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Post by giles on Sept 12, 2021 19:46:46 GMT
Out of his depth out of his mind. Will not pass a tear if he fails miserably in his career in football. Barton?
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 12, 2021 20:02:42 GMT
Like I said, it's so much easier to dismantle a winning team, than to create it. Whomever is tasked to orchestrate the phoenix... BG made a series of awful decisions, and some here still wanted to give him more time!? That's truly baffling! Can anyone name one tactic that truly worked on the pitch under BG ? (Apart from the release of RN, for which I give credit to,) So Burton bring in Jimmy who then brings in about 11 players. Not sure what there run was but they avoided relegation easily. And this season are 7th at the moment. 3 wins and three draws. So what will he do when given time etc? The post is well written but bears no bearing or relevance to my post including the question I asked...
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 12, 2021 20:09:55 GMT
Disagree. The crux of the argument is dismantlement of a successful, going for promotion for the first time on a generation to the championship to a whimper of a team with no credible leaders or proven experience. That's the crux. Time is irrelevant, because you can't get rid of the likes of Craig, Ollie Clark, JCH and think you're going anywhere without a proven goalscorer at the same level.....the philosophy sounds great in theory, but in the uncompromising 3rd division we were swept aside. You raise good points, and I agree with a lot of your points But do you not feel, once the decisions had been made, the club needed to hold firm and see it through? Um, no. I think the club knew it had made a grave mistake. Time was not the issue. BG was. There was not one match we lost under BG that I thought (or most others if you care to review the posters players marks) we deserved something out of. In essence we were well beaten in all matches we lost (you could argue Mansfield, Stevenage and even yesterday Hartlepool we matched our opponents for most if not all match and unlucky to lose them all), all the while BG watched scratching his beard and made like for like subs 65-75 mins. For example....to start the season with no striker, bring Ayunga on at half time when 2-0 down away to Ipswich and then make passing comments on the 'journey' as an excuse is just patronising and insulting to intelligence. He started the next match, league game v Sunderland away playing Alfie on the left of a back 3..... ? Time.....? Yep, time gentleman please.
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Post by bluebiro on Sept 12, 2021 20:11:08 GMT
Out of his depth out of his mind. Will not pass a tear if he fails miserably in his career in football.what a pleasant person you are. yes. cant abide the bloke if that's ok with you.killed any hope I had of seeing a rovers team in a new stadium for the next 10 years
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 12, 2021 20:17:28 GMT
Like I said, it's so much easier to dismantle a winning team, than to create it. Whomever is tasked to orchestrate the phoenix... BG made a series of awful decisions, and some here still wanted to give him more time!? That's truly baffling! Can anyone name one tactic that truly worked on the pitch under BG ? (Apart from the release of RN, for which I give credit to,) All but 1 of the starting players on Saturday was a JB signing? In fact out of the match day 18, 15 are JB signings. Ward and Kilgour were here before and Grant the only Garner signing. Not sure why BGs time at the club is relevant to the poor job that JB is doing? He's had time, he's had a long transfer window, he's been allowed to re-shape the coaching team etc. There's no excuses, and if there are then blaming BG is certainly a stretch. I'm not blaming BG for our poor start to the season! I'm blaming BG for his hand in dismantling a winning team, genuinely challenging for promotion and the club's subsequent struggle afterwards.... It will take years to recover from the mess BG left us in, and ongoing failures since. Interesting it appears my question goes unanswered as of now.
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Post by bluebiro on Sept 12, 2021 20:21:41 GMT
Think some are getting excited at the thought of Garner winning this game. I think given how sh** Barton has been some have forgotten how sh** Garner was too. Ultimately, some seem to have forgotten under whom this rot started. Won’t be getting a good reception from me.Very sad to hear that. Whatever your opinion of his signings/performances/results - it was his first EFL managerial post where it should have been obvious even to our dimmer supporters, that he was going to be on a learning curve. He was also tasked with taking a new approach, playing football (as opposed to hoofball) with younger players. Apart from his lack of previous experience he also had to cope with family illness and with the impact of Covid. He did all that with great dignity and yes, there were signs of improvement before he was sacked and we are now paying the price. The fact that many of our supporters can't appreciate that a long term project is..er..long term...just shows a complete lack of understanding as well as patience. Not sure I will be at the Swindon match but if I am I will be the one (yes, maybe only one!!) applauding BG as he walks to the dugout. as you said before why is it ok for garner to use covid as a excuse but not the current manager?
