fair Atropine is not the sort of stuff you can pick up at Boots. Oh, word of warning. If you do get hold of some Atropine, and you think you are under Nerve Agent attack, then please do use it. Be aware though, that if you do use it and you are not under Nerve Agent attack, the Atropine will probably kill you ! It's a dodgy game eh! Did the Russians do it? Well, if they are innocent, wouldn't you think that they'd try to identify how the agent came to be used in the UK, and how someone got hold of it? Instead of ramping up International tension, don't you think they'd say, "hey, hold on. Let's work together to find out how this happened!". From the Russian reaction I don't think there is any doubt that they did this. Nobs you can stick your atropine jab up yer arse, i would rather die than propel that needle into my thigh, if i remember rightly you save the needle and put it through the arm of your noddy suit ,3 max wasn't it, Apparently the NA was designed to bypass nato nbc equipment, so it beggars the question if it was as claimed Novichok, how did we detect it and more importantly how did it not penetrate the very equipment it was designed to penetrate ,and how did we know what it was if its never been seen before, yes it could be those pesky ruskies however it it government or organised crime who deployed it, you have to admit a lot of it doesn't add up, one reason being that whoever deployed the na left some behind. Does may or others really believe that the measures they have taken against russia are going to do any good, they sail their ships openly in our waters. It's quite feasible that the na was obtained on the black market as the average soldier /guard over there isn't exactly flush with cash Good read here in the Guardian. Novichok chemist speaks..... |
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Mar 16, 2018 21:30:52 GMT
I listened to a really interesting debate a few days ago about so called Russian Troll farms and their alleged interference in Facebook, Fake News and the US elections.
There is some evidence that they are not involved in half as much as they are being accused of.
US intelligence are actively using Facebook to manipulate its own citizens and subject them to propaganda. Something that is actually unconstitutional.
It's also entirely possible that someone else is trying to set Russia up for a fall on this but looks more likely that Russia are involved.
Its really quite impressive/fishy how we seem to have slipped into a cold war with Russia and that those evil Muslims and ISIS seemed to be long forgotten.
I don't trust a bloody thing anyone tells me anymore.
We live in very dangerous times with all sides lying and manipulating us more than it's ever happened before.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 21:53:27 GMT
As always, the world is a dangerous place, which makes the defence cuts even more mystifying.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Mar 16, 2018 22:05:49 GMT
As always, the world is a dangerous place, which makes the defence cuts even more mystifying. We've nothing left to defend. We are no longer part of Europe, America doesnt want us and we appear to have been sucked into the new Cold War. Difficult times ahead for this little island. |
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Post by aghast on Mar 16, 2018 22:22:56 GMT
So, my knowledge of Nerve Agents and all that malarky is just based on my NBC training while employed by Queen Liz, so I am no expert and my knowledge may be well out of date. I've heard that Novichok is a 'persistent' agent. Basically, NA's fall into two categories, persistent or non-persistent. A non-persistent agent is one that when deployed, disappears pretty quickly. A persistent agent is one that say, falls to the ground and stays there for long periods, meaning people could still be affected a long time after the agent was deployed. I think this is the reason why we are still seeing a clean-up operation underway. Don't forget, in liquid form just one drop of this stuff on your skin can kill you, unless you are carrying something like Atropine which you inject into your thigh to counteract the agent, and to be fair Atropine is not the sort of stuff you can pick up at Boots. Oh, word of warning. If you do get hold of some Atropine, and you think you are under Nerve Agent attack, then please do use it. Be aware though, that if you do use it and you are not under Nerve Agent attack, the Atropine will probably kill you ! It's a dodgy game eh! Did the Russians do it? Well, if they are innocent, wouldn't you think that they'd try to identify how the agent came to be used in the UK, and how someone got hold of it? Instead of ramping up International tension, don't you think they'd say, "hey, hold on. Let's work together to find out how this happened!". From the Russian reaction I don't think there is any doubt that they did this. Nobs you can stick your atropine jab up yer arse, i would rather die than propel that needle into my thigh, if i remember rightly you save the needle and put it through the arm of your noddy suit ,3 max wasn't it, Apparently the NA was designed to bypass nato nbc equipment, so it beggars the question if it was as claimed Novichok, how did we detect it and more importantly how did it not penetrate the very equipment it was designed to penetrate ,and how did we know what it was if its never been seen before, yes it could be those pesky ruskies however it it government or organised crime who deployed it, you have to admit a lot of it doesn't add up, one reason being that whoever deployed the na left some behind. Does may or others really believe that the measures they have taken against russia are going to do any good, they sail their ships openly in our waters. It's quite feasible that the na was obtained on the black market as the average soldier /guard over there isn't exactly flush with cash It was a pretty amateur attack. It didn't work. They live, thankfully. Even Putin's opponents in Russia are saying it might not be down to him. If he wanted the job done, he would have made sure it was done. It's very easy for the West to point the blame at an evil devil from Russia, and it makes them all look very strong and forthright, but there are a lot of questions about why Putin would have done this, what he would have achieved from it, and what he thought the fallout would have been. I'm not defending him. He's a rotter. But I have a lot of doubts about him being the man behind it. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 22:42:57 GMT
