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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2021 21:22:41 GMT
But what has he improved so far? We're still conceding stupid goals, we're still not scoring and we're getting fewer points that at any other point during the season. Not only are we not improving, one could quite easily argue we are going backwards. The comparison to Garner is soooo strong. Garner last season was in freefall - but all we had was "well it's not his team, give him time, judge him next season" blah blah blah. Christ, do we not learn?! Keep burying your head in the sand and pinning everything on blind faith, afterall it's "Joey Barton" - whatever that means or counts for. So are you saying we are not competitive in most games and our style of play has gone backwards since he has arrived. Again no manager could have coped with losing your best players in Nicholson,Rodman and even Grant who got alot of undue criticism but is sorely missed and was getting better every game he played under JB. And to be left with 3 strikers with 2 that can't hit a barn door and are certainly not league one standard and Westbrooke who was meant to be are marquee signing but has been very disappointing for the majority of the season. Losing Ehmer for me wasn't a bad thing as he has been nothing but poor this season but was meant to be our leader and pivotal centre half. Yes our defence make mistakes but watch the games most teams make massive mistakes our problem is we have noone to capatilise on them which is a major recruitment failure not Bartons fault. There are plenty of things that have gone wrong this season and this is a total different scenario than Garner who had a January transfer window as soon as he got here and inherited a team who were full of confidence when he arrived and he had JCH to score goals for him so that comparison is poor. Why shouldn't JB be given the chance to do things his way and get a transfer window and pre season to see what he can do or should we just fire another manager and keep the revolving door moving. Well said, hopefully a few others on here can stop comparing apples with oranges and give JB the same chance that Garner and to a lesser extent Tisdale had.
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Post by LJG on Apr 19, 2021 21:28:48 GMT
What's he said this time? The cleaning lady is a lady garden? The bloke who turns on the overhead projector is a prick? Showers too cold? Soup too hot? Doesn't like the carpet in the clubhouse? Very close. Well not to worry. He'll soon be in charge of the whole shooting match and can change it for whatever he wants.
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Post by LJG on Apr 19, 2021 21:29:43 GMT
So are you saying we are not competitive in most games and our style of play has gone backwards since he has arrived. Again no manager could have coped with losing your best players in Nicholson,Rodman and even Grant who got alot of undue criticism but is sorely missed and was getting better every game he played under JB. And to be left with 3 strikers with 2 that can't hit a barn door and are certainly not league one standard and Westbrooke who was meant to be are marquee signing but has been very disappointing for the majority of the season. Losing Ehmer for me wasn't a bad thing as he has been nothing but poor this season but was meant to be our leader and pivotal centre half. Yes our defence make mistakes but watch the games most teams make massive mistakes our problem is we have noone to capatilise on them which is a major recruitment failure not Bartons fault. There are plenty of things that have gone wrong this season and this is a total different scenario than Garner who had a January transfer window as soon as he got here and inherited a team who were full of confidence when he arrived and he had JCH to score goals for him so that comparison is poor. Why shouldn't JB be given the chance to do things his way and get a transfer window and pre season to see what he can do or should we just fire another manager and keep the revolving door moving. Well said, hopefully a few others on here can stop comparing apples with oranges and give JB the same chance that Garner and to a lesser extent Tisdale had. Isn't the point that it was obvious Garner should never have been given that opportunity?
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Post by Topper Gas on Apr 19, 2021 21:32:33 GMT
Your bizarre continued defence of Garner now seems to just be solely "he is less sh** than someone else" If we take it at face value and say all 3 managers this season are sh**, he is the only one that signed a full squad of his own players and had a full pre-season. He is head and shoulders the sh**test manager we have ever had. The fact the the following 2 are nearly as bad is not really something the BG fan club should be shouting about. A full squad that he signed to play possession football, a squad that weren’t in the relegation spots after playing 4 or 5 of the top 6 teams in the league in the opening 11 games. A team that hadn’t lost to any team around them or below 12th place. You can bang on and on as much as you like we weren’t going down. Garner got 30% of our wins, 37.5% of our draws and only 20% of our losses in 11 games. Tisdale got 30% of our wins, 37.5% of our draws and 37.5% of our losses in 15 games. Barton has 30% of our wins, 25% of our draws and 37.5% of our losses in 14 games. So tell me again how Garner has relegated us? Barton has lost to Swindon and Wigan and drawn with Northampton! Tisdale lost to Rochdale and Swindon and drew with Wigan! The lowest team Garner lost to in 11 games were in 10th place. You are absolutely off your chops if you can’t see we weren’t going down with that record. We spent a summer recruiting and preparing players to play a possession based football style and then recruit a manager that plays chaos, sack him and sign a manager that plays a high press and we can’t work out why it’s not working?! Compare Daly and Hanlan goals under Garner v Daly and Hanlan goals under Barton... Ok I’ll do it for you! Hanlan had 4 goals under Garner and 1 under Barton. Daly had 4 goals under garner and 0 under Barton. It's hard to believe a poster is trying to make a point about our main striker scoring just 4 goals when the striker he replaced is now on course for 30+ goals!!
