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Post by baggins on Apr 20, 2021 6:33:04 GMT
Strange isn't it that not so long ago fans were complaining at the style of football offered up by GC. That's because it was sh** to watch. Just because what came after is sh**, that doesnt automatically make Coughlanball easy on the eye. Relegation is part and parcel of football. At our best we are a L1 club. At our worse we are non league. Thats just how it is. I didn't say it was easy on the eye, was pointing out that sometimes, if it's a results business, you've got to accept performances like that. If you're us that is.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Apr 20, 2021 6:48:18 GMT
Yeah that's fair enough.
One thing we can probably all agree on is that Barton has certainly divided the fan base and that can never be a good thing.
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Post by carlts2020 on Apr 20, 2021 6:49:28 GMT
A full squad that he signed to play possession football, a squad that weren’t in the relegation spots after playing 4 or 5 of the top 6 teams in the league in the opening 11 games. A team that hadn’t lost to any team around them or below 12th place. You can bang on and on as much as you like we weren’t going down. Garner got 30% of our wins, 37.5% of our draws and only 20% of our losses in 11 games. Tisdale got 30% of our wins, 37.5% of our draws and 37.5% of our losses in 15 games. Barton has 30% of our wins, 25% of our draws and 37.5% of our losses in 14 games. So tell me again how Garner has relegated us? Barton has lost to Swindon and Wigan and drawn with Northampton! Tisdale lost to Rochdale and Swindon and drew with Wigan! The lowest team Garner lost to in 11 games were in 10th place. You are absolutely off your chops if you can’t see we weren’t going down with that record. We spent a summer recruiting and preparing players to play a possession based football style and then recruit a manager that plays chaos, sack him and sign a manager that plays a high press and we can’t work out why it’s not working?! Compare Daly and Hanlan goals under Garner v Daly and Hanlan goals under Barton... Ok I’ll do it for you! Hanlan had 4 goals under Garner and 1 under Barton. Daly had 4 goals under garner and 0 under Barton. You're persistent I'll give you that. Not sure how anyone can so fervently defend Garner and that comes from someone who was very much in favour (wrongly as it turns out) of letting him build his own squad. Quite how you can be so sure we wouldnt have gone down under him is beyond me, you do realise that this seasons record when he was sacked cant just be extrapolated through the rest of the games ? Possession football you say,if by that you meant we'll play 30 passes between our back 3 and defensive midfield then punt it forward without ever testing their keeper then I'd agree. How many games did he oversee when we barely had a shot ? As for Hanlan, 4 goals yes but by the time Barton arrived he was shot to pieces, flogged to death playing every minute as Garner had deemed it the right thing to go with 3 strikers and then promptly lost Ayunga injured for 2 months. I admire the fact you stick up for him but he is the major reason (along with Widdrington and to a lesser extent Tisdale) we are in this mess. I've asked you this before and not got an answer but if the roles were reversed and JB had a full pre season and a blank canvas to bring in his signings and them Garner had been tasked with coming into the same situation as Barton how do you think that would have gone ? Neither Hanlan or Daly played every minute under Garner. He was quite principled in resting players for the trophy games and didn’t play Hanlan or Daly in the EFL cup first game of the season. There are lots that will have fingers in their ears and shout lalalala but we had our most wins, most draws and least losses under Garner this season. Our best result was 2-1 away to Lincoln under Garner and we were unbeaten against relegation rivals under Garner (this is most important). Finally, we had the least injuries under Garner, our strikers scored their most goals under Garner and our highest league position of the season was under Garner. It has also been well documented about how much the club improved behind the scenes under Garner which was a main part of selecting him for the job. Not liking Garner, or possession football or whatever else it is unfortunately is not relevant. We weren’t going down under Garner. That’s a fact.
