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Post by oldgas on Dec 27, 2020 12:03:10 GMT
Oooh the snowflake is upset 😭 No, you're the snowflake. We've already established that.😉 |
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yattongas
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Post by yattongas on Dec 27, 2020 12:21:10 GMT
He hasn’t explained yet how this is another win ?
I’m sure he’ll come up with something racist ( great banter ha ha ha ) as to why N. Ireland & Scotland leaving the union is a big win for Brexit England 🏴
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2020 12:38:31 GMT
He hasn’t explained yet how this is another win ? I’m sure he’ll come up with something racist ( great banter ha ha ha ) as to why N. Ireland & Scotland leaving the union is a big win for Brexit England 🏴 Yatton Can I respectfully suggest you ignore Oldgas's inane rambling? He is exposed for what he is, let's leave him to it. I don't believe there is a person who contributes to this mini forum who takes him seriously, nor attributes his opinions with an ounce of credibility. Although not for the want of trying by Stuart and Gassy. Just sit back and laugh |
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Post by yattongas on Dec 27, 2020 13:14:34 GMT
He hasn’t explained yet how this is another win ? I’m sure he’ll come up with something racist ( great banter ha ha ha ) as to why N. Ireland & Scotland leaving the union is a big win for Brexit England 🏴 Yatton Can I respectfully suggest you ignore Oldgas's inane rambling? He is exposed for what he is, let's leave him to it. I don't believe there is a person who contributes to this mini forum who takes him seriously, nor attributes his opinions with an ounce of credibility. Although not for the want of trying by Stuart and Gassy. Just sit back and laugh Point taken, he does try and troll me but the idiot doesn’t understand that I’m speaking about him not to him. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2020 13:16:10 GMT
Yatton Can I respectfully suggest you ignore Oldgas's inane rambling? He is exposed for what he is, let's leave him to it. I don't believe there is a person who contributes to this mini forum who takes him seriously, nor attributes his opinions with an ounce of credibility. Although not for the want of trying by Stuart and Gassy. Just sit back and laugh Point taken, he does try and troll me but the idiot doesn’t understand that I’m speaking about him not to him. 👍👍 |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2020 13:30:56 GMT
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Post by oldgas on Dec 27, 2020 13:31:25 GMT
The (Political class) Scottish desire for independence reminds me a little of a child with its nose pressed to the sweet shop window. The likes of Sturgeon, and Salmond before her, desire Scottish independence only for the sense of power and achievement they think it will bestow on them. At the moment Sturgeon enjoys, to a large extent, power without responsibility, because whatever she does at the moment, she knows she can always fall back on Westminster and the Union if it all goes horribly wrong.
How different all that will be if they gain independence from the UK. Deprived of the Barnet Formula and cut off from Westmimster funding, Scotland will become a whole lot chillier. She keeps harping on about the wonders of the EU, I have often wondered if Scotland didn't do rather well from Brussels as a result of UK membership, with Scotland receiving plenty of EU aid, paid for of course out of the ridiculous membership fees paid by the UK, which in all practical terms meant English tax payers. I can see Sturgeon promising the Scottish people immediate membership of the EU on gaining independence, with a resumption of the grant money pouring in from Brussels. I think the reality will be somewhat different, with the EU not keen to take in another hungry mouth to feed, with that particular baby contributing nothing in return. One of the reasons the Irish were so keen to see us forced to stay in the EU was the fact they would be expected to pay a lot more in, with the expectation they will get a lot less back. That Varadker chap and his henchman Coveny were full of EU threats of how we would be punished if we dared to leave, seemingly forgetting that when the Irish economy was on the rocks it was the UK government that stepped in and bailed them out.
I think the government should let Sturgeon have her referendum. The Scottish people should then be told that if they vote for independence then so be it, they will be on their own from that point on. No more Barnet Formula, no more English cash of any sort, and the best of luck with joining the EU. They should also be told they will no longer be using the British Pound, they will no longer be Brits, so come up with your own worthless currency, perhaps with a picture of William Wallace on their bank notes. They should also be advised to look for a new leader with the surname Minnow, for that's about the size of the fish they'd be if imdependent. Faced with that sort of prospect I feel sure the Scottish people, with their famed attachment to money, would soon send that stupid woman packing.
In the same vein, I can see, over time, Erin seeking closer ties with the U.K., once they witness the gradual stagnation of the EU and realise the horrible expense of being trapped in the Euro currency, which after all is designed to protect the interests of Germany and France, which is really the sole purpose of the whole EU juggernaut, they may decide it's a whole lot better to be best friends with us, rather than two-faced, petty minded little assholes like Macron.
Freedom Day is 5 days and counting.
REJOICE!