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Post by bridgwatergas on Apr 19, 2021 21:36:39 GMT
So are you saying we are not competitive in most games and our style of play has gone backwards since he has arrived. Again no manager could have coped with losing your best players in Nicholson,Rodman and even Grant who got alot of undue criticism but is sorely missed and was getting better every game he played under JB. And to be left with 3 strikers with 2 that can't hit a barn door and are certainly not league one standard and Westbrooke who was meant to be are marquee signing but has been very disappointing for the majority of the season. Losing Ehmer for me wasn't a bad thing as he has been nothing but poor this season but was meant to be our leader and pivotal centre half. Yes our defence make mistakes but watch the games most teams make massive mistakes our problem is we have noone to capatilise on them which is a major recruitment failure not Bartons fault. There are plenty of things that have gone wrong this season and this is a total different scenario than Garner who had a January transfer window as soon as he got here and inherited a team who were full of confidence when he arrived and he had JCH to score goals for him so that comparison is poor. Why shouldn't JB be given the chance to do things his way and get a transfer window and pre season to see what he can do or should we just fire another manager and keep the revolving door moving. But all of those points are relevant to Tisdale too? He had the same strikeforce and injuries - he was without our best player (i.e. Ansi!). So that doesn't really cut it. And again, couldn't care less about "how we look" - all I care about right now are results; and they're pathetic. It seems once again the best argument for keeping Barton is "we can't just fire another one". Lucky, lucky man it seems. I've never mentioned Tisdale but he is another story that I have said enough on. You say results have been pathetic yes you are right but they have been all season and the best was under Garner but alot wanted him gone and got there wish. The argument about firing him has nothing to do with we can't just fire him it's about giving him a chance to build his side. He hasn't had a transfer window to work with and deserves that chance as the other two had a window even though Tisdales is the hardest one to bring in players he didn't bring in what was urgently required.
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Post by bridgwatergas on Apr 19, 2021 21:43:53 GMT
So are you saying we are not competitive in most games and our style of play has gone backwards since he has arrived. Again no manager could have coped with losing your best players in Nicholson,Rodman and even Grant who got alot of undue criticism but is sorely missed and was getting better every game he played under JB. And to be left with 3 strikers with 2 that can't hit a barn door and are certainly not league one standard and Westbrooke who was meant to be are marquee signing but has been very disappointing for the majority of the season. Losing Ehmer for me wasn't a bad thing as he has been nothing but poor this season but was meant to be our leader and pivotal centre half. Yes our defence make mistakes but watch the games most teams make massive mistakes our problem is we have noone to capatilise on them which is a major recruitment failure not Bartons fault. There are plenty of things that have gone wrong this season and this is a total different scenario than Garner who had a January transfer window as soon as he got here and inherited a team who were full of confidence when he arrived and he had JCH to score goals for him so that comparison is poor. Why shouldn't JB be given the chance to do things his way and get a transfer window and pre season to see what he can do or should we just fire another manager and keep the revolving door moving. To be fair bridgwatergas, whilst you are clearly more pro-Barton than I am right now, you make good points and I don't disagree with what you're saying. I do though think that Barton should have done better, and I do think he needs to cut out his annoying unprofessional rants. Certainly I do not want to see him sacked, but I am very disappointed in his performance as manager so far, and more than a little concerned about the summer and next season. I really do hope though that JB can come back and rub my face in it if we're gunning for promotion next year and playing teams off the park. I'm more pro Bristol Rovers and want whoever is manager to succeed. I was hoping JB would have done better and saved us from relegation but things haven't gone our way whatever people think some decisions this season have definitely been against us that have been pivotal and would have given us a decent chance of escaping. I try to see the positives in things as there is enough negativity in the world and its easier to moan especially with the season we are having.
