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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 5:13:23 GMT
Have read the numerous threads on here which always appears to degenerate into tit for tat arguments about our owners and whether or not there are realistic plans or a vision, whether their heart is in it, whether they should be gifting money to the club etc etc
Much of these debates seem to stem from people's expectations of what a football club owner should or shouldn't do and therefore rather than argue amongst ourselves and call each other names, I thought it might be wise to understand where each of us is coming from with regards to a football club ownership. We can at least understand people's motivation and perspectives before falling back to the tit for tat arguments!
So what is your expectations of a football club owner (could be any club)?
For me I have simple views:
1. Talk to the fan base on a regular basis (but only on important topics when there is something to communicate). 2. Make the maximum available budget available each year to the manager for recruitment based upon the rules in place 3. Invest in improving the facilities of the club on a reasonable commercial basis (i.e I do not expect owners to gift or write off money they loan to the club but that if the loan and charge interest then it is at a reasonable level and they have a right to protect themselves on the loans they make 4 Support the development of the club through improving the infrastructure and operations 5. Support the manager by putting in place the best staff support around him based upon what he needs and requests 6. Invest in youth teams / development to support throughput into first team squad and create assets that can either mitigate the need for transfers or can generate transfer income in the long term 7. Involve the fanbase as far as possible in major decisions such as ground redevelopment or improvements and be transparent as far as reasonable on them 8. Continually seek to improve the customers experience through improving offers, the match day and non match day opportunities etc 9. Charge reasonable prices and explain when prices change why they have and what's influenced it 10. Make good commercial decisions that put the clubs interest at the forefront and benefits the club in the maximum way possible
Based upon the above my view of our current owners is that they are doing OK. There are some areas they could be better in and they could take the opportunity more to bring the fans along with them and involve the fans a bit more and communicate a bit more (e.g they possibly would get less criticism about the training ground if people new at a summary level why it is taking the time it is taking or where in the process they were - be a little bit more transparent without breaking commercial leverage or non disclosure agreements and re the temporary stands, they sought feedback on - the fans could have stand a) which would cost £x amount or stand b) that would cost £y amount but if you go for a)then ticket prices will be whatever, but if you go for b) then ticket prices will have to increase to whatever to make it commercially viable. Fan representatives you decide which option we select and build.) But I don't believe that they should get as much stick as they currently do.
However, that's my view and not the debating point. My interest is as I said, what do people expect from football club ownership? (Not necessarily ours but owners in general)?
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Post by Henbury Gas on Sept 26, 2018 5:37:36 GMT
Good Post !
Agree with most of what you say
The only other thing i would add would be to TRUST the owners to do a good parenting of the club and that has to be earned, which in my case, they have
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 6:39:17 GMT
Have read the numerous threads on here which always appears to degenerate into tit for tat arguments about our owners and whether or not there are realistic plans or a vision, whether their heart is in it, whether they should be gifting money to the club etc etc Much of these debates seem to stem from people's expectations of what a football club owner should or shouldn't do and therefore rather than argue amongst ourselves and call each other names, I thought it might be wise to understand where each of us is coming from with regards to a football club ownership. We can at least understand people's motivation and perspectives before falling back to the tit for tat arguments! So what is your expectations of a football club owner (could be any club)? For me I have simple views: 1. Talk to the fan base on a regular basis (but only on important topics when there is something to communicate). 2. Make the maximum available budget available each year to the manager for recruitment based upon the rules in place 3. Invest in improving the facilities of the club on a reasonable commercial basis (i.e I do not expect owners to gift or write off money they loan to the club but that if the loan and charge interest then it is at a reasonable level and they have a right to protect themselves on the loans they make 4 Support the development of the club through improving the infrastructure and operations 5. Support the manager by putting in place the best staff support around him based upon what he needs and requests 6. Invest in youth teams / development to support throughput into first team squad and create assets that can either mitigate the need for transfers or can generate transfer income in the long term 7. Involve the fanbase as far as possible in major decisions such as ground redevelopment or improvements and be transparent as far as reasonable on them 8. Continually seek to improve the customers experience through improving offers, the match day and non match day opportunities etc 9. Charge reasonable prices and explain when prices change why they have and what's influenced it 10. Make good commercial decisions that put the clubs interest at the forefront and benefits the club in the maximum way possible Based upon the above my view of our current owners is that they are doing OK. There are some areas they could be better in and they could take the opportunity more to bring the fans along with them and involve the fans a bit more and communicate a bit more (e.g they possibly would get less criticism about the training ground if people new at a summary level why it is taking the time it is taking or where in the process they were - be a little bit more transparent without breaking commercial leverage or non disclosure agreements and re the temporary stands, they sought feedback on - the fans could have stand a) which would cost £x amount or stand b) that would cost £y amount but if you go for a)then ticket prices will be whatever, but if you go for b) then ticket prices will have to increase to whatever to make it commercially viable. Fan representatives you decide which option we select and build.) But I don't believe that they should get as much stick as they currently do. However, that's my view and not the debating point. My interest is as I said, what do people expect from football club ownership? (Not necessarily ours but owners in general)? That bit almost made me choke on me cornflakes !
