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Post by gulfofaden on Jan 18, 2024 17:37:27 GMT
As is the case with many games I watch as a neutral, decisions always seem to go with the bigger club. Watching that back is painful, for all their money, wages etc and we really could have finished them. I’m getting jaded as I realise football is virtually only just about players. All the tactics, team spirit and ethos in the world cannot beat just simply paying 3 times as much to get the best players. Clough knew this. So really what do we watch? We watch new collection of players every year which are the best our budget can afford, and do battle with other clubs and usually it’s decided on the wage structure. The way they finished their chances just shows that. They have those finishers. We have one but he’s clapped out and old (sorry Chris). We could just replace the game with just a comparison of wage budgets at the start of the game and largest wins. It will save all the BS, all the misplaced hope as pretty much that decides everything. What a waste of time. Just have an auction at the start of the season: Lot 1 - League Cup Lot 2 - FA Cup Lot 3 - Premiership Title Lot 4 - European Participation Trophy Lot 5 - Europa Cup Lot 6 - Champions League To string it out over a season, they could be blind bids. Then each fixture will compare the bids and the 3 points will go to the highest bids. I do think we are going to see a couple of very high profile club failures on a par with Rangers over the next 10 years this new rule about submitting accounts by 31st Dec and then FFP impacts clubs who are making a loss of £105m over 3 years just seems like a double whammy. You have to face the losses and you then lose points which increases the risk of relegation and even more losses. I've always been a fan of a Salary cap. Not one that is connected to revenue but one that is the same for each team in that league. I've also thought that football could learn something from the NFL draft process. Fix two issues with the same rule. Academy players should belong to the FA and not the club. Then at the beginning of the season the clubs get to select those academy players in reverse place order: Playoff winner from league below 2nd place from League below League winner from league below Then the teams in the league from bottom up with the highest teams selecting later. This should also resolve the talent problem that lower league clubs are facing. A salary cap will mean that the best players in the world will not come here but will go to Saudi, or Spain, or France etc. Unworkabke unless the world agreed to it and it’s virtually impossible. It’s a quirk of nature that they do something which billions of people pay to see. Apparently in Roman society the gladiators were the lowest ranks but after a good career they became noble and were celebrated in the highest echelons. I can’t help think nowt has really changed. Football is all on merit and often it’s the poorest who end up becoming really wealthy. I don’t see the problem with it. It’s fair and square. |
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Post by gasify on Jan 18, 2024 17:45:56 GMT
What a waste of time. Just have an auction at the start of the season: Lot 1 - League Cup Lot 2 - FA Cup Lot 3 - Premiership Title Lot 4 - European Participation Trophy Lot 5 - Europa Cup Lot 6 - Champions League To string it out over a season, they could be blind bids. Then each fixture will compare the bids and the 3 points will go to the highest bids. I do think we are going to see a couple of very high profile club failures on a par with Rangers over the next 10 years this new rule about submitting accounts by 31st Dec and then FFP impacts clubs who are making a loss of £105m over 3 years just seems like a double whammy. You have to face the losses and you then lose points which increases the risk of relegation and even more losses. I've always been a fan of a Salary cap. Not one that is connected to revenue but one that is the same for each team in that league. I've also thought that football could learn something from the NFL draft process. Fix two issues with the same rule. Academy players should belong to the FA and not the club. Then at the beginning of the season the clubs get to select those academy players in reverse place order: Playoff winner from league below 2nd place from League below League winner from league below Then the teams in the league from bottom up with the highest teams selecting later. This should also resolve the talent problem that lower league clubs are facing. A salary cap will mean that the best players in the world will not come here but will go to Saudi, or Spain, or France etc. Unworkabke unless the world agreed to it and it’s virtually impossible. It’s a quirk of nature that they do something which billions of people pay to see. Apparently in Roman society the gladiators were the lowest ranks but after a good career they became noble and were celebrated in the highest echelons. I can’t help think nowt has really changed. Football is all on merit and often it’s the poorest who end up becoming really wealthy. I don’t see the problem with it. It’s fair and square. There is of course a possible future where the best players will go to Saudi anyways. If only there was a worldwide football governing body that could impose a global salary cap... |
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Jan 18, 2024 18:41:47 GMT
After sleeping on it and absorbing other opinions from different parts of the ground I think we all have a right to feel disappointed.
