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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2018 22:27:41 GMT
Perhaps? How many sides in this division have invested £300k+ in a striker? Tell me. Throw in 200k+ for Payne too. At no point did the owners promise to reinvest 100% of sales. Simply hasn't happened. We're losing millions every year so it's delusional to expect big signings to replace players we have lost. It's a tough ask but clubs need to be shrewd with player recruitment and we haven't been good enough. £500k+ is a reasonable and realistic investment. Without looking/googling I’d wager more than 50% have. It’s also about what you can offer players in wages. Let’s look at the recruitment - Upson (relegated L1), Matthews (conference), Reilly (Scottish 2nd division), Payne (L1). That to me doesn’t scream backing for our most successful manager ever. Do you think it does? If you do - fair enough but I suggest move on because we will never agree if that’s the case. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not happy with DC right now, he isn’t performing as well as he should be. I just don’t think it’s all on him, I think 75% is down on the board. How do you perform at work when your manager made you promises and broke them and then made cut backs? Do you think you could perform to the best of your ability? DC is still very young in managing, managers need to learn from experience - we all say he’s our best ever so let’s give him the chance to prove it - I guarantee we won’t regret it Wages are obviously a big factor but rest assured, Nicholls and Payne will be on a healthy L1 wage. Upson and THD likewise. I haven't checked the figures but would be amazed if over half the clubs at this level have spent 500k+ on their strike force. In the context of losing millions a year, it's relatively decent backing. The reality of lower league management is that 100% reinvestment is simply unrealistic. Replacing your best players is obviously a major challenge but it's something lower league managers have to contend with and plan accordingly. Struggling to see what promises have been made and broken relating to the playing squad? Simply not having that the board take 75% responsibility for what's gone on this season. DC has been backed on and off the field and it's his squad and backroom staff. Wouldn't necessarily agree he's our best ever but certainly singing from the same hymn sheet regarding sticking with him. He's young and is still learning at this level. He needs time and I sincerely hope our fans remain loyal and patient. Getting rid of managers is bizarrely fashionable with so many fickle supporters who tend to have very short memories and don't have a plan.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2018 22:33:13 GMT
He has been injured at Bury. If he had more game time at our place he would have scored. In many ways he is one that could have improved and improved us. He used to volunteer to play for the Development squad. Overall in all the matches he played he scored 14 Fair enough if he’s been injured. I actually would have liked to have seen Dom here, but I certainly don’t think he’d be our saviour. From what I’ve seen I actually think Jak is the better player Not our saviour but his stats suggest he knows where the back of the net is. Averaged a goal every 121 minutes in a Rovers shirt and currently 221 in a Bury shirt.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2018 22:37:55 GMT
This. The blame is on the board, not DC. We sold our 3 best players, all our attacking options for well over £1m and allowed him to replace them for a fraction of their wages and cost. Nonsense. We've had enough investment to put a half decent side together at this level. Honestly, what do you expect? A new ground,a training ground,a category 2 academy and the club we were told we deserved by the owners. Thats what wael told anyone who cared to listen is it not? Nobody forced him to say that stuff. There are sites that show our playing budget at 16th/17th which is utter rubbish. The team and the manager are struggling and under performing but unless we get proper investment in the form of a new ground and retail/corporate facilities to match thats how it will always be. A fantastic chance to really do something great with the club has gone until forever maybe?
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Post by tylerdunnell03 on Oct 14, 2018 0:21:51 GMT
If dc is sacked or whatever happens is Paul heckingbottom a realistic appointment? Young manager out of a job...