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Post by kruger on Apr 19, 2021 21:59:00 GMT
I've just got a new job as a manager, the staff are always off sick, and they can't do their job correctly because they are not the right grade, the old boss has left now and my manager is blaming me for it all even though I have only been in the job a few weeks, don't you think that's a bit unfair of my boss?
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Post by Gas Go Marching In on Apr 19, 2021 22:04:57 GMT
I've just got a new job as a manager, the staff are always off sick, and they can't do their job correctly because they are not the right grade, the old boss has left now and my manager is blaming me for it all even though I have only been in the job a few weeks, don't you think that's a bit unfair of my boss? Depends how you deal with it. You can 1) Moan about the job the previous manager done, moan about the employees, moan about your manager etc and the poor job he has done. Don't forget to make everyone else aware of this. 2) Knuckle down and try and make the most out of a bad situation. This is my problem with Barton is I feel he has chose option 1 over option 2. Or 2)
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Post by kruger on Apr 19, 2021 22:14:03 GMT
I've just got a new job as a manager, the staff are always off sick, and they can't do their job correctly because they are not the right grade, the old boss has left now and my manager is blaming me for it all even though I have only been in the job a few weeks, don't you think that's a bit unfair of my boss? Depends how you deal with it. You can 1) Moan about the job the previous manager done, moan about the employees, moan about your manager etc and the poor job he has done. Don't forget to make everyone else aware of this. 2) Knuckle down and try and make the most out of a bad situation. This is my problem with Barton is I feel he has chose option 1 over option 2. Or 2) I moan about the machinery we have because it's not consistent and not very good, one minute it works the next minute it don't bit like a referee really, I've told my boss I need to get these workers out and get some new ones in but I have to give them all a few weeks notice then I can get my own workers in to do the job that the other lot couldn't do, he agreed and said we can then decide how good I am at my job.
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Post by warehamgas on Apr 19, 2021 22:49:02 GMT
Blimey, most of the positive stuff around JB is all about what he says and calling it as it is, rather than the results. Most on here could have called that out, it’s not that hard. It’s a strange one because performances have been better but results have deteriorated. In the end what JB says is just deflection from our position. He knows what he says will probably go down well with supporters. I’d prefer to see him winning games and if he can’t say anything positive about us then best to keep quiet until the season's end when perhaps he can start to do something about changing what needs changing. The British legal system permitting of course. UTG!
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Post by Officer Barbrady on Apr 19, 2021 22:49:31 GMT
Depends how you deal with it. You can 1) Moan about the job the previous manager done, moan about the employees, moan about your manager etc and the poor job he has done. Don't forget to make everyone else aware of this. 2) Knuckle down and try and make the most out of a bad situation. This is my problem with Barton is I feel he has chose option 1 over option 2. Or 2) I moan about the machinery we have because it's not consistent and not very good, one minute it works the next minute it don't bit like a referee really, I've told my boss I need to get these workers out and get some new ones in but I have to give them all a few weeks notice then I can get my own workers in to do the job that the other lot couldn't do, he agreed and said we can then decide how good I am at my job. Nice analogy. So just to get it right, in the meantime, whilst you wait for notice periods to be worked, you can go around calling everyone cancer right?
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Post by LJG on Apr 19, 2021 23:04:01 GMT
I've just got a new job as a manager, the staff are always off sick, and they can't do their job correctly because they are not the right grade, the old boss has left now and my manager is blaming me for it all even though I have only been in the job a few weeks, don't you think that's a bit unfair of my boss? Don't you think your boss might want to know why you can't sort this out when you told him in your interview you could? You said you'd watched videos of every minute those workers have worked under the previous manager. You knew exactly what was going on when you came in and said you could fix it. Why did you tell me you could fix it if you can't? Why are results worse now you're in charge than they were the previous two blokes who you publicly called sh**? Don't you think your boss might be asking that sort of thing?
