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Post by axegas on Sept 27, 2020 17:01:00 GMT
I think there’s a difference between writing something off and saying hey let’s not reach a final verdict on a manager and team 3 games of the way through the season. I think everyone on here wanted Rovers to win their first three games and for them to put a lot of effort in trying to achieve it in the process, not seen a single poster say “oh well these games don’t matter at all now”.
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Post by Gassy on Sept 27, 2020 17:08:05 GMT
Do you actually care to show or prove where “so many oh well write off the first 3 matches”? Or are you just making it up, to back your view point? I look forward to seeing the quotes from so many of these posters. This is not a show and tell game (even though I didn't originally post this, I do however believe it as this is commonly used cliché) and I'm not particularly into trawling or trolling fellow GasHeads. What else would the giving more time theory mean? After the first match? After the second match? After this, the 24th match? It is if you're going to question why people ask a point, when no one has made that point. I think we've seen from GGMI since the first game against Sunderland that in fact, it is a show and tell game. But in reality: no, is your answer. No one has said the first 3 games don't count. Giving someone more time also doesn't mean "write off the first 3 matches", you are aware? If some people want to give Ben's (failing) project more time, then so be it. That is their opinion to hold, but don't go making things up to suit your argument.
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 27, 2020 17:10:37 GMT
Do you actually care to show or prove where “so many oh well write off the first 3 matches”? Or are you just making it up, to back your view point? I look forward to seeing the quotes from so many of these posters. This is not a show and tell game (even though I didn't originally post this, I do however believe it as this is commonly used cliché) and I'm not particularly into trawling or trolling fellow GasHeads. What else would the giving more time theory mean? After the first match? After the second match? After this, the 24th match? So if you owned Rovers and appointed a manger on a 2.5 year contract at £150K(?) p.a. and his assistant at another 2 year at £100K(?) p.a. and also given him your entire summer transfer/wage budget (£1.5m+) would you sack him as you'd lost 3 tough looking opening games and then have find another £500K(?) to bring in his replacement, or stick with him in the hope things improved and he saved you £1m in wasted wages/contracts? (NB: all figures shown are 100% guesses)
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 27, 2020 17:11:17 GMT
This is not a show and tell game (even though I didn't originally post this, I do however believe it as this is commonly used cliché) and I'm not particularly into trawling or trolling fellow GasHeads. What else would the giving more time theory mean? After the first match? After the second match? After this, the 24th match? Giving someone more time also doesn't mean "write off the first 3 matches", you are aware? It means exactly this. What else does it mean?
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 27, 2020 17:17:07 GMT
This is not a show and tell game (even though I didn't originally post this, I do however believe it as this is commonly used cliché) and I'm not particularly into trawling or trolling fellow GasHeads. What else would the giving more time theory mean? After the first match? After the second match? After this, the 24th match? So if you owned Rovers and appointed a manger on a 2.5 year contract at £150K(?) p.a. and his assistant at another 2 year at £100K(?) p.a. and also given him your entire summer transfer/wage budget (£1.5m+) would you sack him as you'd lost 3 tough looking opening games and then have find another £500K(?) to bring in his replacement, or stick with him in the hope things improved and he saved you £1m in wasted wages/contracts? (NB: all figures shown are 100% guesses) Guesses? A manger is about right... Ok..... please accept apologies for my pendantic joke on a mis-spelling that actually made me laugh.... It isn't 3 opening games. It's 20+ With two transfer windows. I would be asking my manager of written accountability of Timmy Abraham, Ginnely and all his acquisition. Why are we recruiting a Chelsea development kid when we have Cam and others in our development squad that need developing? Money spent? Good point. What's the cost of relegation?