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Post by Henbury Gas on Oct 14, 2018 4:52:38 GMT
I personally back D.C.and have a lot of sympathy for him I also seriously question wether the club could even afford to sack him due to his stupidly long contract! But it cant be nice to be lied to by your bosses and promised the earth only to be given scraps to work with! the utter shambles that this club is and is painfully exposed as in the media must also damge morale across the club at all levels! Its time for that phony Wael and his band of inept clowns to to pack there bags i'm afaid as they have made us a laughing stock! Hamer almost invisable, Stairns totally invisable, Gorringe visable but making horrendus sackable blunders, 2x unknown employees in London office thats costing us god knows how much wonga. Not one pound invested but millions loaned with interset to cover debts run up by there own incompetence! please please leave and let someone else have a go before its to late!
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Post by Henbury Gas on Oct 14, 2018 4:56:55 GMT
This situation in which we find ourselves is purely down to DC. He has recruited badly and added to that constantly played players out of position. I watch games and wonder what indeed he is trying to do. I see know "pattern" of play, no matter who is in the team, but what he really must do is pick the best team and stick to it, all those changes are not doing anyone at the club any good. For example Sercombe must be in the middle, not out wide to accommodate Upson or Lines. Up front, well what can we say, who looks like scoring? No one. The beard is another who is wasted out wide, it is better to play without him rather than ask him to do something that he's not very good at. I'd give him until Christmas and if we are still in the bottom 4 then it is time for him to go. As for letting him bring in more players in the January window, who has to go? Because we have maxed out our EFL percentage. Of course with next season our budget will be less as our crowds get smaller this season. He should have signed Telford Telford refused to sign
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Post by Henbury Gas on Oct 14, 2018 5:01:17 GMT
Nonsense. We've had enough investment to put a half decent side together at this level. Honestly, what do you expect? A new ground,a training ground,a category 2 academy and the club we were told we deserved by the owners. Thats what wael told anyone who cared to listen is it not? Nobody forced him to say that stuff. There are sites that show our playing budget at 16th/17th which is utter rubbish. The team and the manager are struggling and under performing but unless we get proper investment in the form of a new ground and retail/corporate facilities to match thats how it will always be. A fantastic chance to really do something great with the club has gone until forever maybe? Can you please point me to a post/article/evil post page where Wael has said he is NOT going to build these facilities ? The plan is to provide those facilities over the coming years, sadly we cannot building them from flat packs like people want
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Post by blueridge on Oct 14, 2018 5:30:05 GMT
A new ground,a training ground,a category 2 academy and the club we were told we deserved by the owners. Thats what wael told anyone who cared to listen is it not? Nobody forced him to say that stuff. There are sites that show our playing budget at 16th/17th which is utter rubbish. The team and the manager are struggling and under performing but unless we get proper investment in the form of a new ground and retail/corporate facilities to match thats how it will always be. A fantastic chance to really do something great with the club has gone until forever maybe? Can you please point me to a post/article/evil post page where Wael has said he is NOT going to build these facilities ? The plan is to provide those facilities over the coming years, sadly we cannot building them from flat packs like people want Oh - there's a "plan" is there? Must of missed that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2018 5:46:26 GMT
I get fed up with fans coming on here and saying DC is the best manager we have ever had, Gerry Francis achieved far more than DC he got us up-to Championship level playing at little Twerton Park on a shoe string budget, he even paid 10,000 pounds of his own money to bring Holloway to the club as there was no money for transfers. Going back even further Don Megson also got us to the second tier admittedly like DC he did have money for transfers but he bought in Bannister, Worboys and Stanifoth, not the likes of Nichols,Rielly and Payne who are poor in comparison. I don't want to see DC go but if he doesn't stop tinkering and playing players out of position he may well dig his own grave. The club is already loosing money at this level if we go down the situation will only get worse and we could go into a downward spiral,like players no Manager is greater than the club and DC needs to change his ways. Also with how poorly some players played today it appears that some players are loosing faith with their manager. 99% agree with you but DC must go Wasn't it the tealady that spotted Nigel Martyn while on holiday in Cornwall? Nothing to do with any great scouting network or Gerry Francis contacts but fair play he did at least give him a trial and ultimately offered him a contract.
