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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 11:48:04 GMT
Check out @mnrrnt’s Tweet:
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stuart1974
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Post by stuart1974 on Oct 3, 2018 12:08:45 GMT
I didn't think the speech was that bad, bearing in mind what happened last year and who the real audience was.
The speech wasn't aimed at the likes of us, but the party wings, her tone and comments were aimed at the Rees-Mogg side that want out regardless,the other side that want a Norway style deal or Brexit in all but name and everyone with the comments about how bad Labour (or more specifically Jeremy Corbyn) would be.
Back me with a bespoke compromise or get nothing (WTO or a second referendum depending on your point of view) or even worse, lose power.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 12:22:43 GMT
I didn't take any political stance, only raised the issue that there is a very recent history of problems with a hard boarder. How anyone can think a hard boarder is a good idea is ignoring this problem. I think the hard border meaning a resumption of the Troubles is a bit misleading (incidentally Quantocks, I very much disagree with your interpretation of events) but it being a totem for those with a different agenda and a focal point for resentment. Wherever a hard border would be it is likely to lead to a quicker plebiscite for Irish unification than mere demographics would and no British Prime Minister would want to be the modern day Lord North. In the 1973 Referendum in Northern Ireland, which asked if NI should merge with the South, 98.9% of all votes cast were to stay as part of the UK. The majority of the North do not want to be part of the South, and we, as a democracy, should do all we can to support and defend those people. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 12:25:09 GMT
I didn't think the speech was that bad, bearing in mind what happened last year and who the real audience was. The speech wasn't aimed at the likes of us, but the party wings, her tone and comments were aimed at the Rees-Mogg side that want out regardless,the other side that want a Norway style deal or Brexit in all but name and everyone with the comments about how bad Labour (or more specifically Jeremy Corbyn) would be. Back me with a bespoke compromise or get nothing (WTO or a second referendum depending on your point of view) or even worse, lose power. We just cannot have a second referendum. Why is it that the people calling for a second referendum will not abide by the result of the first referendum! What makes the result in the second referendum any different than the first result? It's not democracy, it's bullying. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 12:27:26 GMT
I didn't think the speech was that bad, bearing in mind what happened last year and who the real audience was. The speech wasn't aimed at the likes of us, but the party wings, her tone and comments were aimed at the Rees-Mogg side that want out regardless,the other side that want a Norway style deal or Brexit in all but name and everyone with the comments about how bad Labour (or more specifically Jeremy Corbyn) would be. Back me with a bespoke compromise or get nothing (WTO or a second referendum depending on your point of view) or even worse, lose power. I agree the speech was aimed at themselves, with a few bits aimed at countering proposals made by Labour. The one that caught my eye (Or ear) was the plan to allow local councils to borrow money against their revenue account to build houses. So 35 years after Thatcher obliterated local democracy and prevented councils from raising their own funds, which led to the collapse of local authority house building and directly to today's housing crisis, they reverse. Jesus. |
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Post by baggins on Oct 3, 2018 12:27:47 GMT
Can anyone, anyone, honestly say that this isn't anything other than a complete and utter f**k up? And let's also be honest, it's all the Tories fault.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 12:29:47 GMT
<iframe width="16.159999999999968" height="6.759999999999991" style="position: absolute; width: 16.159999999999968px; height: 6.759999999999991px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none;left: 15px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_6141440" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="16.159999999999968" height="6.759999999999991" style="position: absolute; width: 16.16px; height: 6.76px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 755px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_16032832" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="16.159999999999968" height="6.759999999999991" style="position: absolute; width: 16.16px; height: 6.76px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 15px; top: 275px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_36783831" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="16.159999999999968" height="6.759999999999991" style="position: absolute; width: 16.16px; height: 6.76px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 755px; top: 275px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_1633476" scrolling="no"></iframe> oh dear, you're not harping on about Croke Park 1920. It wasn't the British Army. You also have to look at that day in total and the fourteen murders in the morning by the IRA that led up to the later events. Nowadays you can watch Taylor Swift play at Croke Park. Times move on. It's about time some others did as well. Yes I know. But I was responding to Quantocks standard response to the Irish issue. Thankfully we are at peace, neither "side" wants any disruption to that peace and all sides do not want a hard border dividing Northern Ireland and Eire. About 50% of us, at least, don't want a hard border between the UK and ANY of the countries in the EU. Nor do the Japanese. Nor the vast majority of companies who have invested 100s of billions of their own money in the UK. Well, if 'you know' why did you imply the British Army were the bad guys? Why cast that slur if you knew it to be wrong? It's difficult to trust/believe a single word you print when you put out these blatant lies, which you knew were lies. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 12:32:32 GMT
Can anyone, anyone, honestly say that this isn't anything other than a complete and utter f**k up? And let's also be honest, it's all the Tories fault. No Bags, it's the fault of all the politicians on all sides. As has been said on here before, the Referendum was a non-partizan vote. It was not conducted across party lines. It's the politicians that have turned it into a party issue, when in reality, all parties should have joined together to deliver what is best for the country. This can be demonstrated by the fact that you believe it to be 'all the Tories fault'. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 12:42:58 GMT