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Post by singupgas on Sept 26, 2018 6:45:37 GMT
Long live the tents.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 6:58:38 GMT
Have read the numerous threads on here which always appears to degenerate into tit for tat arguments about our owners and whether or not there are realistic plans or a vision, whether their heart is in it, whether they should be gifting money to the club etc etc Much of these debates seem to stem from people's expectations of what a football club owner should or shouldn't do and therefore rather than argue amongst ourselves and call each other names, I thought it might be wise to understand where each of us is coming from with regards to a football club ownership. We can at least understand people's motivation and perspectives before falling back to the tit for tat arguments! So what is your expectations of a football club owner (could be any club)? For me I have simple views: 1. Talk to the fan base on a regular basis (but only on important topics when there is something to communicate). 2. Make the maximum available budget available each year to the manager for recruitment based upon the rules in place 3. Invest in improving the facilities of the club on a reasonable commercial basis (i.e I do not expect owners to gift or write off money they loan to the club but that if the loan and charge interest then it is at a reasonable level and they have a right to protect themselves on the loans they make 4 Support the development of the club through improving the infrastructure and operations 5. Support the manager by putting in place the best staff support around him based upon what he needs and requests 6. Invest in youth teams / development to support throughput into first team squad and create assets that can either mitigate the need for transfers or can generate transfer income in the long term 7. Involve the fanbase as far as possible in major decisions such as ground redevelopment or improvements and be transparent as far as reasonable on them 8. Continually seek to improve the customers experience through improving offers, the match day and non match day opportunities etc 9. Charge reasonable prices and explain when prices change why they have and what's influenced it 10. Make good commercial decisions that put the clubs interest at the forefront and benefits the club in the maximum way possible Based upon the above my view of our current owners is that they are doing OK. There are some areas they could be better in and they could take the opportunity more to bring the fans along with them and involve the fans a bit more and communicate a bit more (e.g they possibly would get less criticism about the training ground if people new at a summary level why it is taking the time it is taking or where in the process they were - be a little bit more transparent without breaking commercial leverage or non disclosure agreements and re the temporary stands, they sought feedback on - the fans could have stand a) which would cost £x amount or stand b) that would cost £y amount but if you go for a)then ticket prices will be whatever, but if you go for b) then ticket prices will have to increase to whatever to make it commercially viable. Fan representatives you decide which option we select and build.) But I don't believe that they should get as much stick as they currently do. However, that's my view and not the debating point. My interest is as I said, what do people expect from football club ownership? (Not necessarily ours but owners in general)? That bit almost made me choke on me cornflakes ! Which is your prerogative but what are your expectations of what football owners should do that makes you feel that way??
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Post by althepirate on Sept 26, 2018 7:00:41 GMT
My worry is why aren't they developing the training ground?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 7:05:39 GMT
Mate without being disrespectful, what is the point of a comment like that? Adds absolutely nothing and doesn’t make you look smart or funny. I’ve asked what your expectations of a football owner is - not whether you like what our current or previous owners have / haven’t done. Nor have I asked if you agree with my view or not - your entitled to your own view. I’m just interested in what makes people think the way they do and in my opinion that is driven by what your expectations are of what a football club owner should do irrespective of the club they own. Now if you can’t answer that then fair enough but don’t derail a thread because you can’t or don’t want to. Read and move on.....
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 7:07:57 GMT
My worry is why aren't they developing the training ground? But what’s driving that worry? If it was any other owner at any other club would you still worry or think there was something untoward going on?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 7:18:59 GMT
I could write lots but I will boil it down to one key tenet:
'You have to be willing to risk your own money and potentially make a loss.'
I really do take a penny pinching attitude as a sign that an owner of a football club doesn't care about the club and is in it for entirely the wring reasons because they are avoiding putting their own skin in the game.
As supporters we are not guaranteed value for money, we pay at the turnstile and have no recourse to our money back if we are paying to watch the likes of Payne not even bother to jump for a ball and lose 3-0. That is money down the drain for the supporter. Consequently for the owners of that club to want to buy in and not risk losing any money by hook or by crook is a slap in the face.