For 3 out of 4 halves, we would have won it if it was a boxing match; and over the 2 whole games, we missed more guilt edged chances.
But.... that's the nature of the FA Cup!
Sometimes it goes for you, sometimes not.
We move on.
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Post by trevorgas on Jan 18, 2024 18:53:58 GMT
After sleeping on it and absorbing other opinions from different parts of the ground I think we all have a right to feel disappointed. For 3 out of 4 halves, we would have won it if it was a boxing match; and over the 2 whole games, we missed more guilt edged chances. But.... that's the nature of the FA Cup! Sometimes it goes for you, sometimes not. We move on. I agree however,that's been our problem all season we are soft in both boxes,can't put away clear chances and concede easily,both our Mgr and Captain have said as much and unless that changes we will stay mid table. Lots of work to do in the summer methinks. |
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Post by bambergashead on Jan 18, 2024 18:56:14 GMT
I'm glad I couldn't see this properly from the North Terrace!! What a dive 
Shameful. |
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Post by tbonegas on Jan 18, 2024 19:15:59 GMT
I'm glad I couldn't see this properly from the North Terrace!! What a dive
Shameful. Cheating lump of nasty stuff. Thomas never touched him. Collins does this and never gets the decision. Ref is an embarrassment to his profession. |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jan 18, 2024 19:23:58 GMT
Cheating lump of nasty stuff. Thomas never touched him. Collins does this and never gets the decision. Ref is an embarrassment to his profession. Him and his mate on the other wing spent all match falling to the ground, its a bit embarrassing a top Championship club had to resort to cheating to beat a mid table L1 side. You do have to wonder what other decisions also went their way, no cards for kicking the balls away, the goalie blatantly time wasting and 10 yards stolen at every thrown in were the obvious ones. The linesman on the west side missed every offside all night. |
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Post by tbonegas on Jan 18, 2024 19:32:10 GMT
Cheating lump of nasty stuff. Thomas never touched him. Collins does this and never gets the decision. Ref is an embarrassment to his profession. Him and his mate on the other wing spent all match falling to the ground, its a bit embarrassing a top Championship club had to resort to cheating to beat a mid table L1 side. You do have to wonder what other decisions also went their way, no cards for kicking the balls away, the goalie blatantly time wasting and 10 yards stolen at every thrown in were the obvious ones. The linesman on the west side missed every offside all night. Gaining advantage at throwins is rarely punished, strangely the ref gave two foul throws against us. |
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Post by seanclevedongas on Jan 18, 2024 19:41:40 GMT
Him and his mate on the other wing spent all match falling to the ground, its a bit embarrassing a top Championship club had to resort to cheating to beat a mid table L1 side. You do have to wonder what other decisions also went their way, no cards for kicking the balls away, the goalie blatantly time wasting and 10 yards stolen at every thrown in were the obvious ones. The linesman on the west side missed every offside all night. Gaining advantage at throwins is rarely punished, strangely the ref gave two foul throws against us. Vale was penalised twice at Blackpool too, our throw ins are mostly appalling |
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Post by tbonegas on Jan 18, 2024 19:44:51 GMT
Gaining advantage at throwins is rarely punished, strangely the ref gave two foul throws against us. Vale was penalised twice at Blackpool too, our throw ins are mostly appalling I know. It really is schoolboy stuff. |
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Post by dudelebowski on Jan 18, 2024 19:47:27 GMT
Gaining advantage at throwins is rarely punished, strangely the ref gave two foul throws against us. Vale was penalised twice at Blackpool too, our throw ins are mostly appalling I’ve noticed it the last month odd, Vales legs coming off the floor to get more distance on his throws and also throwing the ball straight down into the ground. League one ref’s never pulling him up on it, the second he got penalised last night every throw he took the rest of the night was ‘perfect’. |
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Post by gasheadontour on Jan 18, 2024 20:06:47 GMT
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Post by gulfofaden on Jan 18, 2024 21:15:09 GMT