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Sept 12, 2021 21:27:02 GMT
It's all Garners fault, despite having a better points per game record than Barton last season which would have accumulated enough points to stay in League One, rather than pathetically finishing bottom of the league after Barton disgracefully threw in the towel.
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Post by Somersetgas on Sept 12, 2021 21:42:43 GMT
Where’s Carlts?
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Post by aghast on Sept 12, 2021 21:46:00 GMT
Managing Swindon Town, I believe.
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pirate
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Posts: 18,621
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Post by pirate on Sept 12, 2021 21:47:11 GMT
You raise good points, and I agree with a lot of your points But do you not feel, once the decisions had been made, the club needed to hold firm and see it through? In essence we were well beaten in all matches we lost (you could argue Mansfield, Stevenage and even yesterday Hartlepool we matched our opponents for most if not all match and unlucky to lose them all), Of course you could argue that, if you hadn't watched the games against Mansfield and Stevenage that is. The reality is something different. Mansfield clearly deserved to win after dominating the ball and creating 5 times as many shots at goal than us, in fact we struggled to create anything of note. Pretty similar for the Stevenage game at home where they dominated possession, created more chances and we only managed a pathetic one shot on target.
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Post by Topper Gas on Sept 12, 2021 22:13:02 GMT
It's all Garners fault, despite having a better points per game record than Barton last season which would have accumulated enough points to stay in League One, rather than pathetically finishing bottom of the league after Barton disgracefully threw in the towel. Blimey you've changed your tune! Do you seriously think Garner would have kept us up without Nicholson, Rodman, Oztumer and with a semi fit Hanlan?
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Sept 12, 2021 22:27:04 GMT
It's all Garners fault, despite having a better points per game record than Barton last season which would have accumulated enough points to stay in League One, rather than pathetically finishing bottom of the league after Barton disgracefully threw in the towel. Blimey you've changed your tune! Do you seriously think Garner would have kept us up without Nicholson, Rodman, Oztumer and with a semi fit Hanlan? Surprised you are trying to excuse a record of 3 wins in 18 games, 0.61 points per game, failing to score in 11 out of his 18 games and finishing rock bottom 10 points adrift of safety despite taking over with us outside the relegation zone.
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Post by Quarters on Sept 13, 2021 6:45:38 GMT
So Burton bring in Jimmy who then brings in about 11 players. Not sure what there run was but they avoided relegation easily. And this season are 7th at the moment. 3 wins and three draws. So what will he do when given time etc? The post is well written but bears no bearing or relevance to my post including the question I asked... As i said somewhere, I quoted the wrong one. Could not be bothered to look around for the correct one, expect you can work it out. Sorry
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Post by Quarters on Sept 13, 2021 6:50:38 GMT
All but 1 of the starting players on Saturday was a JB signing? In fact out of the match day 18, 15 are JB signings. Ward and Kilgour were here before and Grant the only Garner signing. Not sure why BGs time at the club is relevant to the poor job that JB is doing? He's had time, he's had a long transfer window, he's been allowed to re-shape the coaching team etc. There's no excuses, and if there are then blaming BG is certainly a stretch. I'm not blaming BG for our poor start to the season! I'm blaming BG for his hand in dismantling a winning team, genuinely challenging for promotion and the club's subsequent struggle afterwards.... It will take years to recover from the mess BG left us in, and ongoing failures since. Interesting it appears my question goes unanswered as of now. He was given a remit by the board to reduce the wage bill, play a different style and get value from players. SO we have to base him only on last season when he was fully operating under that remit with "his" team. Did he get all the right players in and build a team, no. Has he learnt from that, probably. The fact is over last season and this season he is our most successful manager! Hard to swallow but a fact. Will JB turn it all around, as this is now of HIS making, again a fact. His squad?
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Post by yetigas on Sept 13, 2021 7:25:13 GMT
what a pleasant person you are. yes. cant abide the bloke if that's ok with you.killed any hope I had of seeing a rovers team in a new stadium for the next 10 years Really? You know he was the manager not the owner, right?
