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Post by stuart1974 on Dec 2, 2017 23:53:25 GMT
Full marks for doing the interview even if very guarded, feel a little sorry for the guy, so perhaps a cut-back training ground in a couple of years, no redevelopment for the foreseeable future and perhaps a little money for DC in January. Could be worse I suppose but a win today makes things feel a little better. Guess if we can sustain league 1 then I'm ok with it but not what I hoped for a year ago. Certainly agree with your first and last points. My personal take on this is that with the collapse of the UWE all financial assumptions have gone out of the window and until revised plans are worked through a bare minimum spend on the training ground and the January transfer window is all that has been sanctioned. Doing both training ground and stadium in phases isn't necessarily a bad thing if started soonish and we are aware of the end goal. I would be interested to know what SH meant by "stand by stand", did he mean over the course of a couple of seasons or simply get one built then move on when money allows? I would like us to get on with something significant though, just to show intent and goodwill. Something like a 6,000 seater new stand on the East side and retain the terrace (until further development later) would push capacity up towards 16,000. We don't necessarily need a full redevelopment straight away, just plans to put into place when needed.
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Post by Topper Gas on Dec 2, 2017 23:56:00 GMT
From a Top 6 budget (Hamer) to a bottom 6 budget... From an £8m training complex next summer (Hamer) to 4 pitches and a Portaloo the following summer. From the landing lights at UWE (Hamer) to the Mem rebuild... to the worst bit for me... potentially building stand by stand. Which means we will be hampered even more by lack of space. Replace the best seats, a terrace and the largest capacity side with a similar sized stand. Two small stands replace the South/West Stands, and the people who enjoy the atmosphere and terrace behind the goal get lumbered with an all seater stand. If it ever happens, I starting to hope it doesn't TBH. If they can't do it properly, actively find someone else to. It's all well and good taking time to do this stuff, but constantly watering down and questions as to whether any of it will get done, is simply not good enough. And give Steve Hamer the boot, he is largely responsible for the negativity around the club at the moment. Optimism and ambition is everything, without it... So who is going to spend £12m buying out the ALQ's and then another £30/40m doing a proper job? It's like the forums been taking over by school kids FFS some posters need to get real.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2017 0:05:30 GMT
"expectation is the root of all heartache" William shakespeare
Might have been craig shakespeare though? not sure
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Post by Centenary Gas on Dec 3, 2017 0:20:37 GMT
From a Top 6 budget (Hamer) to a bottom 6 budget... From an £8m training complex next summer (Hamer) to 4 pitches and a Portaloo the following summer. From the landing lights at UWE (Hamer) to the Mem rebuild... to the worst bit for me... potentially building stand by stand. Which means we will be hampered even more by lack of space. Replace the best seats, a terrace and the largest capacity side with a similar sized stand. Two small stands replace the South/West Stands, and the people who enjoy the atmosphere and terrace behind the goal get lumbered with an all seater stand. If it ever happens, I starting to hope it doesn't TBH. If they can't do it properly, actively find someone else to. It's all well and good taking time to do this stuff, but constantly watering down and questions as to whether any of it will get done, is simply not good enough. And give Steve Hamer the boot, he is largely responsible for the negativity around the club at the moment. Optimism and ambition is everything, without it... So who is going to spend £12m buying out the ALQ's and then another £30/40m doing a proper job? It's like the forums been taking over by school kids FFS some posters need to get real. People said the same thing when the old board were here, and who would of thought a Jordanian family would end up buying the club? "Actively find" doesn't assume people are queuing up, maybe I should of added the word 'try'. If they had of said the Mem was an option if the UWE falls through rather than it's not viable, then people would be more understanding. If they hadn't talked of a top 6 budget etc etc.. I agree Wael is a good bloke, heart in the right place. It's whether things can be delivered that ultimately matters. When the new owners turned up, everything they did was great. But when it starts slipping, people (especially with the let downs at this cliub) are naturally going to wonder how far.