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Post by playtowin on Apr 20, 2021 6:51:37 GMT
I'm over his talk now. If he could have backed up his talk with results (i.e. us NOT getting relegated) then it would hold a lot more sway for me. Don't get me wrong, I don't hate the guy, I think he's an interesting character, quite articulate and certainly passionate, which I like. However, he has to convert his talk into results for me now. I've become too cynical to accept anything else. We've shown zero fight recently. Surely a bunch of Sunday league players would have shown that with the right management? Don't get me wrong I don't want him gone but I'd rather he kept his mouth shut and started planning for an assault on L2 next season. Have to disagree about the effort. The effort has been there ,there have been no lazy players. The fact still remains if the strikers dont score the rest of the team lose confidence in them scoring. So try to get goals without them which leads to gaps at the back and mistakes. If the team knew they could rely on one of the 3 strikers to score each game they could concentrate more on their own games. Its not like the strikers are being starved of the ball they get it lots and in good positions. I know hanlan didnt play all the last game but he didnt even have a shot. Ayunga had two blocked efforts and a lightweight headed attempt. They never attack the 6 yard area ,so many times ball have gone across the box and the strikers watch from a distance. Could you imagine cureton or penrice or devon white doing that ? The strikers we have 'look' the part do lots of hard work but are not natural goalscorers who can read the game. Simply not good enough.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Apr 20, 2021 7:00:30 GMT
You're persistent I'll give you that. Not sure how anyone can so fervently defend Garner and that comes from someone who was very much in favour (wrongly as it turns out) of letting him build his own squad. Quite how you can be so sure we wouldnt have gone down under him is beyond me, you do realise that this seasons record when he was sacked cant just be extrapolated through the rest of the games ? Possession football you say,if by that you meant we'll play 30 passes between our back 3 and defensive midfield then punt it forward without ever testing their keeper then I'd agree. How many games did he oversee when we barely had a shot ? As for Hanlan, 4 goals yes but by the time Barton arrived he was shot to pieces, flogged to death playing every minute as Garner had deemed it the right thing to go with 3 strikers and then promptly lost Ayunga injured for 2 months. I admire the fact you stick up for him but he is the major reason (along with Widdrington and to a lesser extent Tisdale) we are in this mess. I've asked you this before and not got an answer but if the roles were reversed and JB had a full pre season and a blank canvas to bring in his signings and them Garner had been tasked with coming into the same situation as Barton how do you think that would have gone ? Neither Hanlan or Daly played every minute under Garner. He was quite principled in resting players for the trophy games and didn’t play Hanlan or Daly in the EFL cup first game of the season. There are lots that will have fingers in their ears and shout lalalala but we had our most wins, most draws and least losses under Garner this season. Our best result was 2-1 away to Lincoln under Garner and we were unbeaten against relegation rivals under Garner (this is most important). Finally, we had the least injuries under Garner, our strikers scored their most goals under Garner and our highest league position of the season was under Garner. It has also been well documented about how much the club improved behind the scenes under Garner which was a main part of selecting him for the job. Not liking Garner, or possession football or whatever else it is unfortunately is not relevant. We weren’t going down under Garner. That’s a fact. No it's not. It's an opinion.
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Post by worrelsterlingalbion on Apr 20, 2021 7:01:24 GMT
You're persistent I'll give you that. Not sure how anyone can so fervently defend Garner and that comes from someone who was very much in favour (wrongly as it turns out) of letting him build his own squad. Quite how you can be so sure we wouldnt have gone down under him is beyond me, you do realise that this seasons record when he was sacked cant just be extrapolated through the rest of the games ? Possession football you say,if by that you meant we'll play 30 passes between our back 3 and defensive midfield then punt it forward without ever testing their keeper then I'd agree. How many games did he oversee when we barely had a shot ? As for Hanlan, 4 goals yes but by the time Barton arrived he was shot to pieces, flogged to death playing every minute as Garner had deemed it the right thing to go with 3 strikers and then promptly lost Ayunga injured for 2 months. I admire the fact you stick up for him but he is the major reason (along with Widdrington and to a lesser extent Tisdale) we are in this mess. I've asked you this before and not got an answer but if the roles were reversed and JB had a full pre season and a blank canvas to bring in his signings and them Garner had been tasked with coming into the same situation as Barton how do you think that would have gone ? Neither Hanlan or Daly played every minute under Garner. He was quite principled in resting players for the trophy games and didn’t play Hanlan or Daly in the EFL cup first game of the season. There are lots that will have fingers in their ears and shout lalalala but we had our most wins, most draws and least losses under Garner this season. Our best result was 2-1 away to Lincoln under Garner and we were unbeaten against relegation rivals under Garner (this is most important). Finally, we had the least injuries under Garner, our strikers scored their most goals under Garner and our highest league position of the season was under Garner. It has also been well documented about how much the club improved behind the scenes under Garner which was a main part of selecting him for the job. Not liking Garner, or possession football or whatever else it is unfortunately is not relevant. We weren’t going down under Garner. That’s a fact. Just repeating we weren't going down under Garner doesnt make it a fact, we might have stayed up or might not the only fact is neither of us know. No you're right neither Hanlan or Daly played against Ipswich from memory I think Hanlan had only just signed and Daly possibly not fit so we played the renowned prolific striker Mitchell Lawson up top with our only other striker Ayunga on the bench. Less injuries under Garner is pretty obvious it's the start of the season so players are more likely to be fit, they hadn't played for 3 months so logic says most of them would be available. It's a fact Hanlan played virtually every game out of necessity as Garner chose to go with 3 strikers during a season when everyone knew the games were packed together, absolute madness
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Post by Topper Gas on Apr 20, 2021 7:03:13 GMT
