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Post by GasAttacK on Oct 28, 2020 9:25:07 GMT
Things to work on:
Four times this season and twice last night Harries sliced a low cross towards our own goal giving away needless corners. He has to work on that.
Baldwin does a lot of things well but like Harries I always feel there is a mistake waiting to happen. Was anybody that surprised when he left that back pass well short?
Our midfield 3 are not effective. They don't really protect the back 5 and they're not creating enough chances for the front 2. Maybe Liddle for Grant would help?
Tutonda gave their winger far too much space last night. Decent going forward but defensively needs to improve. Would like to see what Koike has to offer, he might be a better option when we know the opposition have real threats down our left.
There were positives but we have to find a way to turn possession in to attacks.
Rochdale won't be easy on Saturday. They drew 2-2 with Sunderland tonight, twice coming from behind in a game that would appear fairly even from the stats; 13 shots each, 3 corners each.
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Post by titchthephot on Oct 28, 2020 9:32:03 GMT
Things to work on: Four times this season and twice last night Harries sliced a low cross towards our own goal giving away needless corners. He has to work on that. Baldwin does a lot of things well but like Harries I always feel there is a mistake waiting to happen. Was anybody that surprised when he left that back pass well short? Our midfield 3 are not effective. They don't really protect the back 5 and they're not creating enough chances for the front 2. Maybe Liddle for Grant would help? Tutonda gave their winger far too much space last night. Decent going forward but defensively needs to improve. Would like to see what Koike has to offer, he might be a better option when we know the opposition have real threats down our left. There were positives but we have to find a way to turn possession in to attacks. Rochdale won't be easy on Saturday. They drew 2-2 with Sunderland tonight, twice coming from behind in a game that would appear fairly even from the stats; 13 shots each, 3 corners each. You have criticised the match last night BUT you have done in a positive, constructive way. You are totally correct that certain areas need to be worked on (hopefully BG will be thinking the same thing!). Your post is so much better than 'crap, sack BG' responses. We are a work in progress but the direction is the right one. It is going to take a while but I believe we have the foundation to get there. |
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Post by strads1983 on Oct 28, 2020 9:46:42 GMT
The thing is... with a packed out mem under the lights last night I feel we would have taken at least a point from that game!
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Post by lpgas1 on Oct 28, 2020 10:02:56 GMT
Bit of an over-reaction. I was just commenting on the defending which was sh**, nothing else. Why, would you try and argue our defending wasn’t sh**? Go on then, this should be interesting *grabs popcorn* You’re as nasty and spiteful on these threads as you are in your little communist community. how do you know he is a communist? and lets face it, we were good for about 3 minutes, then we were on the back foot |
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Post by cockergas on Oct 28, 2020 10:08:53 GMT
That’s it from me, I officially resign from match day threads.
Have to say I am really enjoying Watching us play at the moment, I’m gutted with the result yes, maybe it’s hard to compare ruining a wednesday at work and a ruined Sunday!
Fine margins yesterday, If Zain had buried that chance on half time who knows. The goals conceded were also really avoidable. Tutonda was very slow closing their player down for the cross, just seemed to jog towards him giving him the time and space to pick out their player free in the box. The second both Tutonda and Harries were very high up the pitch, in not sure whether Baldwin then slipped or was tripped but it effectively left them with 3 on 2 with Baldwin struggling to get back, Ehmer and Hare get pulled towards the ball leaving their player free at the back. Very naive in my book, Tutonda well forward OK but Harries also well in their half?
Third well what can you say, these thinks happen.
We also seemed to invite pressure in the second half, sitting too deep. But I think that’s sort of inevitable when you have a top team pushing for an equaliser, they are going to push forward and commit bodies, I’m sure this young team will learn and hopefully become more composed. At times when under pressure we treat the ball like a hot potato, hence some of the rushed and slices clearances. I really like Harries on the left side of the 3, really good with the ball at his feet and defends well, just needs that little bit of composure.