Nobs you can stick your atropine jab up yer arse, i would rather die than propel that needle into my thigh, if i remember rightly you save the needle and put it through the arm of your noddy suit ,3 max wasn't it, Apparently the NA was designed to bypass nato nbc equipment, so it beggars the question if it was as claimed Novichok, how did we detect it and more importantly how did it not penetrate the very equipment it was designed to penetrate ,and how did we know what it was if its never been seen before, yes it could be those pesky ruskies however it it government or organised crime who deployed it, you have to admit a lot of it doesn't add up, one reason being that whoever deployed the na left some behind. Does may or others really believe that the measures they have taken against russia are going to do any good, they sail their ships openly in our waters. It's quite feasible that the na was obtained on the black market as the average soldier /guard over there isn't exactly flush with cash It was a pretty amateur attack. It didn't work. They live, thankfully. Even Putin's opponents in Russia are saying it might not be down to him. If he wanted the job done, he would have made sure it was done. It's very easy for the West to point the blame at an evil devil from Russia, and it makes them all look very strong and forthright, but there are a lot of questions about why Putin would have done this, what he would have achieved from it, and what he thought the fallout would have been. I'm not defending him. He's a rotter. But I have a lot of doubts about him being the man behind it. Yes, there are a thousand and one other ways of killing someone and getting away with it, but sometimes, the killer wants it known that he did it! It was the same with the Polonium 210 attack on Litvenko (!). Why use that when a simple dose of say, Arsenic, would have done the same? Both attacks are a statement. "I did it, you know I did it, but you can't prove a thing!". You just cannot walk into Boots and buy the stuff to make the NA or Polonium, and knock it up in your kitchen. If so, there are plenty of Mohammed's who would have this stuff by now. Here's a thought. If the Russians were innocent, don't you think that behind the scenes they would have told the British Government that they'd do everything they could to find out what happened? They wouldn't have wanted things to escalate the way they have. Instead, the rhetoric and bluster coming out of Moscow just seems to point to the fact they have something to hide. |
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Post by stuart1974 on Mar 16, 2018 22:49:06 GMT
As always, the world is a dangerous place, which makes the defence cuts even more mystifying. We've nothing left to defend. We are no longer part of Europe, America doesnt want us and we appear to have been sucked into the new Cold War. Difficult times ahead for this little island. In terms of defence we are still a major player, large in European terms, a member of NATO still and we have niche skills the US want. Recent events, a hungry new Defence Secretaty and Tory backbenchers are likely to prevent significant cuts in the upcoming review. I'm hearing May is going to the NATO summit in the summer with "news". She is unlikely to say we are pulling up the drawbridge after the last couple of weeks. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 22:53:59 GMT
I'l also add, we are still in NATO. Pulling out of the EU will not affect our defence capabilities a single iota.
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Post by stuart1974 on Mar 16, 2018 22:54:14 GMT
I don't always agree with Nobby when it comes to politics but on this topic he is right.
As far as the attempt failing, they may not be dead but I fear a recovery is not too hopeful. This nerve agent is likely to cause lasting damage, including to the police officer.
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Post by William Wilson on Mar 17, 2018 7:41:56 GMT
It was a pretty amateur attack. It didn't work. They live, thankfully. Even Putin's opponents in Russia are saying it might not be down to him. If he wanted the job done, he would have made sure it was done. It's very easy for the West to point the blame at an evil devil from Russia, and it makes them all look very strong and forthright, but there are a lot of questions about why Putin would have done this, what he would have achieved from it, and what he thought the fallout would have been. I'm not defending him. He's a rotter. But I have a lot of doubts about him being the man behind it. Here's a thought. If the Russians were innocent, don't you think that behind the scenes they would have told the British Government that they'd do everything they could to find out what happened? How do you know they haven`t? |
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Post by William Wilson on Mar 17, 2018 10:31:28 GMT
Changing the subject slightly, ever heard of the Darwin Awards?
"The Darwin Awards are a tongue-in-cheek honor, originating in Usenet newsgroup discussions around 1985. They recognize individuals who have supposedly contributed to human evolution by selecting themselves out of the gene pool via death or sterilization by their own actions."
It seems to me that anyone who publically crosses Vladimir Putin, should be given one of these awards.
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