Can anyone, anyone, honestly say that this isn't anything other than a complete and utter f**k up? And let's also be honest, it's all the Tories fault. No Bags, it's the fault of all the politicians on all sides. As has been said on here before, the Referendum was a non-partizan vote. It was not conducted across party lines. It's the politicians that have turned it into a party issue, when in reality, all parties should have joined together to deliver what is best for the country. This can be demonstrated by the fact that you believe it to be 'all the Tories fault'. I think it's a fair shout to say the ONLY reason Cameron raised the potential for a referendum and got it through Parliament was to try and kill off the minority in the Tory party who constantly attacked their own leadership over Europe, for decades. Without that this shambles, this threat to our economic well being would not be happening. |
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Oct 3, 2018 12:43:34 GMT
Check out @mnrrnt’s Tweet: Cringey. |
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Post by baggins on Oct 3, 2018 12:46:42 GMT
Can anyone, anyone, honestly say that this isn't anything other than a complete and utter f**k up? And let's also be honest, it's all the Tories fault. No Bags, it's the fault of all the politicians on all sides. As has been said on here before, the Referendum was a non-partizan vote. It was not conducted across party lines. It's the politicians that have turned it into a party issue, when in reality, all parties should have joined together to deliver what is best for the country. This can be demonstrated by the fact that you believe it to be 'all the Tories fault'. So who called for the referendum then? Labour? Liberals? Or Tories? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 12:58:28 GMT
No Bags, it's the fault of all the politicians on all sides. As has been said on here before, the Referendum was a non-partizan vote. It was not conducted across party lines. It's the politicians that have turned it into a party issue, when in reality, all parties should have joined together to deliver what is best for the country. This can be demonstrated by the fact that you believe it to be 'all the Tories fault'. So who called for the referendum then? Labour? Liberals? Or Tories? All three did. It was in all their individual Manifesto's ! |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 13:00:12 GMT
No Bags, it's the fault of all the politicians on all sides. As has been said on here before, the Referendum was a non-partizan vote. It was not conducted across party lines. It's the politicians that have turned it into a party issue, when in reality, all parties should have joined together to deliver what is best for the country. This can be demonstrated by the fact that you believe it to be 'all the Tories fault'. I think it's a fair shout to say the ONLY reason Cameron raised the potential for a referendum and got it through Parliament was to try and kill off the minority in the Tory party who constantly attacked their own leadership over Europe, for decades. Without that this shambles, this threat to our economic well being would not be happening. Wrong again. All three parties voted in the HoC to hold a Referendum. It is pretty fair to say that all three of them were scared of the votes they were losing to UKIP at that time. "The European Union Referendum Bill easily passed during a vote in the Commons last night by 544 to 53, with support from Labour MPs giving the motion a majority of 491." |
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Post by baggins on Oct 3, 2018 13:04:59 GMT
So who called for the referendum then? Labour? Liberals? Or Tories? All three did. It was in all their individual Manifesto's ! But ultimately it was Cameron. The Tory. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 13:09:15 GMT
All three did. It was in all their individual Manifesto's ! But ultimately it was Cameron. The Tory. "The European Union Referendum Bill easily passed during a vote in the Commons last night by 544 to 53, with support from Labour MPs giving the motion a majority of 491." The 53 who voted against it were the SNP. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 13:12:53 GMT
I think it's a fair shout to say the ONLY reason Cameron raised the potential for a referendum and got it through Parliament was to try and kill off the minority in the Tory party who constantly attacked their own leadership over Europe, for decades. Without that this shambles, this threat to our economic well being would not be happening. Wrong again. All three parties voted in the HoC to hold a Referendum. It is pretty fair to say that all three of them were scared of the votes they were losing to UKIP at that time. "The European Union Referendum Bill easily passed during a vote in the Commons last night by 544 to 53, with support from Labour MPs giving the motion a majority of 491." Not wrong, I have said it went through Parliament. But it was Cameron who was tired of the party infighting and introduced the legislation. This was a Tory led issue. Lib Dems were discredited and Labour were in complete disarray. No, it was the Tory hard right that forced this and they are still agitating for the hardest of Brexits. The internal strife continues, derailing current negotiations. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 13:21:18 GMT
"The internal strife continues, derailing current negotiations."
I think it's the EU that are derailing negotiations as they have no intention of negotiating a deal.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 13:38:21 GMT
"The internal strife continues, derailing current negotiations." I think it's the EU that are derailing negotiations as they have no intention of negotiating a deal. Might help if our "government" had an agreed position to negotiate from. They don't because the hard right whithin their own party prevents them getting a position through Parliament. The same group, many of whom have been causing issues for decades, that forced Cameron's hand |
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Post by South Stand Ultra on Oct 3, 2018 13:40:19 GMT
I didn't think the speech was that bad, bearing in mind what happened last year and who the real audience was. The speech wasn't aimed at the likes of us, but the party wings, her tone and comments were aimed at the Rees-Mogg side that want out regardless,the other side that want a Norway style deal or Brexit in all but name and everyone with the comments about how bad Labour (or more specifically Jeremy Corbyn) would be. Back me with a bespoke compromise or get nothing (WTO or a second referendum depending on your point of view) or even worse, lose power. We just cannot have a second referendum. Why is it that the people calling for a second referendum will not abide by the result of the first referendum! What makes the result in the second referendum any different than the first result? It's not democracy, it's bullying.
They're calling it it "the people's vote"
Um no, we had the "people's vote" 2 years ago, and the "people" voted to leave!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2018 13:45:08 GMT
"The internal strife continues, derailing current negotiations." I think it's the EU that are derailing negotiations as they have no intention of negotiating a deal. Might help if our "government" had an agreed position to negotiate from. They don't because the hard right whithin their own party prevents them getting a position through Parliament. The same group, many of whom have been causing issues for decades, that forced Cameron's hand What is your obsession with the 'hard right'? To be honest, there is no such thing as a 'hard right' in the Tory Party! |
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