I’m still positive and feel we are more than capable to getting a result on Saturday
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Post by lpgas1 on Oct 28, 2020 10:10:37 GMT
As has been the case year after year, if the top teams turn up they are of a higher level than most in this league. The same was true even when we had Snake, Bodin, Ellis. There are good signs that things are coming together and with so many new additions and an inexperienced manager it is clearly going to take time. There, we had three good attacking players. We now have a promising kid, a forward who doesnt have a great scoring history, and a player from non league who is out injured. I would have preferred more investment in an experienced forward rather than the number of midfielders or defenders we have. At the moment our first team squad reads 12 defenders, 11 midfielders 3 forwards. and there lies the problem |
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Post by gashead1981 on Oct 28, 2020 10:48:08 GMT
Didn't see the game but wondered what sub changes should have made when we were under pressure? If Tutonda was being overrun then maybe a change with Leahy coming on in front of him in a 4-4-2? The best managers can change the shape of a team rather than the personnel but this is something that Garner can learn given time. Subs wouldn't have definitely changed the game but with the constant pressure you felt like a goal was coming and freshening it up may have disrupted Hull with something else to think about. And it's not so much the old days of clamouring for a Telford/Jakubiak just because they're not playing, there's no complaints with the starting XI. We spent the whole second half reacting to Hull so getting on the front foot would have helped us I think. We had a period of keeping the ball at 1-2 which we needed 10 minutes earlier. Although this could have just been Hull stepping back with their lead. Oztumer didn't do much when he came on and Nicholson just didn't have enough time to make an impact. But they are exciting players that force the opposition to at least react to our forward threats. I rate both Daly and Mccormick but their games are suited to forcing mistakes rather than driving the team forward. Nicholson dribbling could have dragged everyone forward so Hanlon wasn't so isolated too. Its all hypothetical though and nothing to get too worked up over, just something that could have been done differently. TL;DR Bringing on midfielders to add an extra threat might have disrupted Hull and eased some pressure but it's all hypothetical. Of course a change of players and tactics would have changed the game. Hull at 1-0 down were desperate to get back into the game, they were playing on the front foot for the whole of the first half from about minute 15, and right up until they went 2-1 up. They changed from a front 2 to a front 3 on the basis that Emanuel was beating Tutonda all ends up going forward so they basically loaded the box with an extra striker in Tom Eaves. We had a warning shot on about 50 mins when Hull missed a free header from a cross from their right. That was the time to change. If we had changed to a 433 or a 442 with Leahy coming in for Tutonda and putting Nicholson on for LMc with Ozzie playing off Hanlan would have changed the shape and made us have an extra body on the left. None of Hulls attacks were coming down our right as Hare pretty much had everything covered off. The only reason we got a bit of a foot hold at 2-1 was because Emanuel, and Honeyman in particular that ran their midfield, dropped deeper because it was job done. Ozzie came on at 70 mins but after 5 mins realised that if he was going to get any service to link, he had to drop into our half to get it, and also for some reason, Tutonda started coming inside more into the middle which forced Ozzie to drop back into the LWB position a few times. It was frustrating to watch because it was that obvious. It was like watching Donny all over again. It was just poor and hesitant decision making from the management that cost us anything from the game. I say anything as I would expect us to win, but after 2 mins you set yourself up for a result after going 1-0 up and being at home. |
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Post by WeAreTheGas on Oct 28, 2020 11:44:10 GMT
Things to work on: Four times this season and twice last night Harries sliced a low cross towards our own goal giving away needless corners. He has to work on that. Baldwin does a lot of things well but like Harries I always feel there is a mistake waiting to happen. Was anybody that surprised when he left that back pass well short? Our midfield 3 are not effective. They don't really protect the back 5 and they're not creating enough chances for the front 2. Maybe Liddle for Grant would help? Tutonda gave their winger far too much space last night. Decent going forward but defensively needs to improve. Would like to see what Koike has to offer, he might be a better option when we know the opposition have real threats down our left. There were positives but we have to find a way to turn possession in to attacks. Rochdale won't be easy on Saturday. They drew 2-2 with Sunderland tonight, twice coming from behind in a game that would appear fairly even from the stats; 13 shots each, 3 corners each. Agree with all of this. Before last night (as the updated stats aren’t available yet), we were ranked 21st in L1 for the quality of open play chances created in our first 7 league games. So it’s clearly an area we really need to improve in. Daly looks like a finisher to me, but he created last night’s goal out of nothing really. I’d say the only good chance we created ourselves last night was the Westbrooke pass-back in the 45th minute. Other than that there was very little attacking threat from us. As for the midfield, couldn’t agree more. Maybe time for someone like Oztumer, Hargreaves or Liddle to get a start. |
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Post by rememberhalifax on Oct 28, 2020 14:43:02 GMT
Well we lost a game that a few weeks ago we were nailed on to lose its just that hopes have risen given recent results ,then we get an early goal and we really believe we can win the game. The thing is if things are not going your way you either soldier on to the inevitable or change things and try something else. Last night we scored early, should have bagged a second and limited Hull to what, a couple of attempts on goal one of which was on target in the first half, so we would have been content at halfway but Hull certainly would not have been and therefore made changes which ultimately won them a game they were losing for 3/4 0f the match.BG is the man in charge of such calls for us and i am happy with that scenario, we would all do things differently and i would certainly make changes earlier than he tends to, IMHO you sometimes need to change a winning team to counter the oppositions strengths and weaknesses, a case in point is Tutonda , great signing, very good attack minded wing back BUT the defensive side of his game does not come natural to him and IMHO last night was a time to play a more defence minded player in that position, i am not picking on Dave , just using it as an example, any way its all about opinions as i said , its not the end of the world and we must regroup and be ready for a tough match at Dale where we are more than capable of returning with 3 points, up the Rovers!