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Post by yattongas on Dec 27, 2020 13:41:23 GMT
Devastating for musicians, making touring too expensive for most . There will be so many of these things coming about , the car industry will shrivel and die that’s for sure over the coming years. |
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Post by trevorgas on Dec 27, 2020 13:41:49 GMT
Scotland will be interesting as there will be no auto readmission to the EU and Spain in particular will be very against as they don't want a precedent set for Basque independence. The Scots will have to consider very carefully the pros/cons of Independence as it's not cut and dried. The challenge will be who will lead the pro Union group,Gordon Brown ,it could never be a Tory and a bit like the EU referendum will facts be thin on the ground. The thing is Clive, if the reading of the NI position is accurate, then there is now precedent for admitting Scotland into the Customs Union, accepting the jurisdiction of the ECJ and then perhaps the Single Market. That most likely is all they would want economically. That would be a huge stepping stone to full independence. A rather funny consequence of a policy and treaty purpatrated by the Conservative and Unionist Party. Especially and rather deliciously, as their supporters and leave voters were baying at the moon over "sovereignty" (Excluding you, obviously) I don't read it that way Les,NI is surely a unique one off due to the need to maintain peace and I don't believe it sets a precedent. Scotland voted as part of the UK however without telling additional considerations around the peace process,if we extend your Argument then London etc would be on the same route. |
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Post by yattongas on Dec 27, 2020 13:58:22 GMT
I see that the Irish government is going to finance the Erasmus scheme for N.Ireland students
Third level students from Northern Ireland colleges will continue to be able to study in Europe under the Erasmus+ scheme after the UK leaves the EU because the Irish Government will fund them.
The estimated cost will be around €2.1m per year.
Erasmus enables third level students to study for part or all of their degree in another EU member state or undertake a work placement abroad, with their fees and costs paid.
The exchanges usually take place during the second or third year of a course and can last up to 12 months.
Last year, 649 students and staff from Northern Ireland took part in the scheme.
Funding will be available to all full-time students attending third level institutions and will not be limited to those with an Irish passport, so British passport holders will also qualify.
British Prime Minister Boris Johnson confirmed on Christmas Eve that the UK had rejected an offer to remain part of the EU programme and will instead develop its own alternative policy.
In April last year, the Irish Government decided that, in anticipation of a possible no-deal Brexit outcome, arrangements should be made to enable students of relevant institutions in Northern Ireland to have continued access to the programme.
Concern had been expressed that students from less affluent backgrounds would be worst hit as they could not fund their travel and expenses without the programme.
The initiative was signed off when Minister for Further and Higher Education Simon Harris brought a detailed paper to Cabinet several weeks ago.
It means that after Brexit third level students in Northern Ireland will have access to a programme no longer available to their counterparts in England, Scotland or Wales.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2020 14:07:23 GMT
I see that the Irish government is going to finance the Erasmus scheme for N.Ireland students Third level students from Northern Ireland colleges will continue to be able to study in Europe under the Erasmus+ scheme after the UK leaves the EU because the Irish Government will fund them. The estimated cost will be around €2.1m per year. Erasmus enables third level students to study for part or all of their degree in another EU member state or undertake a work placement abroad, with their fees and costs paid. The exchanges usually take place during the second or third year of a course and can last up to 12 months. Last year, 649 students and staff from Northern Ireland took part in the scheme. Funding will be available to all full-time students attending third level institutions and will not be limited to those with an Irish passport, so British passport holders will also qualify. British Prime Minister Boris Johnson confirmed on Christmas Eve that the UK had rejected an offer to remain part of the EU programme and will instead develop its own alternative policy. In April last year, the Irish Government decided that, in anticipation of a possible no-deal Brexit outcome, arrangements should be made to enable students of relevant institutions in Northern Ireland to have continued access to the programme. Concern had been expressed that students from less affluent backgrounds would be worst hit as they could not fund their travel and expenses without the programme. The initiative was signed off when Minister for Further and Higher Education Simon Harris brought a detailed paper to Cabinet several weeks ago. It means that after Brexit third level students in Northern Ireland will have access to a programme no longer available to their counterparts in England, Scotland or Wales. Well, there you go. More evidence of a move down the path of unification. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2020 14:15:51 GMT