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Post by olskooltoteender on Apr 20, 2021 1:03:25 GMT
Your bizarre continued defence of Garner now seems to just be solely "he is less sh** than someone else" If we take it at face value and say all 3 managers this season are sh**, he is the only one that signed a full squad of his own players and had a full pre-season. He is head and shoulders the sh**test manager we have ever had. The fact the the following 2 are nearly as bad is not really something the BG fan club should be shouting about. A full squad that he signed to play possession football, a squad that weren’t in the relegation spots after playing 4 or 5 of the top 6 teams in the league in the opening 11 games. A team that hadn’t lost to any team around them or below 12th place. You can bang on and on as much as you like we weren’t going down. Garner got 30% of our wins, 37.5% of our draws and only 20% of our losses in 11 games. Tisdale got 30% of our wins, 37.5% of our draws and 37.5% of our losses in 15 games. Barton has 30% of our wins, 25% of our draws and 37.5% of our losses in 14 games. So tell me again how Garner has relegated us? Barton has lost to Swindon and Wigan and drawn with Northampton! Tisdale lost to Rochdale and Swindon and drew with Wigan! The lowest team Garner lost to in 11 games were in 10th place. You are absolutely off your chops if you can’t see we weren’t going down with that record. We spent a summer recruiting and preparing players to play a possession based football style and then recruit a manager that plays chaos, sack him and sign a manager that plays a high press and we can’t work out why it’s not working?! Compare Daly and Hanlan goals under Garner v Daly and Hanlan goals under Barton... Ok I’ll do it for you! Hanlan had 4 goals under Garner and 1 under Barton. Daly had 4 goals under garner and 0 under Barton. Garner is completely useless. He is solely responsible for our being in this position and I wouldn’t trust him to stack shelves in a supermarket, let alone manage a football league team. I hope he never gets another job in football. Ever. Bloke is a lady garden.
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Post by peterparker on Apr 20, 2021 5:22:50 GMT
Serious question for those Pro-Barton.
If he is convicted and/of banned from football, what will be your opinion of the JB appointment?
Roll on June, so we can get some sort of certainty
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Post by singupgas on Apr 20, 2021 5:26:00 GMT
Blimey, most of the positive stuff around JB is all about what he says and calling it as it is, rather than the results. Most on here could have called that out, it’s not that hard. It’s a strange one because performances have been better but results have deteriorated. In the end what JB says is just deflection from our position. He knows what he says will probably go down well with supporters. I’d prefer to see him winning games and if he can’t say anything positive about us then best to keep quiet until the season's end when perhaps he can start to do something about changing what needs changing. The British legal system permitting of course. UTG! Wareham, you have just said "most on here could have called that out", so I guess you would agree with JB then? If we were winning every week we wouldn't be having these conversations now, we aren't winning so it is what it is, JB is saying something whether people like to hear it or not for what they are. We truly aren't good enough and to lose as many as we have you do have to look at the players too, a good set of players would pick up wins no matter what formation or 11 is selected. We lose every game because we have defenders who make far too many mistakes and strikers who do not score goals.
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Post by baggins on Apr 20, 2021 5:32:29 GMT
Have we got worse? Results have been, yes. But we have looked competitive in most of the games I've seen since he took over. Sorry mate, it's a results business. I don't care if we're playing total football if we're getting beat every week. Strange isn't it that not so long ago fans were complaining at the style of football offered up by GC.
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Post by gashead1981 on Apr 20, 2021 6:04:39 GMT
I understand that, but do you honestly believe this group of players are able to avoid the drop, regardless of who is managing them? Yes. They were in the process of avoiding it until Joey took over. Then he had a long list of hugely winnable games, against teams around or below us - all of which he lost. I disagree. Under Tisdale we were getting hammered every game including a 6-1 pathetic display up at Accrington. The only thing that made staying up a possibility was the amount of games Joey had a lot of luck and hope. . Beyond that, he had no chance. It’s a poor squad, no strength and depth, devoid of experience with an injury list that took out the one or two players that could play in this division. That inexperience has cost us around 20 points this season in either poor decision making, poor play, or just not having the right management around them to have been drilled in a way to know what to do. Culpability of this season lies firmly at the feet of TW, Garner and Tisdale who mismanaged the entire recruitment since last January, over a season and half of poor signings. How on earth can you go into a season with 3 strikers, 2 of them completely inexperienced and expect to stay up? Uttter madness. We have looked more of a football team under JB than we have previously under the previous managers. I didn’t like the JB appointment when it was made, but he gets my backing now simply because I’ve seen what he has done performance wise with us and that will stand us in good stead for what L2 is all about.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Apr 20, 2021 6:09:18 GMT
Sorry mate, it's a results business. I don't care if we're playing total football if we're getting beat every week. Strange isn't it that not so long ago fans were complaining at the style of football offered up by GC. That's because it was sh** to watch. Just because what came after is sh**, that doesnt automatically make Coughlanball easy on the eye. Relegation is part and parcel of football. At our best we are a L1 club. At our worse we are non league. Thats just how it is.
