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Post by bluebiro on Apr 18, 2021 12:39:24 GMT
What great candidates there will be of he is sacked. Certainly wont be looking at a quality manager but the likes of Sheridan and holloway to steer us closer to the conference
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Post by oldie on Apr 18, 2021 12:43:16 GMT
And its the role of tbe interviewer to pull the answer apart and to be convinced. I cannot really believe you think otherwise. Saying yes I can is not enough. They must have drilled down. So what did Barton say? Whatever answer given or plan he put forward, he has failed spectacularly. So on that basis, why should we believe a word he says? So is that Bartons fault or the interviewer??? I would say that shows where our main problem is hence why hopefully Wael will see that changes is needed with the structure of the club. Trouble is by the sounds of it Wael was involved in the interview process with MS so he has to take the blame but as he is the owner I think its looking pretty grim for MS. Both, in reality. Barton for either being a complete bullshitter, an incompetent or liar. Or all three. The interview panel for being grotesquely incompetent.
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Post by orgasmic on Apr 18, 2021 12:59:48 GMT
I’ll ask on this thread as nobody seems to have an answer... Still confused as to what JB has done to be trusted with the great reset. Sh!t players or not, JB's performance as manager is worse than BG who is one of the worst managers in our history. He also has no experience of L2. He effectively said in public we were down long before we were and publicly criticised everyone and everything, taking no responsibility himself. Why should he be trusted with the great reset?! Not necessarily advocating sacking him but can’t understand the clamour to let him loose at a total restructure when he has been a total failure so far. Any ideas? Think it comes down to the fact that the owner has given his a 2.5 year contract and he is the man the owner believes is the right person to carry out this reset which lets be honest is needed. Whether he is the right man or not we can only judge once he has had pre-season and brought in his own players but even if we were to get rid of him and a new man comes in their is going to be a risk with such a big rebuild needed. Only time will tell if its worked once we are into a dozen games next season but if we were to appoint a new manager then the same question and concerns will arise as I don’t know there is any manager who out there who when a rebuild is needed you can be sure will get it right. Had we got rid of DC when we got relegated or after the start we had in the national league then who knows, We may have done even better and gone up as champions or we could have stayed in that league and still be there or worse off now. So other than him being Waels choice there isn’t a shred of evidence to suggest he should be given the keys to the kingdom. Luckily Wael has a proven track record in selecting managers or it could be another disaster! The only reason I’d stick with JB now is because I think it would massively damage our reputation to fire another manager!
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Post by bluegas on Apr 18, 2021 13:08:00 GMT
What great candidates there will be of he is sacked. Certainly wont be looking at a quality manager but the likes of Sheridan and holloway to steer us closer to the conference No, no, there's loads of candidates out there falling over themselves to join us. Duff, Flynn, um, er, Sheridan, Holloway. Pity Cook, Adkins and Cowley went elsewhere. They'd have jumped at the chance.
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Post by orgasmic on Apr 18, 2021 13:09:33 GMT
What great candidates there will be of he is sacked. Certainly wont be looking at a quality manager but the likes of Sheridan and holloway to steer us closer to the conference No, no, there's loads of candidates out there falling over themselves to join us. Duff, Flynn, um, er, Sheridan, Holloway. Pity Cook, Adkins and Cowley went elsewhere. They'd have jumped at the chance. I actually think there are good candidates out there. Sol Campbell is a good example.
