stuart1974
Proper Gas
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Post by stuart1974 on Dec 28, 2021 17:26:36 GMT
We tried buying Ashton Gate at the time, that would have changed so much for us. who do we think we are trying to kid? City are miles ahead of us and have the structure and personnel to stay there. We should accept where we are and if Wael can inject enough cash to keep us going - that is fine by me. I feel for Wael if he tries to compete with City because that is all about pride. We do not need that - just enough guts to keep going. We are in a competition - but not with City! Go Wael, Go I think you have misread the context.
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Post by yattongas on Dec 28, 2021 17:39:37 GMT
We tried buying Ashton Gate at the time, that would have changed so much for us. who do we think we are trying to kid? City are miles ahead of us and have the structure and personnel to stay there. We should accept where we are and if Wael can inject enough cash to keep us going - that is fine by me. I feel for Wael if he tries to compete with City because that is all about pride. We do not need that - just enough guts to keep going. We are in a competition - but not with City! Go Wael, Go City are only “miles ahead” because they’ve had multi millions pumped into them . God knows how much it’s now with all the money Lansdown has written off and the current losses? It’s gotta be north of £100 million at a guess . Thats the only reason they are “miles ahead” …..or just one promotion for us and relegation for them and we’re back level ( Both unlikely but possible this season)
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Post by Topper Gas on Dec 28, 2021 17:41:28 GMT
who do we think we are trying to kid? City are miles ahead of us and have the structure and personnel to stay there. We should accept where we are and if Wael can inject enough cash to keep us going - that is fine by me. I feel for Wael if he tries to compete with City because that is all about pride. We do not need that - just enough guts to keep going. We are in a competition - but not with City! Go Wael, Go I think you have misread the context. The President Club's personnel seem good at doing that, you do wonder what planet they live on to be so out of touch with the club's fan base.
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Post by lympstonegas on Dec 28, 2021 19:05:29 GMT
Well their situation has moved their continued focus of enjoying speculating when we will go bust
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Post by yattongas on Dec 28, 2021 19:48:17 GMT
Any club that reports losses of over £38.3 million in a season should be punished with a double relegation.
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Post by gulfofaden on Dec 28, 2021 22:07:54 GMT
All I can hear is a voice in my head saying “points deduction. Points deduction. Points deduction”
Let’s be fair, this is one year they’re in a slight bit of trouble but Lady Luck has given them 2 teams points deductions to lift them clearer.
It only seems fair they get one.
Seems harsh, but then again, we’ve never burned their stadium down nor taken strikers off them in dubious circumstances out of spite
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Post by blueblood1883 on Dec 28, 2021 22:24:16 GMT
Drop this in when next passing.. It appears they haven't got one..
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2021 22:36:39 GMT
Drop this in when next passing.. It appears they haven't got one.. They literally have though, because it’s all funded by their owner who will write this off in the coming years like he always has done. He will have to bring their spend in a little bit though because they’ll have FFP issues if they don’t.
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Post by baggins on Dec 29, 2021 5:40:43 GMT
So much for having a brand new Stadium with all the facilities bringing financial and football success.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Dec 29, 2021 7:13:31 GMT
I hate them as much as the next man, but doesn't this prove just how ridiculous and unsustainable football is.
They have fantastic facilities, they get good TV revenue and they have an extremely wealthy owner yet they are hemorrhaging an unbelievable amount of money.
Something is serious wrong with football.
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Post by rememberhalifax on Dec 29, 2021 7:29:31 GMT
I hate them as much as the next man, but doesn't this prove just how ridiculous and unsustainable football is. They have fantastic facilities, they get good TV revenue and they have an extremely wealthy owner yet they are hemorrhaging an unbelievable amount of money. Something is serious wrong with football. Spot on Hugo and we could have a never ending debate about the reasons but as is often the case there is a wise old proverb which sums it up and it's to do with something being the root of all evil, now what was it? !
