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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 12:25:46 GMT
Wow, Shareholders get paid a dividend. Shocking eh? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 12:50:27 GMT
All these links Oldie.....to the Sun, Daily Mirror, The Independent, Economist.....Phew. One day you may wish to use your own experience's to form a judgement rather than relying on biased media streams.
Here's something for you to ponder. Immigration worries are not restricted to those with center-right views. The whole immigration discussion is not about left-wing, right-wing, and as long as you are stuck in your idealogical straighjacket, you'll never understand the effects that mass immigration has had on those near the bottom of the ladder.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 15:01:35 GMT
All these links Oldie.....to the Sun, Daily Mirror, The Independent, Economist.....Phew. One day you may wish to use your own experience's to form a judgement rather than relying on biased media streams. Here's something for you to ponder. Immigration worries are not restricted to those with center-right views. The whole immigration discussion is not about left-wing, right-wing, and as long as you are stuck in your idealogical straighjacket, you'll never understand the effects that mass immigration has had on those near the bottom of the ladder. Hi Nobby The links I post are put up to back up my points of view. Most (I hope) are based upon actual events and or empirical evidence. You claim that I am stuck in an ideological straitjacket, where previously I have been accused of being a raging lefty, out of touch home counties resident and aloof. None of which are true of course. You claim I can never understand how immigration has affected those near the bottom of the ladder. But then you do not say what that affect has been?. I would argue that the biggest impact on the lives of those near the bottom of the ladder has been the impact of austerity. A policy of withdrawal of funding for public services in order to alleviate the impact of the mass of debt incurred to bail out the banking sector, and the 6% reduction in annual GDP this caused. Immigration had nothing to do with that, in fact as the Economist shows immigration has added net value to the economy. This thread, along with others, is however about Brexit and the outcome on the UK Economy. I guess we have argued that to death now and what will be will be. Personally I see an economy which is only just delivering some positive outcomes on those near "the bottom of the ladder, after 8 years, is hopelessly unbalanced in terms of income distribution, is at least six years behind the fiscal targets set by the government in 2010, whose currency has depreciated by 20% over the last 18 months (see imported inflation which hits the poorest the most). And now, born of one party disunity, overlaid with a laissez faire view on economic management by elements of the same party, we dump the largest free trade agreement in the world. Great. So let's see what happens. |
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Oct 7, 2018 16:22:13 GMT
Stuart Thanks. It's a bit like the Brexit Debate. It doesn't matter what warnings are given from companies, academics, Bank of England, even the Treasury, leavers stick their fingers in their ears and sing "La La La". Are these the same warnings issued by Companies, Academics, Bank of England, IMF and even the Treasury pre-Referendum? You know, the half a million job losses, the instant Recession, House prices crashing, Emergency Budget, doom & gloom? Excuse me if many people totally ignore these 'warnings', as the same thing from the same people in the past has been proven to be false. They were wrong last time, so why should we believe them now? Nobody is sticking their fingers in their ears. Everyone is well aware that there will be losers during the Brexit process. There will also be winners as well. Some things will change, or is that what you are scared about, change? Be positive. Onwards and upwards. Better to be an Independent Sovereign Nation than a region of Federal Europa. "There will be losers during the Brexit process" The poor "There will also be winners as well" The rich. |
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Post by stuart1974 on Oct 7, 2018 17:37:23 GMT
Are these the same warnings issued by Companies, Academics, Bank of England, IMF and even the Treasury pre-Referendum? You know, the half a million job losses, the instant Recession, House prices crashing, Emergency Budget, doom & gloom? Excuse me if many people totally ignore these 'warnings', as the same thing from the same people in the past has been proven to be false. They were wrong last time, so why should we believe them now? Nobody is sticking their fingers in their ears. Everyone is well aware that there will be losers during the Brexit process. There will also be winners as well. Some things will change, or is that what you are scared about, change? Be positive. Onwards and upwards. Better to be an Independent Sovereign Nation than a region of Federal Europa. "There will be losers during the Brexit process" The poor "There will also be winners as well" The rich. The poor have always been collateral damage and the rich able to access the means of escape. One school of thought for why the vote went to leave was because the 'poor' had nothing to lose and wanted something different. Is there a genuinely sovereign nation these days? Even North Korea is reliant on China, who needs American and other's markets.....and so on. |
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Post by stuart1974 on Oct 7, 2018 17:43:34 GMT
A 'deal' appears more likely than not this weekend.
It needs to have the support of the EU 27 and Parliament, then it needs to be agreed by Westminster.
Looking at the numbers and Labour's statement it is likely to vote against any deal, where does that leave us? The ERG seem to be softening their stance but I doubt the terms will satisfy many.
If Parliament has no majority to vote it through then it fails, or will the fear of a no deal make Labour MPs defy the Whip?
Interesting times.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2018 17:52:47 GMT
A 'deal' appears more likely than not this weekend. It needs to have the support of the EU 27 and Parliament, then it needs to be agreed by Westminster. Looking at the numbers and Labour's statement it is likely to vote against any deal, where does that leave us? The ERG seem to be softening their stance but I doubt the terms will satisfy many. If Parliament has no majority to vote it through then it fails, or will the fear of a no deal make Labour MPs defy the Whip? Interesting times. That's right. But leavers wanted to reassert the "Sovereignty" of our Parliament. What happens if Parliament rejects the final proposed deal, even a hard Brexit?? |
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Post by stuart1974 on Oct 7, 2018 18:06:14 GMT
A 'deal' appears more likely than not this weekend. It needs to have the support of the EU 27 and Parliament, then it needs to be agreed by Westminster. Looking at the numbers and Labour's statement it is likely to vote against any deal, where does that leave us? The ERG seem to be softening their stance but I doubt the terms will satisfy many. If Parliament has no majority to vote it through then it fails, or will the fear of a no deal make Labour MPs defy the Whip? Interesting times. That's right. But leavers wanted to reassert the "Sovereignty" of our Parliament. What happens if Parliament rejects the final proposed deal, even a hard Brexit?? We'll be in uncharted territory, no to the deal, no to no deal. I'll predict one thing in those circumstances, the Constitutional lawyers will be working late. I'd guess a withdrawal agreement will be reached and a framework for post exit trade will too for "further discussion" in the transition period, allowing Parliament to pass it and a avoid a hard Brexit. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2018 18:13:39 GMT
That's right. But leavers wanted to reassert the "Sovereignty" of our Parliament. What happens if Parliament rejects the final proposed deal, even a hard Brexit?? We'll be in uncharted territory, no to the deal, no to no deal. I'll predict one thing in those circumstances, the Constitutional lawyers will be working late. I'd guess a withdrawal agreement will be reached and a framework for post exit trade will too for "further discussion" in the transition period, allowing Parliament to pass it and a avoid a hard Brexit. I suspect you may well be right Stuart. Otherwise known as a fudge. That way nobody will be accountable for the consequences. |
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