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Post by Antonio Fargas on Sept 7, 2020 12:07:05 GMT
For the record, this is the longest matchday thread ever on here. The previous record was held by the 0-0 draw at Stevenage, that at the time was seen as the draw that would cost us promotion, but actually turned into the point that took us up. Yeah I went back and saw that as well. Was expecting the Dag and Red game to be the longest but for some reason we had two Matchday threads for it. Must be because no-one was actually at the game and were all sat at home watching it on laptops, TVs, IPads etc. I think one of them was for the away game that got bumped for the home game. |
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 7, 2020 12:41:19 GMT
Just watched the highlights again from yesterday. What was constantly doing us was the high press from us. Once Ipswich beat the high press and got in behind, our CBs were too slow to deal with the pace. Thing is GGMI I was saying exactly that after ten minutes and my Ipswich mate “couldn’t believe how high we were pressing with such slow central defenders “. - mine and his words exactly. We didn’t need to watch the highlights the following day. It was obvious all the match. So why didn’t he change things ? If we could see it after ten minutes and then I’d imagine many football people watching it could see it. Garner is a professional football coach trying his hand at management he should have seen it.And as for playing our best winger who’s 5 foot nothing as a lone target man what the hell is that all about ? That's one of my concerns with BG in that he doesn't seem capable of changing our tactics when we're struggling, even during pre-season he seemed to religiously stick to 3-4-3, as if he'd found a winning formula he didn't want to change. Whereas I always thought pre-season was about trying different formations. I'm also pretty sure Ehmer played alongside just one CB at Gillingham, so he's probably as unfamiliar with 3 CB's as Kilgour is at playing left CB. |
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Post by richard on Sept 7, 2020 13:21:50 GMT
Yes exactly and since GC left they have got the opposite. This isn't a fashion business, but a results based one and up to now GC got the results and BG hasn't.That is a fact not an opinion. We all hope it will change of course we do. GC wasn't fancied by many fans. A lot of fans wanted Holloway, etc. As you say, it is not a fashion business and there are many successful managers who have "failed" at other clubs for whatever reasons, e.g. Mourinho at Man United, Brendan Rogers at Liverpool, etc. At L1 level, one only finds out how "good" the manager is once he is the manager and the players are playing for him and the fans are supporting him. At our level, pretty football is nice but survival and promotion are what we are after. GC was producing results and getting fan support; imagine what he would have got with a few newer players of his choice. I try not to criticise our managers but since BG has come in, our team has been battered by the opposition. The Southend 4-2 home win only came after we were 2-0 down; they should have buried us by 1/2 time. The season's last game against Sunderland was a good win but there wasn't much else. I think the formations used are wrong, ie. 4 or 5 needed at the back, especially away, players playing in wrong positions, overall composition of the team is not physically strong enough, no real playmakers, no tactical substitutional nous to change the game, etc. I hope I am badly wrong and the team begins to gel and flow this season. Would I prefer GC football or BG football? GC by a long way; because the team played for each other. To build such a team again will take quite a few years I feel.
The manager for the Southend game you reference was GC! We also lost at Home to Bolton under GC.
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Post by yaz on Sept 7, 2020 14:18:35 GMT
GC wasn't fancied by many fans. A lot of fans wanted Holloway, etc. As you say, it is not a fashion business and there are many successful managers who have "failed" at other clubs for whatever reasons, e.g. Mourinho at Man United, Brendan Rogers at Liverpool, etc. At L1 level, one only finds out how "good" the manager is once he is the manager and the players are playing for him and the fans are supporting him. At our level, pretty football is nice but survival and promotion are what we are after. GC was producing results and getting fan support; imagine what he would have got with a few newer players of his choice. I try not to criticise our managers but since BG has come in, our team has been battered by the opposition. The Southend 4-2 home win only came after we were 2-0 down; they should have buried us by 1/2 time. The season's last game against Sunderland was a good win but there wasn't much else. I think the formations used are wrong, ie. 4 or 5 needed at the back, especially away, players playing in wrong positions, overall composition of the team is not physically strong enough, no real playmakers, no tactical substitutional nous to change the game, etc. I hope I am badly wrong and the team begins to gel and flow this season. Would I prefer GC football or BG football? GC by a long way; because the team played for each other. To build such a team again will take quite a few years I feel.
The manager for the Southend game you reference was GC! We also lost at Home to Bolton under GC.
I stand corrected re GC being manager vs Southend on 07/12/19. We lost at home to Bolton who had lost? their previous 7 games? That is typical Rovers losing to the bottom club when everyone else was thrashing them? |
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Post by stevek192 on Sept 7, 2020 14:30:30 GMT
Thhe centre backs are not that slow . The problem iis when you play a back three the opposition will attempt to drag the centre halves out wide and that is where we were caught out particularly Kilgour who was absolutely attrocious and was not helped by having Leahy on his side.The 3 at the back depends on the wing backs covering when defending and if that don't happen then you are in trouble.Eher and Baldwin are capable of being a strong central unit but I am not convinced in the three. Personally felt if we were going to play the three then Harries or Kelly should have got the nod ahead of Kilgour who has been the poorest in the friendlies.