You're persistent I'll give you that. Not sure how anyone can so fervently defend Garner and that comes from someone who was very much in favour (wrongly as it turns out) of letting him build his own squad. Quite how you can be so sure we wouldnt have gone down under him is beyond me, you do realise that this seasons record when he was sacked cant just be extrapolated through the rest of the games ? Possession football you say,if by that you meant we'll play 30 passes between our back 3 and defensive midfield then punt it forward without ever testing their keeper then I'd agree. How many games did he oversee when we barely had a shot ? As for Hanlan, 4 goals yes but by the time Barton arrived he was shot to pieces, flogged to death playing every minute as Garner had deemed it the right thing to go with 3 strikers and then promptly lost Ayunga injured for 2 months. I admire the fact you stick up for him but he is the major reason (along with Widdrington and to a lesser extent Tisdale) we are in this mess. I've asked you this before and not got an answer but if the roles were reversed and JB had a full pre season and a blank canvas to bring in his signings and them Garner had been tasked with coming into the same situation as Barton how do you think that would have gone ? Neither Hanlan or Daly played every minute under Garner. He was quite principled in resting players for the trophy games and didn’t play Hanlan or Daly in the EFL cup first game of the season. There are lots that will have fingers in their ears and shout lalalala but we had our most wins, most draws and least losses under Garner this season. Our best result was 2-1 away to Lincoln under Garner and we were unbeaten against relegation rivals under Garner (this is most important). Finally, we had the least injuries under Garner, our strikers scored their most goals under Garner and our highest league position of the season was under Garner. It has also been well documented about how much the club improved behind the scenes under Garner which was a main part of selecting him for the job. Not liking Garner, or possession football or whatever else it is unfortunately is not relevant. We weren’t going down under Garner. That’s a fact. So why did the board dismiss Garner if he was going to keep us up and doing such a good job generally, just for the sake of it? I assume he was told the reasons for his dismissal?
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Post by milesy83 on Apr 20, 2021 7:21:02 GMT
All the same people moaning about JB like when he first walk through the door. Get a grip, no manager can sort this team out! Garner and tisdale had transfer windows to try and sort this team out and they didn't address the problems we had. Give JB a chance to sort his own team out, he will sort it out. I know I will fully be behind him and trust he will take us forward next season.
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Post by Jomo on Apr 20, 2021 7:52:18 GMT
All the same people moaning about JB like when he first walk through the door. Get a grip, no manager can sort this team out! Garner and tisdale had transfer windows to try and sort this team out and they didn't address the problems we had. Give JB a chance to sort his own team out, he will sort it out. I know I will fully be behind him and trust he will take us forward next season. You're flat out wrong about that. I was excited about him after his first interview and for a while afterwards. In the same way, not everybody who opposed his appointment in the first place wants him out. Try not to make sweeping statements. Still, regardless of my reticence about him now, I will continue to support the club and will continue to hope that JB sorts us out and takes us to greater things. No true Gashead wouldn't want that.
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Post by BishopstonBRFC on Apr 20, 2021 7:59:17 GMT
We’ve got even worse since he arrived. I actually do want him to try and lead us to promotion next season but I'm not sure what all these outbursts are achieving. Have we got worse? Results have been, yes. But we have looked competitive in most of the games I've seen since he took over. It's a results business though.
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Post by bluebiro on Apr 20, 2021 8:00:27 GMT
You're persistent I'll give you that. Not sure how anyone can so fervently defend Garner and that comes from someone who was very much in favour (wrongly as it turns out) of letting him build his own squad. Quite how you can be so sure we wouldnt have gone down under him is beyond me, you do realise that this seasons record when he was sacked cant just be extrapolated through the rest of the games ? Possession football you say,if by that you meant we'll play 30 passes between our back 3 and defensive midfield then punt it forward without ever testing their keeper then I'd agree. How many games did he oversee when we barely had a shot ? As for Hanlan, 4 goals yes but by the time Barton arrived he was shot to pieces, flogged to death playing every minute as Garner had deemed it the right thing to go with 3 strikers and then promptly lost Ayunga injured for 2 months. I admire the fact you stick up for him but he is the major reason (along with Widdrington and to a lesser extent Tisdale) we are in this mess. I've asked you this before and not got an answer but if the roles were reversed and JB had a full pre season and a blank canvas to bring in his signings and them Garner had been tasked with coming into the same situation as Barton how do you think that would have gone ? Neither Hanlan or Daly played every minute under Garner. He was quite principled in resting players for the trophy games and didn’t play Hanlan or Daly in the EFL cup first game of the season. There are lots that will have fingers in their ears and shout lalalala but we had our most wins, most draws and least losses under Garner this season. Our best result was 2-1 away to Lincoln under Garner and we were unbeaten against relegation rivals under Garner (this is most important). Finally, we had the least injuries under Garner, our strikers scored their most goals under Garner and our highest league position of the season was under Garner. It has also been well documented about how much the club improved behind the scenes under Garner which was a main part of selecting him for the job. Not liking Garner, or possession football or whatever else it is unfortunately is not relevant. We weren’t going down under Garner. That’s a fact. still out of work.thats a fact
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Post by gregsy on Apr 20, 2021 8:04:03 GMT
Neither Hanlan or Daly played every minute under Garner. He was quite principled in resting players for the trophy games and didn’t play Hanlan or Daly in the EFL cup first game of the season. There are lots that will have fingers in their ears and shout lalalala but we had our most wins, most draws and least losses under Garner this season. Our best result was 2-1 away to Lincoln under Garner and we were unbeaten against relegation rivals under Garner (this is most important). Finally, we had the least injuries under Garner, our strikers scored their most goals under Garner and our highest league position of the season was under Garner. It has also been well documented about how much the club improved behind the scenes under Garner which was a main part of selecting him for the job. Not liking Garner, or possession football or whatever else it is unfortunately is not relevant. We weren’t going down under Garner. That’s a fact. still out of work.thats a fact Still technically employed by us isn't he?