Football is an expensive business and the goal has to be to make a club sustainable in the long run but in the short term a successful team needs to be assembled and as an owner you have to be willing to fund that, at least partially, by injecting money into the club as necessary rather than 100% via the refinancing of existing assets.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 7:30:41 GMT
I could write lots but I will boil it down to one key tenet: 'You have to be willing to risk your own money and potentially make a loss.' I really do take a penny pinching attitude as a sign that an owner of a football club doesn't care about the club and is in it for entirely the wring reasons because they are avoiding putting their own skin in the game. As supporters we are not guaranteed value for money, we pay at the turnstile and have no recourse to our money back if we are paying to watch the likes of Payne not even bother to jump for a ball and lose 3-0. That is money down the drain for the supporter. Consequently for the owners of that club to want to buy in and not risk losing any money by hook or by crook is a slap in the face. Football is an expensive business and the goal has to be to make a club sustainable in the long run but in the short term a successful team needs to be assembled and as an owner you have to be willing to fund that, at least partially, by injecting money into the club as necessary rather than 100% via the refinancing of existing assets. Thank you 365 and I can see why you have the views about our current owners that you do. I’m guessing if you saw them gifting money in the short term but converting that gift to shares whereby the risk is allocated to share performance then your view may be slightly different?
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Post by Henbury Gas on Sept 26, 2018 7:35:40 GMT
My worry is why aren't they developing the training ground? still going through the green belt planning process - could take a LONG TIME
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Post by Henbury Gas on Sept 26, 2018 7:38:39 GMT
I could write lots but I will boil it down to one key tenet: 'You have to be willing to risk your own money and potentially make a loss.' I really do take a penny pinching attitude as a sign that an owner of a football club doesn't care about the club and is in it for entirely the wring reasons because they are avoiding putting their own skin in the game.As supporters we are not guaranteed value for money, we pay at the turnstile and have no recourse to our money back if we are paying to watch the likes of Payne not even bother to jump for a ball and lose 3-0. That is money down the drain for the supporter. Consequently for the owners of that club to want to buy in and not risk losing any money by hook or by crook is a slap in the face. Football is an expensive business and the goal has to be to make a club sustainable in the long run but in the short term a successful team needs to be assembled and as an owner you have to be willing to fund that, at least partially, by injecting money into the club as necessary rather than 100% via the refinancing of existing assets. so do you want "A" owner(s) to run the club as an expensive hobby or a sustainable business ?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 7:40:33 GMT
Imo they bought the club and now regret it because they couldn’t have the uwe development too themselves,so now a tart up operation has begun until they can find a way out that suits their pockets. Ground wise we are going backwards. Communication backwards Playing budget backwards Training ground that’s a laugh. Improving the Matchday experience,the style of football we play gone backwards the most important thing imo. Most places you stand in the ground you get wet and if que for food you get wet if raining. Thatchers bar very good
Butcombe bar good Overall we ain’t going nowhere but backwards until a full revamp or new stadium we can all sit in and sing good night Irene.
Tents are not for us....
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Post by Henbury Gas on Sept 26, 2018 7:42:55 GMT
Imo they bought the club and now regret it because they couldn’t have the uwe development too themselves,so now a tart up operation has begun until they can find a way out that suits their pockets. Ground wise we are going backwards. Communication backwards Playing budget backwards Training ground that’s a laugh. Improving the Matchday experience,the style of football we play gone backwards the most important thing imo. Most places you stand in the ground you get wet and if que for food you get wet if raining. Thatchers bar very good The good Butcombe bar good Overall we ain’t going nowhere but backwards until a full revamp or new stadium we can all sit in and sing good night Irene. Tents are not for us.... How about watching the game on ifollow from the comfort of your living room, sounds a lot more appealing after your comments
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2018 7:47:01 GMT
I could write lots but I will boil it down to one key tenet: 'You have to be willing to risk your own money and potentially make a loss.' I really do take a penny pinching attitude as a sign that an owner of a football club doesn't care about the club and is in it for entirely the wring reasons because they are avoiding putting their own skin in the game. As supporters we are not guaranteed value for money, we pay at the turnstile and have no recourse to our money back if we are paying to watch the likes of Payne not even bother to jump for a ball and lose 3-0. That is money down the drain for the supporter. Consequently for the owners of that club to want to buy in and not risk losing any money by hook or by crook is a slap in the face. Football is an expensive business and the goal has to be to make a club sustainable in the long run but in the short term a successful team needs to be assembled and as an owner you have to be willing to fund that, at least partially, by injecting money into the club as necessary rather than 100% via the refinancing of existing assets. Thank you 365 and I can see why you have the views about our current owners that you do. I’m guessing if you saw them gifting money in the short term but converting that gift to shares whereby the risk is allocated to share performance then your view may be slightly different? Yeah that would be one way of showing some good faith. I just don't see what forces an owner to care about the club if they can easily retrieve their loss. If you knew that you could sell an asset, get the basic market rate for it and then walk away having lost nothing would you care about the fate of that business? Would you be determined to make it a success or would the easy out make you ambivalent? I can only speak for myself and I know what would motivate me to make a business a success! People may say "you can't expect a family the Al Qadi's to put in 10 million unsecured" - good, because that would force half-assed owners like these out of the game. Football is pay to play and if you haven't got deep pockets go and invest in penny stocks and get your kicks that way.