In truth until we bring a couple of strikers in we are going to struggle and that is my sole criticism of our summer business- the lack of goals which will cost BG his job if it is not sorted and quick.
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Post by gasandelectricity on Sept 7, 2020 15:01:54 GMT
The manager for the Southend game you reference was GC! We also lost at Home to Bolton under GC.
I stand corrected re GC being manager vs Southend on 07/12/19. We lost at home to Bolton who had lost? their previous 7 games? That is typical Rovers losing to the bottom club when everyone else was thrashing them? I’d take an embarrassment against the bottom of the league again vs being the embarrassment of the league for this season like we have been after christmas. |
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 7, 2020 15:03:09 GMT
Thhe centre backs are not that slow . The problem iis when you play a back three the opposition will attempt to drag the centre halves out wide and that is where we were caught out particularly Kilgour who was absolutely attrocious and was not helped by having Leahy on his side.The 3 at the back depends on the wing backs covering when defending and if that don't happen then you are in trouble.Eher and Baldwin are capable of being a strong central unit but I am not convinced in the three. Personally felt if we were going to play the three then Harries or Kelly should have got the nod ahead of Kilgour who has been the poorest in the friendlies. In truth until we bring a couple of strikers in we are going to struggle and that is my sole criticism of our summer business- the lack of goals which will cost BG his job if it is not sorted and quick. Much respect, Steve, but in reverance i think it runs much deeper than this. Little on the right has not performed like a bone fide right wing back in my time watching him. Hardly up and down the line, some nice touches but no expert delivery from flanks and no blocking of crosses or shots. Injury mitigation, but you may agree or disagree? v Ipswich, Ehmer and Baldwin appeared to be caught out by pace. No marking These two points (amongst others) were contributory to the two goals that placed us in a lost position......the first two goals were finished on the right side most would reasonably expect a right back/right sided central defender to cover. Great with hindsight, but in contemporary time some of us were hoping we might have reverted quickly to a flat back 4... It might have closed up opportunity for an attacking force and given us space in midfield. If we had kept Cam high up pitch, with his dynamo energy, he could push forward and supported.........ah. um. Himself. |
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Post by WeAreTheGas on Sept 7, 2020 15:17:30 GMT
Thhe centre backs are not that slow . The problem iis when you play a back three the opposition will attempt to drag the centre halves out wide and that is where we were caught out particularly Kilgour who was absolutely attrocious and was not helped by having Leahy on his side.The 3 at the back depends on the wing backs covering when defending and if that don't happen then you are in trouble.Eher and Baldwin are capable of being a strong central unit but I am not convinced in the three. Personally felt if we were going to play the three then Harries or Kelly should have got the nod ahead of Kilgour who has been the poorest in the friendlies. In truth until we bring a couple of strikers in we are going to struggle and that is my sole criticism of our summer business- the lack of goals which will cost BG his job if it is not sorted and quick. Much respect, Steve, but in reverance i think it runs much deeper than this. Little on the right has not performed like a bone fide right wing back in my time watching him. Hardly up and down the line, some nice touches but no expert delivery from flanks and no blocking of crosses or shots. Injury mitigation, but you may agree or disagree? v Ipswich, Ehmer and Baldwin appeared to be caught out by pace. No marking These two points (amongst others) were contributory to the two goals that placed us in a lost position......the first two goals were finished on the right side most would reasonably expect a right back/right sided central defender to cover. Great with hindsight, but in contemporary time some of us were hoping we might have reverted quickly to a flat back 4... It might have closed up opportunity for an attacking force and given us space in midfield. If we had kept Cam high up pitch, with his dynamo energy, he could push forward and supported.........ah. um. Himself. Agree with your assessment of Little. He’s a 32-year-old with a ropey injury record - IMO his days of being a quick, dynamic wingback are behind him. I’d play him at RCB or not at all. |
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 7, 2020 15:42:14 GMT
Much respect, Steve, but in reverance i think it runs much deeper than this. Little on the right has not performed like a bone fide right wing back in my time watching him. Hardly up and down the line, some nice touches but no expert delivery from flanks and no blocking of crosses or shots. Injury mitigation, but you may agree or disagree? v Ipswich, Ehmer and Baldwin appeared to be caught out by pace. No marking These two points (amongst others) were contributory to the two goals that placed us in a lost position......the first two goals were finished on the right side most would reasonably expect a right back/right sided central defender to cover. Great with hindsight, but in contemporary time some of us were hoping we might have reverted quickly to a flat back 4... It might have closed up opportunity for an attacking force and given us space in midfield. If we had kept Cam high up pitch, with his dynamo energy, he could push forward and supported.........ah. um. Himself. Agree with your assessment of Little. He’s a 32-year-old with a ropey injury record - IMO his days of being a quick, dynamic wingback are behind him. I’d play him at RCB or not at all. Wasn't RCB the position he'd looked good at in most of the pre-season games? I can't understand why he moved him to RWB when Hare impressed in that role before his injury, even Kilgour seems a better option whilst Rodman is out injured. |