The thing is Clive, if the reading of the NI position is accurate, then there is now precedent for admitting Scotland into the Customs Union, accepting the jurisdiction of the ECJ and then perhaps the Single Market. That most likely is all they would want economically. That would be a huge stepping stone to full independence. A rather funny consequence of a policy and treaty purpatrated by the Conservative and Unionist Party. Especially and rather deliciously, as their supporters and leave voters were baying at the moon over "sovereignty" (Excluding you, obviously) I don't read it that way Les,NI is surely a unique one off due to the need to maintain peace and I don't believe it sets a precedent. Scotland voted as part of the UK however without telling additional considerations around the peace process,if we extend your Argument then London etc would be on the same route. I agree the key drivers are unique to Ireland. But resolution I don't believe is. From a Unionist viewpoint this has to be seen as a dangerous precedent, surely. For the life of me, I cannot see how, if these arrangements are entered into the Statute Book, how they could be denied to other parts of the current UK. It would make no constitutional sense. Unless of course NI leaves the UK and unites with Eire. |
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yattongas
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Post by yattongas on Dec 27, 2020 14:25:03 GMT
I see that the Irish government is going to finance the Erasmus scheme for N.Ireland students Third level students from Northern Ireland colleges will continue to be able to study in Europe under the Erasmus+ scheme after the UK leaves the EU because the Irish Government will fund them. The estimated cost will be around €2.1m per year. Erasmus enables third level students to study for part or all of their degree in another EU member state or undertake a work placement abroad, with their fees and costs paid. The exchanges usually take place during the second or third year of a course and can last up to 12 months. Last year, 649 students and staff from Northern Ireland took part in the scheme. Funding will be available to all full-time students attending third level institutions and will not be limited to those with an Irish passport, so British passport holders will also qualify. British Prime Minister Boris Johnson confirmed on Christmas Eve that the UK had rejected an offer to remain part of the EU programme and will instead develop its own alternative policy. In April last year, the Irish Government decided that, in anticipation of a possible no-deal Brexit outcome, arrangements should be made to enable students of relevant institutions in Northern Ireland to have continued access to the programme. Concern had been expressed that students from less affluent backgrounds would be worst hit as they could not fund their travel and expenses without the programme. The initiative was signed off when Minister for Further and Higher Education Simon Harris brought a detailed paper to Cabinet several weeks ago. It means that after Brexit third level students in Northern Ireland will have access to a programme no longer available to their counterparts in England, Scotland or Wales. Well, there you go. More evidence of a move down the path of unification. We must remember that poorer kids don’t study abroad even though the Irish government specifically sight this as a reason for funding Erasmus 🙄 |
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Post by oldgas on Dec 27, 2020 14:33:48 GMT
Devastating for musicians, making touring too expensive for most . There will be so many of these things coming about , the car industry will shrivel and die that’s for sure over the coming years. Our resident EU heroes, who belittled the British Fishing Industry, saying it only accounted for 0.1% of GDP, are now up in arms because a few niche musicians here and in Europe will have to pay a bit more if they want to tour abroad. How many people will be affected, how much money are we talking about? I doubt it will have any major impact on the main music entertainment business, or the likes of Take That, Robbie Williams, etc etc. Nearly all of the big stuff is Brit musicians touring Europe anyway, so where's the problem? And the source of this earth-shattering, deal-busting news? The Independent! What a pair of Doozies! One of whom, amazingly, finds comparisons in this with the car manufacturing industry! Oooh, me sides! |
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Post by trevorgas on Dec 27, 2020 14:35:03 GMT
I don't read it that way Les,NI is surely a unique one off due to the need to maintain peace and I don't believe it sets a precedent. Scotland voted as part of the UK however without telling additional considerations around the peace process,if we extend your Argument then London etc would be on the same route. I agree the key drivers are unique to Ireland. But resolution I don't believe is. From a Unionist viewpoint this has to be seen as a dangerous precedent, surely. For the life of me, I cannot see how, if these arrangements are entered into the Statute Book, how they could be denied to other parts of the current UK. It would make no constitutional sense. Unless of course NI leaves the UK and unites with Eire. I think your last sentence will be the direction of travel Having lived in Scotland for 13 years I do worry for my Scottish friends,whilst the moral case for Independence is undeniable the economic case is more murky and will depend on how much Westminster is prepared to support post an independence vote. I don't see post Jan 1st how Scotland can rejoin the EU without a formal process and we know how the Spanish feel about that. Nearly 70% of Scotlands export go to the rest of the UK which is an added complication,hard border along Hadrians Wall!! |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2020 14:40:11 GMT
Well, there you go. More evidence of a move down the path of unification. We must remember that poorer kids don’t study abroad even though the Irish government specifically sight this as a reason for funding Erasmus 🙄 Oh I agree. Anything that broadens the outlook and education of our young has to be encouraged. Luckily for the youth of NI a government their parents do not pay tax to in Dublin has agreed to fund this opportunity for them. A stark contrast to the mealy mouthed nationalists in our so called government. I notice in America that certain books have been banned from being taught. I believe The Grapes of Wrath by John Steinbeck is amongst them. An absolute classic. Such is the slippery road once we allow flag waving nationalists to get into power. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2020 14:45:19 GMT