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Post by LJG on Apr 20, 2021 8:05:06 GMT
Isn't the point that it was obvious Garner should never have been given that opportunity? Garner should have been given the opportunity. What the board should have done was either sacked him at the end of last season after 1 win 18 or whatever it was or kept him until December when we had a much better idea of where we were at this season. Carlts could be right, he could have kept us up, but also he could have capitulated and given his record in 30 odd games, the poor style of play he was promoting, I can understand him getting the sack. What was a mistake was appointing Tisdale and then not strengthening in January. Our season was salvageable, but we were down the moment that window closed. Gross mismanagement of resources right there. Sorry, this is what I meant by never given the opportunity. We saw how bad he was last season so he should never have been allowed to build his own squad. I'm of the same opinion about Barton. We're seeing someone fail. That's not a reason to start giving them whatever they demand.
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Post by bluebiro on Apr 20, 2021 8:10:27 GMT
still out of work.thats a fact Still technically employed by us isn't he? employed but not working because no one is daft enough to take him off our wage bill.yet his ppg are so impressive.
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Post by gashead1981 on Apr 20, 2021 8:20:09 GMT
Yeah that's fair enough. One thing we can probably all agree on is that Barton has certainly divided the fan base and that can never be a good thing. Unless Wael appointed Holloway, which on the evidence we have from his last appointment at Grimsby is now a busted flush, no appointment was going to truly harmonise the fanbase.
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Post by kruger on Apr 20, 2021 8:30:54 GMT
All the same people moaning about JB like when he first walk through the door. Get a grip, no manager can sort this team out! Garner and tisdale had transfer windows to try and sort this team out and they didn't address the problems we had. Give JB a chance to sort his own team out, he will sort it out. I know I will fully be behind him and trust he will take us forward next season. exactly my thoughts, same ones not giving him a chance and want him To fail, any dig they can throw they will
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Post by LJG on Apr 20, 2021 8:34:15 GMT
All the same people moaning about JB like when he first walk through the door. Get a grip, no manager can sort this team out! Garner and tisdale had transfer windows to try and sort this team out and they didn't address the problems we had. Give JB a chance to sort his own team out, he will sort it out. I know I will fully be behind him and trust he will take us forward next season. So if he keeps us up Barton won't deserve any card for that?
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Post by LJG on Apr 20, 2021 8:34:58 GMT
All the same people moaning about JB like when he first walk through the door. Get a grip, no manager can sort this team out! Garner and tisdale had transfer windows to try and sort this team out and they didn't address the problems we had. Give JB a chance to sort his own team out, he will sort it out. I know I will fully be behind him and trust he will take us forward next season. exactly my thoughts, same ones not giving him a chance and want him To fail, any dig they can throw they will Same question to you - if he keeps us up he gets no credit as far as you're concerned?
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Post by kruger on Apr 20, 2021 8:58:16 GMT
exactly my thoughts, same ones not giving him a chance and want him To fail, any dig they can throw they will Same question to you - if he keeps us up he gets no credit as far as you're concerned? some of our fans are fickle, he will be the best thing since sliced bread if he keeps us up, he gets credit from me when we go down or if the unthinkable happens and he keeps us up, let's be honest we are not staying up we are the worst team in this league
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Post by LJG on Apr 20, 2021 9:32:42 GMT
Same question to you - if he keeps us up he gets no credit as far as you're concerned? some of our fans are fickle, he will be the best thing since sliced bread if he keeps us up, he gets credit from me when we go down or if the unthinkable happens and he keeps us up, let's be honest we are not staying up we are the worst team in this league What are you giving him credit for if we go down?
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