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Post by Henbury Gas on Oct 14, 2018 5:54:47 GMT
Can you please point me to a post/article/evil post page where Wael has said he is NOT going to build these facilities ? The plan is to provide those facilities over the coming years, sadly we cannot building them from flat packs like people want Oh - there's a "plan" is there? Must of missed that. " A new ground,a training ground,a category 2 academy and the club we were told we deserved by the owners.
Thats what wael told anyone who cared to listen is it not? Nobody forced him to say that stuff. There are sites that show our playing budget at 16th/17th which is utter rubbish. The team and the manager are struggling and under performing but unless we get proper investment in the form of a new ground and retail/corporate facilities to match thats how it will always be. A fantastic chance to really do something great with the club has gone until forever maybe?" Our friend BlueButterfly knows of a "Plan"
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Post by Gassy on Oct 14, 2018 6:52:30 GMT
Without looking/googling I’d wager more than 50% have. It’s also about what you can offer players in wages. Let’s look at the recruitment - Upson (relegated L1), Matthews (conference), Reilly (Scottish 2nd division), Payne (L1). That to me doesn’t scream backing for our most successful manager ever. Do you think it does? If you do - fair enough but I suggest move on because we will never agree if that’s the case. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not happy with DC right now, he isn’t performing as well as he should be. I just don’t think it’s all on him, I think 75% is down on the board. How do you perform at work when your manager made you promises and broke them and then made cut backs? Do you think you could perform to the best of your ability? DC is still very young in managing, managers need to learn from experience - we all say he’s our best ever so let’s give him the chance to prove it - I guarantee we won’t regret it Wages are obviously a big factor but rest assured, Nicholls and Payne will be on a healthy L1 wage. Upson and THD likewise. I haven't checked the figures but would be amazed if over half the clubs at this level have spent 500k+ on their strike force. In the context of losing millions a year, it's relatively decent backing. The reality of lower league management is that 100% reinvestment is simply unrealistic. Replacing your best players is obviously a major challenge but it's something lower league managers have to contend with and plan accordingly. Struggling to see what promises have been made and broken relating to the playing squad? Simply not having that the board take 75% responsibility for what's gone on this season. DC has been backed on and off the field and it's his squad and backroom staff. Wouldn't necessarily agree he's our best ever but certainly singing from the same hymn sheet regarding sticking with him. He's young and is still learning at this level. He needs time and I sincerely hope our fans remain loyal and patient. Getting rid of managers is bizarrely fashionable with so many fickle supporters who tend to have very short memories and don't have a plan. There’s a reason that our budget always sits in and around the bottom 7/8 of this division. DC has always overachieved with the budget available - now for the first time he isn’t overachieving, people want him gone. It’s actually unbelievable. 95% of the time, sacking a long term manager is a bad move. People look back on the time we sacked Trollope as a bad move. Well DC is 100x better than PT - and yet here we are again, 13 games in and people want his head. If we keep doing the same thing over and over again, we will find ourselves doing the same thing that we always keep doing, getting relegated to L2
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Post by simon1883 on Oct 14, 2018 7:13:34 GMT
