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Post by justin blue on Feb 6, 2024 22:59:53 GMT
When Barton had us playing out from the back we could play our way out of trouble and even when we lost we still looked a decent side. Tonight we not only lost, we looked like a really poor side. I think we have gone backwards.
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Post by oldmarket65 on Feb 6, 2024 23:01:07 GMT
This thread started with people making score predictions of a Rovers win. For the love of God, can this be the last time? Please. Should we congratulate Taylor on his tactical masterpiece? I see Friend And Grant as the next Shearer and Sutton attacking force. Still can't understand why he plays a lone striker against a team nervously fighting relegation. Although our striker force is very limited . A more attacking style of play could of resulted in a different result. Still unsure about Taylor !. |
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Post by tbonegas on Feb 6, 2024 23:01:42 GMT
It’s rare so many fans agree on one point, so if we can all see it, why the hell did Taylor encourage / allow / set up to play passing, patient football in those conditions. You play direct and into channels and win 2nd balls. Jesus wept! Oh well, thought Vaughan looked to grow into the game and think we will enjoy watching this lad as Taylor suggests. Thought he was the one bright spark to emerge from a calamitous night. |
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Post by socrates on Feb 6, 2024 23:02:28 GMT
It’s rare so many fans agree on one point, so if we can all see it, why the hell did Taylor encourage / allow / set up to play passing, patient football in those conditions. You play direct and into channels and win 2nd balls. Jesus wept! Oh well, thought Vaughan looked to grow into the game and think we will enjoy watching this lad as Taylor suggests. I agree with your first sentence. Your 2nd I couldn’t disagree more, as the the game went on he could barely stand up. Poor decision to start him and bringing him off was probably the only thing Taylor did right, should have done it half time though and put Aguilara further forward and played in to the channels. |
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Post by socrates on Feb 6, 2024 23:03:28 GMT
Should we congratulate Taylor on his tactical masterpiece? I see Friend And Grant as the next Shearer and Sutton attacking force. Still can't understand why he plays a lone striker against a team nervously fighting relegation. Although our striker force is very limited . A more attacking style of play could have resulted in a different result. Still unsure about Taylor !. Or at least play the Costa Rica kid who is surely a number 10 not a sweeper behind him. |
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Post by oldmarket65 on Feb 6, 2024 23:04:34 GMT
Thing is who else do we put up front? I really think Greenslade can’t be any worse than the fan running around the pitch, we’d all do what Marquis does given the chance! The boards needs to be partly accountable. They claimed around 850k on Loft & Collins and reinvested nothing . We desperately need a number 9 but nothings doing . |
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Post by Gastafari on Feb 6, 2024 23:23:08 GMT
Absolute sh*te! Terrible team selection, game plan, game management and substitutions. That's what you get. If I was Aguilera I'd be wanting to go back to Forest ASAP. You've got an absolute gem of an attacking talent, being asked to play just in front of the back 4. Wasted. Pathetic. Good job we didn't ask Elliot Anderson to play the Makelele role! If this is the Football we are going to be served up the majority of the time under Matt Taylor then I ain't interested. I'm sure I'm not alone. To be fair this was more like Barton ball tonight than they way weve been playing under Taylor and we’ve won our last two not playing that way but Bu playing a more typical league 1 team style of football mixing it up and with a quick tempo. Which begs the question why did Taylor go with the tactics and players he started in the game tonight in such conditions. It was clear on the first few minutes that our game plan was to give the ball to Aguilara as a quarter back so he could dictate play , and I think most and myself included thought well this ain’t gonna work. Bizarre. It's just totally bizarre. You've been given an absolute gem right at the last minute, who Forest fans are absolutely raving about, whose already played in the PL this season, with trickery, flair, guile and technique which is far above standard League 1 level, you then give him the Number 10 shirt after Aaron Collins, who should be a brilliant attacking acquisition. For some unbeknown reason Matt Taylor decides to put him in a deep Midfield role just in front of the back 4. I honestly don't know what Matt Taylor was thinking? He mentioned he played him in a slightly deeper role away at Exeter, so that he could see the game in front of him, I could understand his thinking a little there to a certain extent, but tonight it was just absolutely bemusing. Even to start, but to not even attempt to change it and look to move him in a more advanced role throughout the game is pretty mind blowing. As I mentioned its a good job we didn't play Elliot Anderson in a Defensive Midfield position isn't it? It's absolutely criminal to be helped out by being given players like this who are technically far superior to League 1, yet mess them about by playing them in roles that are alien to them. It's taking the p*ss as far as I'm concerned. Yeah we can argue about Bartons and Jennings role in certain aspects of this team, but that's got absolutely nothing to do with Matt Taylors decision to put a star attacking player we've been given in a Defensive Midfield position. |
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Post by gashead79 on Feb 6, 2024 23:23:16 GMT
