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Post by baggins on Feb 24, 2020 14:35:28 GMT
As a Manager, I'd expect him to do both. But have his signings really been abysmal? I've seen some good signs from every player so far. I said certainly the results have been abysmal. The signings are hard to judge because we haven't really seen a lot of them so far, but the keeper looks good, JML showed promising signs in the Wycombe game, Barrett overweight and done very little, Ginnelly flatters to deceive and now on the bench, Harries only one brief sub appearance, similar for Abraham and Daly yet to feature. Not great overall so far. I thought Ginnelly put one away recently? The rest have hardly been given much game time.
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Feb 24, 2020 16:06:37 GMT
I said certainly the results have been abysmal. The signings are hard to judge because we haven't really seen a lot of them so far, but the keeper looks good, JML showed promising signs in the Wycombe game, Barrett overweight and done very little, Ginnelly flatters to deceive and now on the bench, Harries only one brief sub appearance, similar for Abraham and Daly yet to feature. Not great overall so far. I thought Ginnelly put one away recently? The rest have hardly been given much game time. He did, but has been on the subs bench 3 times out of the last 4 games.
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Post by Gassy on Feb 24, 2020 16:08:55 GMT
How do you know they're Widdrington's and not Garners? Hmmm, let me think. Garner already told us that Abraham had been lined up long before he was appointed and Harries was at Coventry during Widdrington's time there and Barrett joined Coventry on loan during his spell as chief scout. My question was genuine, but that's for your sarcastic reply. As you've set the tone, I'll carry it on. I guess what we can takeaway from your post is that Abraham was lined up from Widdrington whilst Barrett & Harries you're guessing/making it up. The other 4 signings (the majority of the 7) you have no idea. So when you say "give Widdrington's signings a chance", I can only assume you're talking about Abraham.
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Post by wilmslowgas on Feb 24, 2020 16:24:44 GMT
I've always thought that whole point of January acquisitions was to plug gaps in the first team with immediate effect. These acquisitions need to improve on what currently exists. There is little point in getting squad players unless the cover for the first team was thin or even non existent.
It's possible to take a longer term view with summer signings. Hoever January signings need to make an instant impact. Otherwise why get them?
The January window was heralded as an exciting venture for Rovers. In all honesty, one month and several games later the whole exercise seems rather underwhelming - apart from the keeper, who does look good.
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Feb 24, 2020 16:28:04 GMT
Hmmm, let me think. Garner already told us that Abraham had been lined up long before he was appointed and Harries was at Coventry during Widdrington's time there and Barrett joined Coventry on loan during his spell as chief scout. My question was genuine, but that's for your sarcastic reply. As you've set the tone, I'll carry it on. I guess what we can takeaway from your post is that Abraham was lined up from Widdrington whilst Barrett & Harries you're guessing/making it up. The other 4 signings (the majority of the 7) you have no idea. So when you say "give Widdrington's signings a chance", I can only assume you're talking about Abraham. It doesn't take a genius to work it out mate, considering Widdrington was part of the process in signing Barrett at his previous club and was at Coventry at the same time as Harries. As for "the other 4" signings, I was wrong to say Garner's only real influence was with the Daly signing, as he also wanted Blackman (who looks good) and has known about him since trying to sign the player as a 14-year-old.
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Post by aghast on Feb 24, 2020 18:58:26 GMT
My thoughts on BG are that he appears to be slowly sinking, unable to know what to do, and looking mightily watered off with it all.
He's had a fair stab at it now. 15 games is a reasonable length for him to see what the team was, start to change it to his design, and to deal with any teething problems.
And the result is little short of disastrous. Dave Penney was chased out of Bristol by a mob with pitchforks for a lot less. But we were sinking towards relegation.
So I suppose we should keep him until the end of the season, and BG can thank his lucky stars that GC has saved his job.
But it's all a bit weird to me. We seem to be writing off a season just to keep on and on giving a poor manager a chance. Then we sack him in May.
Maybe he will turn it around, but I don't see it. People say promising signs are there, but I think they're clutching at straws.
Craig and JCH, two stalwarts of the side earlier, seem off form. The new signings haven't been tried. We're not scoring goals but conceding plenty.
What a mess.
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Post by pucklegas on Feb 24, 2020 19:10:01 GMT
Think the midfield conundrum is plain for all to see, Abs ollie and Ed do not compliment each other. Need Barrett to start as the creative spark, then a destroyer like Abs and a box to box player in the vitas mould, so Sercs. Still behind Ben however the results are clear for all to see, hope the club don t take the Mickey and raise the season ticket prices as loads will walk.