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Post by gulfofaden on Dec 29, 2021 8:13:09 GMT
I hate them as much as the next man, but doesn't this prove just how ridiculous and unsustainable football is. They have fantastic facilities, they get good TV revenue and they have an extremely wealthy owner yet they are hemorrhaging an unbelievable amount of money. Something is serious wrong with football. Not really, I can’t say I’m an expert on the rewards of getting to the prem, but I would guess it’s immediate prosperity if you get up the leagues into the top flight. Owners are therefore investing capital in the hope that they will be successful. It’s no different to venture capital. Plenty of people sink hundreds of thousands into businesses and they fail. The idea is, you invest a ton and later you get a pay off. A large majority of small to medium sized technology companies don’t make any money. They lose tons, and they are aiming to get to scale where the rewards are enormous. Look at Zoom. Lost a ton of money yet now, their product is an adjective in the English language and the name alone must be worth at least £20M probably multiples of that. Not picking a fight Hugo but just saying that a lot of businesses run at a loss in the hope of “doing a Leicester” and has the added benefit of bringing enjoyment to the owner. Another example of this is why people, despite all the numbers being against it, always want to plough all their money into their houses and buy to lets and avoid things like pensions and investment funds even though they are more tax efficient, less risky and (usually) provide better returns. Aside from the obvious issue that most people understand how a house works but not how a fund works, the other thing is that although ploughing money into a property or BTL often has a poor ROCE and is taxed heavily, the fringe benefit is the owner gets to live in a brilliant house. Same with a football club. An owner sat on £500M who wants to invest £100m speculatively would rather a football club where he gets the enjoyemnrt of the games, the adoration, hanging out with the players and the attractive women who orbit all things football…..rather this than a complicated tech start up infested with men with glasses and zero social skills in a drab office…. So the tendency is for rich men to keep investing…only becomes unsustainable when the rich men dry up, which isn’t happening until football becomes unpopular with rich men. I use the term “men” as it’s nearly all rich men doing it with very few women, just to clarify for any wokettes ready to screech me down.
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Post by wertongas on Dec 29, 2021 8:43:40 GMT
Any club that reports losses of over £38.3 million in a season should be punished with a double relegation. If they were punished with relegation which they deserve, half of the other teams in that division would deserve a similar fate , allot accrue similar losses last year , Bournemouth's was 60 million for example.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Dec 29, 2021 9:07:58 GMT
I hate them as much as the next man, but doesn't this prove just how ridiculous and unsustainable football is. They have fantastic facilities, they get good TV revenue and they have an extremely wealthy owner yet they are hemorrhaging an unbelievable amount of money. Something is serious wrong with football. Not really, I can’t say I’m an expert on the rewards of getting to the prem, but I would guess it’s immediate prosperity if you get up the leagues into the top flight. Owners are therefore investing capital in the hope that they will be successful. It’s no different to venture capital. Plenty of people sink hundreds of thousands into businesses and they fail. The idea is, you invest a ton and later you get a pay off. A large majority of small to medium sized technology companies don’t make any money. They lose tons, and they are aiming to get to scale where the rewards are enormous. Look at Zoom. Lost a ton of money yet now, their product is an adjective in the English language and the name alone must be worth at least £20M probably multiples of that. Not picking a fight Hugo but just saying that a lot of businesses run at a loss in the hope of “doing a Leicester” and has the added benefit of bringing enjoyment to the owner. Another example of this is why people, despite all the numbers being against it, always want to plough all their money into their houses and buy to lets and avoid things like pensions and investment funds even though they are more tax efficient, less risky and (usually) provide better returns. Aside from the obvious issue that most people understand how a house works but not how a fund works, the other thing is that although ploughing money into a property or BTL often has a poor ROCE and is taxed heavily, the fringe benefit is the owner gets to live in a brilliant house. Same with a football club. An owner sat on £500M who wants to invest £100m speculatively would rather a football club where he gets the enjoyemnrt of the games, the adoration, hanging out with the players and the attractive women who orbit all things football…..rather this than a complicated tech start up infested with men with glasses and zero social skills in a drab office…. So the tendency is for rich men to keep investing…only becomes unsustainable when the rich men dry up, which isn’t happening until football becomes unpopular with rich men. I use the term “men” as it’s nearly all rich men doing it with very few women, just to clarify for any wokettes ready to screech me down. No, I understand the point you are making, but I still find it bizarre. I mean, realistically there are only 23 places up for grabs. 20 in the prem and 3 yo yo teams at best? You can probably narrow that down further to 8 places and 3 yo-yo teams. It's a massive investment risk and an awful lot of money for such a finite number of places up for grabs. Coupled with the sheer cost of just treading water. I genuinely cannot get my head around it! I think you are spot on, Football is a rich man's vanity project and little more.