I agree the key drivers are unique to Ireland. But resolution I don't believe is. From a Unionist viewpoint this has to be seen as a dangerous precedent, surely. For the life of me, I cannot see how, if these arrangements are entered into the Statute Book, how they could be denied to other parts of the current UK. It would make no constitutional sense. Unless of course NI leaves the UK and unites with Eire. I think your last sentence will be the direction of travel Having lived in Scotland for 13 years I do worry for my Scottish friends,whilst the moral case for Independence is undeniable the economic case is more murky and will depend on how much Westminster is prepared to support post an independence vote. I don't see post Jan 1st how Scotland can rejoin the EU without a formal process and we know how the Spanish feel about that. Nearly 70% of Scotlands export go to the rest of the UK which is an added complication,hard border along Hadrians Wall!! All good points and nothing to argue against. On the export %, I believe that's the same for NI. I think my point remains however, stopping short of full independence, why Scotland should not push for the same trading terms with the EU? |
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Post by trevorgas on Dec 27, 2020 14:50:10 GMT
I think your last sentence will be the direction of travel Having lived in Scotland for 13 years I do worry for my Scottish friends,whilst the moral case for Independence is undeniable the economic case is more murky and will depend on how much Westminster is prepared to support post an independence vote. I don't see post Jan 1st how Scotland can rejoin the EU without a formal process and we know how the Spanish feel about that. Nearly 70% of Scotlands export go to the rest of the UK which is an added complication,hard border along Hadrians Wall!! All good points and nothing to argue against. On the export %, I believe that's the same for NI. I think my point remains however, stopping short of full independence, why Scotland should not push for the same trading terms with the EU? I think we know it would not be politically acceptable,after 4 years I am sure we all want this behind us,so I can Indy 2 being the next bit of political theatre . |
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Post by Gassy on Dec 27, 2020 15:52:27 GMT
And on the opposite view, when I lived in mainland Europe - I never showed my passport unless I left the Schengen zone. Seems odd because I've flown several times from France to Italy and had to show a passport every time. Also drove from France into Switzerland (no one at the border going) however on the way back got into hot water as there was a presence at border checking passports and I didn't have mine on me. Live in France and driving a French registered car didn't think I'd need it driving to Switzerland. How wrong I was ! Maybe its a larger country thing? I lived in Slovakia and travelled to Austria, Czech, Poland, Hungary, Switzerland, Portugal, Denmark & Germany without having my passport checked. The only times I ever had it checked was one other time on a coach going into Poland and when the height of the refugees across Europe in 2016 roughly |
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Post by Gassy on Dec 27, 2020 16:00:57 GMT
Can't really argue with that point of view, especially the complacency. However, one thing I won't accept is when people will look back on our time in the EU as a disaster where we've been trapped and bullied by Brussels. We've prospered under the EU, if that time is now over then so be it - we move on onwards & upwards (hopefully). But many of the comments of hatred towards the EU have just been pathetic. Personally, it wouldn't surprise me to see the UK join again in 20 years time. I think much of the younger generation are fully behind EU membership and unless we really prosper, I can see a movement to join again coming back around. In all seriousness I can't see the EU surviving in its current format fo 20 years. I think the Euro currency is doomed, you just can't have one currency and a one size fits all economic policy with such divergent states. The Germans, with the French hanging on their coat tails will bully countries for only so long. Also, the Eastern European countries are more independently minded having not long escaped Soviet pclutches. They aren't keen on the closer integration demanded by Brussels, and I can see a number of nations saying enough, give us more freedom. The EU may in time return to what it should only ever have been, a Common Market for trading between European nations. Nothing wrong and plenty right with that, and it's what I voted for back in 1975. It was lying, cheating, duplicitous PM's of all shades that betrayed us. I'm so glad we're out. PS. I thought we were sh1t today. I completely disagree with this, but whats new there?  The Euro seems to be doing fine, I think we'll see less countries adopting the Euro as they join the EU though as typically when countries have adopted it, prices increase quite quickly. The Eastern European countries, having lived in one for 5 years, are pretty pro-EU. They know without the EU funding they'd bee f*cked as there is simply so much corruption there and funds going missing. If you're an eastern European country, if you want to actually compete - you must be an EU country. Otherwise tourism is lower, businesses won't invest/expand into those countries & you cannot attract good workers. Never mind that fact that you have much less buying power as a single nation than the single-market. In fact, a lot of those ex-Soviet countries are more used to being part of a larger community, if anything. Having been in Austro-Hungarian empire, German control, then Soviet. (And before you get in there, no - the EU cannot be compared to either of those). I actually think it'll be the smaller countries that'll drive the EU on as it is needed for many smaller countries. If we end up succeeding quite quickly and another country like Italy leaves, then you may be right - I think a few might consider it. Otherwise, I don't think anything will change at all. |
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