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Post by socrates on Feb 24, 2020 21:41:28 GMT
Think the midfield conundrum is plain for all to see, Abs ollie and Ed do not compliment each other. Need Barrett to start as the creative spark, then a destroyer like Abs and a box to box player in the vitas mould, so Sercs. Still behind Ben however the results are clear for all to see, hope the club don t take the Mickey and raise the season ticket prices as loads will walk. Agreed. Having the 3 defensive midfielders as a screen in front of a back 5 made us very hard to break down and we scored enough at the other end playing direct up to JCH. But if we’re going to try and play football through midfield then having three defensive midfielders in there is ridiculous to be honest. We need 3 different types of players who compliment each other and all have their own strengths so they work like a team. We probably only need one of Ogogo , Clarke and Upson . I’d try Hargreaves Upson and barret on Saturday if Sercs isn’t fit.
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Post by gashead1981 on Feb 24, 2020 21:53:18 GMT
My thoughts on BG are that he appears to be slowly sinking, unable to know what to do, and looking mightily watered off with it all. He's had a fair stab at it now. 15 games is a reasonable length for him to see what the team was, start to change it to his design, and to deal with any teething problems. And the result is little short of disastrous. Dave Penney was chased out of Bristol by a mob with pitchforks for a lot less. But we were sinking towards relegation. So I suppose we should keep him until the end of the season, and BG can thank his lucky stars that GC has saved his job. But it's all a bit weird to me. We seem to be writing off a season just to keep on and on giving a poor manager a chance. Then we sack him in May. Maybe he will turn it around, but I don't see it. People say promising signs are there, but I think they're clutching at straws. Craig and JCH, two stalwarts of the side earlier, seem off form. The new signings haven't been tried. We're not scoring goals but conceding plenty. What a mess. Im begining to agree with you aghast. But perhaps sticking now and getting a new manager in the close season is the best course rather than cut bait now? I really want Garner to succeed but its looking disasterous at the moment. The only reason Im not there yet is that we have had an awful run with injuries, we have had some terrible luck with decisions from refs which have cost us and also the time where his home circumstances meant it definately affected his work. All I will say is that Craig is playing to his usual standard of the last 2 years when hes played in a back 4. He simply isnt good enough. He's flattered to decieve everyone with because he's had an extra defender next to him for the first half of the season. JCH hasnt had nearly the same sort of service that he was getting from the wings playing 352 and we lost Sercombe who was playing some excellent football before he got injured again.
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Post by landrover on Feb 24, 2020 22:34:34 GMT
As one that didn’t want Garner anywhere near the job it turns out that he’s worse than I thought. He’s robotic, uninspiring and passionless. You have to suspect that the players aren’t having him. He’s been over promoted and probably struggles to get his ideas across to the more senior players. The fact that he’s signed so many young players could well be because he’s more comfortable with them and that they will listen more. Mind you, he talks a great game.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2020 0:55:22 GMT
My thoughts on BG are that he appears to be slowly sinking, unable to know what to do, and looking mightily watered off with it all. He's had a fair stab at it now. 15 games is a reasonable length for him to see what the team was, start to change it to his design, and to deal with any teething problems. And the result is little short of disastrous. Dave Penney was chased out of Bristol by a mob with pitchforks for a lot less. But we were sinking towards relegation. So I suppose we should keep him until the end of the season, and BG can thank his lucky stars that GC has saved his job. But it's all a bit weird to me. We seem to be writing off a season just to keep on and on giving a poor manager a chance. Then we sack him in May. Maybe he will turn it around, but I don't see it. People say promising signs are there, but I think they're clutching at straws. Craig and JCH, two stalwarts of the side earlier, seem off form. The new signings haven't been tried. We're not scoring goals but conceding plenty. What a mess. Im begining to agree with you aghast. But perhaps sticking now and getting a new manager in the close season is the best course rather than cut bait now? I really want Garner to succeed but its looking disasterous at the moment. The only reason Im not there yet is that we have had an awful run with injuries, we have had some terrible luck with decisions from refs which have cost us and also the time where his home circumstances meant it definately affected his work. All I will say is that Craig is playing to his usual standard of the last 2 years when hes played in a back 4. He simply isnt good enough. He's flattered to decieve everyone with because he's had an extra defender next to him for the first half of the season. JCH hasnt had nearly the same sort of service that he was getting from the wings playing 352 and we lost Sercombe who was playing some excellent football before he got injured again. But craig played in a back four all last season in a team that conceded very few goals. If one centre half is so poor against professional footballers that would be exploited and our goals against column would not be as good. Coughlan happily selected craig in a back four and continued to select him with one defender less in a three. So was coughlan rubbish at selecting defenders to do the job required?
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Post by theduke on Feb 25, 2020 4:55:48 GMT
As one that didn’t want Garner anywhere near the job it turns out that he’s worse than I thought. He’s robotic, uninspiring and passionless. You have to suspect that the players aren’t having him. He’s been over promoted and probably struggles to get his ideas across to the more senior players. The fact that he’s signed so many young players could well be because he’s more comfortable with them and that they will listen more. Mind you, he talks a great game. Does he? I think he comes across as talking nonsense for the most part. I do think that he’s a good coach. He had some good positions prior and is rated. However, I agree that the seniors probably aren’t having him. It probably doesn’t help that he’s made it clear that most of them are being bombed out to make way for young players who can be sold on once they start to look decent. I don’t blame the club for going down this route to be fair, it’s a sustainable model for a club Rovers size. Whether Garner is the right man to oversee it remains to be seen, but the early signs haven’t exactly been great have they.