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Post by gulfofaden on Dec 29, 2021 9:39:32 GMT
Not really, I can’t say I’m an expert on the rewards of getting to the prem, but I would guess it’s immediate prosperity if you get up the leagues into the top flight. Owners are therefore investing capital in the hope that they will be successful. It’s no different to venture capital. Plenty of people sink hundreds of thousands into businesses and they fail. The idea is, you invest a ton and later you get a pay off. A large majority of small to medium sized technology companies don’t make any money. They lose tons, and they are aiming to get to scale where the rewards are enormous. Look at Zoom. Lost a ton of money yet now, their product is an adjective in the English language and the name alone must be worth at least £20M probably multiples of that. Not picking a fight Hugo but just saying that a lot of businesses run at a loss in the hope of “doing a Leicester” and has the added benefit of bringing enjoyment to the owner. Another example of this is why people, despite all the numbers being against it, always want to plough all their money into their houses and buy to lets and avoid things like pensions and investment funds even though they are more tax efficient, less risky and (usually) provide better returns. Aside from the obvious issue that most people understand how a house works but not how a fund works, the other thing is that although ploughing money into a property or BTL often has a poor ROCE and is taxed heavily, the fringe benefit is the owner gets to live in a brilliant house. Same with a football club. An owner sat on £500M who wants to invest £100m speculatively would rather a football club where he gets the enjoyemnrt of the games, the adoration, hanging out with the players and the attractive women who orbit all things football…..rather this than a complicated tech start up infested with men with glasses and zero social skills in a drab office…. So the tendency is for rich men to keep investing…only becomes unsustainable when the rich men dry up, which isn’t happening until football becomes unpopular with rich men. I use the term “men” as it’s nearly all rich men doing it with very few women, just to clarify for any wokettes ready to screech me down. No, I understand the point you are making, but I still find it bizarre. I mean, realistically there are only 23 places up for grabs. 20 in the prem and 3 yo yo teams at best? You can probably narrow that down further to 8 places and 3 yo-yo teams. It's a massive investment risk and an awful lot of money for such a finite number of places up for grabs. Coupled with the sheer cost of just treading water. I genuinely cannot get my head around it! I think you are spot on, Football is a rich man's vanity project and little more. I actually think this is a good argument for the super league. You have football fans and then you have armchair fans. I’m fed up of talksport talking about the same 5-6 clubs. I’m fed up of endless chatter about some player who’s name I can’t even pronounce having some kind of battle with some other player who can’t even pronounce the name of the club he plays for. This isn’t a sight on foreign people, I’m married to one. I just think the international nature of the top league dilutes it’s appeal. It’s just a bunch of ultimate journeymen playing solely for the money, managed by owners who most of the time come from despotic and cruel countries and got their money for their playthings by exploiting people or institutions. Let the big boys * off to China or India or wherever they think they can make the most coin, and the armchair fans can watch it on TV and we can have the football league back. Then hopefully the government can impose high taxes on those clubs to feed the Football league and if they don’t like it, Liverpool can relocate to Jinchuan and just be nakedly what these clubs are, international brands. Perhaps Liverpool fans might create “Liverpool AFC” and we get a club for the actual fans while their bizzare Harlem globetrotter big brother can relocate overseas. We would have to find a way to prevent players disappearing off there whenever they were wanted, but even if that’s the case, it’s no different to now. I really hope this happens as it’s the domination of the big clubs nicking all the youth talent, and their fans, if you aren’t actually from the place they claim to come from, are beneath contempt. A “lifelong man United/Liverpool fan” from Bristol who has no reason (like a family from there) to support them is just an egotistical kid who just wanted to always be on the winning team. Bah and humbug.