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Post by Severncider on Sept 26, 2018 7:47:24 GMT
Good Post ! Agree with most of what you say The only other thing i would add would be to TRUST the owners to do a good parenting of the club and that has to be earned, which in my case, they have "You may think that but I cannot possibly comment" Francis Ewen Urquhart who is alive and well in the Boardroom.
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 26, 2018 7:52:48 GMT
Imo they bought the club and now regret it because they couldn’t have the uwe development too themselves,so now a tart up operation has begun until they can find a way out that suits their pockets. Ground wise we are going backwards. Communication backwards Playing budget backwards Training ground that’s a laugh. Improving the Matchday experience,the style of football we play gone backwards the most important thing imo. Most places you stand in the ground you get wet and if que for food you get wet if raining. Thatchers bar very good The good Butcombe bar good Overall we ain’t going nowhere but backwards until a full revamp or new stadium we can all sit in and sing good night Irene. Tents are not for us.... How about watching the game on ifollow from the comfort of your living room, sounds a lot more appealing after your comments After watching the last two away games, Shrewsbury and Luton, that was even less appealing than watching at the Mem! The big issue is everything is linked to a new stadium, communication, the playing budget and, hopefully, performances, fans moral, etc, etc, would then all improve if we got one, without it we'll slowly go backwards.
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Post by singupgas on Sept 26, 2018 7:55:00 GMT
Mate without being disrespectful, what is the point of a comment like that? Adds absolutely nothing and doesn’t make you look smart or funny. I’ve asked what your expectations of a football owner is - not whether you like what our current or previous owners have / haven’t done. Nor have I asked if you agree with my view or not - your entitled to your own view. I’m just interested in what makes people think the way they do and in my opinion that is driven by what your expectations are of what a football club owner should do irrespective of the club they own. Now if you can’t answer that then fair enough but don’t derail a thread because you can’t or don’t want to. Read and move on..... The board came in with setting expectations saying Rovers need a new stadium and then looked at a training facility. My expectation of the current lot is very low as they show no intention of building either. The UWE deal wasn't right, fair enough, over a year on we are yet to see anything from the board. The Training ground, they own the ground, so what are they waiting for? I expect they have no money to invest in Bristol Rovers training ground or like the UWE wanted a cheaper deal, a £10M build for £2M. I am not content with continuing to watch Rovers play in front of a handful of tents. I am not content with us selling our best players every window. I think there is too much hiding from the truth and a fear to admit they cant meet fans ambitions and it is playing staff. There is little respect being shown to us as fans right now, we have a board that don't speak to us and when they do it carries next to no weight. For football club that supposedly has a lot going on, there is nothing to show from it. TG even if he did put the sausage roll prices up, he appears to be the only one with presence and making things happen. My interest and wanting to spend money on season tickets and going away is beginning to tire, on Saturday i could pursue other interests. After 20 years i wouldn't feel too guilty either. I would expect a mission statement of sorts, what they want to achieve and have it communicated with the fans. But honest communication not bits and pieces, vague mixed messages. I would then at the end of the season like a report, what they did and what they couldnt but how they could put that right, thank the fans for their continued support.
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Post by Henbury Gas on Sept 26, 2018 7:57:33 GMT
How about watching the game on ifollow from the comfort of your living room, sounds a lot more appealing after your comments After watching the last two away games, Shrewsbury and Luton, that was even less appealing than watching at the Mem! The big issue is everything is linked to a new stadium, communication, the playing budget and, hopefully, performances, fans moral, etc, etc, would then all improve if we got one, without it we'll slowly go backwards. Agree with your comments, Stadium had been and always will be the issue, and these things a) cost a bloody fortune to build and b) take forever to get approved
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Sept 26, 2018 8:00:56 GMT
Good Post ! Agree with most of what you say The only other thing i would add would be to TRUST the owners to do a good parenting of the club and that has to be earned, which in my case, they have "You may think that but I cannot possibly comment" Francis Ewen Urquhart who is alive and well in the Boardroom. Keep your friends close but your enemies closer?
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