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Post by yetigas on Sept 13, 2021 7:30:26 GMT
Very sad to hear that. Whatever your opinion of his signings/performances/results - it was his first EFL managerial post where it should have been obvious even to our dimmer supporters, that he was going to be on a learning curve. He was also tasked with taking a new approach, playing football (as opposed to hoofball) with younger players. Apart from his lack of previous experience he also had to cope with family illness and with the impact of Covid. He did all that with great dignity and yes, there were signs of improvement before he was sacked and we are now paying the price. The fact that many of our supporters can't appreciate that a long term project is..er..long term...just shows a complete lack of understanding as well as patience. Not sure I will be at the Swindon match but if I am I will be the one (yes, maybe only one!!) applauding BG as he walks to the dugout. as you said before why is it ok for garner to use covid as a excuse but not the current manager? I have never heard Garner use Covid as an excuse. It is my observation when analysing his performance as manager - it was his first managerial post in EFL and he had many challenges. That was my point. Barton is supposed to have at least some experience as a manager so should also be better equipped to face the challenges - plus Covid was a reality before he joined so presumably his plan to save us from relegation took that into account.
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Post by percy on Sept 13, 2021 7:56:46 GMT
Oh good, we're still having this argument.
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Post by olskooltoteender on Sept 13, 2021 8:28:26 GMT
Think some are getting excited at the thought of Garner winning this game. I think given how sh** Barton has been some have forgotten how sh** Garner was too. Ultimately, some seem to have forgotten under whom this rot started. Won’t be getting a good reception from me. Me either
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Post by olskooltoteender on Sept 13, 2021 8:29:30 GMT
Very sad to hear that. Whatever your opinion of his signings/performances/results - it was his first EFL managerial post where it should have been obvious even to our dimmer supporters, that he was going to be on a learning curve. He was also tasked with taking a new approach, playing football (as opposed to hoofball) with younger players. Apart from his lack of previous experience he also had to cope with family illness and with the impact of Covid. He did all that with great dignity and yes, there were signs of improvement before he was sacked and we are now paying the price. The fact that many of our supporters can't appreciate that a long term project is..er..long term...just shows a complete lack of understanding as well as patience. Not sure I will be at the Swindon match but if I am I will be the one (yes, maybe only one!!) applauding BG as he walks to the dugout. The guy didn’t have a clue. Being long term with the wrong appointments is short sighted. That’s why the club got rid of him, because he was crap. He turfed out experienced players who were the spine of the club. The nice guy blamed everyone bar himself, particularly referees, when everything went wrong. He sent Josh Barrett out to train with the kids. I honestly don’t understand where the ‘nice guy’ tag comes from other than possibly because the guy was so soft and delicate on the sidelines he gave off the impression of being inoffensive? You wouldn’t applaud Paul Tisdale so why would you applaud Ben Garner? If he goes on to be good for Swindon fair play. He could go on to manage Real Madrid or something but to me he will always[/i] be one of the worst rovers managers I have seen, only saved from THE worst by the actions of his two successors who were to some extent hampered by his diabolical recruitment. [/quote] Bang on . . .
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Sept 13, 2021 10:05:14 GMT
In essence we were well beaten in all matches we lost (you could argue Mansfield, Stevenage and even yesterday Hartlepool we matched our opponents for most if not all match and unlucky to lose them all), Of course you could argue that, if you hadn't watched the games against Mansfield and Stevenage that is. The reality is something different. Mansfield clearly deserved to win after dominating the ball and creating 5 times as many shots at goal than us, in fact we struggled to create anything of note. Pretty similar for the Stevenage game at home where they dominated possession, created more chances and we only managed a pathetic one shot on target. I disagree. I was there at all 3 matches and if they all would have been draws, that wouldn't have been unreasonable. We are poor moving forward, yet Oldham was scintillating first half... Hartlepool manager admits they were out-competed first half where we looked more competitive and hungrier. We didn't do enough to win, but a draw was a fair result. Stevenage had 55% possession. They had one more shot than us on target and off target....they didn't dominate us, they were just better organised. Mansfield was an anomaly..... starting the season with 7 injuries, then another one in first half and bringing Westbrook on was like playing with 10 men. Then a freak sending off, we were down to 9. A penalty 90 +7? Yep we were finally sunk, but will such misfortune (constructed by ourselves or not) really conspire again? We were literally seconds away from a draw. I see it differently. We would have capitulated under BG We are playing an all effort match under JAB, I saw many matches under BG where we had no passion and just ran round a bit....
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