I get fed up with fans coming on here and saying DC is the best manager we have ever had, Gerry Francis achieved far more than DC he got us up-to Championship level playing at little Twerton Park on a shoe string budget, he even paid 10,000 pounds of his own money to bring Holloway to the club as there was no money for transfers. Going back even further Don Megson also got us to the second tier admittedly like DC he did have money for transfers but he bought in Bannister, Worboys and Stanifoth, not the likes of Nichols,Rielly and Payne who are poor in comparison. I don't want to see DC go but if he doesn't stop tinkering and playing players out of position he may well dig his own grave. The club is already loosing money at this level if we go down the situation will only get worse and we could go into a downward spiral,like players no Manager is greater than the club and DC needs to change his ways. Bert Tann was obviously our greatest ever manager because he operated at a level we can only dream about now. Don Megson brought a new dynamic to the club and anyone who was around at the start of the 73/74 season will remember how we just knew this was going to be our year and sure enough we made it to the second tier once again. I have first hand knowledge of how Gerry Francis worked and it was a very enlightening experience. I watched how Denis and Geoff Dunford managed Gerry together with vital input from Ron Craig and Roy Redman. Contrary to what many fans think you don't, as Nick Higgs once famously said, appoint a manager and let him get on with it. Gerry was an exceptional footballer with a wide knowledge of the game and extensive contacts but he needed and accepted (sometimes reluctantly) the advice from older hands who not only had long business experience but were also genuine Rovers fans. That is what helped make him a successful manager. Of course Darrell Clarke does not have Gerry's football pedigree and he has gained his success with Rovers at a level many of us never imagined we would sink to. But, he does have the same "rough diamond" characteristics as Gerry and he is a totally dedicated football man who is willing to learn as evidenced by his work to achieve top coaching badges. What Darrell is crying out for is the wise counsel which Gerry was lucky enough to have. I think this is bang on. If we could go down the route again of a DoF it would benefit us hugely. However, would DC accept this? I'm not so sure as he is a bit full of himself.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Oct 14, 2018 8:14:28 GMT
I agree with the poster who said he’d like to keep DC even if we went down. I’m not sure it would be a minority. He’s a top class manager, a few bad signings don’t change that. Every manager makes a few bad signings, but the top clubs can afford to replace them quickly, we have to stick with what we have Agreed. I don't think it would necessarily be a minority. Most realise that DC is a top class manager whose ability and ambition surpass anything we can offer him. Some good points made in this thread, particularly referencing Accrington as thriving despite having sold their best players. Accy are a superb example.of a very well run club, from top to bottom, and good luck to them. However, we've been selling our best goalscorers for three windows now. Taylor, Bodin, Harrison. Eventually, it catches up with you. It did with Ollie and it has with other clubs. Bottom line: if you keep on selling your best goalscorers, eventually you are going to struggle to score goals. It's not rocket science. You can't keep unearthing diamonds every time when you spend considerably less than you bring in. That may not be the fault of the owners - for all any of us know it might not have been prudent to have spent similar amounts on players of the standard we let leave (assuming of course that players of that value would want to come to League 1, never mind our antiquated set up). The fault is irrelevant for this debate though - the fact remains that if you keep selling the valuable commodity of goals, eventually those goals dry up. DC has made a poor signing in Nichols and some seem hell bent on judging his ability as a manager purely on this signing. I think he deserves more respect than that, but instead, despite four successful seasons the knives are out after a poor start to this season. Personally, I would continue to support him even if we go down. Players are playing for him and despite the admittedly growing number of dissenters, it would seem that the vast majority of fans still support him, something the owners would do well to bear in mind should they be shortsighted enough to pull the trigger. As many have said, IF we go down he has earned the right to have a go at bringing us back up. It's not about judging DC on one signing (Nichols) it's about judging him on how it's taken him over 40 games to realise that he's sh**.