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Post by stevek192 on Sept 7, 2020 15:56:18 GMT
The first goal was entirely down to too much space down our left side which drew everybody across to that side and then crossed to the far post where their player was unmarked.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 7, 2020 16:05:57 GMT
where their player was unmarked. Exactly. And the corner too? BG changed nothing to rectify either situation, but in his defence BG has been consistent. He rarely reacts to anything on pitch real time until it's too late.. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2020 16:18:31 GMT
where their player was unmarked. Exactly. And the corner too? BG changed nothing to rectify either situation, but in his defence BG has been consistent. He rarely reacts to anything on pitch real time until it's too late.. Conceding from a corner will be no different whether we had a back 4 or a back 3. The same players will have been in the box and defending - badly! FWIW I generally prefer a back 4 and think our midfield and attacking players would operate better in a 4-3-3. However, there is nothing wrong with different formations, just look at the even more adventurous way Sheffield United play under Wilder. BG is unlikely to change what he has been working towards after losing one cup game. |
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Sept 7, 2020 18:01:02 GMT
I'd probably go 451 at the moment.
We are a bit short of strikers so I'd give Ayunga a chance at holding the ball up for our attack minded midfield to support.
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Post by landrover on Sept 7, 2020 19:00:37 GMT
Is Ehmer fit cos judging on what I saw he most certainly ain’t.
He was treading water with the first goal and should have got back in time to cut out the cross. As for the second goal, he collapsed like a rag doll after allowing himself to be blocked off. He was always the wrong side of Chambers anyway.
And what the hell is he doing pushing 10 yards into the Ipswich half for the third, leaving his team short of numbers at the back.
We are up sh*t street if he’s the best defender we have.
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Post by Colyton Gas on Sept 7, 2020 19:15:14 GMT
Rollin was better on Sat's displays from the three Centre Backs.Don't like thinking about it really as it was so easy to knock all our players off the ball.
Massive improvement needed and for BG to say we didn't take our chances was somewhat disingenuous as we only had two.
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Post by james246 on Sept 7, 2020 19:31:34 GMT
For me each of our central defenders was played out of position
In the pre season friendly games AK plated off his right foot, but suddenly in Saturday's match he played had to play off his left. In the pre season games CH or MK played the left side position.
ME is an old school centre half who is used to taking on the opponents attacking focal point, in a back three he should be the middle man.
The two wing backs did not play well, and we started the game without one striker on the field and only one on the bench.
Ben's post match interview demonstrated no understanding of the match he had just managed
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Post by lastminutewinner on Sept 7, 2020 20:00:38 GMT
Thing is GGMI I was saying exactly that after ten minutes and my Ipswich mate “couldn’t believe how high we were pressing with such slow central defenders “. - mine and his words exactly. We didn’t need to watch the highlights the following day. It was obvious all the match. So why didn’t he change things ? If we could see it after ten minutes and then I’d imagine many football people watching it could see it. Garner is a professional football coach trying his hand at management he should have seen it.And as for playing our best winger who’s 5 foot nothing as a lone target man what the hell is that all about ? , even during pre-season he seemed to religiously stick to 3-4-3, as if he'd found a winning formula he didn't want to change. Whereas I always thought pre-season was about trying different formations. I'm also pretty sure Ehmer played alongside just one CB at Gillingham, so he's probably as unfamiliar with 3 CB's as Kilgour is at playing left CB. True, and he has had a lot of practice at it already! |
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Post by yaz on Sept 7, 2020 22:27:50 GMT
Agree with your assessment of Little. He’s a 32-year-old with a ropey injury record - IMO his days of being a quick, dynamic wingback are behind him. I’d play him at RCB or not at all. Wasn't RCB the position he'd looked good at in most of the pre-season games? I can't understand why he moved him to RWB when Hare impressed in that role before his injury, even Kilgour seems a better option whilst Rodman is out injured. He is not a natural Right Back. He gets exposed too much and out of position a lot. Rollin was superb in this position end last season; a bit raw but tough to get past. Hare is a much better option. Playing Little further up puts much less risk on our defence. I for one cannot understand why we got rid of Rollin after waiting patiently for him to emerge from the 2nd teamers? |
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