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Post by gasandelectricity on Jun 7, 2020 17:06:24 GMT
Allowing people to desecrate property (public or private) whether or not we like the context behind or not - if the masses consider it abhorrent - is an extremely dangerous route to go down. Where do you draw the line? I jokingly posted we could tear down Ashton Gate because as gasheads we don't particularly agree with it. Of course, that wouldn't be an appropriate thing to do. I hope those responsible are bought to justice. Even if you agree with it being taken down I would hope you would agree that this is not the right way to go about it. As for the social distancing on show when we're in the middle of a global pandemic, that needs not to be mentioned. I think the best thing that could have happened is the statue was peacefully and appropriately pulled down, and for it to be located in a permanent exhibit in the city museum where the context and history of himself and the slave trade could be discussed and used a prop for educating our children about the origins of our city. I hope it can be recovered so that something along those lines can be done. I think that's a fair point. But it is worth noting people have been attempting to peacefully take the statue down for years. And I can definitely understand people aware of Colston's history seeing the BlackLivesMatter protests and being infuriated at the fact a statue is in public idolising him. I'm well aware of the context. There may have been a campaign to take the statue down but it had not previously been successful. If it's not successful, the right course of action is to try again. To try new avenues. I'm sure Marvin Rees would have been sympathetic and given the recent protests the community would have been able to reach a compromise like taking it down and putting it in a museum. For a select group of people to choose to tear it down is unacceptable. Let's put it this way, if my neighbour applies for planning permission for some sort of development, and a few of my other neighbours disagree, we have no right to then go and take down development because we'd not been heard by the authorities. |
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Post by wutangkillerbees on Jun 7, 2020 17:07:53 GMT
Not sure I've ever been as proud of Bristol as I am right now
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Post by althepirate on Jun 7, 2020 17:08:00 GMT
Within whose reason, always yours? It doesn't work that way. Boundaries are the same for everyone so if you can do what you want then so can anyone else and because each persons reasoning is different you may not agree, but you don't care what anyone else thinks so neither will anyone else care what you think. So if a bunch of hells angels beat you up for pulling down the statue I'm assuming you will think that's ok because they thought it was in reason? Within common reason. Murder is not acceptable but homosexuality is. Aren't the Hell's Angels banned in several countries? There's a clear and obvious line, I don't believe my views are strong enough to justify violence against me, but would I lose a wink of sleep if someone was walking down the street and right hooked Derek Chauvin across the jaw? No. Of course you don't, but others will |
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Post by Gassy on Jun 7, 2020 17:11:08 GMT
Ah ok, apologies on misunderstanding your point. It's a tough one really, in protests people tend to typically get away with what they want, when they become violent. This has been the case of pretty much all violent protests in UK history. Remember London about 10-15 years ago? Of course, violence needs to be quashed - and it will. Genuine question: what are the notable successes in recent history of violent protest? Off the top of my head, I don't know any. Violence in protesting is never the answer. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:19:12 GMT
I'm a little bit behind on this fast moving thread but everything seems fairly well behaved so far - just a reminder before anything that could happen does happen, that we would appreciate if we keep everything respectful and not too personal! Cheers Can you retrospectively moderate the Corona Virus and Brexit threads before they become swamped with abuse and nastiness? |
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Post by gasandelectricity on Jun 7, 2020 17:20:13 GMT
I'm a little bit behind on this fast moving thread but everything seems fairly well behaved so far - just a reminder before anything that could happen does happen, that we would appreciate if we keep everything respectful and not too personal! Cheers Can you retrospectively moderate the Corona Virus and Brexit threads before they become swamped with abuse and nastiness? Didn’t read most of them so I’m staying out of it. Just a polite request. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:21:13 GMT
Meanwhile, over in Brussels
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:22:01 GMT
Can you retrospectively moderate the Corona Virus and Brexit threads before they become swamped with abuse and nastiness? Didn’t read most of them so I’m staying out of it. Just a polite request. Nothing personal has happened |
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Post by gasandelectricity on Jun 7, 2020 17:22:51 GMT
Didn’t read most of them so I’m staying out of it. Just a polite request. Nothing personal has happened Agreed, just asking for us to keep it civilised |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:24:35 GMT
Genuine question: what are the notable successes in recent history of violent protest? The over throw of the western supported fascist, the Shah of Iran. Hosni Mubarak in Egypt? The establishment of a new Republic in Eire? I should have clarified that I was referring specifically for ‘western’ countries, particularly America and the U.K. to see if there is any precedent for violence actually achieving a positive outcome- so Ireland is a good point. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:25:36 GMT
Meanwhile, over in Brussels Are they going to exhume Mobutu and hold him to account? |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:27:22 GMT
Apart from the day we lost to Mansfield I’ve never been less proud of Bristol.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:27:57 GMT
Genuine question: what are the notable successes in recent history of violent protest? Off the top of my head, I don't know any. Violence in protesting is never the answer. Well, I was reading that the Rodney King riots were “successful” in bringing about a law that gave the president the right to deploy the army on American streets (with the authorisation of the mayor of the relevant state) so that didn’t quite work out for the best. |
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Post by pirate on Jun 7, 2020 17:30:44 GMT
Genuine question: what are the notable successes in recent history of violent protest? The over throw of the western supported fascist, the Shah of Iran. Hosni Mubarak in Egypt? The establishment of a new Republic in Eire? Sadly Egypt have now got an even bigger puppet of the Americans and Israelis in charge of the country in the form of military dictator Al Sisi who is even more violent and repressive. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:30:57 GMT
The over throw of the western supported fascist, the Shah of Iran. Hosni Mubarak in Egypt? The establishment of a new Republic in Eire? I should have clarified that I was referring specifically for ‘western’ countries, particularly America and the U.K. to see if there is any precedent for violence actually achieving a positive outcome- so Ireland is a good point. Ok, if we want to keep it "white" Cuba, Nicaragua, Hungary, Poland the old Czechoslovakia |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:31:48 GMT
Meanwhile, over in Brussels Are they going to exhume Mobutu and hold him to account? That's their business. He didn't invade Belgium |
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Post by matealotblue on Jun 7, 2020 17:32:23 GMT
God help us if a Government can determine a protest a mob and determine it anarchy. Giving them, Trump like, the excuse to use the armed forces on their populations. Peterloo anyone? Don’t think I suggested that the Government could determine “a protest a mob”...even if I could understand what that was in English. |
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Post by pirate on Jun 7, 2020 17:34:17 GMT
Off the top of my head, I don't know any. Violence in protesting is never the answer. Well, I was reading that the Rodney King riots were “successful” in bringing about a law that gave the president the right to deploy the army on American streets (with the authorisation of the mayor of the relevant state) so that didn’t quite work out for the best. It worked out exactly how the government wanted. That is why they deploy 'agent provocateurs' to cause trouble. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:34:24 GMT
The over throw of the western supported fascist, the Shah of Iran. Hosni Mubarak in Egypt? The establishment of a new Republic in Eire? Sadly Egypt have now got an even bigger puppet of the Americans and Israelis in charge of the country in the form of military dictator Al Sisi who is even more violent and repressive. Of course. I mean, the Americans and the Israelis can't have the Egyptians choosing their own representatives, whatever next. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 17:35:31 GMT
God help us if a Government can determine a protest a mob and determine it anarchy. Giving them, Trump like, the excuse to use the armed forces on their populations. Peterloo anyone? Don’t think I suggested that the Government could determine “a protest a mob”...even if I could understand what that was in English. Fair shout on use of English. |
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