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Post by Topper Gas on Oct 14, 2018 8:24:17 GMT
Bert Tann was obviously our greatest ever manager because he operated at a level we can only dream about now. Don Megson brought a new dynamic to the club and anyone who was around at the start of the 73/74 season will remember how we just knew this was going to be our year and sure enough we made it to the second tier once again. I have first hand knowledge of how Gerry Francis worked and it was a very enlightening experience. I watched how Denis and Geoff Dunford managed Gerry together with vital input from Ron Craig and Roy Redman. Contrary to what many fans think you don't, as Nick Higgs once famously said, appoint a manager and let him get on with it. Gerry was an exceptional footballer with a wide knowledge of the game and extensive contacts but he needed and accepted (sometimes reluctantly) the advice from older hands who not only had long business experience but were also genuine Rovers fans. That is what helped make him a successful manager. Of course Darrell Clarke does not have Gerry's football pedigree and he has gained his success with Rovers at a level many of us never imagined we would sink to. But, he does have the same "rough diamond" characteristics as Gerry and he is a totally dedicated football man who is willing to learn as evidenced by his work to achieve top coaching badges. What Darrell is crying out for is the wise counsel which Gerry was lucky enough to have. I think this is bang on. If we could go down the route again of a DoF it would benefit us hugely. However, would DC accept this? I'm not so sure as he is a bit full of himself. Until this season nobody has been calling for a DoF why do we suddenly need one now DC's struggling. Plus that's even more "middle" management costs we all moan about the ALQ's already spending.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2018 8:25:22 GMT
[/quote]It's not about judging DC on one signing (Nichols) it's about judging him on how it's taken him over 40 games to realise that he's sh**.[/quote]
You're still doing it, taking one negative rather tham the overall picture. Brilliant.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Oct 14, 2018 8:32:52 GMT
It's not about judging DC on one signing (Nichols) it's about judging him on how it's taken him over 40 games to realise that he's sh**.[/quote] You're still doing it, taking one negative rather tham the overall picture. Brilliant.[/quote] How many games is it ok to judge him over then? I'm still DC in by the way, but there are some obvious flaws that should not be overlooked. He persisted with a player last year despite a loanee looking more dangerous and he's started this season making the same mistake. You could surely argue that our lack of any kind of goal threat is the only reason we are even discussing DCs position. If we'd scored more, we'd have lossed less right? How is that not looking at the bigger picture?
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Post by z1zou on Oct 14, 2018 10:15:04 GMT
Sacking DC would be nothing short of another nail in the coffin.
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Post by tomylil on Oct 14, 2018 11:01:32 GMT
Nonsense. We've had enough investment to put a half decent side together at this level. Honestly, what do you expect? A new ground,a training ground,a category 2 academy and the club we were told we deserved by the owners. Thats what wael told anyone who cared to listen is it not?Nobody forced him to say that stuff. There are sites that show our playing budget at 16th/17th which is utter rubbish. The team and the manager are struggling and under performing but unless we get proper investment in the form of a new ground and retail/corporate facilities to match thats how it will always be. A fantastic chance to really do something great with the club has gone until forever maybe? I think it should be broadly accepted that whilst appearing a nice chap Wael is a grade A bullshitter or, relative to the rest of his family a simpleton - or both. Fact is, the new ground, training facilities etc whilst disappointing, can wait. The club needs to sort things out on the pitch in the short term. Hopefully that is with DC but he looks an increasingly dejected figure and maybe that will transmit to all the players eventually. We need to make sure we aren't adrift by the transfer window and then our illustrious owners need to back whoever is in charge at the time with signings and/or loans to maintain our status in this league even if it's a one off until they finds a buyer..
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Post by darkbluegas on Oct 14, 2018 11:03:26 GMT
DC clearly has problems coping with the the changes in the way the club is being run by the owners. There seems to be little contact now between him and the owners, judging by DC's comments in the press.
His frustrations are no doubt rubbing off on the squad. In an ideal world he would be given the opportunity to have a break but football obviously doesn't work that way.
There's going to be no more money available and DC can't get enough from this group.
In the long term DC will probably have a good managerial career but under the circumstances here it may not at the Mem.
At the moment he needs fresh eyes on this situation but I doubt he'd accept help from outside. If he won't then I think his time is almost up.
That doesn't reflect on him as a manager in the long term but I think he's been badly effected by the owners attitude and the raised expectations.
So with no sign the ownership is changing any time soon DC may well be paying the ultimate price.
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Post by Raj Gas on Oct 14, 2018 11:07:07 GMT
Sacking DC would be nothing short of another nail in the coffin. I am not convinced that the man who controls the money would want to pay off DC, especially if he's on a long term contract? I don't think anything will happen until the ownership changes and then hopefully the new people will back DC, in the meantime he needs to concentrate about what happens on the pitch.
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