Where were you viewing from? The amount of times the ball just stopped right in the middle of a puddle in the second half was ridiculous. Every time it was one of our balls and not a Fleetwood ball. Agreed. If Man City had tried to play their usual game on that pitch v someone like Palace or Luton it would have been a massive leveller. Should not have approached the game with that plan and should have changed to a more basic 442 or 4231 direct approach as soon as it became apparent that it wasn’t working and wasn’t going to work. The most frustrating thing for me isn’t that the game plan was wrong but that we were still playing that way 2-0 down and hadn’t changed it. Man City in that scenario would go for the long through ball to Haland which to be fair was how fleetwood played tonight. They got it so right We got it so wrong. It was embarrassing. Fleetwood are set up to play that way and have the players to do it. They were physical with big lads down the spine of the side. They are also firmly in the bottom 4. We don't have a Haaland and to believe Man City would have just pumped it long is unrealistic. They didn't do it against QPR that time and rarely do it now-they don't need to. We also should play to our strengths, and matching up against Fleetwood to pump long balls at a number 9 is definitely a leveller!! We lost but our attacking stats were all better. So we didn't get it so wrong at all. Double the shots, double on target, 3 times as many corners. It's disappointing and a terrible watch, but we were capable of getting something. Football is about opinions I guess. |
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Post by gashead1981 on Feb 6, 2024 23:27:16 GMT
It's the same old this season. When we play a team that's direct, in our faces and like a fight, together with being particularly route one, we can't cope. Squad isn't tough enough and isn't good enough and I can't wait for MT to rid us of some of the dross that JB signed. Fair play to Fleetwood, absolutely did a job on us tonight and deserved 3 points. What’s he brought in during the window, four kids? He’s an experienced Manager, so he should have contacts, a wish list of potential signings. We should have shown ambition and gone for Warnock, I’m sure it would have taken him one training session to realise we have little pace in the squad. The quickest player in the pitch was Ward running to take the throw in. You're not going to get the experienced first choice players in Jan as most of them will be under contract. Jan is mostly free transfers and loans and we needed 6 or 7 really and were never going to do that. Conteh is an excellent signing as will Christina. Problem we have is our back line and forward options. It's been the same all season and it's caused by having players who aren't fit enough, can't stay injury free or not good enough. But hey, this is the best squad ever apparently. |
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Post by socrates on Feb 6, 2024 23:27:24 GMT
Stevenage lost tonight as well.
Makes the infuriating tactics by us even more infuriating as we’d have probably been 9 points off rather than still 12 tonight if we hadn’t gone back to Barton ball.
Ffs , still need 2 points a game average anyway so in that respect nothing changes .
I’d like to see a team this Saturday of 3421 with Marquis up front hitting the channels and doing the graft and Aguilara and Evans supporting.
You’ve Got to play your most creative players in attacking positions
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Post by socrates on Feb 6, 2024 23:29:37 GMT
To be fair this was more like Barton ball tonight than they way weve been playing under Taylor and we’ve won our last two not playing that way but Bu playing a more typical league 1 team style of football mixing it up and with a quick tempo. Which begs the question why did Taylor go with the tactics and players he started in the game tonight in such conditions. It was clear on the first few minutes that our game plan was to give the ball to Aguilara as a quarter back so he could dictate play , and I think most and myself included thought well this ain’t gonna work. Bizarre. It's just totally bizarre. You've been given an absolute gem right at the last minute, who Forest fans are absolutely raving about, whose already played in the PL this season, with trickery, flair, guile and technique which is far above standard League 1 level, you then give him the Number 10 shirt after Aaron Collins, who should be a brilliant attacking acquisition. For some unbeknown reason Matt Taylor decides to put him in a deep Midfield role just in front of the back 4. I honestly don't know what Matt Taylor was thinking? He mentioned he played him in a slightly deeper role away at Exeter, so that he could see the game in front of him, I could understand his thinking a little there to a certain extent, but tonight it was just absolutely bemusing. Even to start, but to not even attempt to change it and look to move him in a more advanced role throughout the game is pretty mind blowing. As I mentioned its a good job we didn't play Elliot Anderson in a Defensive Midfield position isn't it? It's absolutely criminal to be helped out by being given players like this who are technically far superior to League 1, yet mess them about by playing them in roles that are alien to them. It's taking the p*ss as far as I'm concerned. Yeah we can argue about Bartons and Jennings role in certain aspects of this team, but that's got absolutely nothing to do with Matt Taylors decision to put a star attacking player we've been given in a Defensive Midfield position. Exactly as I feel. And with stevenage losing tonight it’s a massive opportunity to close in on top 6 sickeningly wasted. |
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Post by gashead1981 on Feb 6, 2024 23:30:33 GMT
When Barton had us playing out from the back we could play our way out of trouble and even when we lost we still looked a decent side. Tonight we not only lost, we looked like a really poor side. I think we have gone backwards. A loss is a loss and it means you weren't good enough. This isn't synchronised swimming where you get points for effort and looking good. Barton, like Garner before him spent most of the time knocking it around in our own third and not actually penetrating the opposition defences. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2024 23:35:41 GMT
Just got home …. Soaking wet and as angry as I have been with a gutless / heartless team performance as I have been in s very long time.
