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Post by peterparker on Aug 31, 2020 6:56:34 GMT
No idea why they are on the street anyway, but
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Post by peterparker on Aug 31, 2020 7:04:36 GMT
If you just do what you are told...
Whats the point with lady gardens like this policing the streets
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 8:27:56 GMT
You are just making it up. Try commenting on the facts. About 50 pages ago somebody asked, what was next for the black community, and you replied "civil disobedience." I`m making that up? And before you argue, we all know what you mean by civil disobedience. You`ve already told us how much you enjoyed living through the days of The Red Army Faction. Or am I making that up too? Yes Civil Disobedience is a bona fide course of action by any legitimate protest group, a protest against the actions of a Government. You seem to think that this plays out into violence, when the opposite is the case. Violence, as we are witnessing in Trump's America, only plays into the violence inflicted by a Government. See Portland, see Wisconsin. See Bielorussia. 1968 was a year. As youths we were generally causing trouble, in London, in Paris and in Germany, the to USA Quite right too given the horrific social conservatism, the overt racism, the last squirming of old empires and a vile class structure. We made mistakes, we were young and tempted by extreme politics. Ultimately almost nobody signed up to that In any event we failed and by 1970 it was all over, culminating perhaps with Nixon killing those students at Kent State Uni in Ohio. About the same time as he was carpet bombing with Agent Orange in Vietnam. So you can blather on about the mistakes of youth, comfortable in the knowledge that perhaps you have challenged nothing, wear grey shirts and had a song written about you. Ballad of a Thin Man---Bob Dylan www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3Dwe37yX3zpKA&ved=2ahUKEwjR68DTgsXrAhWIaRUIHWcsCCAQ3ywwAnoECAIQAg&usg=AOvVaw15JJRCXh8MjEGUggULumW_
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 8:35:31 GMT
" Quite. And I wish we could all have a frank discussion about why Oldie’s relatives are law abiding citizens and the Blakes of this world have warrants out for them which leads to encounters that end in shootings." Let's have that discussion. The relatives are my son and three grandsons. Go on. On the rest. You go on about the values that were promoted by Blake's parents but make no mention of the values instilled in the 17 year old who shot three and killed two. Why? That’s a perfectly fair comment but the 17 year olds parents aren’t on the TV criticising the system for his arrest. I would hope though that wherever they are they are thoroughly ashamed of his behaviour and questioning their role in the fact that their son was on the streets armed and killing people. I’m not getting the sense that Blake’s family are ashamed of him. I condemn them both oldie but the impression I get from you is that we can only condemn the 17 year old for his conduct but Blake gets a pass because of his skin colour and that he is the product of his society whereas the 17 year old isn’t. If everyone in America was brought up with the right values and respect for life maybe it wouldn’t be such a f**ked up place. Ok then. I am not disagreeing with your principle. It's just this. I, perhaps you, have no idea what Blake has or did wrong. None. The kid was obvious. So the real issue then is why did the police shoot Blake and not the kid, because unless concrete evidence emerges to the contrary it is only the kid who was posing an immediate threat to life. Agreed?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 8:37:16 GMT
If everyone in America was brought up with the right values and respect for life maybe it wouldn’t be such a f**ked up place. A lot of people don`t have the right values or respect for life though. They`re happy to see murder and mayhem, as long as it`s carried out by an ideology that accords with their own. True or false, Oldie? Very true. Trump is promoting it every day of every week.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 8:38:20 GMT
No idea why they are on the street anyway, but Jesus Christ
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Post by William Wilson on Aug 31, 2020 10:04:14 GMT
A lot of people don`t have the right values or respect for life though. They`re happy to see murder and mayhem, as long as it`s carried out by an ideology that accords with their own. True or false, Oldie? Very true. Trump is promoting it every day of every week. Well, that`s something you`ve got in common.