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Post by oasisgas on Apr 18, 2021 13:19:44 GMT
Maybe thats why Wael wants him to implement what was in place at Fleetwood?? Like I said earlier, Wael is the owner and the person who he believes he is the correct man. Whether you believe he is not the right person or like me will let him make the changes and then see how it goes it all boils down to Wael. If it works then all good but if it fails then Wael will then have to dig deep into his pockets. The fact that it seems Wael is going to let him make the changes we will just have to wait and see. That makes the presumption that Wael would have accepted relegation as part of any potential plan. You believe that? I don’t think anyone would have accepted relegation but when PT was sacked why do you think he was sacked?? It wasn’t because we were looking at a mid-table finnish and just going through the motions. It was because the board could see we were heading down the table and needed to try to save our league 1 status. If there was no concerns that we would get relegated then they would have stuck with PT instead of having to pay out which must be a decent wedge of money for his contract. Some people only look at the hear and now which I can understand but sometimes you need to look at the longer term picture. Maybe Joey said to Wael “I will keep us up sir you have me word” which I highly doubt. Or maybe he said “I will do my best to keep us up but the who structure of the club needs to be changed and it may not be until those changes are made that you will see the club moving forward” It depends what those changes are, If he just said I want to bring my mates in cos the coaches here are crap and Wael bought that then we deserve to be relegated, if however he said to Wael. Why have you had so many injuries??? Why do the players look hanging after 60 minutes every game?? Why did JCH look a stone over weight when he signed for Perterborough?? Why have you let the previous manager sign 3 left wing-backs and gone into the season with 2 un-tested strikers and one who has potential you don’t have a 15-20 goal season striker ready to go?? Why did the medical team say that so and so player would be ok and fit enough to play then at half time you have to bring them off and they are then out for 2 months or the rest of the season, why did you have to bring another keeper in on loan when you already have a back-up keeper who has been with the club for 2 season but still need to sign another keeper on loan cos basically he isnt’t good enough?? These is what needs to be done, so and so needs to change and we have to do this in pre-season and this has to be done with the backroom staff and we have to target this type of player and get the balance of the squad sorted. So Wael thinks this through and kinda sees where JB is coming from. So Wael then interviews candidate number 2 and asks why he believes the clubs is struggling and what needs to be done. If the candidate says its all because of the mistakes of the previous manager and he will get it sorted on the training pitch then for Wael its better for him as he won’t have to spend more money and just hope that the guy can sort it out even though things aren’t looking good. Or maybe Wael thinks “actually what JB has said is true, Why did Anssi get injured after the medical team told PT that he was fit to play and there was no risks, Why did on Saturday we were the better team up until 65 minutes and then the players got tired while the other team got stronger and they scored 2 goals in the last 20 minutes and we lost, Why did we already have JVS on the books but have to sign another keeper on loan. Why did we sign George Williams when we already have Josh Hare??, ok we need to make these changes instead of appointing candidate 2 who may keep us up but the same problems will be going on in the background” Now this may or may not have happened and some fans will say and quite rightly that JVS gives them butterflies (me included) and that he is not good enough correctly but if you look they are all linked. JVS was signed which while probably on cheap wages we would probably have been better signing a younger back up if we were going to sign a a loan keeper anyway and then brought in Chris Day who while he has made some decent saves has let him so real dodgy goals too so the recruitment team needs to be looked at, and the reason why they will be looked at is because the medical team said that Anssi was fit to play when it turns out he wasn’t and we lost him for 2 months so the medical team will be looked at and the fitness team will have to answer why the players are unfit and why Darren Ferguson said that JCH needed to have work done on him to get him fitter. I’d imagine Mark Robins did the same when he went into Coventry and said it looks like we are going to be relegated to league 2, this is what needs to be done during the summer and we all know what has happened to them since. We have to hope that the changes what are needed and made during the summer that JB said to Wael work.
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Post by oasisgas on Apr 18, 2021 13:25:08 GMT
What great candidates there will be of he is sacked. Certainly wont be looking at a quality manager but the likes of Sheridan and holloway to steer us closer to the conference No, no, there's loads of candidates out there falling over themselves to join us. Duff, Flynn, um, er, Sheridan, Holloway. Pity Cook, Adkins and Cowley went elsewhere. They'd have jumped at the chance. Adkins rejected the chance to talk to us, Cook while not confirmed I’m sure would have said the same. Cowley brothers probably would have taken the job on tbh.