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Post by wilmslowgas on Oct 28, 2020 18:39:42 GMT
Rochdale will be a tough game. Always is there. Nonetheless, Rochdale are no Hull and will not have the quality of players we faced last night. I fully expect us to leave Rochdale with at least one point.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Oct 28, 2020 20:43:00 GMT
Rochdale will be a tough game. Always is there. Nonetheless, Rochdale are no Hull and will not have the quality of players we faced last night. I fully expect us to leave Rochdale with at least one point. Plus.....no Henderson! He usually gets a goal.. |
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Post by goodnightirene1883 on Oct 29, 2020 8:23:14 GMT
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Post by lastminutewinner on Oct 29, 2020 14:21:27 GMT
Rochdale will be a tough game. Always is there. Nonetheless, Rochdale are no Hull and will not have the quality of players we faced last night. I fully expect us to leave Rochdale with at least one point. Defend like we did on Tuesday and they wont have to be. |
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Post by RD on Oct 29, 2020 14:53:36 GMT
I have to say, I really don't see what Wetbrook really offers at the moment (tin-hat firmly on). Think he flatters to deceive.
Don't get me wrong, not saying he's a poor player or even a poor signing - I just don't think he's done anywhere enough thus far.
Yes he might "look to play people in", but I could look to do that to if I was on the pitch. Like him though, I would simply fail to do so and give the ball away. As such, he doesn't really offer anything much going forward (at present, IMO) and similarly doesn't offer much protection to the back four. I'd actually play Luke over him based on what I've seen (if it were a case of one or the other).
Grant is the invisible man. Makelele used to be known for that but for different reasons. He makes the odd challenge, but not to the level you expect from a defensive midfielder.
Liddle is an odd one - signed for a fee (no doubt small don't get me wrong) but yet to even make the bench?
At the moment, I'm yet to really see any creativity from central midfield. In all honesty, I'd rather player 3 DMs, as even though they aren't going to create anything, at least then we might not concede as many! I was hugely underwhelmed with Oztumer last night but in fairness it was a tough game.
Harries I like actually - made a mistake and yes, does "look like he's got one in him" but then most defenders do at this level. Even the brilliant Tutonda had arguably his worst game last night IMO - gave the ball away a LOT and got done a couple of times.
Baldwin is a difficult one. At times he looks good enough and then you get moments like Hull's third last night - appalling.
Daly I love. Hanlon I think is very good too. McCormack I like for a young lad and love his passion. Tutonda is obviously good enough and Jak is the best keeper in the division by some distance. Harries is good enough IMO (far from perfect granted). Ehmer not bad and I think there's definitely more to come. Oztumer I was spaffing about when he signed and, whilst pretty unmemorable cameo last night, you'd hope he's better than that. But outside of that I don't think much of anyone else I'm if brutally honest - that's not to say that they can't improve (they're young and have recently signed after all), but I do think there are areas that will definitely require strengthening if we're to have genuine dreams of being in the playoff mix at some point (not necessarily this season, but more generally).
I'd drop Zain and start Oztumer next game personally.
Also BG needs to get a grip regarding substitutions. It was obvious to every man and their dog we were struggling last night - it was almost like he forgot we were allowed to make subs. Bizarre.