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Post by William Wilson on Aug 31, 2020 10:26:41 GMT
About 50 pages ago somebody asked, what was next for the black community, and you replied "civil disobedience." I`m making that up? And before you argue, we all know what you mean by civil disobedience. You`ve already told us how much you enjoyed living through the days of The Red Army Faction. Or am I making that up too? Yes Civil Disobedience is a bona fide course of action by any legitimate protest group, a protest against the actions of a Government. You seem to think that this plays out into violence, when the opposite is the case. Violence, as we are witnessing in Trump's America, only plays into the violence inflicted by a Government. See Portland, see Wisconsin. See Bielorussia. 1968 was a year. As youths we were generally causing trouble, in London, in Paris and in Germany, the to USA Quite right too given the horrific social conservatism, the overt racism, the last squirming of old empires and a vile class structure. We made mistakes, we were young and tempted by extreme politics. Ultimately almost nobody signed up to that In any event we failed and by 1970 it was all over, culminating perhaps with Nixon killing those students at Kent State Uni in Ohio. About the same time as he was carpet bombing with Agent Orange in Vietnam. So you can blather on about the mistakes of youth, comfortable in the knowledge that perhaps you have challenged nothing, wear grey shirts and had a song written about you. It`s not the mistakes of youth though, is it? You still look back on the murderous activities of the Baader Meinhoffers with nostalgia. You said so yourself, a month or so back. Was that the point when you stopped being young? It`s pretty clear that the intervening years haven`t changed you. Right wing president ( Nixon ) killing people. Shameful. Left wing terrorist group killing people. "Heady days."
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Post by William Wilson on Aug 31, 2020 10:52:47 GMT
That’s a perfectly fair comment but the 17 year olds parents aren’t on the TV criticising the system for his arrest. I would hope though that wherever they are they are thoroughly ashamed of his behaviour and questioning their role in the fact that their son was on the streets armed and killing people. I’m not getting the sense that Blake’s family are ashamed of him. I condemn them both oldie but the impression I get from you is that we can only condemn the 17 year old for his conduct but Blake gets a pass because of his skin colour and that he is the product of his society whereas the 17 year old isn’t. If everyone in America was brought up with the right values and respect for life maybe it wouldn’t be such a f**ked up place. Ok then. I am not disagreeing with your principle. It's just this. I, perhaps you, have no idea what Blake has or did wrong. None. The kid was obvious. So the real issue then is why did the police shoot Blake and not the kid, because unless concrete evidence emerges to the contrary it is only the kid who was posing an immediate threat to life. Agreed? No. Not at all. The kid was walking towards the police line with his hands in the air. In the dark, confused melee, I doubt if the cops even realised what he`d just done. If they had known what he`d just done, and he refused to obey their commands, ( in the same manner as Mr Blake ) I think he would very rapidly have had more holes in him, than 5 Kilos of Emmental. Colour would not have come into it. Blake`s actions in leaning away from the cops and reaching into the interior of his car, most definitely would have caused the police to worry that there was an immediate threat to their lives. You bring race into everything.
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Post by baggins on Aug 31, 2020 11:06:21 GMT
Ok then. I am not disagreeing with your principle. It's just this. I, perhaps you, have no idea what Blake has or did wrong. None. The kid was obvious. So the real issue then is why did the police shoot Blake and not the kid, because unless concrete evidence emerges to the contrary it is only the kid who was posing an immediate threat to life. Agreed? No. Not at all. The kid was walking towards the police line with his hands in the air. In the dark, confused melee, I doubt if the cops even realised what he`d just done. If they had known what he`d just done, and he refused to obey their commands, ( in the same manner as Mr Blake ) I think he would very rapidly have had more holes in him, than 5 Kilos of Emmental. Colour would not have come into it. Blake`s actions in leaning away from the cops and reaching into the interior of his car, most definitely would have caused the police to worry that there was an immediate threat to their lives. You bring race into everything. Mmm, emmental.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 11:22:29 GMT
Very true. Trump is promoting it every day of every week. Well, that`s something you`ve got in common. I can feel a Roy Orbison song coming on....