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Post by peterparker on Dec 3, 2017 7:49:23 GMT
From a Top 6 budget (Hamer) to a bottom 6 budget... From an £8m training complex next summer (Hamer) to 4 pitches and a Portaloo the following summer. From the landing lights at UWE (Hamer) to the Mem rebuild... to the worst bit for me... potentially building stand by stand. Which means we will be hampered even more by lack of space. Replace the best seats, a terrace and the largest capacity side with a similar sized stand. Two small stands replace the South/West Stands, and the people who enjoy the atmosphere and terrace behind the goal get lumbered with an all seater stand. If it ever happens, I starting to hope it doesn't TBH. If they can't do it properly, actively find someone else to. It's all well and good taking time to do this stuff, but constantly watering down and questions as to whether any of it will get done, is simply not good enough. And give Steve Hamer the boot, he is largely responsible for the negativity around the club at the moment. Optimism and ambition is everything, without it... So who is going to spend £12m buying out the ALQ's and then another £30/40m doing a proper job? It's like the forums been taking over by school kids FFS some posters need to get real. Thats part of the problem now though. SOME people have expectes the Al-Qadis to just dump 30/40//50 million quid out of the goodness of their hearts. We never had the money before and wernt going anywhere Anyone who bought Rovers would have gad to have spent millions paying off Wonga, ex directors and Court costs, so essentiall just like anyone else would have to do now. People go on about the money being secured against the ground, but if they or anyone else owns BRFC what difference does it make? They can seel the ground to recoup cash regardless So again. Unless a Lansdown type comes in and his willing to essentially give us his money, than we have to work with what we have and can get as best we can (which is a different debate as to how well that is being done) Chatting to someone who had involvent with UWE design when Higgs was in charge was eye opening as anyone hearing about the Al-Qadis and what Hani does or doesnt want to spend. The level of cutbacks waa going to leave UWE a shell basically
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Post by garystash on Dec 3, 2017 8:16:29 GMT
Now I've slept on it, I've a couple of thoughts about this interview.
Firstly, I don't think the ultimate plan for the training ground has been cut back. However, rather than being delivered in one hit - it'll be phased over an unknown amount of time.
Secondly, what are we like? The guy who comes in and essentially saves our club from administration feels he has to apologise to us because we expect more!
Message for Wael - talk to us more often. Explain your plan and vision. Keep doing it until we get it. It helps us understand where we are and where we are going.
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Post by geddongas on Dec 3, 2017 8:39:51 GMT
Now I've slept on it, I've a couple of thoughts about this interview. Firstly, I don't think the ultimate plan for the training ground has been cut back. However, rather than being delivered in one hit - it'll be phased over an unknown amount of time. Secondly, what are we like? The guy who comes in and essentially saves our club from administration feels he has to apologise to us because we expect more! Message for Wael - talk to us more often. Explain your plan and vision. Keep doing it until we get it. It helps us understand where we are and where we are going. This point is excellent. Clarity would make things so much better rather than leaving the rumour mill to run. That, to me, is Al-Qadi's only real failing. Hamer did promise a lot more than reasonably possible considering administration was looming and this team needs building back up from scratch. £12million in a year is a lot for a (let's face it) mid-table League 1 team to spend on infrastructure. If it comes off, we'll see much more interest to join the club in future. So whilst Wael is a bit shady over timescales, i think Hamer is the one in the wrong promising dates willy nilly...
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Post by BishopstonBRFC on Dec 3, 2017 9:45:40 GMT
It’ll be telling if the new shop is a proper construction or another shipping crate. Given lack of planning permission so far it points at the latter. You wouldn’t build a proper club shop if you were planing on flattering it 24 months later. Perhaps they're moving it so they can flatten the East Stand?
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Post by Strange Gas on Dec 3, 2017 9:57:39 GMT
It’ll be telling if the new shop is a proper construction or another shipping crate. Given lack of planning permission so far it points at the latter. You wouldn’t build a proper club shop if you were planing on flattering it 24 months later. Perhaps they're moving it so they can flatten the East Stand? Cargo boxes in car park (assume that would avoid need for planning permission) and a bigger waterer where the shop was I reckon
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Post by bumble on Dec 3, 2017 10:01:04 GMT
Now I've slept on it, I've a couple of thoughts about this interview. Firstly, I don't think the ultimate plan for the training ground has been cut back. However, rather than being delivered in one hit - it'll be phased over an unknown amount of time. Secondly, what are we like? The guy who comes in and essentially saves our club from administration feels he has to apologise to us because we expect more! Message for Wael - talk to us more often. Explain your plan and vision. Keep doing it until we get it. It helps us understand where we are and where we are going. Great post and eloquently sums up how I feel.