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Post by Gassy on Sept 27, 2020 17:20:13 GMT
Giving someone more time also doesn't mean "write off the first 3 matches", you are aware? It means exactly this. What else does it mean? No it doesn't. It can mean they want to give them another chance. It can mean their mind isn't made up yet. It can mean they believe they can improve. It can mean they don't believe 3 games is enough to make a decision. It can mean a lot of things. I want to give Ben 1 more chance to win against Northampton, does that mean I've written off the first 3 games? Think outside the box here, just because someone might have a different opinion on firing Garner, doesn't mean they're written everything off.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 27, 2020 17:47:30 GMT
It means exactly this. What else does it mean? No it doesn't. It can mean they want to give them another chance. It can mean their mind isn't made up yet. It can mean they believe they can improve. It can mean they don't believe 3 games is enough to make a decision. It can mean a lot of things. I want to give Ben 1 more chance to win against Northampton, does that mean I've written off the first 3 games? Think outside the box here, just because someone might have a different opinion on firing Garner, doesn't mean they're written everything off. All of the above can be copied and pasted to the 3 games, or 23 games BG has already been in tenure of (with his own exclusive transfer window)... It's arbitrary. Giving time can always be used as a disguise. It's a resort to writing off difficult matches we'd much rather not concentrate on. Fine. No problem. What about all the previous matches BG has been in charge of? ....I have tried to think outside the box, but whomever was at Southend must be thinking the same as yesterday 5pm.....wtf? Different opinion? Really? I mean, really? Based on what?
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Post by Gas-Ed on Sept 27, 2020 17:54:17 GMT
This is not a show and tell game (even though I didn't originally post this, I do however believe it as this is commonly used cliché) and I'm not particularly into trawling or trolling fellow GasHeads. What else would the giving more time theory mean? After the first match? After the second match? After this, the 24th match? So if you owned Rovers and appointed a manger on a 2.5 year contract at £150K(?) p.a. and his assistant at another 2 year at £100K(?) p.a. and also given him your entire summer transfer/wage budget (£1.5m+) would you sack him as you'd lost 3 tough looking opening games and then have find another £500K(?) to bring in his replacement, or stick with him in the hope things improved and he saved you £1m in wasted wages/contracts? (NB: all figures shown are 100% guesses) If I were Wael, having just put £25m into the club, I would be wanting a lot more from the manager. Wait 6 or 7 more games and we could easily be 12 - 15 points adrift at the bottom. A new manager coming in would already need miracles with a squad without a goalscorer. I’ve said it about 30 times before on this forum without a response - can anyone remember a manager turning around a record like Garner’s?
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Post by casey12a on Sept 27, 2020 17:59:47 GMT
So if you owned Rovers and appointed a manger on a 2.5 year contract at £150K(?) p.a. and his assistant at another 2 year at £100K(?) p.a. and also given him your entire summer transfer/wage budget (£1.5m+) would you sack him as you'd lost 3 tough looking opening games and then have find another £500K(?) to bring in his replacement, or stick with him in the hope things improved and he saved you £1m in wasted wages/contracts? (NB: all figures shown are 100% guesses) If I were Wael, having just put £25m into the club, I would be wanting a lot more from the manager. Wait 6 or 7 more games and we could easily be 12 - 15 points adrift at the bottom. A new manager coming in would already need miracles with a squad without a goalscorer. I’ve said it about 30 times before on this forum without a response - can anyone remember a manager turning around a record like Garner’s? No because it's never happened, the longer we leave it the worse it is for the next manager. Spend this week lining up his replacement.