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 11:27:28 GMT
Ok then. I am not disagreeing with your principle. It's just this. I, perhaps you, have no idea what Blake has or did wrong. None. The kid was obvious. So the real issue then is why did the police shoot Blake and not the kid, because unless concrete evidence emerges to the contrary it is only the kid who was posing an immediate threat to life. Agreed? No. Not at all. The kid was walking towards the police line with his hands in the air. In the dark, confused melee, I doubt if the cops even realised what he`d just done. If they had known what he`d just done, and he refused to obey their commands, ( in the same manner as Mr Blake ) I think he would very rapidly have had more holes in him, than 5 Kilos of Emmental. Colour would not have come into it. Blake`s actions in leaning away from the cops and reaching into the interior of his car, most definitely would have caused the police to worry that there was an immediate threat to their lives. You bring race into everything. He had just tripped over his own feet and was challenged by someone who appeared to be unarmed. He then shot the guy dead. All within 50 to 100 yds max from the police line who themselves had lit the area with spot lights. The police let him walk by, heavily armed still and without challenge. Why?
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Post by baggins on Aug 31, 2020 11:27:36 GMT
Well, that`s something you`ve got in common. I can feel a Roy Orbison song coming on.... Keep it to yourself.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 11:36:17 GMT
Yes Civil Disobedience is a bona fide course of action by any legitimate protest group, a protest against the actions of a Government. You seem to think that this plays out into violence, when the opposite is the case. Violence, as we are witnessing in Trump's America, only plays into the violence inflicted by a Government. See Portland, see Wisconsin. See Bielorussia. 1968 was a year. As youths we were generally causing trouble, in London, in Paris and in Germany, the to USA Quite right too given the horrific social conservatism, the overt racism, the last squirming of old empires and a vile class structure. We made mistakes, we were young and tempted by extreme politics. Ultimately almost nobody signed up to that In any event we failed and by 1970 it was all over, culminating perhaps with Nixon killing those students at Kent State Uni in Ohio. About the same time as he was carpet bombing with Agent Orange in Vietnam. So you can blather on about the mistakes of youth, comfortable in the knowledge that perhaps you have challenged nothing, wear grey shirts and had a song written about you. It`s not the mistakes of youth though, is it? You still look back on the murderous activities of the Baader Meinhoffers with nostalgia. You said so yourself, a month or so back. Was that the point when you stopped being young? It`s pretty clear that the intervening years haven`t changed you. Right wing president ( Nixon ) killing people. Shameful. Left wing terrorist group killing people. "Heady days." 1968 was a great year to be young. By 1970 the State was killing us. By 1980 we, that generation, were installing Local Area Networks. I was part of the team that managed the first LAN installation in the UK. Funnily enough, in Bristol. You don't get much more establishment than that...(but man did we have a laugh) What were you doing between 1980 and '82? Times change, we were kids in 1968 and I look back on that period with fond memories. Then we joined in the money chase. 😂😂😂
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 11:36:54 GMT
I can feel a Roy Orbison song coming on.... Keep it to yourself. Ahhhh...Baggs...can I? Please...😂😂
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Post by baggins on Aug 31, 2020 11:50:40 GMT
Ahhhh...Baggs...can I? Please...😂😂 Oh go on then, it's Bank Holiday.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 12:32:56 GMT
If you just do what you are told... Whats the point with lady gardens like this policing the streets Jesus wept. I’ve changed my mind- just nuke the entire country, it’s not fit for human habitation anymore.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 21:00:37 GMT
I’m hearing the autopsy of George Floyd revealed he died of a fentanyl overdose. Wow, what a plot twist that would be.
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Post by peterparker on Sept 1, 2020 5:59:23 GMT
I’m hearing the autopsy of George Floyd revealed he died of a fentanyl overdose. Wow, what a plot twist that would be. Kind of irrelevant. We have all seen the video. The Police helped kill him. At worst/best its manslaughter
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2020 6:12:50 GMT
From America. I managed to copy this because the publication's behind a pay wall.