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Post by yattongas on Dec 29, 2021 9:45:38 GMT
Any club that reports losses of over £38.3 million in a season should be punished with a double relegation. If they were punished with relegation which they deserve, half of the other teams in that division would deserve a similar fate , allot accrue similar losses last year , Bournemouth's was 60 million for example. Ok , to make it fairer any club that loses between 38.3m and 38.5
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Post by lympstonegas on Dec 29, 2021 9:55:45 GMT
All I can hear is a voice in my head saying “points deduction. Points deduction. Points deduction” Let’s be fair, this is one year they’re in a slight bit of trouble but Lady Luck has given them 2 teams points deductions to lift them clearer. It only seems fair they get one. Seems harsh, but then again, we’ve never burned their stadium down nor taken strikers off them in dubious circumstances out of spite They’ve enjoyed the fact there are 2 teams with points deductions believing they just have to finish above 3rd from bottom in their current plight. The reality is if Derby and Reading hadn’t had points deducted they would currently be above City - Reading on goal difference, showing just how fragile their situation is. I’m sure they won’t get a points deduction but whose to say the likes of Barnsley Peterborough Cardiff and Hull won’t accrue more points than them if they did. They surely can’t be relying on buying themselves out of trouble in the Jan transfer window so need to find a consistent winning formula real quick regardless
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Post by mftc on Dec 29, 2021 11:03:12 GMT
But why are we following the same path?
A well run club with a good manager could be profitable in the lower leagues yet we are just throwing money at the problem.
We don't really try and bring local youngsters through.Three pizza trophy games is to going to help their development.
No doubt we will pay off more players to leave - if we have players on £3k a week with 1.5 years left on the contract, "left by mutual agreement" basically means pay them £80k plus to go and JB will say he has saved the club £100k plus on future wages, which he can spend on a new highly paid player who may or may not work.
Off the field the club just preach to the converted, but how many new fans are introduced to the club apart from the community trust or friends or family?
Rather than moan about the state of the Mem, they should reduce costs to fans and try and bring in more new supporters like Bradford.
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Post by gassince1957 on Dec 29, 2021 11:07:43 GMT
But why are we following the same path? A well run club with a good manager could be profitable in the lower leagues yet we are just throwing money at the problem. We don't really try and bring local youngsters through.Three pizza trophy games is to going to help their development. No doubt we will pay off more players to leave - if we have players on £3k a week with 1.5 years left on the contract, "left by mutual agreement" basically means pay them £80k plus to go and JB will say he has saved the club £100k plus on future wages, which he can spend on a new highly paid player who may or may not work. Off the field the club just preach to the converted, but how many new fans are introduced to the club apart from the community trust or friends or family? Rather than moan about the state of the Mem, they should reduce costs to fans and try and bring in more new supporters like Bradford.Bradford have a 20,000+ stadium so it's relatively easy for them to have lower pricing. I don't think our prices are particularly high versus other League 2 clubs. Don't forget we have limited seating capacity which does mean the pricing for seats is relatively high so there's no easy solution whilst we have the current facilities.
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Post by bluegas on Dec 29, 2021 11:30:04 GMT
I hate them as much as the next man, but doesn't this prove just how ridiculous and unsustainable football is. They have fantastic facilities, they get good TV revenue and they have an extremely wealthy owner yet they are hemorrhaging an unbelievable amount of money. Something is serious wrong with football. But wasn't it always thus? It certainly was when I started watching in 1970. The cliché was of hard headed businessmen who had made a fortune taking on a football club and throwing all their business acumen out of the window and all their fortune into the club in a desperate bid for success. Only difference now is the amount of money and the number of income streams.
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