A salary cap will mean that the best players in the world will not come here but will go to Saudi, or Spain, or France etc. Unworkabke unless the world agreed to it and it’s virtually impossible. It’s a quirk of nature that they do something which billions of people pay to see. Apparently in Roman society the gladiators were the lowest ranks but after a good career they became noble and were celebrated in the highest echelons. I can’t help think nowt has really changed. Football is all on merit and often it’s the poorest who end up becoming really wealthy. I don’t see the problem with it. It’s fair and square. There is of course a possible future where the best players will go to Saudi anyways. If only there was a worldwide football governing body that could impose a global salary cap... It’s almost impossible to enforce it. Stuff happens behind the scenes, always has and always will. I’m not too fussed about Saudi, I haven’t followed the prem or European football for years. It’s too corporate, the clubs are just brands. European cups were interesting as there were different philosophies, different tactics etc. Now it’s a load of interchangeable clubs run by interchangeable people and decided on which oligarch has the most money to waste. Hiving this off to Saudi as some mega league will at least give us league football back and not the Frankenstein we have, where all the youth play for very large clubs. It’s just too commercial, it’s lost the plot of what it’s about. |
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Post by gasheadontour on Jan 18, 2024 22:19:31 GMT
Pen etc from a different angle:
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Post by bambergashead on Jan 18, 2024 23:26:42 GMT
Pen etc from a different angle: No way was that a penalty.  |
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Post by gasify on Jan 19, 2024 6:43:42 GMT
There is of course a possible future where the best players will go to Saudi anyways. If only there was a worldwide football governing body that could impose a global salary cap... It’s almost impossible to enforce it. Stuff happens behind the scenes, always has and always will. I’m not too fussed about Saudi, I haven’t followed the prem or European football for years. It’s too corporate, the clubs are just brands. European cups were interesting as there were different philosophies, different tactics etc. Now it’s a load of interchangeable clubs run by interchangeable people and decided on which oligarch has the most money to waste. Hiving this off to Saudi as some mega league will at least give us league football back and not the Frankenstein we have, where all the youth play for very large clubs. It’s just too commercial, it’s lost the plot of what it’s about. If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. If you don't want to support a football club who has commercial reasons for being in existence, then you might need to be looking for another team to support. Do you think the new owners invested to help the community? You do realise that the reason Rovers are struggling is that aren't commercial enough. |
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Post by gashead79 on Jan 19, 2024 7:43:35 GMT
Goals change dynamics. 2 goals is obviously a different mountain than 1 and the mood of the place and both camps would have been different. It was a fantastic opportunity to take a step closer to the finish line but of course your point is valid. Normally I'd agree but no evidence of that last night. They couldn't be arsed in the first, got a rollicking at HT and were a totally different side in the second. For all we know, a second may have made them come out the second half even angrier and stick 5 past us! Normally I'd be inclined to agree, but no evidence of that whatsoever last night. Ok so to test the boundaries of your logic.. If we were 5-0 up at HT, you are saying that we would have lost 5-6 due to them getting a rollicking and coming out a different side? You are saying that 2 goals instead of 1 as an advantage would have made little difference? Perhaps we should have avoided trying to score, then just tried to win on penalties? My points are purposely silly BTW, to see where you are at. |
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Post by RD on Jan 19, 2024 17:02:30 GMT
Normally I'd agree but no evidence of that last night. They couldn't be arsed in the first, got a rollicking at HT and were a totally different side in the second. For all we know, a second may have made them come out the second half even angrier and stick 5 past us! Normally I'd be inclined to agree, but no evidence of that whatsoever last night. Ok so to test the boundaries of your logic.. If we were 5-0 up at HT, you are saying that we would have lost 5-6 due to them getting a rollicking and coming out a different side? You are saying that 2 goals instead of 1 as an advantage would have made little difference? Perhaps we should have avoided trying to score, then just tried to win on penalties? My points are purposely silly BTW, to see where you are at. No obviously not. And making a straw man argument (which you even admit to) isn't helpful. My point is normally I'd agree. However... If you take a match where there's very little between the sides THROUGHOUT the game, I'd totally 100% agree. My point is that this game was different to normal as: 1) We were playing a Championship side 2) They were completely uninterested in the first half, and only started trying / giving it a real go in the second half As such, my point is that - even at 2-0 - (so yes, not 5-0 or 700-0 or whatever "silly" scoreline you want to use; specifically 2-0) I'm less confident (than usual) it would have made a difference. Why? Because... 