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Post by gasandelectricity on Dec 3, 2017 10:01:48 GMT
It’ll be telling if the new shop is a proper construction or another shipping crate. Given lack of planning permission so far it points at the latter. You wouldn’t build a proper club shop if you were planing on flattering it 24 months later. Perhaps they're moving it so they can flatten the East Stand? This seems a bit premature for me. It would be 4.5k capacity we’d have to sacrifice in one go. For a redeveloped mem you’d expect the pitch to move eastwards to generate room for expansion elsewhere so I’d be inclined to build a new grandstand right behind the East stand, with new changing facilities, club admin and main bars/shops which you don’t have to go through turnstiles to access. and shuffle everything over that way once complete. If you did this and it was big enough you possibly wouldn’t be too concerned with flattening the Thatchers end and/or west stand to do the next step. Perhaps even you wouldn’t be in a massive rush to do it.
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Post by Strange Gas on Dec 3, 2017 10:09:20 GMT
Interesting he cited FFP as though it was a constraint, although didn’t quite say it was. If we spent to FFP ceiling, assume we’d be top 10 as is based on crowd revenue. Is that right?
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Post by gashead1981 on Dec 3, 2017 10:34:50 GMT
So what I was told at the AFC Wimbledon game was correct. They wanted an all star training ground but didn’t want to pay for it. The budget given was £2m when it needed more like £10m spent. So they are scaling it back and getting what they can for £2m.
Tarting up the Mem. Why would you bother spending money on the toilets if you had plans to level it?
Moving the club shop makes sense. Was in there a few weeks back and had to help a man in an electric wheelchair make 2 90’ turns to get in and out of the shop which is almost impossible. Felt sorry for the poor chap.
If redevelopment of east stand was the first phase then that would need to be planned, architected, submitted and approved in the next 4 months if they were to make a start in the summer. But if the plan is to do that for the summer of 2019 it would mean completion by the summer of 2020. It gives you the idea of how much time is needed to do the whole ground that way. That stand holds 3000 fans + hospitality. How is that going to be accommodated? Doing the North and South stands first surely would make better sense?
But all of these ideas and questions can be addressesd within a couple of weeks with people and companies experienced in these kind of things. At least the board would have some idea of cost, some idea of build phase and some idea of timescale to “evolutionise” the Mem. Us supporters would then know what we are in for.
As for the playing budget Wael said this year it has been extra competitive with big teams in there. Well I see it as no different to any other season when the likes of City, Sheff U, Wolves, Portsmouth, Leeds, Bournemouth, Leicester and a good few other big clubs have been in there with their spending power. Most championship clubs are big clubs now as if you are there you punch for the prem. so they have better stadiums with bigger sponsorship and better revenue streams. So if one or 2 fall into our league of course they will out bid us on everything. That is why having the club fit for the championship is vital. Or you become a Scunthorpe, Blackpool or Yeovil. Brentford are the only real club which has bucked that trend.
So basically you need to give your manager the best you can afford to give him to compete, but if you give him peanuts you won’t progress and you won’t draw a calibre of player to the club. If you also unlock a gem, we will never keep them.
What does my head in more than anything else is the lack of communication. We aren’t Chelsea with a fantastic stadium and global brand sponsorship. Our owners and players aren’t high net worth rollers and famous with all the bling to match. It’s a local club supported by local businesses with a local fan base. You have to connect more with the community because one false move could see the club teeter into extinction. Our £20 a week and our energy is at times worth more that the money they put in to keep it afloat and we deserve a return on our hard earned in the way of some communication back. They need to learn that, embrace it and realise that although they are investment bankers, some of us aren’t stupid either and can see through a lot of BS that gets presented.
It doesn’t help when our Commercial and Communication man Tom Gorringe happens to be the best mate of our chairman’s son...