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Post by Gassy on Sept 27, 2020 18:05:02 GMT
No it doesn't. It can mean they want to give them another chance. It can mean their mind isn't made up yet. It can mean they believe they can improve. It can mean they don't believe 3 games is enough to make a decision. It can mean a lot of things. I want to give Ben 1 more chance to win against Northampton, does that mean I've written off the first 3 games? Think outside the box here, just because someone might have a different opinion on firing Garner, doesn't mean they're written everything off. All of the above can be copied and pasted to the 3 games, or 23 games BG has already been in tenure of (with his own exclusive transfer window)... It's arbitrary. Giving time can always be used as a disguise. It's a resort to writing off difficult matches we'd much rather not concentrate on. Fine. No problem. What about all the previous matches BG has been in charge of? ....I have tried to think outside the box, but whomever was at Southend must be thinking the same as yesterday 5pm.....wtf? Different opinion? Really? I mean, really? Based on what? Ah ok, so when I say I want to give Ben 1 last chance to win against Northampton, otherwise he's out - and this is on the basis that I've watched every game, including going to Southend away - instead of me using the previous games to drive me to that decision, no no I'm actually disguising my true feelings and I'm writing off the previous 3 games this season. Even though I've taken them into account to drive me to this decision, I am wrong, because a stranger on the internet called o2o2bo2ba - has told me that I'm wrong. Using your own logic (which we've already proven is flawed because you've already shown that you'll literally make up an argument from other fans to back up your argument), I can only assume you said to fire Ben from the first loss against Wimbledon? Your theory states that either you must believe in firing a manager, or you've written off the previous games. Therefore, you only make a decision on firing a manager, based on one game and one game only, because the previous games have already been written off. You're literally telling me that if you don't think Ben should be fired right now, then you've written off the past 3 games. How on Earth is that you thinking outside the box? And yes, we have a different opinion, as I've stated in the post above. I'll repeat it for you: I want to give Ben 1 more chance, which is to win against Northampton. If he doesn't then IMO, he has to go. You want him to go now. You see? That is a different opinion.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2020 18:15:15 GMT
So if you owned Rovers and appointed a manger on a 2.5 year contract at £150K(?) p.a. and his assistant at another 2 year at £100K(?) p.a. and also given him your entire summer transfer/wage budget (£1.5m+) would you sack him as you'd lost 3 tough looking opening games and then have find another £500K(?) to bring in his replacement, or stick with him in the hope things improved and he saved you £1m in wasted wages/contracts? (NB: all figures shown are 100% guesses) If I were Wael, having just put £25m into the club, I would be wanting a lot more from the manager. Wait 6 or 7 more games and we could easily be 12 - 15 points adrift at the bottom. A new manager coming in would already need miracles with a squad without a goalscorer. I’ve said it about 30 times before on this forum without a response - can anyone remember a manager turning around a record like Garner’s? The only real response is Thomas Frank, but even he turned it around after 12 games. Who on earth has turned round a win ratio like Garner’s after 20 odd games? It would be the most miraculous comeback since bloody Lazarus. It ain’t happening lads. Stick a fork in Garner because he’s done.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2020 18:17:44 GMT
All of the above can be copied and pasted to the 3 games, or 23 games BG has already been in tenure of (with his own exclusive transfer window)... It's arbitrary. Giving time can always be used as a disguise. It's a resort to writing off difficult matches we'd much rather not concentrate on. Fine. No problem. What about all the previous matches BG has been in charge of? ....I have tried to think outside the box, but whomever was at Southend must be thinking the same as yesterday 5pm.....wtf? Different opinion? Really? I mean, really? Based on what? Ah ok, so when I say I want to give Ben 1 last chance to win against Northampton, otherwise he's out - and this is on the basis that I've watched every game, including going to Southend away - instead of me using the previous games to drive me to that decision, no no I'm actually disguising my true feelings and I'm writing off the previous 3 games this season. Even though I've taken them into account to drive me to this decision, I am wrong, because a stranger on the internet called o2o2bo2ba - has told me that I'm wrong. Using your own logic (which we've already proven is flawed because you've already shown that you'll literally make up an argument from other fans to back up your argument), I can only assume you said to fire Ben from the first loss against Wimbledon? Your theory states that either you must believe in firing a manager, or you've written off the previous games. Therefore, you only make a decision on firing a manager, based on one game and one game only, because the previous games have already been written off. You're literally telling me that if you don't think Ben should be fired right now, then you've written off the past 3 games. How on Earth is that you thinking outside the box? And yes, we have a different opinion, as I've stated in the post above. I'll repeat it for you: I want to give Ben 1 more chance, which is to win against Northampton. If he doesn't then IMO, he has to go. You want him to go now. You see? That is a different opinion. It rather says it all that there are Sh1!heads on Otib desperate for us to win next week to paper over the cracks and keep Garner in a job. When your bitter neighbours want you to win that’s a good time to wake up and smell the coffee about the state we are in.