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Post by oasisgas on Apr 18, 2021 13:29:07 GMT
Think it comes down to the fact that the owner has given his a 2.5 year contract and he is the man the owner believes is the right person to carry out this reset which lets be honest is needed. Whether he is the right man or not we can only judge once he has had pre-season and brought in his own players but even if we were to get rid of him and a new man comes in their is going to be a risk with such a big rebuild needed. Only time will tell if its worked once we are into a dozen games next season but if we were to appoint a new manager then the same question and concerns will arise as I don’t know there is any manager who out there who when a rebuild is needed you can be sure will get it right. Had we got rid of DC when we got relegated or after the start we had in the national league then who knows, We may have done even better and gone up as champions or we could have stayed in that league and still be there or worse off now. So other than him being Waels choice there isn’t a shred of evidence to suggest he should be given the keys to the kingdom. Luckily Wael has a proven track record in selecting managers or it could be another disaster! The only reason I’d stick with JB now is because I think it would massively damage our reputation to fire another manager! Exactly, only the person who has been told what JB plans are and believes in those plans are Wael. If we could see what those plans are then we could all make a better judgement but the truth if the matter is that we will have to wait and see after 12 games next season if this was the correct choice.
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Post by LJG on Apr 18, 2021 13:29:59 GMT
I’ll ask on this thread as nobody seems to have an answer... Still confused as to what JB has done to be trusted with the great reset. Sh!t players or not, JB's performance as manager is worse than BG who is one of the worst managers in our history. He also has no experience of L2. He effectively said in public we were down long before we were and publicly criticised everyone and everything, taking no responsibility himself. Why should he be trusted with the great reset?! Not necessarily advocating sacking him but can’t understand the clamour to let him loose at a total restructure when he has been a total failure so far. Any ideas? Exactly. Talking about the beheadings he'd make at the end of the season when there were what? Eight games? Left to play is nigh on suicidal. Eight games - 24 points. The potential to finish on 62 points and talking about taking the players out and shooting them at the end of the season. Idiotic.
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Post by LJG on Apr 18, 2021 13:32:18 GMT
I’ll ask on this thread as nobody seems to have an answer... Still confused as to what JB has done to be trusted with the great reset. Sh!t players or not, JB's performance as manager is worse than BG who is one of the worst managers in our history. He also has no experience of L2. He effectively said in public we were down long before we were and publicly criticised everyone and everything, taking no responsibility himself. Why should he be trusted with the great reset?! Not necessarily advocating sacking him but can’t understand the clamour to let him loose at a total restructure when he has been a total failure so far. Any ideas? Think it comes down to the fact that the owner has given his a 2.5 year contract and he is the man the owner believes is the right person to carry out this reset which lets be honest is needed. Whether he is the right man or not we can only judge once he has had pre-season and brought in his own players but even if we were to get rid of him and a new man comes in their is going to be a risk with such a big rebuild needed. Only time will tell if its worked once we are into a dozen games next season but if we were to appoint a new manager then the same question and concerns will arise as I don’t know there is any manager who out there who when a rebuild is needed you can be sure will get it right. Had we got rid of DC when we got relegated or after the start we had in the national league then who knows, We may have done even better and gone up as champions or we could have stayed in that league and still be there or worse off now. DC was a proven manager at Conference South level so a reasonable appointment in the conference. Barton knows nothing about league two. It's not "real football" remember?
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Post by Jomo on Apr 18, 2021 13:35:36 GMT
I don't remember feeling such a massive change in my feelings towards any other manager than JB in such a short space of time. He wouldn't have been my choice, but the first few interviews from him, and the way the likes of Leahy and Rodman spoke about him got me so excited. If he'd have kept up that energy and positivity I would even still be on side despite the results. It's the results coupled with his spectacularly misjudged and unprofessional outbursts since then that have drained all positivity I had away. He's gone from hero to zero for me very quickly.
I'd still be willing to give him more time though, as sacking managers is clearly not something that brings us much joy is it!
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Post by orgasmic on Apr 18, 2021 13:36:41 GMT
So other than him being Waels choice there isn’t a shred of evidence to suggest he should be given the keys to the kingdom. Luckily Wael has a proven track record in selecting managers or it could be another disaster! The only reason I’d stick with JB now is because I think it would massively damage our reputation to fire another manager! Exactly, only the person who has been told what JB plans are and believes in those plans are Wael. If we could see what those plans are then we could all make a better judgement but the truth if the matter is that we will have to wait and see after 12 games next season if this was the correct choice. Which means all we have to go on is his performance as manager and that has been appalling! I don’t understand why many are desperate for him to be the person to restructure the club!