1) They're a championship side 2) They only started playing in the second half; this wasn't a case of "evens stevens" thorughout the game - second half they went up a gear and, let's be honest, left us for dust really 3) They scored 3 (not a hypothetical - a fact) and 4) 3 goals > 2 goals So yes, as per my post - normally I would agree, but I don't agree this time. Does that mean you aren't right - not at all; IF Thomas had scored, maybe we would have won (we'll never know). My point is that I'm not anywhere near as confident we would have, given the points I've made above. And also, it's Friday so who really cares anyway  It's all ifs and buts so we'll never know, but that's at least the rationale to my thinking for this particular game. |
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Post by gashead79 on Jan 19, 2024 17:54:18 GMT
Ok so to test the boundaries of your logic.. If we were 5-0 up at HT, you are saying that we would have lost 5-6 due to them getting a rollicking and coming out a different side? You are saying that 2 goals instead of 1 as an advantage would have made little difference? Perhaps we should have avoided trying to score, then just tried to win on penalties? My points are purposely silly BTW, to see where you are at. No obviously not. And making a straw man argument (which you even admit to) isn't helpful. My point is normally I'd agree. However... If you take a match where there's very little between the sides THROUGHOUT the game, I'd totally 100% agree. My point is that this game was different to normal as: 1) We were playing a Championship side 2) They were completely uninterested in the first half, and only started trying / giving it a real go in the second half As such, my point is that - even at 2-0 - (so yes, not 5-0 or 700-0 or whatever "silly" scoreline you want to use; specifically 2-0) I'm less confident (than usual) it would have made a difference. Why? Because... 1) They're a championship side 2) They only started playing in the second half; this wasn't a case of "evens stevens" thorughout the game - second half they went up a gear and, let's be honest, left us for dust really 3) They scored 3 (not a hypothetical - a fact) and 4) 3 goals > 2 goals So yes, as per my post - normally I would agree, but I don't agree this time. Does that mean you aren't right - not at all; IF Thomas had scored, maybe we would have won (we'll never know). My point is that I'm not anywhere near as confident we would have, given the points I've made above. And also, it's Friday so who really cares anyway It's all ifs and buts so we'll never know, but that's at least the rationale to my thinking for this particular game. Makes sense and fair points. |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jan 19, 2024 18:39:52 GMT
Ok so to test the boundaries of your logic.. If we were 5-0 up at HT, you are saying that we would have lost 5-6 due to them getting a rollicking and coming out a different side? You are saying that 2 goals instead of 1 as an advantage would have made little difference? Perhaps we should have avoided trying to score, then just tried to win on penalties? My points are purposely silly BTW, to see where you are at. No obviously not. And making a straw man argument (which you even admit to) isn't helpful. My point is normally I'd agree. However... If you take a match where there's very little between the sides THROUGHOUT the game, I'd totally 100% agree. My point is that this game was different to normal as: 1) We were playing a Championship side 2) They were completely uninterested in the first half, and only started trying / giving it a real go in the second half As such, my point is that - even at 2-0 - (so yes, not 5-0 or 700-0 or whatever "silly" scoreline you want to use; specifically 2-0) I'm less confident (than usual) it would have made a difference. Why? Because... 1) They're a championship side 2) They only started playing in the second half; this wasn't a case of "evens stevens" thorughout the game - second half they went up a gear and, let's be honest, left us for dust really 3) They scored 3 (not a hypothetical - a fact) and 4) 3 goals > 2 goals So yes, as per my post - normally I would agree, but I don't agree this time. Does that mean you aren't right - not at all; IF Thomas had scored, maybe we would have won (we'll never know). My point is that I'm not anywhere near as confident we would have, given the points I've made above. And also, it's Friday so who really cares anyway It's all ifs and buts so we'll never know, but that's at least the rationale to my thinking for this particular game. Then again Norwich got lucky with their first goal given it looked borderline offside, then scored a second from what looked like a clear dive, even then we still had chances to equalise. Perhaps if Ward had been fit we would have run out easy winners. |
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It's all ifs and buts so we'll never know, but that's at least the rationale to my thinking for this particular game.