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Post by WeAreTheGas on Sept 27, 2020 18:29:02 GMT
Can’t we just accept & respect that not everyone will have the same threshold when it comes to wanting a manager replaced? And that someone having a different patience limit to yourself doesn’t make them deluded, loony or a ‘rose tinter’, but just a different person with a different point of view?
Not sure why everything has to be so black & white. You want Garner out? Yay, good Gashead! You don’t want Garner out? Boo, bad Gashead!
Tedious.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 27, 2020 18:33:32 GMT
All of the above can be copied and pasted to the 3 games, or 23 games BG has already been in tenure of (with his own exclusive transfer window)... It's arbitrary. Giving time can always be used as a disguise. It's a resort to writing off difficult matches we'd much rather not concentrate on. Fine. No problem. What about all the previous matches BG has been in charge of? I am wrong, because a stranger on the internet called o2o2bo2ba........
That's the most accurate post so far! 😋 Tongue in cheek, tongue out cheek sometimes. Shall we play tippy toe predictions on games? Northampton yes, here we go it's gelling... Oxford no...the gelneeds more time, oh but hang on game doesn't matter, journey, ref decision (s), give time etc? Think inside and outside the box as much as anyone likes, doesn't anyone think we've done that? ...it all leads back to the same place. Hmmmmm....
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 27, 2020 18:51:51 GMT
So if you owned Rovers and appointed a manger on a 2.5 year contract at £150K(?) p.a. and his assistant at another 2 year at £100K(?) p.a. and also given him your entire summer transfer/wage budget (£1.5m+) would you sack him as you'd lost 3 tough looking opening games and then have find another £500K(?) to bring in his replacement, or stick with him in the hope things improved and he saved you £1m in wasted wages/contracts? (NB: all figures shown are 100% guesses) If I were Wael, having just put £25m into the club, I would be wanting a lot more from the manager. Wait 6 or 7 more games and we could easily be 12 - 15 points adrift at the bottom. A new manager coming in would already need miracles with a squad without a goalscorer. I’ve said it about 30 times before on this forum without a response - can anyone remember a manager turning around a record like Garner’s? That's assuming we don't win any of our 6 or 7 games? I assume Wael & his BoD have decided how many games they'll give BG but I doubt they are checking the posts on Gaschat to see where that should be 3 or 4 etc.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 27, 2020 19:06:10 GMT
If I were Wael, having just put £25m into the club, I would be wanting a lot more from the manager. Wait 6 or 7 more games and we could easily be 12 - 15 points adrift at the bottom. A new manager coming in would already need miracles with a squad without a goalscorer. I’ve said it about 30 times before on this forum without a response - can anyone remember a manager turning around a record like Garner’s? .... but I doubt they are checking the posts on Gaschat to see where that should be 3 or 4 etc. Oh....😞
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Post by heartofgas on Sept 27, 2020 19:52:32 GMT
Yes everyone has a different opinion but it is down to Wael what happens.
I started watching rovers mid 80’s and just got to see one game at eastville. I,m 48 now and in those 35 years watching Rovers I’ve seen us in the Championship for 3 seasons and play some cracking football under Holloway. Aside from that it has been year after year of mediocrity and failure( including our stadium). In those 35 years we have not only failed to keep up with other team but have actually fallen further behind. DC worked a miracle getting us to league one. If we get relegated again how many years will we be down there 5 years/ 10 years? I used to wonder if rovers would get in the premier league in my lifetime. I am now wondering if we’ll ever see championship football again in my lifetime.( I’ve kinda given up hope on a new stadium) That’s why Wael needs to think long and hard about this. I will be forever grateful for his investment in the club and who knows where we would be without him. However the collapse of the UWE was a bitter pill to take and Relegation would be yet another hard bodyblow to take. I still think it was strange how Coughlin left. 4th in the league and he goes to manage in a league below, not sure if something like that has ever happened before with any other team. Ben came in and I bought into the whole project thing and it seemed to make sense. What we have seen since is complete failure. We could be out of sight at the bottom before Garner goes. For me, we just can’t go on any longer with Garner. We will be giving ourselves a Mountain to climb.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2020 20:09:56 GMT
To move away from the figures I posted earlier, for me, if you're going to sack a manager the next time he loses, he might as well be sacked now.