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Post by oasisgas on Apr 18, 2021 13:41:29 GMT
Think it comes down to the fact that the owner has given his a 2.5 year contract and he is the man the owner believes is the right person to carry out this reset which lets be honest is needed. Whether he is the right man or not we can only judge once he has had pre-season and brought in his own players but even if we were to get rid of him and a new man comes in their is going to be a risk with such a big rebuild needed. Only time will tell if its worked once we are into a dozen games next season but if we were to appoint a new manager then the same question and concerns will arise as I don’t know there is any manager who out there who when a rebuild is needed you can be sure will get it right. Had we got rid of DC when we got relegated or after the start we had in the national league then who knows, We may have done even better and gone up as champions or we could have stayed in that league and still be there or worse off now. DC was a proven manager at Conference South level so a reasonable appointment in the conference. Barton knows nothing about league two. It's not "real football" remember? The thing that I would go on is DC never manager in the national league and we just been relegated and fans were calling for his head after the first 6 games into the new season. And then you look at Paul Buckle who had done a excellent job at Torquay the previous season and we all know how it went with him here. Yes experience in any division is a help but its not the be all end all.
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Post by Dirt Dogg on Apr 18, 2021 13:42:26 GMT
Some people just want to watch the club burn.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Apr 18, 2021 13:43:36 GMT
Sacking Barton would be more than an Embarrassment.
It would be a living endorsement..
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Post by oasisgas on Apr 18, 2021 13:54:07 GMT
Exactly, only the person who has been told what JB plans are and believes in those plans are Wael. If we could see what those plans are then we could all make a better judgement but the truth if the matter is that we will have to wait and see after 12 games next season if this was the correct choice. Which means all we have to go on is his performance as manager and that has been appalling! I don’t understand why many are desperate for him to be the person to restructure the club! I think what I am trying to say is that no matter what we the fans feel or believe that its the guy who is putting the cash into the club who will decide what happens. I used to get worked up like yourself over matters on and off the pitch but as you get older you kinda learn that no matter what your views are then its the people who are at the top who make those choices and you have no say or outcome of them. The only thing that gives me hope is that while we still havent scored goals or stopped the silly mistakes we have looked better than when PT and BG was in charge with regards to creating chances Had we not been creating chances and been backs against the walls every game then I would be concerned but we have looked better since JB came in but the sad truth is our strikers aren’t good enough right now and that is why we will be relegated. If come next season JB has brought in a new striker and some defenders and the same things are still happening then that is the moment I will think “This isn’t working” but up until the point I’m not going to get worked up because until that moment arrives it all if’s and maybe’s.[ Results haven’t improved but I would only share all your views had he had January. Don’t think you can say leading up to the close of the window we need a striker or we are going to struggle and then we don’t bring that required striker in and go and blame the future manager when what was needed wasn’t done, Had he been in charge at that point then some of the flak he is getting would be justified but while he is the manager and to take some blame you cannot say we are going to be relegated because of JB, the issues were evident before ge arrived and befire PT arrived but while PT and BG had the chance to try to rectify it JB didn’t sadly
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Post by orgasmic on Apr 18, 2021 14:02:09 GMT
Which means all we have to go on is his performance as manager and that has been appalling! I don’t understand why many are desperate for him to be the person to restructure the club! I think what I am trying to say is that no matter what we the fans feel or believe that its the guy who is putting the cash into the club who will decide what happens. I used to get worked up like yourself over matters on and off the pitch but as you get older you kinda learn that no matter what your views are then its the people who are at the top who make those choices and you have no say or outcome of them. The only thing that gives me hope is that while we still havent scored goals or stopped the silly mistakes we have looked better than when PT and BG was in charge with regards to creating chances Had we not been creating chances and been backs against the walls every game then I would be concerned but we have looked better since JB came in but the sad truth is our strikers aren’t good enough right now and that is why we will be relegated. If come next season JB has brought in a new striker and some defenders and the same things are still happening then that is the moment I will think “This isn’t working” but up until the point I’m not going to get worked up because until that moment arrives it all if’s and maybe’s.[ Results haven’t improved but I would only share all your views had he had January. Don’t think you can say leading up to the close of the window we need a striker or we are going to struggle and then we don’t bring that required striker in and go and blame the future manager when what was needed wasn’t done, br] FWIW I’m not wound up at all. I just can’t get my head around why so many people are clamouring for JB to restructure the club when his track record is one of failure. I agree about Wael. He wants this to work as much as we do so have to hope one day he gets it right!