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Post by gashead1981 on Apr 20, 2021 6:16:15 GMT
Well said, hopefully a few others on here can stop comparing apples with oranges and give JB the same chance that Garner and to a lesser extent Tisdale had. Isn't the point that it was obvious Garner should never have been given that opportunity? Garner should have been given the opportunity. What the board should have done was either sacked him at the end of last season after 1 win 18 or whatever it was or kept him until December when we had a much better idea of where we were at this season. Carlts could be right, he could have kept us up, but also he could have capitulated and given his record in 30 odd games, the poor style of play he was promoting, I can understand him getting the sack. What was a mistake was appointing Tisdale and then not strengthening in January. Our season was salvageable, but we were down the moment that window closed. Gross mismanagement of resources right there.
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Post by worrelsterlingalbion on Apr 20, 2021 6:31:24 GMT
Your bizarre continued defence of Garner now seems to just be solely "he is less sh** than someone else" If we take it at face value and say all 3 managers this season are sh**, he is the only one that signed a full squad of his own players and had a full pre-season. He is head and shoulders the sh**test manager we have ever had. The fact the the following 2 are nearly as bad is not really something the BG fan club should be shouting about. A full squad that he signed to play possession football, a squad that weren’t in the relegation spots after playing 4 or 5 of the top 6 teams in the league in the opening 11 games. A team that hadn’t lost to any team around them or below 12th place. You can bang on and on as much as you like we weren’t going down. Garner got 30% of our wins, 37.5% of our draws and only 20% of our losses in 11 games. Tisdale got 30% of our wins, 37.5% of our draws and 37.5% of our losses in 15 games. Barton has 30% of our wins, 25% of our draws and 37.5% of our losses in 14 games. So tell me again how Garner has relegated us? Barton has lost to Swindon and Wigan and drawn with Northampton! Tisdale lost to Rochdale and Swindon and drew with Wigan! The lowest team Garner lost to in 11 games were in 10th place. You are absolutely off your chops if you can’t see we weren’t going down with that record. We spent a summer recruiting and preparing players to play a possession based football style and then recruit a manager that plays chaos, sack him and sign a manager that plays a high press and we can’t work out why it’s not working?! Compare Daly and Hanlan goals under Garner v Daly and Hanlan goals under Barton... Ok I’ll do it for you! Hanlan had 4 goals under Garner and 1 under Barton. Daly had 4 goals under garner and 0 under Barton. You're persistent I'll give you that. Not sure how anyone can so fervently defend Garner and that comes from someone who was very much in favour (wrongly as it turns out) of letting him build his own squad. Quite how you can be so sure we wouldnt have gone down under him is beyond me, you do realise that this seasons record when he was sacked cant just be extrapolated through the rest of the games ? Possession football you say,if by that you meant we'll play 30 passes between our back 3 and defensive midfield then punt it forward without ever testing their keeper then I'd agree. How many games did he oversee when we barely had a shot ? As for Hanlan, 4 goals yes but by the time Barton arrived he was shot to pieces, flogged to death playing every minute as Garner had deemed it the right thing to go with 3 strikers and then promptly lost Ayunga injured for 2 months. I admire the fact you stick up for him but he is the major reason (along with Widdrington and to a lesser extent Tisdale) we are in this mess. I've asked you this before and not got an answer but if the roles were reversed and JB had a full pre season and a blank canvas to bring in his signings and them Garner had been tasked with coming into the same situation as Barton how do you think that would have gone ?
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