He's also done absolutely nothing, quite literally nothing, to be given the extra 1,4 or 7 games mooted by others here.
He's the worst manager in the history of Bristol Rovers, there is no precedent of anyone ever turning round a run like this.
The only run that's even comparable over such a long stretch is the L2 Leyton Orient team in the 90s, who collapsed to finish 3rd bottom. They did beat Wales in the following pre-season in a friendly though, so if Giggsy needs a friendly match ahead of their fixtures in October, it could be just what we need.
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Post by Gassy on Sept 27, 2020 20:44:16 GMT
That's the most accurate post so far! 😋 Tongue in cheek, tongue out cheek sometimes. Shall we play tippy toe predictions on games? Northampton yes, here we go it's gelling... Oxford no...the gelneeds more time, oh but hang on game doesn't matter, journey, ref decision (s), give time etc? Think inside and outside the box as much as anyone likes, doesn't anyone think we've done that? ...it all leads back to the same place. Hmmmmm.... I'm so confused by your quoting, I'm not really sure how to reply
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Post by Gassy on Sept 27, 2020 20:52:44 GMT
To move away from the figures I posted earlier, for me, if you're going to sack a manager the next time he loses, he might as well be sacked now.He's also done absolutely nothing, quite literally nothing, to be given the extra 1,4 or 7 games mooted by others here. He's the worst manager in the history of Bristol Rovers, there is no precedent of anyone ever turning round a run like this. The only run that's even comparable over such a long stretch is the L2 Leyton Orient team in the 90s, who collapsed to finish 3rd bottom. They did beat Wales in the following pre-season in a friendly though, so if Giggsy needs a friendly match ahead of their fixtures in October, it could be just what we need. Problem is with this theory, is where does it stop? If you're going to sack a manager next month, why not now? And so on. Also, I'm not saying to sack him next time he loses, what if (by some miracle) we win 3 in a row? Do we sack him at the first defeat? No, of course not. Wael put a lot of money into this club during a global pandemic, off the field he's probably taken us the furthest we've been in a long, long time. For some reason, he believes in Ben a lot - I think we owe Wael to see Ben's team try their chances against one of the weakest teams in the division at home. We've faced teams who'll be at the top of the division, 2 of them away from home. Now is Ben's chance to prove he can at least make us a midtable team, by beating Northampton. If he can't do that, then f*ck it - all hope really is lost. Ah ok, so when I say I want to give Ben 1 last chance to win against Northampton, otherwise he's out - and this is on the basis that I've watched every game, including going to Southend away - instead of me using the previous games to drive me to that decision, no no I'm actually disguising my true feelings and I'm writing off the previous 3 games this season. Even though I've taken them into account to drive me to this decision, I am wrong, because a stranger on the internet called o2o2bo2ba - has told me that I'm wrong. Using your own logic (which we've already proven is flawed because you've already shown that you'll literally make up an argument from other fans to back up your argument), I can only assume you said to fire Ben from the first loss against Wimbledon? Your theory states that either you must believe in firing a manager, or you've written off the previous games. Therefore, you only make a decision on firing a manager, based on one game and one game only, because the previous games have already been written off. You're literally telling me that if you don't think Ben should be fired right now, then you've written off the past 3 games. How on Earth is that you thinking outside the box? And yes, we have a different opinion, as I've stated in the post above. I'll repeat it for you: I want to give Ben 1 more chance, which is to win against Northampton. If he doesn't then IMO, he has to go. You want him to go now. You see? That is a different opinion. It rather says it all that there are Sh1!heads on Otib desperate for us to win next week to paper over the cracks and keep Garner in a job. When your bitter neighbours want you to win that’s a good time to wake up and smell the coffee about the state we are in. So we should use their reactions on otib on when to fire our managers? I personally couldn't give a toss about them, or their opinions.
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