Taylor’s team selection was pathetic - allowed Fleetwood the ability to grow into an abysmal game and end up looking the stronger of the two sides. Starting all three new loanees was a very poor call.
Ward- 5 … had no chance with either goal let down horribly by his defence.
Hunt 4 - Went off injured and was bang average to that point.
Wilson 2- Didn’t look like he wanted to be there , slowed the play down constantly , at fault for the 2nd goal just watching Stockley and had a go at the West terrace when they urged him forward.
Crama 4 - Gave the ball away constantly but at least looked like he was trying.
Baggott 3- looks very poor indeed. Can only hope he gets better. Woeful home debut.
Conteh 6- good work rate
Evans 6- Tried hard at least
Aguillera 7- being played too deep but again put in a shift .
Vaughan 2- Looked like a 10 year old who had won a competition to play in a league match . A less ginger version of Ryan Woods- Awful !
Vale 5- Rarely beat his man with cross or ball at feet
Thomas 5- Ran about but added little
Martin 2- Pathetic Red card !
None of the subs added any value - Big John again missing a 1-1 chance.
All in all a pathetic effort from a group who should appreciate their fan base more and give their all for the shirt or one day they might just be playing in front of the 48 or so that Fleetwood managed to bring.
Fleetwood were prepared to fight tonight and got what they deserved .. two stand out players for me were their big No5 who was excellent and No20 who again terrorised Baggott and Vale.
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Post by socrates on Feb 6, 2024 23:37:56 GMT
The reason for Passing around in defence is to bring the opposition out to press so you can then get behind them, if after 10 minutes of doing this constantly the opposition are clearly not falling for it then you change your game plan.
Otherwise you spend all of your possession dicking about with the ball at the back and then losing patience and playing a hopefull pass where there’s 10 players behind the ball to take it off of you.
This is what happened this season in the majority of Barton’s games.
I really thought we’d moved away from it.
Tonight we went back to it.
Hopefully that’s the last of it.
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Post by Topper Gas on Feb 6, 2024 23:39:22 GMT
When Barton had us playing out from the back we could play our way out of trouble and even when we lost we still looked a decent side. Tonight we not only lost, we looked like a really poor side. I think we have gone backwards. A loss is a loss and it means you weren't good enough. This isn't synchronised swimming where you get points for effort and looking good. Barton, like Garner before him spent most of the time knocking it around in our own third and not actually penetrating the opposition defences. JB lost his way this season but we certainly didn't play that way the previous season, the last two Tuesday night home have been crap performances. Probably the worst since our relegation season. |
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Post by dudelebowski on Feb 6, 2024 23:47:58 GMT
If you can stomach it, Knappers always puts up a decent vlog. Goes everywhere with Fleetwood this lad. Some night for their lot, just wish we’d have sent them back with sod all.
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Post by oviedista on Feb 6, 2024 23:56:08 GMT
"Lads, it's windy and raining out there so we're switching everything to long ball"
No manager worth any respect would think like that.
Watched Leeds play quick, passing football to feet and win tonight in probably worse conditions down in Plymouth.
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Post by justin blue on Feb 6, 2024 23:57:41 GMT
When Barton had us playing out from the back we could play our way out of trouble and even when we lost we still looked a decent side. Tonight we not only lost, we looked like a really poor side. I think we have gone backwards. A loss is a loss and it means you weren't good enough. This isn't synchronised swimming where you get points for effort and looking good. Barton, like Garner before him spent most of the time knocking it around in our own third and not actually penetrating the opposition defences. Not synchronised swimming really thanks for clearing that up for me. However the performance and manner of defeat or victory for that matter does matter to me, though maybe not to you. |
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Post by oviedista on Feb 7, 2024 0:00:13 GMT
Also seems obvious we didn't revert to "Barton Ball" it's just we were up against one of those teams happy to sit back and surrender possession.
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Post by socrates on Feb 7, 2024 0:17:34 GMT
"Lads, it's windy and raining out there so we're switching everything to long ball" No manager worth any respect would think like that. Watched Leeds play quick, passing football to feet and win tonight in probably worse conditions down in Plymouth. Tactics tonight were far more slow tempo possession based build up from the back than any other game recently though. Or at least that’s how we tried to play. I don’t get this thing amongst football supporters that it either is Tika taka or long ball. There’s many ways to approach a game of football and tonight , particularly in the first half we tried to be tika taka . Did fleetwood play hoofball ? No they didn’t press because that’s what we wanted them to do then won the ball in their half and hit us hard and quick and we couldn’t cope. The opposite ends of the spectrum are what we tried tonight and hoof ball. We really shouldn’t have tried to do what we did tonight for two reasons - Fleetwood didn’t play a high press and the conditions didn’t suit 20 passes to get the ball in to their final 3rd. Taylor’s been ok and overal so far I like him but his tactics were embarrassing tonight. |
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