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Post by gashead1981 on Dec 3, 2017 10:36:10 GMT
Interesting he cited FFP as though it was a constraint, although didn’t quite say it was. If we spent to FFP ceiling, assume we’d be top 10 as is based on crowd revenue. Is that right? As DC said. FFP is only a constraint if you’re owners aren’t willing or aren’t in the position to give the club money. I think DCs words were “you could have 10m if you want, providing the board were willing to donate it”
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Post by markczgas on Dec 3, 2017 10:43:53 GMT
What do people expect to hear? I'ts been said many times that things will go slow because Wael is building the club again from scratch. He said from day 1 in his 1st ever interview that he wont be throwing money around and that we have to be self sustainable. Evolution not revolution. Clearly he knows the training ground and stadium is a priority but its its all still at the planning stage. Its not something that will be done within a few weeks or months. Obviously he is here to stay. So lets get off his back and let him get on with it. The fact is they have pulled the plug on the UWE project and apparently the training ground project will be scaled back. no-one was expecting million pound deals for players, but the money made available for player recruitment has been pathetic by league 1 standards. What do Dwain Sports expect? that they could develop the club on a shoe string? They must have carried out due diligence before they bought the club, and if not you would have to question their credentials as bankers. Since the major capital works have floundered the huge bubble of positive energy generated has been well and truly burst. These people obviously have no idea how sh1ttily the fans have been treated and let down time after time. They obviously have no idea how difficult it is for Rovers fans when they see those absolute Tnucs south of the river effortlessly get a new stadium, spend millions on players, make an underhanded signing of our striker just to stop us going for promotion, to rub our noses in it, the list goes on as to just how much they don't understand. By the way, I thoroughly enjoyed today's win! I'm a bit surprised at your comment here. DC has spent A LOT OF MONEY for a Rovers manager for any era. Nichols 300K, Sercombe 150K , Parts 90K , Gaffney 50K (??) When was the last time we spent that sort off money in a 12- 18 month period ?? I'd say it was all the way back to Holloway's time in the late 90s.
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Post by Qatar Gas on Dec 3, 2017 10:44:33 GMT
If redevelopment of east stand was the first phase then that would need to be planned, architected, submitted and approved in the next 4 months if they were to make a start in the summer. But if the plan is to do that for the summer of 2019 it would mean completion by the summer of 2020. It gives you the idea of how much time is needed to do the whole ground that way. That stand holds 3000 fans + hospitality. How is that going to be accommodated? Doing the North and South stands first surely would make better sense? It depends on if the pitch would stay in the same place or rotated 90 degrees. If it was to be rotated, the East Stand would have to be first to go (probably during the season too). I guess rotating the pitch means the capacity will not suffer as much compared to if it stays in the same place, especially if you can use temporary stands. Whatever happens, I still cannot see how it will cost that much less than building on another site or knocking the whole thing down and rebuilding whilst we temporarily play elsewhere.
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Post by gas2 on Dec 3, 2017 10:47:20 GMT
Perhaps we will get a shop on glos road for selling stuff ?
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Post by markczgas on Dec 3, 2017 10:47:53 GMT
Let's be realistic here: The stadium may well be developed in much the same way as the training ground seems to be - a phased approach. The east stand will probably be the first to be developed, hence the need to move the club shop so that revenue continues throughout the build.
He's been at the club a very short time and a lot of fans are expecting a brand new stadium within the new year. It just doesn't happen like that. It's hard enough getting planning permission on a house or an extension, let alone a football stadium slap bang in the middle of a residential area. Cool your jets, nothing here so concerning it needs worrying about (yet!). Cheers Hani. Did Wael announce the building of a new East Stand ? No, so some people are getting overly-excited again.
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Post by gas2 on Dec 3, 2017 10:51:19 GMT
Perhaps the new club shop will be on the glos road as I sure someone said kingswood shop is closing ?
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Post by gashead1981 on Dec 3, 2017 11:01:16 GMT
Did Wael announce the building of a new East Stand ? No, so some people are getting overly-excited again. No, but overtures to moving the club shop is a suggestion that would be the first side that would be done, or why bother? Tarting up the toilets in 2 stands can only mean the north and south stands. Why bother if you have plans to level them?
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