The New Republic Magazine
Far-Right Militias Are Learning Impunity From the Cops Trump’s supporters in law enforcement and government play Kenosha as both a threat of what’s to come and an invitation to join in.
There have only been 12 days in 2020 in which police did not kill someone in the United States. As of August 22, the day before Officer Rusten Sheskey of the Kenosha Police Department shot and paralyzed Jacob Blake, police nationwide had killed 751 people this year, according to the Mapping Police Violence database. Going by years past, it’s entirely reasonable to assume that very few of the officers who have killed people in 2020 will be charged with a crime, and even fewer will be convicted. It is not an exaggeration to say that almost every day in this country, police get away with murder.
Police know this. So do others who see themselves as agents of law and order, like the ad hoc militia assembled on Facebook in the days following the Kenosha police shooting, with the call, “Any patriots willing to take up arms and defend our city tonight from evil thugs?” One who answered, Kyle Rittenhouse, stalked the streets of Kenosha with a rifle on the night of August 25. The white 17-year-old probably didn’t have those precise numbers in his head—of how many police have killed, how many have gotten away with it. Before the night was over, Rittenhouse had allegedly shot and killed two people and injured another. Afterward, Rittenhouse wandered past police cars, still armed. He was allowed to flee the state. Before his first court appearance, he had already become a hero to the far right.
We know the police take the side of white vigilantes, as my colleague Alex Pareene wrote earlier this summer. When far-right groups and even these more ad hoc formations of right-wing novices descend on a town to wage violence against Black Lives Matter protesters, he wrote that police allow them to do so with “something more than impunity: an endorsement.” And these groups, in turn, are learning something from law enforcement’s stance toward them: Police and their tacit support endows right-wing militias with some of that impunity.
Trump’s supporters in law enforcement and government play Kenosha as both a threat of what’s to come and an invitation to join in. Ron Johnson, the senior Republican senator from Wisconsin, said on CNN that one way to stop “the violence” and “the rioting” was to call on “citizen soldiers.” (In a statement to The New Republic, Johnson’s communications director said that the senator was referring to the National Guard when invoking “citizen soldiers” and that “he was not calling for vigilantes.”) The head of New York’s largest police union, Pat Lynch, said on a Trump campaign press call on Monday that Joe Biden was a “Democratic apologist” for violence, who, if elected, would turn the whole country into Kenosha or Portland.
The same day, when asked if the White House would say anything about Kyle Rittenhouse, or if it believes vigilantes should stop showing up in cities to allegedly protect buildings, press secretary Kayleigh McEnany did not give an answer. She did say, though, that the U.S. “should have more police, not less.” On Tuesday, Trump will travel to Kenosha, where he will meet with police. He has remained silent as someone apparently took his own words as a directive: “When the looting starts, the shooting starts.”
For a president to stoke all this might appear to complicate his campaigning for reelection on a “law and order” mission. “Trump openly represents law and order without the rule of law—that is, whatever he means by ‘order’ applied lawlessly,” as Greg Sargent argued Monday in The Washington Post. But this skips over the truth borne out in raw numbers: The police, the state-sanctioned agents of law and order, can behave just as “lawlessly” in the name of maintaining it. Right-wing militias and less organized white supremacist and far-right vigilantes operate by the same logic. Law and order and violence come together.
Even if the criminal legal system catches up with the militia members and vigilantes, they can expect an outpouring of right-wing approval, with Tucker Carlson mounting their defense, and with the six-figure online fundraising hauls that come with all of it. They are a brotherhood of George Zimmermans, who was acquitted on all charges in the killing of Trayvon Martin in 2013. They are made folk heroes: Rittenhouse’s image was spotted days later on a T-shirt in Modesto, California, with the words “American Hero,” worn by a man at an event billing itself “Straight Pride,” attended by far-right groups like the Proud Boys, outside a Planned Parenthood.
When these people kill, like police have, they can rest easy in the knowledge that it will take the same criminal legal system that supports them to convict them. They know that for everyone who condemns such a killing as murder, there will be some—maybe more—who welcome it as justice.
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