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Post by lpgas1 on Apr 18, 2021 14:58:34 GMT
Garner, an unmitgated disaster and he will probably never manage aleague club again. Tisdale, not brilliant record really, 13 years at Exeter mostly around the 7th to 10th place. Barton took Fleetwood to the pay offs. The biggest difference is that Barton has played under a number of Premier league managers and coaches, and that alone gives him my vote because he knows about how the top clubs work, and he knows what you need to make a good solid team, purely from those managers. Garner had virtually no playing experience and Tisdale played 6 times for Southampton and 10 times for the Teds, and that was 20+ years ago.
The truth is the club does need re organising. Firstly what does Starnes actually do? CEO, and yet allows a "manager" to set up a team with 4 left backs, a front line of a low scoring average Division one player, another fron Tier 6, and a sick note from an Academy. Starner should have been saying "What the f**k are you doing?" Then there is Widdrington , who openly boasted (1) This is the best squad since promotion and (b) there are goals in this team. He is obviously an idiot if he though that. Both are wasting Waels money. Wael, a very nice man, but he needs to kick these to up the arse and hopefully out the door. Wael needs to employ people who have worked for a successful club.
Then there are coaches. Barton knows what the club needs, and it doesnt need all the coaches we have either. We are where we are because of incompetence and the desire to introduce as many kids to the team asap. Training must be like the Mall on the first day of the school holidays. We need experienced players in the team and they need to be better than Upson for example, and when you have a solid team structure with experienced players you fit the young ones in along side of them, not instead of them. So who do I trust to bring these players in? Well Barton has to ba a whole lot better than Widdrington, because he recomended the shower of crap we now have.
I feel sorry for Wael he has been taken for a ride. He thinks the crowds will grow if we play "exciting" football, well I hate to say this but really its not "exciting " football that brings in the crowds, its winning football, because winning football usually includes scoring goals, and not letting many in.
I really hope someone goes on to Twentymans show and offers a huge appology to the fans, somehow I have my doubts.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2021 15:29:22 GMT
Exactly, only the person who has been told what JB plans are and believes in those plans are Wael. If we could see what those plans are then we could all make a better judgement but the truth if the matter is that we will have to wait and see after 12 games next season if this was the correct choice. Which means all we have to go on is his performance as manager and that has been appalling! I don’t understand why many are desperate for him to be the person to restructure the club! The club needs to be sorted out, top to bottom - an external expert is being brought in, no doubt in full consultation with Wael, with JB being the mouthpiece as he has experience of working with this person at Fleetwood. Within a short time of JB and team being here, players were saying that it felt like a totally different club - in a good way. They were able to be frank with JB, about the standards, and what was going on behind the scenes, he has taken this to Wael - who has finally had his eyes opened. JB has a lot of fairly recent experience as to how top clubs operate, and the standards which are expected on the non-playing side - why would you chose not to listen to somebody with that background? Nobody can deny that the results haven't been what we would have wanted, others have already eloquently put forward the rationale for this, so I won't repeat it, we've all read the various threads. JB may well turn out to be like the Emperor's new clothes, however, I think we can only judge him fairly when he's been given the same opportunity as the previous managers to bring some of his own players in.
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Post by yetigas on Apr 18, 2021 15:38:44 GMT
JB's latest quote: 'Jonson Clarke-Harris was starting for Peterborough and he was a disgrace, he couldn’t move'.
He was so unfit he had an assist in injury time for Posh to equalise....I guess the Fleetwood players must have been even less fit.
Again, JB should stay, but these type of public quotes are an embarrassment.
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