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Post by lpgas on Feb 25, 2020 8:33:23 GMT
The fact we are already questioning the manager is direct result of a society and culture of football supporters that expects results (despite a complete change in style from ugly coughlan ball) straight away. This was never going to be a quick fix and we are all aware of the resource challenges, but Garner clearly has a possession based strategy he wishes to implement, but that takes time. Our job as ‘supporters’ is to support that project and the team. I see a lot of comparisons with when Jurgen Klopp took over Liverpool, he Didn’t have the best start with Liverpool because as he eased his style of play into a Brendan Rodgers squad, but slowly transfer window by transfer window he made a few changes here in there to alter the squad to how he wanted to play (strengthening in required posistions) and soon enough one day it all clicked and became a dominating force. I think it will all come good. Besides, we all know the facilities are rubbish, migh as well implement a system and Philosophy for the long term. What use we get from constantly chopping and changing managers because they all will suffer with the same budget and facilities restrictions? How long, a year? 5? 50? as for comparing us to Liverpool, you are having a laugh.
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Post by lpgas on Feb 25, 2020 8:35:49 GMT
We were winning, now we are not. Tell me who's the better manager again? GC has won 3 in 16 in a lower league with a good squad so he’s hardly proving his worth either! 2 more than garner
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Post by lpgas on Feb 25, 2020 8:39:58 GMT
I just dont get the love in with this guy. Give me one improvement since he has been here? Ruined one of the best defences we have ever had. One of our most promising youngsters now playing at right back. A midfield that no longer protects or attacks. A striker that feeds of scraps and regularly is isolated. A body on the line team that now only surrenders after conceding. Cant wait for next season where he can work his magic over pre season. I think you're confusing love with giving him a chance till the end of the season. and if there is no signs of improvement?
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Post by lpgas on Feb 25, 2020 8:47:35 GMT
Im begining to agree with you aghast. But perhaps sticking now and getting a new manager in the close season is the best course rather than cut bait now? I really want Garner to succeed but its looking disasterous at the moment. The only reason Im not there yet is that we have had an awful run with injuries, we have had some terrible luck with decisions from refs which have cost us and also the time where his home circumstances meant it definately affected his work. All I will say is that Craig is playing to his usual standard of the last 2 years when hes played in a back 4. He simply isnt good enough. He's flattered to decieve everyone with because he's had an extra defender next to him for the first half of the season. JCH hasnt had nearly the same sort of service that he was getting from the wings playing 352 and we lost Sercombe who was playing some excellent football before he got injured again. But craig played in a back four all last season in a team that conceded very few goals. If one centre half is so poor against professional footballers that would be exploited and our goals against column would not be as good. Coughlan happily selected craig in a back four and continued to select him with one defender less in a three. So was coughlan rubbish at selecting defenders to do the job required? Also Craig has organised the defence, remember we have had Kilgour and Rollin with him a lot of the time. I bet he would make a decent defensive coach
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Feb 25, 2020 8:58:39 GMT
I think you're confusing love with giving him a chance till the end of the season. and if there is no signs of improvement? I was commenting on the post I replied to, which seemed to think there was a lot of love for Garner. Am I allowed to do that without someone demanding I give him an ultimatum? If not, then I demand we sack him as soon as I decide we need to sack him. I demand this! And I demand they should pay us to turn up at the Mem until I decide I want to pay money to watch us!!!!! Is that ok?
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Marshy
Proper Gas
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Post by Marshy on Feb 25, 2020 9:02:09 GMT
and if there is no signs of improvement? I was commenting on the post I replied to, which seemed to think there was a lot of love for Garner. Am I allowed to do that without someone demanding I give him an ultimatum? If not, then I demand we sack him as soon as I decide we need to sack him. I demand this! And I demand they should pay us to turn up at the Mem until I decide I want to pay money to watch us!!!!! Is that ok? I’m glad I’m not married to you Antonio, you’re too demanding!
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Post by Antonio Fargas on Feb 25, 2020 9:47:21 GMT
I was commenting on the post I replied to, which seemed to think there was a lot of love for Garner. Am I allowed to do that without someone demanding I give him an ultimatum? If not, then I demand we sack him as soon as I decide we need to sack him. I demand this! And I demand they should pay us to turn up at the Mem until I decide I want to pay money to watch us!!!!! Is that ok? I’m glad I’m not married to you Antonio, you’re too demanding! To be fair, I'd only be demanding you leave me alone.
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Post by wilmslowgas on Feb 25, 2020 10:29:43 GMT
It's not just Craig who appears to be struggling for form. There seems to be a collective drop in performance which can't be helped by the current run of results.
Is any regular player doing better under BG than they were under GC? Just asking.
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