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Post by Gas Go Marching In on Oct 29, 2020 15:29:19 GMT
I have to say, I really don't see what Wetbrook really offers at the moment (tin-hat firmly on). Think he flatters to deceive. Don't get me wrong, not saying he's a poor player or even a poor signing - I just don't think he's done anywhere enough thus far. Yes he might "look to play people in", but I could look to do that to if I was on the pitch. Like him though, I would simply fail to do so and give the ball away. As such, he doesn't really offer anything much going forward (at present, IMO) and similarly doesn't offer much protection to the back four. I'd actually play Luke over him based on what I've seen (if it were a case of one or the other). Grant is the invisible man. Makelele used to be known for that but for different reasons. He makes the odd challenge, but not to the level you expect from a defensive midfielder. Liddle is an odd one - signed for a fee (no doubt small don't get me wrong) but yet to even make the bench? At the moment, I'm yet to really see any creativity from central midfield. In all honesty, I'd rather player 3 DMs, as even though they aren't going to create anything, at least then we might not concede as many! I was hugely underwhelmed with Oztumer last night but in fairness it was a tough game. Harries I like actually - made a mistake and yes, does "look like he's got one in him" but then most defenders do at this level. Even the brilliant Tutonda had arguably his worst game last night IMO - gave the ball away a LOT and got done a couple of times. Baldwin is a difficult one. At times he looks good enough and then you get moments like Hull's third last night - appalling. Daly I love. Hanlon I think is very good too. McCormack I like for a young lad and love his passion. Tutonda is obviously good enough and Jak is the best keeper in the division by some distance. Harries is good enough IMO (far from perfect granted). Ehmer not bad and I think there's definitely more to come. Oztumer I was spaffing about when he signed and, whilst pretty unmemorable cameo last night, you'd hope he's better than that. But outside of that I don't think much of anyone else I'm if brutally honest - that's not to say that they can't improve (they're young and have recently signed after all), but I do think there are areas that will definitely require strengthening if we're to have genuine dreams of being in the playoff mix at some point (not necessarily this season, but more generally). I'd drop Zain and start Oztumer next game personally. Also BG needs to get a grip regarding substitutions. It was obvious to every man and their dog we were struggling last night - it was almost like he forgot we were allowed to make subs. Bizarre. I think with Liddle, BG is being patient with him. There might be a part of his game BG wants to really work on before putting him in. Looking at the size of him I wouldn't be surprised if he's working hard in the gym. I'm pretty sure I remember Harries saying this is what he did with Him. It is also something I think Klopp does at Liverpool. |
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Post by TugPhase on Oct 29, 2020 16:23:04 GMT
I'd drop Zain and start Oztumer next game personally. I mentioned after the game that what really highlighted it to me was how good Honeyman was for Hull. He is the same style player as these two but looked far superior. Always wanting the ball, spinning and constantly playing dangerous, forward passes. I'm not against our two and think they will both be good players for us but they looked lower league compared to Honeyman on Tuesday. If anything, I think play them both. Take it to Rochdale... |
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Post by socrates on Oct 29, 2020 19:52:24 GMT
Things to work on: Four times this season and twice last night Harries sliced a low cross towards our own goal giving away needless corners. He has to work on that. Baldwin does a lot of things well but like Harries I always feel there is a mistake waiting to happen. Was anybody that surprised when he left that back pass well short? Our midfield 3 are not effective. They don't really protect the back 5 and they're not creating enough chances for the front 2. Maybe Liddle for Grant would help? Tutonda gave their winger far too much space last night. Decent going forward but defensively needs to improve. Would like to see what Koike has to offer, he might be a better option when we know the opposition have real threats down our left. There were positives but we have to find a way to turn possession in to attacks. Rochdale won't be easy on Saturday. They drew 2-2 with Sunderland tonight, twice coming from behind in a game that would appear fairly even from the stats; 13 shots each, 3 corners each. We certainly need to finish games better. 50% of the goals we’ve conceded have come 80mins +. Probably a sign that Garners subs haven’t been effecting the game in a positive manner. It certainly seems that way and this stat backs it up. |
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Oct 30, 2020 5:03:48 GMT
I'd drop Zain and start Oztumer next game personally. Omg I'm starting to agree with RD.! That's a good call.. |
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